Pages:
Author

Topic: Should I vote for Walker in the imminent Wisconsin election? - page 2. (Read 3910 times)

hero member
Activity: 950
Merit: 1001
You know, that's exactly what the 80,000 Ralph Nader supporters said in Florida in 2000.

For some reason, they changed their mind when their idealistic stupidity meant Bush won.  I think you will agree that their votes did make a real difference, especially to Iraq.

Voting IS idealistic. You're more likely to die in a car accident on the way to the polls than you are to change the final result. You spend bus fare, wait in line, present ID, educate yourself about candidates, etc. If you're completely rational, then voting is a bad idea; your average utility will decrease. Even if your values include the welfare of others, there are much more efficient means to achieve it in the same amount of time.

Most people unknowingly vote due to superrationality - they think about what if everyone like them skipped voting. Then the Bad Guys win! If you're willing to go to all that trouble to make an insignificant difference, why then take a step back and vote tactically, and with a one-move-ahead strategy like that? If you're using "if everyone did that" reasoning, shouldn't you vote for whoever you think everyone else should vote for?

It's popular to hate on Nader supporters, but far more people never voted at all, or voted for Bush. Nader supporters didn't ask for a broken plurality voting system - they're just answering honestly. Maybe you should blame a Democratic party that has no intention of fixing the flaw that led to Bush because it keeps them in power too.
hero member
Activity: 812
Merit: 1000
However, since I am a student without much USD income

You are a student? How old are you, if you don't mind answering?
I always pictured you as an old fella with grown up kids and all. Smiley


About voting, it's quite likely that the probability of you winning the lottery is larger than the probability of your vote making any difference at all. I bet you're more likely to die in an accident in the way to the voting center than your vote making any difference. In order words, voting is useless. Democracy is an illusion. Don't waste your time.

On the contrary, democracy is not an illusion. Either vote, or expend your energy educating potential voters on the issues.
hero member
Activity: 630
Merit: 500
However, since I am a student without much USD income

You are a student? How old are you, if you don't mind answering?
I always pictured you as an old fella with grown up kids and all. Smiley


About voting, it's quite likely that the probability of you winning the lottery is larger than the probability of your vote making any difference at all. I bet you're more likely to die in an accident in the way to the voting center than your vote making any difference. In order words, voting is useless. Democracy is an illusion. Don't waste your time.
legendary
Activity: 3066
Merit: 1147
The revolution will be monetized!
I will be voting to send Walker home tomorrow. I wish I could vote to hang him. Yuck!

Why.  you work at say Sears hard all day you get paid squat.  Then these public sectors expect it all providing really nothing in return.  They retire in California and the 1st thing these public sector feces do is move to Idaho and Nevada to avoid taxes.  All the while taking home $200K a year in retirement, ripping off taxpayers loading up on overtime in the last 2 years they work.  If you love government so much, why are you on the bitcoin boards?
Why?... The republicans steal all our tax wealth by giving it to their political cronies and allowing them to avoid paying their own taxes. Then they see a public employee making a living wage and try to convince me they are the reason we are broke. Save it for the hillbillies on Fox news.
Voted!
donator
Activity: 1736
Merit: 1010
Let's talk governance, lipstick, and pigs.
Yes
1.  Small government is good government.
2.  He's going to win.
Republicans are all about Big Government though.
BCB
vip
Activity: 1078
Merit: 1002
BCJ
Yes
1.  Small government is good government.
2.  He's going to win.
hero member
Activity: 717
Merit: 501
I will be voting to send Walker home tomorrow. I wish I could vote to hang him. Yuck!

Why.  you work at say Sears hard all day you get paid squat.  Then these public sectors expect it all providing really nothing in return.  They retire in California and the 1st thing these public sector feces do is move to Idaho and Nevada to avoid taxes.  All the while taking home $200K a year in retirement, ripping off taxpayers loading up on overtime in the last 2 years they work.  If you love government so much, why are you on the bitcoin boards?
sr. member
Activity: 266
Merit: 250
The king and the pawn go in the same box @ endgame
legendary
Activity: 1400
Merit: 1013
So you guys do not vote but then whine about the bad government that use force and violence? This is so fail, so fail.
Can you explain why?
legendary
Activity: 1148
Merit: 1008
If you want to walk on water, get out of the boat
So you guys do not vote but then whine about the bad government that use force and violence? This is so fail, so fail.
legendary
Activity: 3066
Merit: 1147
The revolution will be monetized!
I will be voting to send Walker home tomorrow. I wish I could vote to hang him. Yuck!
legendary
Activity: 1218
Merit: 1001
Voting is attempting to violently force (indirectly) a group to accept a government that they don't want.

You lost me right there. Sad. The moment you stop reciting a meme, the more your thoughts will be respected for their originality.
Government uses force to impose their will. Throwing your support behind someone puts that someone in place to use violence to impose their will. Though, voting's not really a violent act, given it's unreasonable to assume nobody will vote and thus the state will simply dissolve. That said, it's unreasonable to expect your vote to change an election, or make any impact, really - negative or positive. Waste of energy to vote. Waste of energy to talk about voting. I'm wasting energy, and I don't like inefficiency. Guten abend!

You know, that's exactly what the 80,000 Ralph Nader supporters said in Florida in 2000.

For some reason, they changed their mind when their idealistic stupidity meant Bush won.  I think you will agree that their votes did make a real difference, especially to Iraq.
sr. member
Activity: 266
Merit: 250
The king and the pawn go in the same box @ endgame
donator
Activity: 1736
Merit: 1010
Let's talk governance, lipstick, and pigs.
hero member
Activity: 812
Merit: 1000
Read my posts. I provide a lot of information, and it is in general unique, rather than repeated meaningless mantras.
I see that. You present facts when doing so is supports your position. But on the other hand in this thread you've also shown a willingness to employ logical fallacies when that suits your purpose.

It looks to me like you stick to logic and facts when doing so is convenient and abandon them the instant they don't support your position. Perhaps this is because my horizons just aren't broad enough to see that the physics definition of "force" refers to the exact same phenomenon as the ethical definition of "force".

Well you better go reread the posts again. Kluge used the term 'force' in reference to violence, which is a physical process of force.
legendary
Activity: 1400
Merit: 1013
Read my posts. I provide a lot of information, and it is in general unique, rather than repeated meaningless mantras.
I see that. You present facts when doing so is supports your position. But on the other hand in this thread you've also shown a willingness to employ logical fallacies when that suits your purpose.

It looks to me like you stick to logic and facts when doing so is convenient and abandon them the instant they don't support your position. Perhaps this is because my horizons just aren't broad enough to see that the physics definition of "force" refers to the exact same phenomenon as the ethical definition of "force".
hero member
Activity: 812
Merit: 1000
Furthermore, you also asked me once what would be required to demonstrate proof to me. I obliged you with an answer indicating that I essentially desired quality discourse, to which you said was not satisfactory.
Yes, because "quality" can mean anything unless it has been precisely defined and the context made it quite clear that your definition of quality is, "whatever I agree with". Your answer indicated that you reserved the right to refute any fact, not based on it being false, but based on coming from a source you considered to be a "sham organization". You also reserved the right to completely disqualify any statement you classified as a "meme", again with no requirement for it to actually be incorrect.

Your reply was an incredible display of intellectual dishonesty since you basically give yourself latitude to be right regardless of any facts or logic provided because you can disregard anything on purely subjective grounds.

You have no idea how much background information I have provided on said 'sham' organizations, their tactics, and their deceptive practices. Furthermore, if 100 forum members use the term 'Blue suits', say the government is enacting violence against its citizens, then exactly two statements have been made, and no more, regardless of how many times it has been said.

Read my posts. I provide a lot of information, and it is in general unique, rather than repeated meaningless mantras. You can start with this one: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/still-believe-the-government-is-not-spying-on-you-84952
legendary
Activity: 1400
Merit: 1013
Furthermore, you also asked me once what would be required to demonstrate proof to me. I obliged you with an answer indicating that I essentially desired quality discourse, to which you said was not satisfactory.
Yes, because "quality" can mean anything unless it has been precisely defined and the context made it quite clear that your definition of quality is, "whatever I agree with". Your answer indicated that you reserved the right to refute any fact, not based on it being false, but based on coming from a source you considered to be a "sham organization". You also reserved the right to completely disqualify any statement you classified as a "meme", again with no requirement for it to actually be incorrect.

Your reply was an incredible display of intellectual dishonesty since you basically give yourself latitude to be right regardless of any facts or logic provided because you can disregard anything on purely subjective grounds.
hero member
Activity: 812
Merit: 1000
Physics is force. The Universe is a process of physics. Live in this universe or go to one where physics does not exist.

Your (most all of you) sad use of the term violence is nothing but moaning about a system that has less violence than any solution I have yet to see proposed.

It is sad. And it does lack originality.
Awwe, an unoriginal solution -- keep crying. You know what physics allows? Physics cause propaganda boxes from RAF planes with non-functioning parachutes to kill children. Physics cause the bullets from NATO troops to kill a group of fellows out cutting wood after physics cause darkness.

I propose we recall physics, then, upon reflection of all the insight your posts in this thread have provided.

You can't recall physics. That's the point. Just like you can't recall violence against your fellow man by recalling government. But you can increase violence against your fellow man significantly by calling for no government.
hero member
Activity: 812
Merit: 1000
May I suggest broadening your horizons?
Sure you can. But I'm not sure what that means.

If being "hung up on proof and logic" means that I care whether factual statements are true or false and that's a "simplistic ideal" should I expand my horizons by believing things that are false?

The bulk of your posts seem to be a request for proof. That is not discussion, but simply a tactic to avoid further trading of information. Your asking for proof does not constitute a refutation of information put forth. Furthermore, you also asked me once what would be required to demonstrate proof to me. I obliged you with an answer indicating that I essentially desired quality discourse, to which you said was not satisfactory.

Regarding taxation: your fanatical fixation on the concept is pointless until you have explored in detail and depth the issues which plague humanity, the environment, and the economy. The subject matter is deep. Explore those concepts, the ramifications of ignoring them and the ramifications of alternative methods to taxation, and then discuss them (in detail). At that point, your position on taxation might be respectable.

What is not respectable is a general denouncement of taxation without deep discussion. Anyone can spread the simplistic memes of their favorite political ideology. It says nothing.
Pages:
Jump to: