Silk road down for over 24 hours now. - page 2.

Wuji

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Quote from: BitcoinAshley on April 30, 2013, 08:22:54 AM

... Wait, silk road has been down for days and BTC price HASN'T tanked?

... Might this mean that BTC price isn't carried by Silk Road, i.e. we AREN'T still in 2011?

And according to some bull/bear schizos on here, the "speculators" have left, interest is down, and BTC is headed for the doldrums.

So if Silk Road is down, and "the speculators" "have left", and price is holding... major bullish, because it means price isn't based on drugs and wall st. wannabes, according to the bears' own arguments

Cool

Ashley, don't be silly, I've been telling you forever the price is solely based on speculation and not usage or adoption. Right now my best guess is it is being used as a temporary cash store in hopes of good news later on. There is nothing surprising here at all.

Also Silk Road has had on and off issues for a long while so it will take more than 3 days to lose confidence. If MtFUX didn't bring BTC down to double digits that shows the irrational exuberance is still at an all time high. I've predicted a slowly downward trend for a long time although a panic sell based on possible news scenarios wouldn't shock me. Once Silk Road comes back who knows another irrational bubble as I first was thinking. I figured it would be up by today though.

EDIT - Also those with BTC in silk road can't panic sell currently their Bitcoins are gone unless the site comes back.

I don't want to spread FUD (just trying to use logic) but the longer Silk Road is down the more I worry a big cash out when funds do become available.

glendall

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Next Generation Web3 Casino

Must be one heck of a whoozy DDOS to take out SR for this long.

mccorvic

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Quote from: drawingthesun on April 30, 2013, 11:46:46 AM

Quote from: julius on April 30, 2013, 08:47:47 AM

Quote from: Wuji on April 29, 2013, 11:27:26 AM

So after more research Silk Road has two larger competitors BMR and Atlantis.

Do these competitors use Bitcoin as well ?

Atlantis was Litecoin only last time I heard. Looks like selling my Litecoins was a massive mistake! Sad

Nope, best thing you ever did.

drawingthesun

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Quote from: julius on April 30, 2013, 08:47:47 AM

Quote from: Wuji on April 29, 2013, 11:27:26 AM

So after more research Silk Road has two larger competitors BMR and Atlantis.

Do these competitors use Bitcoin as well ?

Atlantis was Litecoin only last time I heard. Looks like selling my Litecoins was a massive mistake! Sad

dandirk

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Quote from: Templeton on April 30, 2013, 11:01:23 AM

Quote from: kriwest on April 30, 2013, 08:11:36 AM

"UPDATE (04/30/2013 0035 UTC): We have come a long way in the battle, but still do not have the upper hand. It's looking more and more like a restructuring of the tor software or even the tor network will be required to mitigate the kind of attack we are under. If this can be solved by modifying the tor client software running the silk road .onion, then it will be a matter of patching and redeploying the hidden service. If it is a network issue, it will require the cooperation of the Tor developers, or running a new network of nodes. I haven't given up hope for a faster solution, but if one can not be found, then we will move to a semi private scheme where users will be given access through many private URLs. I'll keep everyone updated on how we will move forward, but please be prepared for a few more days at the least of no access."

where is that from?

The owner of SR, Dread Pirate Roberts on the SR forums which was running last night at least and seems to be a lesser target.

Templeton

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Quote from: kriwest on April 30, 2013, 08:11:36 AM

"UPDATE (04/30/2013 0035 UTC): We have come a long way in the battle, but still do not have the upper hand. It's looking more and more like a restructuring of the tor software or even the tor network will be required to mitigate the kind of attack we are under. If this can be solved by modifying the tor client software running the silk road .onion, then it will be a matter of patching and redeploying the hidden service. If it is a network issue, it will require the cooperation of the Tor developers, or running a new network of nodes. I haven't given up hope for a faster solution, but if one can not be found, then we will move to a semi private scheme where users will be given access through many private URLs. I'll keep everyone updated on how we will move forward, but please be prepared for a few more days at the least of no access."

where is that from?

Chuck Finley

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Quote from: notme on April 29, 2013, 02:08:51 PM

2. The speed of the server has pretty much nothing to do with DDOS resistance. DDOS is accomplished by saturating the network connection, not attempting to overload a machine that is simply piping data from disk to the network port.

That's incorrect.

While saturating a network connection is ONE way of causing a denial of service, overloading the target machine(s) so that they can't respond to requests even if the connection isn't saturated would also count as a DOS attack. As long as someone is intentionally trying to cause a network resource to become unavailable it's a DOS attack regardless of the means through which they cause that service denial. (If they're using a zombie botnet or some such then it's a DDOS).

julius

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Quote from: Wuji on April 29, 2013, 11:27:26 AM

So after more research Silk Road has two larger competitors BMR and Atlantis.

Do these competitors use Bitcoin as well ?

massivebitman

full member

Activity: 224

Merit: 100

Silk Road really can't have much to do with the price of bitcoin right now. People who are inflating the price aren't the users of that site. Money in should roughly equal money out on SR. The site shouldn't affect the big players, do you really think investors are putting 100k in bitcoin because they think the druggies are going to drive up the price? Quite the opposite in fact. Bitcoin being used for illicit activities is a risk for the big investor.

BitcoinAshley

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Activity: 448

Merit: 250

... Wait, silk road has been down for days and BTC price HASN'T tanked?

... Might this mean that BTC price isn't carried by Silk Road, i.e. we AREN'T still in 2011?

And according to some bull/bear schizos on here, the "speculators" have left, interest is down, and BTC is headed for the doldrums.

So if Silk Road is down, and "the speculators" "have left", and price is holding... major bullish, because it means price isn't based on drugs and wall st. wannabes, according to the bears' own arguments

Cool

kriwest

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"UPDATE (04/30/2013 0035 UTC): We have come a long way in the battle, but still do not have the upper hand. It's looking more and more like a restructuring of the tor software or even the tor network will be required to mitigate the kind of attack we are under. If this can be solved by modifying the tor client software running the silk road .onion, then it will be a matter of patching and redeploying the hidden service. If it is a network issue, it will require the cooperation of the Tor developers, or running a new network of nodes. I haven't given up hope for a faster solution, but if one can not be found, then we will move to a semi private scheme where users will be given access through many private URLs. I'll keep everyone updated on how we will move forward, but please be prepared for a few more days at the least of no access."

massivebitman

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Price will go up if SR is down hopefully. Less coins to be sold.

afbitcoins

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How longs it been down for now ?

dave111223

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Quote from: Wuji on April 29, 2013, 02:26:40 PM

Quote from: SaintFlow on April 29, 2013, 01:48:13 PM

Would mirroring the site under many different addresses make it ddos proof in tor?

The problem is that all transactions are stored in a database. In order to mirror the databases have to be sync'd. When you have high speed transactions this gets difficult with distance due to latency. Wall street gets around this having invested billions of dollars in fiber connects and centralizing everything in one spot. Of course if Wall street was the new 104 story building about to be completed I'd compare MtGox or Silk road as a 2 man pup tent. Not to be critical but they are small potatoes.

But couldn't all the mirrors be run from the same source? Because the DDoSers would just be targeting the website distribution in general, as opposed to targeting the specific source computer (if they could locate/target the source server then what would be the point of Tor)

So couldn't the dread pirate roberts just run 100 instances of Tor on the same server all with different tor addresses, but still serving up the same data from the same database?

But then again I have a really limited knowledge of Tor so this could be completely wrong.

Templeton

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It's still down... Hope my BTC are safe Tongue

Wuji

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Quote from: SaintFlow on April 29, 2013, 01:48:13 PM

Would mirroring the site under many different addresses make it ddos proof in tor?

The problem is that all transactions are stored in a database. In order to mirror the databases have to be sync'd. When you have high speed transactions this gets difficult with distance due to latency. Wall street gets around this having invested billions of dollars in fiber connects and centralizing everything in one spot. Of course if Wall street was the new 104 story building about to be completed I'd compare MtGox or Silk road as a 2 man pup tent. Not to be critical but they are small potatoes.

UltimateReaper

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Poor Silk Road. I really like that place.

notme

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Quote from: BitSmile on April 29, 2013, 11:35:45 AM

I think it's just zombie pcs "refreshing". I read somewhere that the thing that supposedly would make DDOS agains the Tor network has not been implemented, because it would require a fair amount of resources. With a sizeable botnet, the zombies could just send legitimate requests over and over, making sites like silk road and such, with stone age servers, be almost unusable.

1. I doubt Silk Road is running on "stone age servers".
2. The speed of the server has pretty much nothing to do with DDOS resistance. DDOS is accomplished by saturating the network connection, not attempting to overload a machine that is simply piping data from disk to the network port.

SaintFlow

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The first is by definition not flawed.

If i where this new atlantis place, this is what i would spend my money on Grin

Would mirroring the site under many different addresses make it ddos proof in tor?

Wuji

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Quote from: dg2010 on April 29, 2013, 10:45:11 AM

Quote from: Wuji on April 29, 2013, 10:35:39 AM

One reason people think TOR is hard to DDOS is because it does not allow UDP. Most DDOS is UDP based and TOR only allows TCP. Still this does not make TOR impossible to DDOS it just means you need to flood a lot of nodes with TCP protocol. I'd imagine using a lot of zombie PC with TOR clients one could map out TOR nodes and develop a fairly simple plan to flood enough nodes to make TOR fairly unusable.

Given how the TOR network operates and the bandwidth constraints, I imagine it's easier to take a site down in terms of traffic required. But harder to do, given that you need your zombies to connect to the Tor network first.

I don't think it would be hard to write or update a botnet that had the tor bundle implemented to connect. Also there are .to sites that proxy to the TOR without the need for the network stuff to be enabled.

Topic: Silk road down for over 24 hours now. - page 2. (Read 7841 times)