Topic: Split BFL thread? - page 5. (Read 6324 times)

+1 THIS THIS THIS

It would be a Sisyphean task to clean up all the BFL treads. It was BFL who started using the "diss" as a form of marketing. Live by the sword diss, die by the sword diss. And "diss" means not only "disrespect" but also "disinformation".

Here's just one example of one of the original BFL ASIC threads that now somehow resides in the Off-topic section, and type of marketing practiced by BFL; I'm pointing to my quote of Inaba's conversation with reeses.

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.933012

Butterfly Labs appeared here first time in August of 2011 in the Russian News subforum and immediately aroused suspiction.

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/httpbutterflylabscomproducts-38922

Then it was you who actually opened the first English language topic:

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/1ghs-20w-500-butterflylabs-is-it-a-scam-48863

1GH/s, 20w, $500 — Butterflylabs, is it a scam?

and the second one:

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/1ghs-20w-700-was-500-butterflylabs-is-it-for-real-part-2-53530

1GH/s, 20w, $700 (was $500) — Butterflylabs, is it for real? (Part 2)

I don't know, maybe you feel somehow responsible for all the BFL-flavoured beer that had been brewed on this forum and feel obliged to drink all of it. But as a reader I feel that BFL should drink their own beer.

The current forum culture can still be shaped but no forum can survive the inevitable "Eternal September" that makes every forum worthless.

The quiet, sane comments get shouted down and these users inevitably leave.

Since BFL does not actually have a product to sell, any and all BFL-related threads should be moved to a more appropriate forum:

Off-topic

or maybe:

Gambling

 

That can be tolerated because they are untouchable.

In a perfect world, a locked thread would work.  But in the world of Bitcointalk, the only thing a locked thread will generate is "BFL is censoring posts! Lollers!  ROFLCOPTER SCAM!" etc...  Same problem with moderating posts for the ASIC vendors, if not done by a disinterested third party.  I can't moderate a thread because anything I moderate would instantly be called censorship.  Look at people like Frizz... he creates at least 1 new account per day on the BFL forums to post crap and then comes over here crying when I delete his spam.  PuertoLibre and the rest of the Clown Crew have also gotten into the act of "Censorship" cries, even though I let a lot of negative stuff go on the BFL forums... I just delete the outright spam, personal attacks and over use of cussing for the most part.  Any reasonable, well thought out post is left intact, even if it's negative.  So I can only imagine what it would be like if I were to impose the same rules here on a thread of our own.  No, it has to come from a disinterested third party.  I trust Gmaxwell completely to do the right thing as far as moderation goes, even though I sometimes disagree with his conclusions... can't say the same thing for all moderators, but most moderators here don't have an agenda to push so I'm fine with them doing it.  

What about all the troll posts that BFL makes that contain no new news but simply bash other manufacturers or are purely marketing bullshit ?

I vote NO because there are only 2 moderators on this sub forum, and when you guys are away, things will just go back to normal.

A moderated thread won't stop anyone from posting whatever they want in it... unless you want to sit and hit the refresh button on the custom hardware sub forum all day...

The vendors would just have this power for their one "official" thread, and users would be made aware of this.

If users felt like they were being censored, they could still post in the other threads like always.

They can, — and in some cases have— started their own forums for all the value that a privately controlled echo chamber may provide.  I think there is value in having a wider diversity of views and keeping more things in a common discussion place... but the openness of this forum has invited people who are so viciously (and, sometimes, irrationally) negative that people actually miss the smaller number of genuine thoughtfully argued concerns.  I don't know how to solve it, but I do know how to make it so there are fewer messages to read.

I'd be quite happy if parties had announcement threads (I don't know that there is really any reason to keep them locked— I can simply split off old responses regularly without much trouble. I'd recommended this in the past.


I've deleted many of posts too.  Many of them very quickly so perhaps they haven't been noticed— crap like bazarro porn mashups with pictures of the family members of asic people.  Some of that is now moved off the forum.  ... some people here should be ashamed of themselves.

You can start telling me what I _need_ to do when I get the authority to ban people and when the overall forum adopts a policy which is less all-is-fair. Until then, it's going to be horrible... and when I see a particularly bad example that I can fix easily I'll continue to do so.

Yup they can. Obviously they weren't smart enough to do that yet they are coming out with these fairy-tale unicorn ASICs.

Cant BFL start their own news thread and keep it locked ?

This. Absolutely this. I check the ASIC threads from time to time, but I can only do so much. Yet, I've still deleted hundreds of posts despite being limited to the global moderation rules. You guys don't even have that limitation since theymos has given the Mining board moderators autonomy! So, you need to either more actively moderate this board or you need to ask theymos for more moderators to be appointed. Anything else is just going to make things worse.

WOW this would not be a good idea. Yes that's like giving PirateAt40 mod powers to his original BTCST thread. Great idea! 

The permanent solution is probably to give the vendors mod powers within their own threads, to delete messages and such.

There is very little in the way of moderation done on this forum. Why start now? Or rather, why moderate just one topic instead of the entire forum or select sub-forums? I am not one for restricting conversation but the amount of non-constructive drivel that is posted makes this website for the most part useless. I'm not sure if Bitcoin attracts trolls or if the lack of repercussions permits them to flourish but something needs to change for this website to be a useful platform for discussion.

I propose make more sub-forums like the mining speculation forum and have no rules there. Heavily moderate the forums where actual facts are discussed. If the trolls want, they can go troll speculation sub-forums without burying facts in their crap.

sounds like you will be sifting through shit to claim the nuggety goodness that is BFL.

I'm not sure if you noticed but I did split & split/nuke jobs with the tails of both the avalon and btcfpga threads.  The difference is that I was willing to go back through a month of history in those and split off most of the tripe and I'm not willing to do something that selective with BFL (just because of the sheer size and low density of signal to tripe, as well as the high density of borderline posts).   I think the other vendors are already better but not good, but right now better is all I can hope for with the current forum culture and policies.  I believe that part of what Josh reached out to me is that he felt that I was being unfair by cleaning up the other threads, and he's right... though I'm not intentionally being unfair and I'd like to fix it.

My preference would be for the vendors to have stickies and potentially locked (or at least ruthlessly cleaned with no promise of fairness) announcement threads where they constantly update the top posts.  This has worked more or less well for the pool subforum in the past.  I've proposed this before but didn't get takers on it... and it's not just something I can impose since it would need people to actually update the posts.  I can, however, split off and lock dramafests unilaterally. 

Guys, quick! Go to the Service Discussion and Service Announcement subforums just in case!