It depend if you can take risk.
People who took risk ordering from bfl about a year of empty promises and obsolete machines delivered - that is what you call bad investment, on the other hand some other investments were better.
I would definitely go for new toy in the town if I like it. And with all that shared mining? I like when I control my money and when they work for me. I would go for shared mining only if I will be setting one up, that mean I do not want my money work for me, at maximum available profit.
Bitcoin mining is not (and never was) fun for poor people. Even with cpu mining you had to have pc, electricity and internet connection.
Topic: STOP!!! Do not buy that new ASIC ! And here's why... - page 4. (Read 15474 times)
So then where do you go from here? As a new comer myself, I do realize the majority of the profits are gone to the early adopters, but I want to mine. Blah...take it as a hobby and mine at a loss I guess? Or wait for the next round of shinny toys and buy!
Not really, his point here is that people who are mining already want other people to stop mining and invest in bitcoin to drive price higher. Guess from who they are supposed to buy those bitcoins? Its easy, from the same guys who advise others to stop mining LMAO.
Every price increase in bitcoin will only attract few thousand people to try mining. If they want to make some profit they do have to have the newest toy in the town otherwise they cant even see ROI on whatever is selling for some time.
Like those usb miners or bfl or avalon miners, while they were good for first few hundred owners after just 3-4 months they are obsolete pieces of machinery. In mining it is no longer about peaceful mining, it is a race for newest toys and fastest utilization of those.
Bitcoin mining moved to predatory stage when one eat another alive and only fittest will survive. Like people with capital to spend.
This is going to benefit people who are in mining from start or significantly longer than those who come only recently. While newcomers need to spend hard cash, ole day miners just invest part of their revenue they generated long time ago.
Every price increase in bitcoin will only attract few thousand people to try mining. If they want to make some profit they do have to have the newest toy in the town otherwise they cant even see ROI on whatever is selling for some time.
Like those usb miners or bfl or avalon miners, while they were good for first few hundred owners after just 3-4 months they are obsolete pieces of machinery. In mining it is no longer about peaceful mining, it is a race for newest toys and fastest utilization of those.
Bitcoin mining moved to predatory stage when one eat another alive and only fittest will survive. Like people with capital to spend.
This is going to benefit people who are in mining from start or significantly longer than those who come only recently. While newcomers need to spend hard cash, ole day miners just invest part of their revenue they generated long time ago.
hmmm... a thought. if people stopped mining and just bought Bitcoins instead, the demand for Bitcoins would go up causing the exchange rate to go up. So people who no longer mine may still be trying to get people to stop mining for their own profit. 
Actually I want to use the bitcoins I bought a while ago to purchase a miner, or at least shares in a miner. Is that the same thing?
Kinda same, but share is higher in risk as in you have to pay for their management fee too...
hmmm... a thought. if people stopped mining and just bought Bitcoins instead, the demand for Bitcoins would go up causing the exchange rate to go up. So people who no longer mine may still be trying to get people to stop mining for their own profit.
Actually I want to use the bitcoins I bought a while ago to purchase a miner, or at least shares in a miner. Is that the same thing?
I am perfectly happy to have ROI back in 2-3 months, even 4.
Not gonna happen.
Sure not. Your wisdom is duly noted. You must be one of BFL pre-order customers or simply do not have money for investment.
So you are the few lucky one eh? Well most people didn't ROI...
I am perfectly happy to have ROI back in 2-3 months, even 4.
Not gonna happen.
Sure not. Your wisdom is duly noted. You must be one of BFL pre-order customers or simply do not have money for investment.
hmmm... a thought. if people stopped mining and just bought Bitcoins instead, the demand for Bitcoins would go up causing the exchange rate to go up. So people who no longer mine may still be trying to get people to stop mining for their own profit.
KnC smaller unit will break even in less than 2 months, if difficulty increase it might be 3-4 months. I dont know what you talk about.
I am perfectly happy to have ROI back in 2-3 months, even 4.
Not gonna happen.
LOL this is like on Wall Street, everyone want ROI in 2 days, week at most which is - funny.
No pain no gain, you have to spend money to make money.
I am perfectly happy to have ROI back in 2-3 months, even 4. Still better than countless of people waiting over year for BFL asics and when they come out, in few months they slowly become relics.
Still safer to buy KnC machine than any one of tens of bfl jalapeno currently on ebay.
No pain no gain, you have to spend money to make money.
I am perfectly happy to have ROI back in 2-3 months, even 4. Still better than countless of people waiting over year for BFL asics and when they come out, in few months they slowly become relics.
Still safer to buy KnC machine than any one of tens of bfl jalapeno currently on ebay.
Err, most miners can't ROI for the lifetime of the machines. Based on the calculator.
LOL this is like on Wall Street, everyone want ROI in 2 days, week at most which is - funny.
No pain no gain, you have to spend money to make money.
I am perfectly happy to have ROI back in 2-3 months, even 4. Still better than countless of people waiting over year for BFL asics and when they come out, in few months they slowly become relics.
Still safer to buy KnC machine than any one of tens of bfl jalapeno currently on ebay.
No pain no gain, you have to spend money to make money.
I am perfectly happy to have ROI back in 2-3 months, even 4. Still better than countless of people waiting over year for BFL asics and when they come out, in few months they slowly become relics.
Still safer to buy KnC machine than any one of tens of bfl jalapeno currently on ebay.
you forgot to take into account that a lot of people like to bet on the difficulty rise slowing down a bit. Difficulty can't rise like this forever, eventually it levels off a bit and those are the miners who will profit nicely
I was just looking at the KNC site for their various miners, the high end Jupiter model hashes 550 Ghash for $4,995.00 .
I'm telling you, DO NOT BUY ONE OF ANY MODEL!
Why? Simple economics. Run the numbers with me:
At current BTC difficulty of 267 million, you'll get 1.03 BTC per day. In a couple days when the difficulty jumps to ~400 million, you will only get 0.69 BTC per day. And it'll only get worse as the difficulty continues to rise!
BTC is at $215.00 right now, and assuming it stays there (which it won't), and assuming you are mining 0.69 BTC per day (which will fall more and more), you'd have to mine for at least 34 days to break even, and if the BTC price drops, it'll be much longer.
If BTC dropped to $100, and assuming again that you were still somehow getting 0.69 BTC at the 400 million difficulty, which will rise, your break even time is now 72 days or longer.
And this does not take into account shipping costs or electricity costs.
And WHEN the difficulty rises, it'll be much longer.
Do you really want to be on pins and needles for 3 months or more, praying that your foolish purchase at least breaks even, much less makes a profit?
Save yourself the headache.
If you're that desperate to throw money away, PM me for my PayPal address.
And I really had to LOL at how they list the Saturn version as the "more affordable" model. 50% of the hash rate for 60% of the price -- you're already losing money relative to buying the Jupiter version!
And this is not a rip on KNC specifically, this goes for any ASIC built by anyone.
I'm telling you, DO NOT BUY ONE OF ANY MODEL!
Why? Simple economics. Run the numbers with me:
At current BTC difficulty of 267 million, you'll get 1.03 BTC per day. In a couple days when the difficulty jumps to ~400 million, you will only get 0.69 BTC per day. And it'll only get worse as the difficulty continues to rise!
BTC is at $215.00 right now, and assuming it stays there (which it won't), and assuming you are mining 0.69 BTC per day (which will fall more and more), you'd have to mine for at least 34 days to break even, and if the BTC price drops, it'll be much longer.
If BTC dropped to $100, and assuming again that you were still somehow getting 0.69 BTC at the 400 million difficulty, which will rise, your break even time is now 72 days or longer.
And this does not take into account shipping costs or electricity costs.
And WHEN the difficulty rises, it'll be much longer.
Do you really want to be on pins and needles for 3 months or more, praying that your foolish purchase at least breaks even, much less makes a profit?
Save yourself the headache.
If you're that desperate to throw money away, PM me for my PayPal address.
And I really had to LOL at how they list the Saturn version as the "more affordable" model. 50% of the hash rate for 60% of the price -- you're already losing money relative to buying the Jupiter version!
And this is not a rip on KNC specifically, this goes for any ASIC built by anyone.
Everyone has access to the charts. Let people do as they please... the information is available to them.
We are past the midpoint. As of now mining will become exponentially difficult. Unless hardware becomes more efficient and cheaper, there is no positive ROI. Nothing available I see viable at this time.
It doesn't help the bitcoin community any. Is just negative and not in a positive way. Honestly people will still buy just look at prices on ebay or anywhere and they ARE selling. And the alternative motives of the poster are always in question. Does he really want YOU to save money or is he trying to make it easier for him to make money etc.
These threads or comments like them are all over the place and I get tired of seeing them like the topic hasn't been said
BTC difficulty * 1000 = times a don't mine post like this is done now lol
I had put the value of 400 million difficulty into the online BitCoin mining calculators, and used 5 cents per KW for the electricity. At 400 million, your 550 GH/s Jupiter will net you 0.69 BTC per day.
Now think about this.....
With the way the difficulty has been rising, how many more steps before it gets to 1 billion difficulty? 8-10 steps maybe? Taking 3-4 months?
At 1 billion difficulty, a 550 GH/s Jupiter will get you 0.27 BTC per day.
Does it seem like a good place to invest $4995 now? When you'll return ~ $50 a day IF the price stays where it is and doesn't collapse again?
I didn't think so either.
And at 2 billion difficulty, 550 GH/s gets you 0.138 BTC per day........
Now think about this.....
With the way the difficulty has been rising, how many more steps before it gets to 1 billion difficulty? 8-10 steps maybe? Taking 3-4 months?
At 1 billion difficulty, a 550 GH/s Jupiter will get you 0.27 BTC per day.
Does it seem like a good place to invest $4995 now? When you'll return ~ $50 a day IF the price stays where it is and doesn't collapse again?
I didn't think so either.
And at 2 billion difficulty, 550 GH/s gets you 0.138 BTC per day........
If you're that desperate to throw money away, PM me for my PayPal address.
The difference is, I have this Jupiter if I send my money to KnC, while sending money to you, will you send me some sort of hardware?Yes, Dabs. If you send $250 to my PayPal, I will go to a local construction site and find you a really nice...... Rock. A nice smooth round rock. I'll bring it home and wash it and box it up to send to you.
That's about what your miners will be worth in 6 months with a few more of these 40%-50% difficulty increases every 10-12 days.
My hardware costs a lot less and produces almost as much BTC as your ASICs will! You'll SAVE MONEY! It's a really great deal!
If you find it profitable to mine, then mine.
If you don't find it profitable, then don't mine.
The "invisible hand of the market" will take care of everything else.
If you don't find it profitable, then don't mine.
The "invisible hand of the market" will take care of everything else.
Not when the visible hands of BFL and Avalon manipulate the market it doesn't.
STOP! Do not buy because I'm already buying and I dont want you to mine because that way I won't mine as much bitcoins as I want
No more mining means no more Bitcoin.
This assumes that everyone who wishes to mine would have to buy a miner to do so. There are people for whom miners are a sunk cost -- for example, every one of KNC's customers.Jump to: