Topic: Swedish ASIC miner company kncminer.com - page 1929. (Read 3049501 times)

Dont need:) Im trader but im intrested only in FOREX eur/usd and options on cboe(some indicies). The main reason for me buying Jupiter is support bitcoin network and mine some BTC for future hold.

If you expect higher BTC/EUR just buy BTC now!

Its my opinion, i dont think that 100TH/s is big amount. 1000x jupiter will be 400TH/s thats quite big. But im counting with higher BTC/EUR. So even with diff 300mil(global network 2000TH/s !!!!) its still good, 2000eur/month if BTC/EUR=100 with 1x Jupiter.

I agree with you that less efficient Gen 1 asics such as Avalon or BFL will become obsolete... but they wont until diff rises quite a bit past that 150-200mil.
Until then the millions of Avalon chips will make a significant difference. And BFL might (I doubt it) speed up production.

Bitfury -few TH/s?
I disagree. Poject "100TH" will (eventually) deploy 75TH in August and 25TH later on, metabank will (eventually) deploy around 50TH until October, Bitfurystrikesback/Megabigpower will (eventually) deploy several hundred TH until the end of the year (if shipment begins in August).

I would be very pleased if the competition fell on their face between now and November, but that's just wishful thinking. I have estimated that difficulty will be at 100M by September and likely 200M by late October/early November. Until KnC has some sort of a major delay, I'll keep my order, but I am not planning on making a ton of profit.

BFL - very slow shipping - no worries - obsolete soon
Avalon chips - pfff nothing - obsolete after KNC will start shipping
Avalon batch 3 - no shipping, if yes only 36TH/s - means nothing
Bitfuty - few TH/s means nothing
ASICminer - obsolete soon

Other companies - avalon clones - means nothing

Thats my opinion.

its gonna be tight even if they do deliver on time.

there is a huge difference in profitability between september & november..(IE. slim & NONE)

i'd be interested to hear what KnC themselves have to say (NOT Bitcoinorama, we know you went to visit etc)

there is a slim possibility that either BTC price will go up substantially or that other alt-sha256 coins will come into prominence along with bitcoin.  There is likely use for asic bitcoin hardware but it will now be a knowledge and efficiency game to find that next new coin and get in while difficulty is low. 

So..difficulty is up to 31M already which concerns me.  As someone who has a Mercury on order that I don't expect to see until October at the earliest, according to the new mining calculator at the genesis block mining.thegenesisblock.com, things aren't looking favorable

For me, its looking like 140 days to break even, then maybe $300-$400 gain over that before losing money.  I could upgrade to a Saturn but those don't look much better - Jupiters still looking decent though.

So for me, as much as I want to support KnC, I'm considering canceling strictly based on current/projected difficulty...anyone else?

You will have to wait until September 2013 to see if they deliver on time wont you. The timing is obviously a best estimate, not a guarantee of anything, it maybe sooner, it may be later, it maybe not at all, those are your three options.

Guaranteed by fiat.

What guarantee that they will deliver on time? will get our Miner in September 2013 guarantee??

I'm of the opinion that KnC will deliver on time.  If that is true, then you will make money on your investment.

I don't know your situation and you should never invest money that you can't afford, but I would upgrade.

I have the opportunity to upgrade my Saturn for $3500 and really not sure what to do. It is already pumping 400G/H/s which isn't bad for my first miner. If money wasn't an issue I'd probably just go ahead and do it.

Has anyone else upgraded their units with their upgrade packages or just kept the same?

Speaking of the number of pads vs. the number of actual leads on the chip, check out this actual die photo of an Avalon chip: http://zeptobars.ru/en/read/avalon-bitcoin-mining-unit-rig

As you can see, the number of pads is completely different from the number of pins on the package.  There are something like almost 400 pad (I didn't count all of them).  Bitsyncom could have added more pins, without changing the chip design if they thought they needed more power, they could have gone from 48 to 200, and it wouldn't have meant a single change for the die itself.

It could simply meant they wanted more "power balls" or perhaps they wanted to add some redundancy on the data lines. The chip could have thousands of pads for all we know.


There could be 10s of companies doing exactly that. In fact, Yifu actually mentioned some VC backed projects that were looking to do ASICs for personal mining use. Hopefully none of them are up and  running before my KnC pays for itself

+1   felt the same after reading that.   The MARS was the FPGA prototype that is being used for the ASIC which is why there isn't that much more talk about the development.   Marcus is working on the 2nd gen at this point.   Everything is already done designwise with the first gen

I believe they are talking about a bitcoin IPO on bitfunder or btct.co.  This would be very easy to do and could instantly raise $1,000,000+  That's assuming of course that KnC even needs the funding which I don't think they do.

Agreed about Israel.  However, this IT company you're mentioning that got $40M didn't start with 0 revenue when they got their VC funding - unless the entrepreneur or founder has a track record.  Nor do I believe that they are building a hardware product (correct me if I'm wrong). You need some degree of traction - maybe after their first successful launch of their products can KNC attract the right VCs.  Before that, they're going to rely on angel investors or family, friends, and fools - and I think we belong to the "Fools" category.  Crazy enough to bet that it'll all work out in the end.

KNC is in Sweden, I have no idea what the VC community looks like there - but they have a great home-grown tech ecosystem that seems to know what they're doing.  Minecraft never touched venture capital even though "Knotch" came from King.com, and Spotify came from ex developers from StarDoll (already successful before he left to start Spotify) - you'll need those type of chops to even get VCs interested pre-revenue, pre-users, pre-traction. 

I'm not saying venture capital is not a path they should take, it' just rarely make sense if you don't need it from the beginning.  You guys read too much Techcrunch to think that venture capital flows freely - build something first, get users or customers, then talk to investors.  Otherwise, keep your day job.

IPO? Is this 1999?  You're kidding about this right?  IPO oriented company needs at least 3 years of trailing revenue and a prospectus that people understand.  People still don't get what a Bitcoin is, let alone a mining hardware manufacturer - I'll be surprised if even the Winklevoss twins can get their Bitcoin ETF through.

EDITED: I didn't realize you guys are talking about an IPO on something like Bitfunder in the spirit of ASICMiner. I think KNC wants to go the high road of a traditional business (with preorders!) than experiment with an unregulated and quasi-shareholder model.

FYI, KnC has not disclosed how many miners will be purchased by employees and owners of the company, but for argument's sake I'll let you assume that it's a (much) smaller operation than ASICMiner's.

Whether it's mining or selling hardware, I'm all for being able to participate as a shareholder. Without going back through the numbers, I believe that ASICMiner has distributed more dividends to shareholders from selling mining hardware than actual mining dividends.