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Topic: [TAT.VIRTUALMINE] - page 16. (Read 39878 times)

hero member
Activity: 938
Merit: 502
June 07, 2013, 04:08:07 PM
Anyone jumping ship is misinformed. TAT.VIRTUALMINE is worth way more then BTC0.072 with the divs so high. Thanks for another timely div, it seems to be getting earlier lol.

 Smiley

From the contract one agrees to when purchasing these bonds:
"Reserved Rights
Issuer reserves the following rights:
1. To issue additional shares as the market demands
2. To buy back shares at any time within the listed parameters
[...]

Buyback Rights
The issuer reserves the right to buy back bonds at a price equal to 110% of the highest price the asset was traded for over the prior 7 days or 200 times the value of the most recent dividend.
"

TAT will keep it going as long as possible. We'll see what happens to the difficulty. At a certain point price/MH will meet with asicminer. Until then I'm pretty happy collecting 3x more divs a week.

No, TAT will keep it going as long as it is profitable.  This is a bond, not a charity.  The second difficulty rises to the point where his AM shares don't pay out enough to cover the coupon payments, he'll buy back the bonds, most certainly at 200x the dividend, which will be quite small by that point, leaving investors with a loss (lets be honest, if AM shares aren't putting out, this 1 Mh/s bond isn't going to be putting out squat).

The 200x buyback clause is the reason this bond is extremely risky, and in a rational, informed market, the price differential between this bond and others such as JAH on BitFunder or PAJKA on BTC-TC should reflect that.
hero member
Activity: 938
Merit: 502
June 07, 2013, 04:02:10 PM
So what happens if the difficulty skyrockets?  TAT is required by the contract to provide the equivalent of 1 Mh/s per bond of output in coupons.  If the network hashrate increases to the point where 1 Mh/s produces only around 100 satoshis per day, TAT is perfectly able to buy back the contracts at 200x that value per the terms of his contract.  While I do trust TAT and think he's a good manager, this risk is way, way too big to take on this one, sorry.  Especially if BFP does ship, the network hashing power will go through the roof.  TAT could actually make a profit in this case, assuming he buys back all the bonds at a fraction of the principal.
legendary
Activity: 1022
Merit: 1000
June 07, 2013, 03:35:59 PM
you just got 700BTC from the shareholders of the VIRTUALMINE. given, diffuculty won't raise, you have thereby enough money to pay them 180 days. what a pitty, that afterwards, you will have to throw in money each day (4btc each day, am i right?)

but hey ... what if difficulty might skyrocket and break through the magic petahash frontline? that might mean, that you will have to pay them 0.36 each day (alltogether, not each), or even less.

we are going to converge the daily income for 1MHs asymtotically to satoshis. You will pay them hundreds of years and still have >> 100 BTC profit.


All true, buy back otherwise paying daily satoshis for hundreds of years. Cheesy
sr. member
Activity: 378
Merit: 250
June 07, 2013, 03:11:11 PM
TAT, you found a big fan in me Grin


you just got 700BTC from the shareholders of the VIRTUALMINE. given, diffuculty won't raise, you have thereby enough money to pay them 180 days. what a pitty, that afterwards, you will have to throw in money each day (4btc each day, am i right?)

but hey ... what if difficulty might skyrocket and break through the magic petahash frontline? that might mean, that you will have to pay them 0.36 each day (alltogether, not each), or even less.

we are going to converge the daily income for 1MHs asymtotically to satoshis. You will pay them hundreds of years and still have >> 100 BTC profit.

That's such a good idea, that makes me jealous not having it on my own first  Cool

If you have left over some coins after buying more AM shares, go to your holidays--they're well-deserved


EDIT: I see, todays total divident payout was around 3.25, making it work for 233 days, if it stayed constant.
 
I am out at 0.0072499, made some profit....still nice investment right now...but for long time...we should see panic selling of those assets...so far the only thing can be bought for is AM....nothing else...
full member
Activity: 127
Merit: 100
June 07, 2013, 02:56:30 PM
TAT, you found a big fan in me Grin


you just got 700BTC from the shareholders of the VIRTUALMINE. given, diffuculty won't raise, you have thereby enough money to pay them 180 days. what a pitty, that afterwards, you will have to throw in money each day (4btc each day, am i right?)

but hey ... what if difficulty might skyrocket and break through the magic petahash frontline? that might mean, that you will have to pay them 0.36 each day (alltogether, not each), or even less.

we are going to converge the daily income for 1MHs asymtotically to satoshis. You will pay them hundreds of years and still have >> 100 BTC profit.

That's such a good idea, that makes me jealous not having it on my own first  Cool

If you have left over some coins after buying more AM shares, go to your holidays--they're well-deserved


EDIT: I see, todays total divident payout was around 3.25, making it work for 233 days, if it stayed constant.
 
hero member
Activity: 518
Merit: 500
June 07, 2013, 02:26:55 PM
This security was just approved on BTCT, how many shares will be released initially?
And at what initial price? Thanks for your reply.

This is news to me! I'm actually travelling for a few days so I might need to hold off til I get back. We'll see though!
sr. member
Activity: 336
Merit: 250
June 07, 2013, 02:15:49 PM
This security was just approved on BTCT, how many shares will be released initially?
And at what initial price? Thanks for your reply.
full member
Activity: 238
Merit: 100
June 07, 2013, 02:08:40 PM
This security was just approved on BTCT, how many shares will be released initially?
full member
Activity: 182
Merit: 100
June 07, 2013, 12:59:45 PM
Anyone jumping ship is misinformed. TAT.VIRTUALMINE is worth way more then BTC0.072 with the divs so high. Thanks for another timely div, it seems to be getting earlier lol.

 Smiley

From the contract one agrees to when purchasing these bonds:
"Reserved Rights
Issuer reserves the following rights:
1. To issue additional shares as the market demands
2. To buy back shares at any time within the listed parameters
[...]

Buyback Rights
The issuer reserves the right to buy back bonds at a price equal to 110% of the highest price the asset was traded for over the prior 7 days or 200 times the value of the most recent dividend.
"

TAT will keep it going as long as possible. We'll see what happens to the difficulty. At a certain point price/MH will meet with asicminer. Until then I'm pretty happy collecting 3x more divs a week.
sr. member
Activity: 391
Merit: 250
June 07, 2013, 12:49:19 PM
Anyone jumping ship is misinformed. TAT.VIRTUALMINE is worth way more then BTC0.072 with the divs so high. Thanks for another timely div, it seems to be getting earlier lol.

 Smiley

From the contract one agrees to when purchasing these bonds:
"Reserved Rights
Issuer reserves the following rights:
1. To issue additional shares as the market demands
2. To buy back shares at any time within the listed parameters
[...]

Buyback Rights
The issuer reserves the right to buy back bonds at a price equal to 110% of the highest price the asset was traded for over the prior 7 days or 200 times the value of the most recent dividend.
"
full member
Activity: 182
Merit: 100
June 07, 2013, 12:29:43 PM
Anyone jumping ship is misinformed. TAT.VIRTUALMINE is worth way more then BTC0.072 with the divs so high. Thanks for another timely div, it seems to be getting earlier lol.
full member
Activity: 148
Merit: 100
June 07, 2013, 11:01:14 AM
Another div payed, as you say, shame its not as high as before but the beauty is that these are still great returns and we know it'll be the same tomorrow (for now... the question is when to jump ship!  Wink ).

The divs are so high in fact I'm considering dropping at LOT more into this at least for the short term. Thanks TAT. Smiley
newbie
Activity: 31
Merit: 0
June 07, 2013, 09:33:27 AM
Difficulty jump reaaallly saddened me though, one day after I buy the shares and get a nice dividend it drops 22%, that's why i asked earlier, I was hoping it was not the monstrous difficulty increase Angry .
Either way I love these assets  Grin
full member
Activity: 196
Merit: 100
June 07, 2013, 07:34:06 AM
TaT has a Midas touch.

Despite the expected drop in dividend the price is as strong as ever for these shares:

Quantity|Price
________|_____
2,053|฿0.007250

Congrats on meeting the bitcoin communities desire for easy to understand products.
full member
Activity: 144
Merit: 100
June 07, 2013, 06:03:55 AM
Just wondering, why should he give us a bonus?  The description of this asset clearly stated what we would be getting, and that we would be paid, per share/unit, based on 1Mhash of mining power.
what is the bonus?Huh

There is no bonus.  Alexius89 suggested that he pay one because dividends were not what he expected and that ASICMiner paid so well this week.
hero member
Activity: 938
Merit: 502
June 07, 2013, 01:50:05 AM
...and for fuck sake people, bonds do not pay dividends!
Bonds pay interest to the bondholders. Why? Because bond is a DEBT aka loan.

Get this shit right and you start making sense. This is not that hard to master


^This. Yes. Coupons, not dividends.
sr. member
Activity: 378
Merit: 250
June 06, 2013, 06:11:48 PM
Just wondering, why should he give us a bonus?  The description of this asset clearly stated what we would be getting, and that we would be paid, per share/unit, based on 1Mhash of mining power.
what is the bonus?Huh
full member
Activity: 144
Merit: 100
June 06, 2013, 03:06:52 PM
Just wondering, why should he give us a bonus?  The description of this asset clearly stated what we would be getting, and that we would be paid, per share/unit, based on 1Mhash of mining power.
hero member
Activity: 709
Merit: 500
Gridcoin Foundation
June 06, 2013, 02:02:43 PM
okay sorry  guys :-D    anyway  a nice bonus for every Virtualmine share  would be fine :-)

TAT  you just got a high dividend from your AM Shares
full member
Activity: 182
Merit: 100
June 06, 2013, 01:53:07 PM
the Dividend was really low.. strange is that the difficulty  raised by 28%  but the Dividend was gone down by almost 50%     a bit strange or not?    Maybe TAT could offer a kind of Bonus because the dividend of th AM shares  was so high ;-)

Its the same. ฿0.00003223*1.284=฿0.00004138. At this difficulty its ฿0.00003223 per 1 Mh/s. You can check it on a mining calculator.

It actually went down 22.1% from ฿0.00004138.
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