Topic: [TAT.VIRTUALMINE] - page 4. (Read 39878 times)

Currently a BTC-for-BTC investment in this stock pays more dividend than AM shares. As mentioned previously in this thread, however, the dividend for this share is inversely proportional to current difficulty as the share represents a constant hashing rate. If you do the figures, the current share price of ~0.004 will be paid for with dividends in less than a year (do the maths yourself, as every investor should! an excel spread sheet will suffice) if you assume a fortnightly difficulty increase of no more than 10%. Recent times have seen difficulty jumps of much more than this, say 20%, and people have become scared that this will continue - hence all the furor in this forums about mining bonds being "scams".

Simply put - at the IPO price of 0.007 these shares are almost certain to never pay the investor back. At the current prices, and assuming difficulty stops jumping by 20% every two weeks, the dividends of these shares are quite nice. Buying all shares is a gamble, the gamble you're making for VIRTUALMINE is that the difficulty CANNOT sustain 20% increases.

Yes they are quite lower to the IPO now
the Dividend will go down and probably a lot! as the difficulty increases  you have to make a guess basically how much the difficulty will increase and see at what price it will be profitable to buy...
do you Math! True for any PMB out there, and decide...

On another note... it would be a good thing for PMBs in general if the issuer put a minimum duration in the contracts, as it stands there is a risk for the issuer to just pack up and leave one day....
I don't believe that's TAT's intention at all but it would be a nice insurance for the buyer...

I am still trying to figure out why this is bad or good..   I mean I could buy like 900 shares today and earn $2 per day for the dividend...

Is the real risk that the price per share is too high???   (they are low now compared to what they IPO'ed for???

Will the Dividend go down or will more supporting shares  be purchased to keep the Div up as Diff increases??

To me the Div payout seems really good compared to most other stocks I have been researching on bitfunder???

(not fixed)

Yes that is a fixed dividend PER SHARE, so if you buy n shares,the dividend will be ((div per share) x n).
Note that as the difficulty rises, the dividend per share will lower

Have a quick question on the Dividends and how this bond works. At the moment I can see that the dividend per share is fixed at BTC0.00002600 . Will this be fixed per share no matter how many shares are purchased by an individual? e.g. If I bought 10,000 shares, then would it be a case that my dividend would be paid out at BTC0.26 per day?

Lets assume we have a honest business, who actually plans to spend the coin properly and buy the equipment.
If one escrows all the coin from IPO, how do you buy the equipment needed for mining? Unless you expect the third party to convert the coin and pay the bills etc.

it's called "flipping" any real trader will take 50% when it doubles and ride free shares..thanks

Are you sure you did not confuse some terminology here?

IPO 100 shares at 1 = 100
One trade at 2 and your market cap is 200

If you don't know what you're doing with your damn money, here's some great advice: keep it in cold storage.  Don't spend it.  Its your own fault if you lose it on investments.  Its not anyone else's fault.  There's no room for excuses such as "lack of experience" in a free market.

When I first started out, I got scammed for 0.75 BTC on BTCjam.  I bitched and moaned about the shady users who scammed me, but it was by no means BTCjam's fault.  The issuer/intermediary simply gives you the information; you're the one who makes the decision.

Wow, someone sold below expected coupons.... That must me the buyers market price

That would be true if and only if the investment will cause all investors to lose money. Here, the issuer is betting that the difficulty will change at a rate that will cause him to have a net positive return. Investors are betting that the difficulty will change at a rate that will cause THEM to have a net positive return. As long as neither is absolutely assured (and it's not), the bet is fair and it's up to the market to determine the appropriate price based on risk. If nobody thinks the issue price is fair, nobody will buy at IPO.

There's a lot of FUD about these. Transparency is the only remedy. But arm waving and hyperbole is not actual transparency.

 Approve a investment which absolutely will causing investors loss money is a wrong, that is nothing to do with how Furuknap write on its contracts bad or good.
We know that Friedcat never make effort in paronomasia, but everybody likes him.

You can't because someone write a nice cheating plan by into every detail, then you concluded this is a good plan.

If Furuknap is a person with moral integrity,  He should not issuing his bond before his devices delivered.  he should not issuing a bond at today's price but mining three months later.   He should not sell his pre-orders 20 times expensive than what he paid. If he take responsibility for his investors he should promise a maturity date for his bond... If he promised ,then this will greatly preventing his contracts losing its value, as well as protecting investors faith in BTCT.He should sell his contracts at 0.2 per M/hash which is 10 times than what he paid , and he can use the profit from this issuing to pay the overhead which relating to operating those miners, and still have some more to spend on  another miners  or doing other investment.By given a maturity date he need to promised what price he will pay back of its initial capital he received.  The term of perpetual is  unfair  which gives absolute predominance to the issuers, I know you are insiders of BTCT, you should make some effort on it to changes the way PMBs used to be, rather than explaining how good  he wrote his plan and how this affects you to derive your decision.


What you did is by helping those greedy people to exploiting on those less experienced investors, and you really should not argue with me , because  you have  made a wrong decision which you had approved it.
  

I voted YES because despite the fact that it is a "perpetual mining bond" and it is probably a losing investment, Furuknap goes into great detail and explains everything fully, including the risks. I predict that the investment will lose money, but I could be wrong. Since I feel he has left no stone unturned and I do not base my approval on predicted performance, there was very little reason to not approve it.

no this is where the rubber hitz the road are you ready?..lol

I'm trying my hardest to take every question and concern seriously this weekend, but these posts are degenerating into baseless assumptions and unintelligible randomness.

Maybe it's the full moon throwing me off?

Four values to choose from :
- expected coupons: 0.0027 (200 day range)
- buyback 1: 0.00698
- buyback 2: 0.0052
- buyers market price: 0.0008 - 0.003314

Backing not secured...

where are these secured shares registered?..thanks

Between my direct shares, AM-PT shares, and G.ASICMINER PT shares I have more than enough to back my assets. Later this week I will be applying for my board seat with AM, after which I will be issuing a full transparency report to make it easy for everyone to have an update on my holdings.

TAT holds over 5k ASICMINER shares, so not sure why you think he doesn't hold 233.