Topic: The happy BTC circular donation thread - page 6. (Read 14718 times)

you have the skype transcript in the thread

the scammer was iluvbitcoins but his account is now in my hands since I kept it as collateral after the first loan
however I was stupid enough to give him the 0.4BTC loan without collateral trusting he'll pay it back

Since we are at giving, here is a president who gives 90% of his salary, because he does not need it.

Gweedo does and I have sent both a message to this thread.

Thank you sir.

I don't want to be harsh, but since this is a new concept and people (me topmost) have the tendency to write before reading, it must be expressed very clearly so that it is almost ridiculous. (Well, the concept is ridiculous for outsiders...)

Do you know if they have the same nick here? Remember to link them to this thread!

Since I was busy and did not read full premise I have deleted my above post, sorry Risto for not following rules.  And with some free time and reading this is a great concept.

I give 0.25 to joesmoe and 0.25 to Gweedo because of the work they do at CC and the fact that if they donate to others they know more people supporting and building more to BTC than I do, and thus would hit more worthy individuals.

Would you rather have this:


or this:

,

OR first have 5 or more people experience THIS:


AFTER WHICH, you can still have the first and the second!

--//**//--

Money does not extinguish itself. (Money extinguishes debt without generating new debt; thus fiat is not money, but this is just a tangential issue here, because in gift economy there is no debt.) Therefore, to generate happiness by means of money, it does not matter how much money you have, because it is not consumed in the process IF you can make such a process where it is not consumed.

Research shows that money increases happiness in multiple occasions (results are statistical, and as such do not apply in every single case):

EARNING money increases happiness.
SPENDING money increases happiness.
GIVING money increases happiness.
RECEIVING money (impersonally, without connection to your effort or the giver) DOES NOT increase happiness.

It should be very easy to increase happiness, just by sending some money circulating so that people would receive with connection, gaining some happiness, and then give, and spend, and gain more happiness. It would just go on and on.

Mathematically, if in each round, X% of the money is withdrawn from the circulating pool, the total amount gifted until the pool runs dry, is (original amount)/X.

Therefore, when we approach the point that people withdraw only small amounts, like 20%, 10% or 5%, or nothing at all, some magic happens: the original 10btc donated is multiplied to 50 or 100 btc, making much more people happy and empowered than could otherwise be the case. All the money in the pool is spent (happiness * 10btc), but in addition it is given 5-10 times (happiness * 50-100 btc). Furthermore, because a myriad of people have been able to decide (one at a time) concerning the spending, the money will likely be spent in ways with very high marginal utility. Totally unlike if I tried to spend my money in good people or good projects, because I have no way to evaluate them. Or the government, which is much more miserable than I.

But, organized charities suck the money from the people in a similar way as governments. The aims are much better, but the means not much different. It is not an organic way of doing things. You get the joy of giving, that is correct. But there the cycle ends. The recipients of the aid are not any happier (don't blame me saying so, it is research). They don't get to earn, spend, or give. It is spoonfed to them.

Also, as I wrote in the introduction of this post, if you have a pet project that needs funding, please consider that everyone has pet projects: if your judgement is that your project is so important that it deserves all the money, you are wrong. The marginal utility of money is such that someone further down the line, definitely has a pet project that could utilize a part of the money more efficiently than you. If you are such a big honcho that you don't take the time to find people to give a part of the money, why do you even have unfunded needs 

In general, people who say that their project is so important that its marginal utility and internal rate of return is higher than anyone else's, are wrong. If they even understood what they are talking about, they would have become rich beyond imagination by investing in their own project long ago.

And after it emerges to the people who have been blessed beyond their needs in their business or investments that, instead of withdrawing from the pool, they can donate some more to it, then we have a perpetuum mobile: The pool never runs dry, there is complete accountability with who gives and takes money and for what purpose, and nothing is ever decided by a community vote or any political and corruptible method.

- If you are a wealthy and magnanimous guy, this method gives you praise and adoration (unlike the current tax system which extracts the money out of you at gunpoint, and treats you as a criminal).

- The people in the middle, the ones connected in the society, are empowered much beyond any previous system. Large sums move through your hands and you get to allocate them to your needs if you suddenly have any, projects that need to be forwarded, and less fortunate people whom you personally know are good and honest. Since the middle class historically pays the most taxes, it is possible that these people will also want to be net contributors. 

- The poor guys learn the magic of money: the more you let go, the more it comes to you. If you are an all-sucking mouth that keeps all the money that others put in, you realize that soon they will not want to feed you so much. If instead, you keep the necessary minimum to yourself, and give the rest to those even worse off, soon you will not only receive more money, but also need less of it, and actually both you and your friends will soon not be poor at all.

I have been shrewd but not stingy. I have walked instead of bought a discounted bus ticket to save $1-2. But also several times donated 5-10% of my entire net worth to charities, including last year. I have been there, all the way.

This text is long, and there is no TL;DR because the concepts presented are so new, and even understanding what I am after, will require reading it again and again (for most).

--//**//--

This one is just the first one. And we learn what works and what doesn't. I will amend some terms in the OP now. Since no money has yet been sent, it is still possible to change your previous decision, unless the recipient person has already taken the money. Changes:
- Donations to people outside bitcoinworld are counted as your personal spending. The reason is that they are dead ends, and we cannot enforce them to report here how happy they are, and also they cannot give the money on, even if they don't need it.
- Donations to charities or any nonpersonal entities are personal spending.
- All personal spending (incl giving to Mum, or Monero development, or going to beer with friends and telling them how great Bitcoin is) should be documented with reasonable precision, such as David is showing upthread.
- If you have received 200mBTC or more, you must give to at least 2 different BCT members, other than yourself, at least 50mBTC each
- If you have received 100mBTC or more, you must give to at least 1 BCT member, other than yourself, at least 50mBTC
- Every gift has to be at least 50mBTC

It is OK to reject the gift, but if you spend it carelessly, then I will not give you more later, and hopefully the others don't, either.

I know, I know. The initiative is like what - 36 hours old now. And none of these have been so called "office hours". And it is the holiday season. In everywhere else in Europe, you get 14-30 DAYS (not hours) payment terms, and then it is customary to pay late.

So please do not be anxious if my gift does not come the second you want it, although it is my intention to transfer as soon as possible. To make everything accountable, othe is doing the actual work of sending the money, and he has not even gotten it from me yet.

Btw. If anyone else holds a grudge towards me for my debt that I haven't paid (I don't ever take debt, so I don't have a routine of paying them back either), please list it here.

As far as I know it hasn't all been given. I didn't receive any BTC yet. I did PM rpietila my BTC address as well I posted here in this thread.

I was very rushed when I made my prior comments, so apologize if I didn't hit all the points in my posts. I very much appreciate Risto recognizing my efforts to try to improve crypto-currency. I've tried to balance sharing my ability to analyze feature sets and technical possibilities publicly in order to foster better technical clarity in the community so as to aid progress by all, with retaining some insights privately for the time being. All insights to be revealed if they prove to work in real code, as it is incredibly inefficient to design new technology in public or by consensus (rather you make a proof-of-concept then you reveal it to the world when you are sure it works). Note I am not launching an altcoin is the sense that I won't be attaching my name or reputation to any altcoin.

I appreciate very much Risto's desire to spread the spirit of working together to better both crypto-currency and the world. I applaud the concept of spreading capital around in small morsels, because no one person is omniscient. Maybe that little flea on your shoulder has the idea for the cure to the ebola virus.

Helping people who are temporarily burdened by life issues, is not very costly, yet it potentially pays back 1000-fold especially if spread around. This is one reason I don't give too much charity to just one person, rather I spread it around, because how can I decide who will do the most with it? Life is way too complex for such omniscience, as God so designed it when he said "Go Forth and Multiply". I explained the science or mathematical justification of that statement.

Again thank you to Risto and I hope this spirit of goodwill also transfers to all parties involved in our space. I hope I can follow too. In any case, it is not critical that it must transfer/produce/succeed (as that would be a claim of top-down omniscience), rather only that Risto understands and exemplifies the mathematical reason that spreading goodwill is critical. For that, I applaud him greatly.

Kudos brothers. We are both learning as we move through this journey.

wow

I didn't know about that

he seems like Jesus

tl;dr

The following are utilities I use and think deserve tips (because they don't have any mandatory usage fee that goes to the developers):
http://www.bitcoinmonitor.net/
https://github.com/fordhurley/btc-priceimg
https://github.com/gbraad/html5-google-authenticator
https://github.com/pointbiz/bitaddress.org
https://github.com/nanotube/supybot-bitcoin-marketmonitor
https://github.com/spesmilo/electrum

This post bookmarked for future additions & reference when I can actually afford to donate BTC.

I am also going to lobby for this guy. He randomly paid of arklan's loan (which was 0.66BTC) and that is an amazingly kind act on a forum that is normally flooded with scammers. Read about it here.

Really liking this initiative and I like to support it. If I can do anything to help out, just say so.

I feel I have to say this...

Please consider also the intention outlined in the OP: to keep the money that you need, and find a person (/people) to give the rest to, to put him in the similar position, for a happy BTC circular donation.

Trying to find charities, so that the movement of the money would stop right there, is against the idea, and robs many rounds of people the joy of receiving, and the chance of deciding to whom the money should go next.

So please everybody, read the OP again, so that you get the idea

Hi! Now some have decided to keep some bitcoins, so othe can you provide the address where I can send this 10,000mBTC to? (The payment is outsourced to make it faster and more reliable).

I would like to lobby for BiPolarBob

I got scammed for 0.43BTC

He saw me for the first time and decided to donate me the whole amount

Read the thread here

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=705550.20

he's an awesome guy

don't leave negative feedback to iluvbitcoins since I got to keep it as collateral for the first loan, I'm trying to sell it currently

I read the OP but didn't understand it

now I get it, thanks

No, that is sort of the opposite of what is happening.
Its all been given already. 
Begging is forbidden in this thread.
What is happening now is that the initial recipients are posting who they are giving it to as a benefactor, or whether they are joining the happy recipients group.
If you didn't get awarded, you could lobby the current recipients outside this thread, but no begging here, its all in the OP.

so if I understand correctly, we write why we think we should get the money and you decide who you're giving it to?

Goat was good enough to take some time from his travel schedule to reply that he will regift the 500mBTC to JVWVU.  The ball keeps rolling...

I choose to be in the "happy" category, because I personally can utilize the BTC to make my productivity more efficient as alluded to in my prior post.

1KxTtf1AjoS5hne974YoKjWL6fqcBgJUpE

For example, I recently spent $635 at amazon.com for a 6 month supply of AHCC, which is the herbal cure I am taking to treat my viral infection and concomitant auto-immunity (mice were cured when injected with the virus I apparently have). Before that I was spending $9 per day to source it locally in the Philippines.

I also continue to give to allmany of the needy who ask my assistance and have continued to give out $200+ a month to recipients in the Philippines who ask for my help (hard to refuse people who can't eat or who are in pain with severe hernia or other condition). I have "peso padala" receipts (e.g. Palawan pawnshop, M'Lhuiller pawnshop, Cebuana Huiller, and LBC) documenting my ongoing philanthropy. I do this inspite of watching my capital dwindle, and even my local gold dealer holds $70,000 of my money and after 3 months can't provide me my money!

P.S. Armstrong is predicting the ebola virus to spread every where by 2017 - 2018. So there is going to be much suffering that needs to be addressed (ponder the orphaned children, etc). We really need to expand the size of the pie as rapidly as possible. I hope we can offset this with our efforts and see more people in the Happy category. He wrote some time ago about how his computer models were expecting a rise in the epidemic cycle. His models see a confluence of bad cycles rising all at the same time. We are headed into a very difficult period 2016 - 2020 maybe to be difficult until 2024 or 2032.

I entirely agree with rpietila's point that getting capital into the hands of those who are the most productive is how we create prosperity for mankind. We must grow the size of the pie, not fight over the pie while we shrink it with our myopic zero sum game thinking.

So great minds are thinking the same.

The role of a whale is to direct capital to the most efficient and productive. It becomes more and more difficult to do this as capital grows large, because the whale needs size and can't efficiently chase smaller opportunities. Thus a whale relies on those who can build systems that increase his economy-of-scale in terms of directing his capital to the most productive.

Thus I wholeheartedly accept rpietila's kind offer, as it is being placed into very high productivity-- much higher than a few months ago because recently my health has improved (due to AHCC and a Paleo diet). I still suffer some drag on my time, e.g. family burdens. And often capital can be expended to increase available time, e.g. hire a maid or send some $ for summer camps.