Topic: The problem with atheism. - page 32. (Read 38463 times)

Do you think that is what eternity will be?  Just simply existing?  I expect it to be beyond our wildest imaginations, with plenty to do.  Basically all of the time to pursue our interests and dreams and talents without any obstructions. 

Wouldn't it be? 100 years of accomplishments and overcoming difficulties is a long time. An eternity of simply existing is kinda

I agree.  It is the trials of life that refine us and make us who we are!

Then why is wrong for me, as a Christian, to believe that God might allow pain and suffering in my life to help me to be more compassionate and loving towards others too?  I believe that He can work all things out for the good of those called according to His purposes.

And the hope of a place after life where there is no more sickness, pain or suffering is a bad thing???

I think a way more interesting question is, can you really enjoy life (or afterlife) without suffering?

Theists believe suffering is something to be endured here on earth, before we pass into heaven where we will be free of suffering. As an atheist, I believe suffering is something that makes my life here on earth more meaningful and more enjoyable. I don't know what happiness and contentment is without having experienced the suffering that I can compare it to, and I can't feel accomplished or get a sense of overcoming and conquering difficulties without having a struggle to overcome. If everything was always perfect, and everything was just given to me, I wouldn't know what to do or how to feel, and would likely feel completely useless and meaningless.

I get your points Rassah.  We have had deep discussions on another forum before so I get where you are coming from, as you probably do I.   That said, It is often hard for me to understand why God does not intervene more often.  It can feel like we are God's pawns in a giant chess game and He just sits in the sky watching without doing anything at all.  But I guess that is where faith truly comes into play.  Because I do believe that He did intervene greatly when He came to earth. (For God so loved the Earth, that He gave His only Son, that whoever believes in Him will have eternal life)  That in itself is enough for me.  He understood pain and suffering on a level that is much deeper than just standing at a distance in heaven and striking down the evil when need be. 

I suppose in a way this earth is our test.  Will we trust God in spite of the suffering around us?  We have the choice.  Could God intervene (other than giving us hope beyond this crappy life by giving us Jesus) I suppose so but that is not what He chose to do, for whatever reason.  Although the Bible does promise that there will be 1000 years when He does lock up Satan and at the time things will be run as it should be here.  I think during that 1000 years He will show us how it should be done and the world will become a wonderful place to be.  Of course, Satan will be allowed to roam again after the 1000 years are up.  It probably won't take long for the hearts of man to harden again and get angry at God for the state of the world.

I prefer bitcointalk for this kind of crap arrogance.

But, again, all those things we have already known about. It wasn't god who set up those traditions and customs, it was the tribes, who wrote them down on the old testament. They were all things that were somewhat obvious and self-edivent: you eat this thing and get sick often enough, you learn that i's not a good idea to eat it. Since god is all knowing, it would have been trivially easy for him to tell us something completely unexpected and world-changing. But he didn't.



Yes, I have. Basically it's like being a parent to a child who loves you very much, and then when someone challenges you by telling you your kid doesn't actually love you, you decide to prove it to them by allowing them to torture the hell out of your kid, while you just stand there and watch smugly. I think it's a perfect example of why god is a sadistic and self-important bastard. No way in hell would I allow someone I care about be tortured just to prove a point about how much they like me in return.


Because God created Satan, Satan is God's child and his responsibility, and God could supposedly stop Satan with nothing but a thought, yet he refuses to do so, just so that Satan can continue to teach us a lesson in god's stead. It's as if Satan is doing all the work, and god just sits back and asks us to love him.

The Bible does advise many things that would keep us from getting diseases (such as not eating raw meat, sex within marriage as to reduce STDs and so on.  Many of the Kosher laws he gave the Israelites did  protect them from these things) but I do often wonder why He does not intervene more than He does and it is frustrates me too.  But I have come to realize that God is not so much concerned about ending suffering and pain on this earth right now as much as He is us trusting Him in spite of it.  Have you read the book of Job in the Bible?  That book gives great insight into God's purpose when it comes to pain and suffering. Perhaps we are being allowed to be tempted and see how great our faith is?

And where does all of the suffering pain and sickness come from? Why doesn't Satan get any credit for His part?  Why is God to blame for what is Satan's doing?  God is the one that promises that there will be no more dying, sickness and tears.  He is the one that gives us hope.

If he had come and told us, way back then about things like viruses, bacteria, and hygiene, he would have both GREATLY reduced our suffering for these millenia AND would have left an unquestionable ever-lasting mark on human history, bringing knowledge so advanced and beneficial out of nowhere, which could not possibly have come out of humans with that level of science and technology. But, alas, everything he taught us was pretty much common knowledge by then already.

The Bible is a great book to read to understand God's relationship with man.  I am not sure why you think it is as a kind of idolatry?  Is studying it idolizing it?  I guess because I read it and found it to be true? Regardless of that,  I think everyone should read it and other religious texts carefully and try to figure it out.  I find more people do not even study or ask ANY questions when it comes to religion or philosophy.   Many people have no interest in studying religions at all.  That is why I can respect most Atheist.  At least they are asking questions.  Studying ALL religions and philosophies is very important!  It is how we can understand the world, and each other better.

Lol

www.smbc-comics.com/index.php?db=comics&id=2073

Sort of.  Reality:god::thoughts:man.   Reality is the constraint god places upon himself. Thoughts are the constraints we place upon ourselves.  We're essentially isomorphic images of god.

Hey, can your god do that?

Okay, then make the sun come up in the west, please.

We are all gods/god.

www.smbc-comics.com/?id=3112

  Check it out- the reason this message is getting spread is because of unity- we can only live in peace when we are unified. As long as we worship different deities then there is not going to be peace- people worshiping elephant headed gods are going to clash with people worshiping griffons, people worshiping money are going to clash with people worshiping nature, and so on. This is why the commandments were revealed- what was the first commandment- Have no other gods before me- that means only worship the one true Reality, the source of all that exists. What is the second commandment? Don't make any images of creatures on the earth, flying in the sky, or in the sea. Why this commandment? Because people worship images, and then start getting in disputes about whether a guy nailed to a cross is better than a dove, or if the image of St. Bartholomew is cooler than the image of St. Nicholas.

     Jesus, peace be upon him, explains in the new testament that the foundation of all of the laws of the old testament is loving the Creator of everything we have and experience with all of our hearts, all of our souls, and all of our beings, and loving for others what we love for ourselves. Love for the creator comes first, because that is the unified field that connects us all.

   Atheism is a key component in right belief, because it is the denial of falsehood. Anything that attempts to describe the origin of the universe in terms that can be divided is falsehood. These divisions can then be used to sow dissension among people and achieve worldly benefit. The trinity is an example- dividing the Creator into father, son, and holy ghost renders fulfilling the first commandment impossible, because no one can balance their devotion perfectly equally into three parts- the love for one is going to be greater than the love for the other, and this will result in conflict between people favoring the holy spirit, like Pentecostals, or those worshiping the dude on the cross, like Catholics, and so on. This division resulted in the wars of the reformation, and they were pretty rough from what I have heard.

   The trinity was not established as a concept central to Christianity until about 300 years after Jesus, peace be with him, at the council of Nicea, and only because the emperor Constantine wanted a unified doctrine for political reasons as Christianity became the official religion of the Roman empire. The theologian, Arius, who was arguing for an indivisible Creator, actually got slapped in the face by one of the trinitarians, St. Nicholas, when the debate got heated. St. Nicholas was the original Santa Claus.

    Anyway, to deny these kinds of intrigues is understandable. But to argue that the universe came from nothing, or that you created it yourself, well... yeah. Different terms for the Creator are just referring to this Source.

   Atheism is ultimately a recipe for conflict, because if each person chooses their personal meaning for their life, it inevitably clashes with the personal meaning of others. Then people end up in parties whose interests are most similar and waging war against other ideological blocs. Hence the first commandment of Moses, peace be upon him. The Bible basically explains how every prophet tried to tell their people to follow monotheism and they constantly ignored them and ended up bringing disaster upon themselves by doing so.

  Monotheism supersedes polytheism because it is encompasses all of the minor deities. It is basically saying every god, idol, and perceptible thing is created and therefore not to be conflated with the Creator. It is saying that by serving only the one Creator, we are in fact serving all that exists, but nothing to the exclusion of anything else.

Boring.

This topic is not about religion but about atheism. Please stay focused.