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Topic: The Well Deserved Fortune of Satoshi Nakamoto, Visionary and Genious - page 5. (Read 13344 times)

hero member
Activity: 798
Merit: 1000
And really, it is Satoshi's identity that lies at the core of these efforts.  All of them.

'He' wants to remain anonymous, and I am ethically constructed in such a way that a request like that - from someone who has done no harm to anyone - is inviolate.

Would selling 1M bitcoins do no harm to anyone? What you want is for this information to remain hidden because it is very damaging to bitcoin's reputation. No one who has not invested in bitcoins gives a shit about who Satoshi is. What they will care about is that this mysterious inventor has the currency by the balls.
member
Activity: 84
Merit: 10
he would be in personal danger if it were known for sure who he was.

I think this is an overstatement at this point. Bitcoin is up and running, and "they" cannot coerce anything out of Satoshi, nor influence the network functioning. There are people with much greater leverage in Bitcoin economy now. As far as I know, no one has been in any danger because of owning bitcoins so far.

Cool if he wants to remain anonymous. What if he is just an uninteresting nerd anyway.. How long do you think the media would be interested? Two weeks maybe. "Mysterious Satoshi drives a Toyota and rolls his toilet paper from left to right." LOL

I believe you may be mistaken.  And I have not in any way expressed that it is Satoshi's ownership of significant quantities of bitcoin that lead him to believe he could be at risk.  Not that it matters to me - simply expressing the desire for privacy is sufficient, as far as I'm concerned.

However... here is but one question, among many surrounding Satoshi:

What are the implications of holding the private key to Block 0?  I assume Satoshi does - and spendable or not, hard-coded or not, it has such a key.  Would anyone who knows more about it than I (a very large cohort  Tongue ) care to comment?
donator
Activity: 1722
Merit: 1036
he would be in personal danger if it were known for sure who he was.

I think this is an overstatement at this point. Bitcoin is up and running, and "they" cannot coerce anything out of Satoshi, nor influence the network functioning. There are people with much greater leverage in Bitcoin economy now. As far as I know, no one has been in any danger because of owning bitcoins so far.

Cool if he wants to remain anonymous. What if he is just an uninteresting nerd anyway.. How long do you think the media would be interested? Two weeks maybe. "Mysterious Satoshi drives a Toyota and rolls his toilet paper from left to right." LOL
member
Activity: 84
Merit: 10
Why aren't you using your skills to do something useful?

I think you mean, why don't you do something that doesn't threaten the bitcoin economy. Confirming or nearly confirming that satoshi does indeed have 1m+ bitcoins is not good news for the knob slobbers.

I meant exactly what I said in my post, as a whole thing - not what you pick or choose to see.

I don't believe any entity with 1M bitcoin is a threat to any of us - white or black hats.  What is the incentive for anyone to damage the source of such wealth?

We've just seen what happens when a million or so gets dumped:  it's annoying.

The coins could be publicly destroyed.  So what?

And those are real actions, not merely the discovery of information; which is what Sergio is doing.  I can see the intellectual attraction of figuring out what Satoshi mined, but personally I find the idea abhorrent - especially when considering that every piece of information teased out of the fabric of reality is only one more step to revealing Satoshi's identity. 

And really, it is Satoshi's identity that lies at the core of these efforts.  All of them.

'He' wants to remain anonymous, and I am ethically constructed in such a way that a request like that - from someone who has done no harm to anyone - is inviolate.  On a political level, violating the privacy of someone who has requested it is a construct of the extreme right or the extreme left (which meet, of course, at authoritarianism) - and there is no question in my mind that the undercurrents surrounding Satoshi's expressed desire to remain anonymous are valid:  he would be in personal danger if it were known for sure who he was.

But of course, there are those who believe that their personal curiosity outweighs anything that any other human on the planet might desire for themselves.  To them I offer a subscription to The Enquirer.

legendary
Activity: 1512
Merit: 1036
It is known that the generation of block 9 belongs to Satoshi, and was sent to Hal Finney as the first transaction on the blockchain.

https://blockchain.info/block/000000008d9dc510f23c2657fc4f67bea30078cc05a90eb89e84cc475c080805

Is it one of the "black dots"?
It should be black red if you could see it and the spents are colored correctly, it was spent in block 170.

That is part of the first miner run count up from block 1-14. Nonconsecutive miner joins are at blocks 12, and apparent restarts at 15 and 18, though there is a good amount of start/restart/join/concurrent activity in the first few hundred blocks that can't be seen in the chart.
donator
Activity: 1722
Merit: 1036
I believe this is hugely bullish on bitcoin. The likelihood of "early coins on the move", has been reduced significantly. Not a wonder that the price shot up.
legendary
Activity: 1792
Merit: 1111
A  picture is worth a thousand words.

http://bitslog.wordpress.com/2013/04/17/the-well-deserved-fortune-of-satoshi-nakamoto/

This obviously contradicts every word GMaxwell and DeathAndTaxes said about mining during the first year.

Best regards,
 Sergio.



It is known that the generation of block 9 belongs to Satoshi, and was sent to Hal Finney as the first transaction on the blockchain.

https://blockchain.info/block/000000008d9dc510f23c2657fc4f67bea30078cc05a90eb89e84cc475c080805

Is it one of the "black dots"?
legendary
Activity: 1512
Merit: 1036
Please take into account that X-Axis is not time, but block number.

Here is the same data, but with the Time in the X-Axis.


Yes, that looks about the same due to the regularity of block finds, but it shows the satoshi miner lines as bending less than your previous graph when there is competition also finding blocks and advancing the block count. More transactions happening on the network will also steepen the lines - network activity increases everyone's extranonce counter faster.

The mean block finding rate at difficulty 1 is one block every 4295032833.0 hashes (just a bit more than 232).
By analyzing the code, the mean value of independent miner's extranonce increments should be 2.000015 (without transactions or someone else's block finds muddying the increment). That more extranonces are being "used up" by the "backbone miner", we know it does something different than everyone else's bitcoin.

Another interesting thing (hard to do at that low resolution), draw an imaginary vertical line through the graph and see how many miner lines it crosses, there are quite a few at any given point.

There's a few "birds" floating above the second half of the graph, somebody is using a different style of coinbase than difficulty + bignum ("ffff001d" + extranonce bytes + extranonce encoded) or you are parsing it wrong.
hero member
Activity: 812
Merit: 1022
No Maps for These Territories
+1 for transparency

Thanks again for the interesting research.
hero member
Activity: 555
Merit: 654
Please take into account that X-Axis is not time, but block number.

Here is the same data, but with the Time in the X-Axis.
legendary
Activity: 1512
Merit: 1036
Interesting, I was thinking of code to analyze this, who knew miners would pop out like this when graphed! I also am pulling my own stats out with bitcointools, but at a block a second, it takes a while. My stats add nonce, time, a spent status, and # of transactions to the table of extranonces, but I don't thing I will bother with writing my own analysis code.

http://bitslog.files.wordpress.com/2013/04/all10-5.jpg (image is wacky so just a link)

I see an interesting aspect, that the extranonce of the non-spending satoshi miner (if it is correct that red=spent and black=unspent) is increasing about four times as fast as others - it's steeper block finding slope indicates that it is significantly lower at block finding than it should be. Remember, computers are not competing against each other during this whole run, they are competing against the difficulty.

I believe this is because this miner is using different code than the released Bitcoin. It may have a getwork-style mining, where multiple CPUs are mining through it, and part of this increases the nonce faster than the block finding rate of the released Bitcoin. The nonce may increase faster if Satoshi was discarding fast block finds to make the block rate more regular (which they are statistically - pull out and analyse one series of increasing extranonces). Something that we see at about 1/10th, and again at 5/8ths of the chart, that the slope changes (along with a daily block rate change), I think that there was some change made in its code or the number of miners configured, maybe Satoshi added something that made the miner inefficient for few weeks and fixed it, or tweaked code to discard any blocks faster than a "heartbeat".

There is one scenario where I think this makes sense: Satoshi created a special "network-supporting" miner. This special always-on miner with it's own code base may have never created permanent keys or had a wallet - in that NOTHING appears spent from it's mining.

Without an always-on miner for people to try out the currency and keep confirmations rolling (and another node for them to connect to), the money would just plain not work. This miner runs different code than the release others are running, evidenced by the identical slopes of everyone else. This may be the "x" IRC username connecting over Tor - it would listen for IP addresses to connect to but normal bitcoins couldn't get it's IP address from IRC.


Another thing interesting is that you can see other black lines in the graph, other people mined for a while with release code and have never spent their generates. We know some people have early 50BTCs, but we can also surmise a few of these lines may be lost coins.

What you see are different THREADS of the same PC. Possibly two or four threads were running concurrently.
Each thread has it own ExtraNonce, but all threads are started almost at the same time.
There is no evidence to support this. In fact this disagrees with your discovery that most mining was done by one rolling extranonce. It may have been Bitcoin #1 + xMiner, as referenced in my previous posting thread. Remember, Bitcoin 0.1.0 doesn't mine unless it has a node connected to it - it counts the nodes, and if the number is 0 or has changed to 0, mining is disabled.

The Satoshi super miner might not have started until Satoshi's normal Bitcoin or another regular Bitcoin user was also connected. Satoshi may have a wallet with his own coins, but never will use the backbone miner's coins. New miner at #64 may be Hal getting Bitcoin working.
hero member
Activity: 555
Merit: 654
Is the periodic reset due to rebooting the machine ? Each week or so or on a given day ?

I estimate the PC is rebooted every 100 hours or 4 days.

I think this is for backing up wallets, but I'm unsure..
hero member
Activity: 555
Merit: 654
Funny... for being the same person, Satoshi's "clock" sure has a funny way of going backward in time, and then picking up immediately where it left off... or even choosing a different format altogether.  This is all in the first 12 hours of Bitcoin's public existence.  Interesting bits are colored.  Bold is just to make it easier to see the which part is changing.



What you see are different THREADS of the same PC. Possibly two or four threads were running concurrently.
Each thread has it own ExtraNonce, but all threads are started almost at the same time.

Nonsense.  Are you trying to tell me that the threads that found blocks 10-15 were started "almost at the same time", yet the "thread" that found block #12 was 47 X 2^32 hashes behind the one(s) that found #11 and #13?  I call BS.  And what about #58, #63, #65..?

No, I didn't mean so. These are probably different machines, My apologize. Deltas of 1 may be threads of the same PC.
 
full member
Activity: 217
Merit: 120
Presale is live!
Funny... for being the same person, Satoshi's "clock" sure has a funny way of going backward in time, and then picking up immediately where it left off... or even choosing a different format altogether.  This is all in the first 12 hours of Bitcoin's public existence.  Interesting bits are colored.  Bold is just to make it easier to see the which part is changing.



What you see are different THREADS of the same PC. Possibly two or four threads were running concurrently.
Each thread has it own ExtraNonce, but all threads are started almost at the same time.

Nonsense.  Are you trying to tell me that the threads that found blocks 10-15 were started "almost at the same time", yet the "thread" that found block #12 was 47 X 2^32 hashes behind the one(s) that found #11 and #13?  I call BS.  And what about #58, #63, #65..?
sr. member
Activity: 504
Merit: 250
Is the periodic reset due to rebooting the machine ? Each week or so or on a given day ?
hero member
Activity: 555
Merit: 654
Funny... for being the same person, Satoshi's "clock" sure has a funny way of going backward in time, and then picking up immediately where it left off... or even choosing a different format altogether.  This is all in the first 12 hours of Bitcoin's public existence.  Interesting bits are colored.  Bold is just to make it easier to see the which part is changing.



What you see are different THREADS of the same PC. Possibly two or four threads were running concurrently.
Each thread has it own ExtraNonce, but all threads are started almost at the same time.
hero member
Activity: 555
Merit: 654
This obviously contradicts every word GMaxwell and DeathAndTaxes said about mining during the first year.

Want to correct this hyperbole, now?



Do you mean that I should remove that sentence from the post?
If you or Gavin ask me to do it, then I'll do it.
full member
Activity: 217
Merit: 120
Presale is live!
Funny... for being the same person, Satoshi's "clock" sure has a funny way of going backward in time, and then picking up immediately where it left off... or even choosing a different format altogether.  This is all in the first 12 hours of Bitcoin's public existence.  Interesting bits are colored.  Bold is just to make it easier to see the which part is changing.

**EDIT** Added blocks 6-9 for additional context, fixed wrong link on #10..  Block 9 is known to have been mined by "Satoshi".
Block #coinbaseLink
104ffff001d0104https://blockexplorer.com/rawblock/00000000839a8e6886ab5951d76f411475428afc90947ee320161bbf18eb6048
...
604ffff001d0123https://blockexplorer.com/rawblock/000000003031a0e73735690c5a1ff2a4be82553b2a12b776fbd3a215dc8f778d
704ffff001d012bhttps://blockexplorer.com/rawblock/0000000071966c2b1d065fd446b1e485b2c9d9594acd2007ccbd5441cfc89444
804ffff001d012chttps://blockexplorer.com/rawblock/00000000408c48f847aa786c2268fc3e6ec2af68e8468a34a28c61b7f1de0dc6
904ffff001d0134https://blockexplorer.com/rawblock/000000008d9dc510f23c2657fc4f67bea30078cc05a90eb89e84cc475c080805
1004ffff001d0136https://blockexplorer.com/rawblock/000000002c05cc2e78923c34df87fd108b22221ac6076c18f3ade378a4d915e9
1104ffff001d013bhttps://blockexplorer.com/rawblock/0000000097be56d606cdd9c54b04d4747e957d3608abe69198c661f2add73073
1204ffff001d010chttps://blockexplorer.com/rawblock/0000000027c2488e2510d1acf4369787784fa20ee084c258b58d9fbd43802b5e
1304ffff001d013chttps://blockexplorer.com/rawblock/000000005c51de2031a895adc145ee2242e919a01c6d61fb222a54a54b4d3089
1404ffff001d013ehttps://blockexplorer.com/rawblock/0000000080f17a0c5a67f663a9bc9969eb37e81666d9321125f0e293656f8a37
1504ffff001d010ahttps://blockexplorer.com/rawblock/00000000b3322c8c3ef7d2cf6da009a776e6a99ee65ec5a32f3f345712238473
...
2004ffff001d0120https://blockexplorer.com/rawblock/00000000174a25bb399b009cc8deff1c4b3ea84df7e93affaaf60dc3416cc4f5
...
2504ffff001d0141https://blockexplorer.com/rawblock/000000008e35a1d59ea1be8d76683662f47fd13c62a9e347ad5845a26f762026
2604ffff001d0105https://blockexplorer.com/rawblock/0000000041438e52d25bccab8798a92cabafdaad69a071d3d2a41718faf01098
2704ffff001d0110https://blockexplorer.com/rawblock/0000000071350772f98f84babf35502b33d42ee8466d3dde0f376c4120352081
2804ffff001d0109https://blockexplorer.com/rawblock/00000000bb0d9430d3d1bab474be5050342161efcca9f7e45b151bff9a700944
2904ffff001d010dhttps://blockexplorer.com/rawblock/00000000c57a1b6351208c592eef8eff015d93c899a047fe35b35252a4a59bcb
3004ffff001d0121https://blockexplorer.com/rawblock/00000000bc919cfb64f62de736d55cf79e3d535b474ace256b4fbb56073f64db
...
3704ffff001d0157https://blockexplorer.com/rawblock/00000000ddd96d128e122d1179034ff66c27dc583eb9e8996a0b1779c60c6f86
3804ffff001d0107https://blockexplorer.com/rawblock/000000007c19ee8e924d3024d58efff50f872aadf256140bb1e3d62fea4fd6dd
3904ffff001d0109https://blockexplorer.com/rawblock/000000005665d506f6c3ccb5fd98624f9816a8a169f1d2327d1d4d6d3262ad12
4004ffff001d010ehttps://blockexplorer.com/rawblock/00000000b2f01f399bf503e55f25a1aa51067056d2eb81915cb91976968b69aa
...
5004ffff001d013fhttps://blockexplorer.com/rawblock/0000000026f34d197f653c5e80cb805e40612eadb0f45d00d7ea4164a20faa33
...
5704ffff001d017ahttps://blockexplorer.com/rawblock/000000004ff375707d7128dd2b080da4185727d534ea1b0aeac5877e00547391
5804ffff001d028200https://blockexplorer.com/rawblock/0000000075b4df54f33c4e60cf88c5dd6a6455f16f4fbe220ae81e157ce32ef1
...
6304ffff001d029f00https://blockexplorer.com/rawblock/00000000ebff91c88984bff39511f544a1c4ef6ec4f33e2ea531e47c2685628e
6404ffff001d0106https://blockexplorer.com/rawblock/0000000031975f17c5642a9c7e53ae4201a70a6ba6363036b55497b8754d1866
6504ffff001d02a100https://blockexplorer.com/rawblock/00000000aae47d47b6ff5eda6abab09cd6720684b1368eac70ac4240b3c90250
...
7204ffff001d02c700https://blockexplorer.com/rawblock/0000000082c0abb2875dc690a243dce6cbc856647b6422abbe82f97a3a7b127a
7304ffff001d0101https://blockexplorer.com/rawblock/000000008ec9525cb2092c6bd7d1c2580e595bcfa54bac51cf6f0278b242f25d
...
legendary
Activity: 1596
Merit: 1100
This obviously contradicts every word GMaxwell and DeathAndTaxes said about mining during the first year.

Want to correct this hyperbole, now?

hero member
Activity: 555
Merit: 654
Price is up $15 since he posted that picture ... maybe market feels better if satoshi has got the keys to the kingdom than god only knows who?

 Cool

I'm really very glad that you all have increased your savings value. I hope the coin goes up much more.
That's a sign that honesty and transparency help valuate the bitcoin. 

I've created my first Bitcoin address today. If you've earned a lot of money and want to send me a tip, here is my public addr: 17mcFB7Xyymd9hxp2bgNPz1ruWsdoPoCnZ

Smiley
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