This is why Ghash sucks and is worse than you think. - page 4.

bryant.coleman

legendary

Activity: 3766

Merit: 1217

Quote from: vpitcher07 on June 22, 2014, 09:25:19 AM

Bitcoin is supposed to be trust-less. In essence, we are currently putting a LOT of trust in ghash for them to do the right thing. They have so far, but that's not the point - we shouldn't even be having this conversation.

Perhaps that is true. But what can be done about this right now? As far as I know, the Bitcoin foundation does not have the rights to remove 51% attack susceptibility. And don't tell me that we should shift to some crappy altcoin. Grin

knightcoin

full member

Activity: 238

Merit: 100

Stand on the shoulders of giants

My thoughts about POW,

If you do an analogy between a network FIB (forwarding information base) and Longest prefix match
bitcoin is building the fasted string match up ever made ...,

jabo38

legendary

Activity: 1232

Merit: 1001

mining is so 2012-2013

Quote from: vpitcher07 on June 22, 2014, 09:25:19 AM

Bitcoin is supposed to be trust-less. In essence, we are currently putting a LOT of trust in ghash for them to do the right thing. They have so far, but that's not the point - we shouldn't even be having this conversation.

+1

vpitcher07

sr. member

Activity: 342

Merit: 250

Bitcoin is supposed to be trust-less. In essence, we are currently putting a LOT of trust in ghash for them to do the right thing. They have so far, but that's not the point - we shouldn't even be having this conversation.

bryant.coleman

legendary

Activity: 3766

Merit: 1217

Quote from: franky1 on June 22, 2014, 07:37:03 AM

+1
i have personally never done any death threating, as i think that GHASH has too much common sense to shoot thmselves in the foot. the point that still has to be made is that there is no protocol code to make bitcoin a truly trust less network.. right now people have to trust that GHASH wont be dumb

GHash guys built that gigantic mining pool through 3-4 years of hard work. They won't be stupid enough to destroy all of their effort, just for a few million $$$ (if they do double spending, it is the maximum amount that they could gain).

S4VV4S

hero member

Activity: 1582

Merit: 502

Quote from: franky1 on June 22, 2014, 07:31:17 AM

Quote from: SOAD on June 22, 2014, 06:05:08 AM

I disagree. I think people are making a problem where there isnt one.

thats because you "trust" ghash wont abuse the power they now have.

but bitcoin is meant to be trustless, where no one has such amount of power.

if only there was code that no mining collective can go beyond ~~40%~~ 15%, it would be a trustless network again

FTFY

franky1

legendary

Activity: 4424

Merit: 4794

Quote from: bryant.coleman on June 22, 2014, 07:32:21 AM

Is there any evidence for GHash double spending the coins so far? Only a few days ago they issued a press release, denying any plans to do so. As the biggest mining pool, GHash has done a lot to the Bitcoin sector. People need to remember that before indulging in death threats and name calling.

+1
i have personally never done any death threating, as i think that GHASH has too much common sense to shoot thmselves in the foot. the point that still has to be made is that there is no protocol code to make bitcoin a truly trust less network.. right now people have to trust that GHASH wont be dumb

bryant.coleman

legendary

Activity: 3766

Merit: 1217

Is there any evidence for GHash double spending the coins so far? Only a few days ago they issued a press release, denying any plans to do so. As the biggest mining pool, GHash has done a lot to the Bitcoin sector. People need to remember that before indulging in death threats and name calling.

franky1

legendary

Activity: 4424

Merit: 4794

Quote from: SOAD on June 22, 2014, 06:05:08 AM

I disagree. I think people are making a problem where there isnt one.

thats because you "trust" ghash wont abuse the power they now have.

but bitcoin is meant to be trustless, where no one has such amount of power.

if only there was code that no mining collective can go beyond 40%, it would be a trustless network again

S4VV4S

hero member

Activity: 1582

Merit: 502

Quote from: SOAD on June 22, 2014, 06:05:08 AM

I disagree. I think people are making a problem where there isnt one.

The problem was there long before Bitcoin core was released.

The answer to the problem is that we (the community and miners) should stick united and try and fight it.

I find that to be a bigger problem due to the fact that people are greedy.

We want a trustless system based on trust (amongst us)?

Nope....

jabo38

legendary

Activity: 1232

Merit: 1001

mining is so 2012-2013

Quote from: SOAD on June 22, 2014, 06:05:08 AM

I disagree. I think people are making a problem where there isnt one.

Can you elaborate on which of the articles' points you disagree with?

jabo38

legendary

Activity: 1232

Merit: 1001

mining is so 2012-2013

Quote from: S4VV4S on June 22, 2014, 05:59:27 AM

So what do you suggest we should do about it other than post threads that spread FUD?

Because I can almost guarantee to you that no changes will be made to the protocol.

Sorry, don't get me wrong, I too have tried to "come up" with a solution but the only solution is to change the protocol which means change BTC to an alt.

So any suggestions?

I agree with you. I am just a normal user and don't know how to come up with a solution. I have read that Gavin has been thinking about this and is possibly going to write something in the code.

It seems like to me the important thing that I can do is to keep awareness on this issue.

Yes, this thread's title is FUD, but the linked article is very real thoughts about the issue.

Ignoring it won't make it better.

Bitcoin is on a path towards something ugly.

I really love Bitcoin and so I am bringing up this issue. Even if I can't come up with the answer and you can't, hopefully somebody else will think upon it and come up with the answer if enough people show support.

Simply ignoring it won't make it go away.

SOAD

sr. member

Activity: 324

Merit: 250

I disagree. I think people are making a problem where there isnt one.

S4VV4S

hero member

Activity: 1582

Merit: 502

So what do you suggest we should do about it other than post threads that spread FUD?

Because I can almost guarantee to you that no changes will be made to the protocol.

Sorry, don't get me wrong, I too have tried to "come up" with a solution but the only solution is to change the protocol which means change BTC to an alt.

So any suggestions?

jabo38

legendary

Activity: 1232

Merit: 1001

mining is so 2012-2013

http://hackingdistributed.com/2014/06/16/how-a-mining-monopoly-can-attack-bitcoin/

The guys that wrote this aren't forum trolls, but people that have studied and studied this over and over.

Really? Huh

? How can Ghash be so destructive?

1. People are in denial
2. Ghash's strength lets it get an unfair advantage (selfish miners like this)
3. Ghash official un-decentralized bitcoin (now we can not longer say it is decentralized, but distributed like Ripple)

This is another problem with PoW in general as implemented currently by Bitcoin. The actually system encourages this kind of thing to happen because people are incentivised to do it. If Bitcoin is to stay strong the system needs to be changed so that people are incentivised to keep it decentralized.

Topic: This is why Ghash sucks and is worse than you think. - page 4. (Read 4122 times)