Topic: Trump will compete directly with Bitcoin (Read 1822 times)

So what. There's nothing in the US Constitution that says a president cannot be in prison and still be president. Trump's voters knew this was a possibility as did the Republican party--and they don't care. Indeed, I think Trump being a criminal is actually whole point of his presidency for a lot of his voters, since they mostly support him to outrage the other side.


That's sounds awesome.

Just FYI, all of Haypenny's nodes are located within the borders USA!

USA! USA! USA!

Deport Bitcoin NOW!!!

 

I think you refer to the capital gains taxes rumours? No, I'm not sure, there have been no new articles on this topic today. We'll have to wait for him to really dilvulge more details about his crypto policy.

I have investigated a bit and it seems Trump proposed this already in October in an interview, although in this occasion he said he wanted to include Bitcoin.

This seems to be the quote:

It also appears in this article too. Perhaps also this X user simply copied that "proposal" from that interview to get viral with it.

In general, I like the idea a bit more if decentralized cryptos like Bitcoins are also included and treated as currencies. If they really replace "taxes with tariffs", then probably the only tokens affected would be those issued by foreign companies, but those without identifiable issuer (like Bitcoin) would not be subject.

Are you sure about it?

Also what about the allegations, I'm not sure about their sensitivity but according to a few journalists whom i follow they've covered a few things about Trump in short I'm not sure about internal matters but mostly people are talking about that president can be arrested in power for the first time.

I know this has nothing to do with the market but still don't be in a hurry. I'm looking forward for what is going too happen on 25th of November and it will affect the market.

I've been seeing different tokens online since Trump became the next American president after Biden which he would be inaugurated by January. There has been so many shit coins in the market current that jumped from no where since Trump was elected. We ought to be very careful about many of these shit coins because it obvious that many devs and scammers are using this opportunity to lure investors to buy altcoins too has the price of Bitcoin keeps going bullish. We are still counting to see the price of Bitcoin hit $100K as soon as possible. Bitcoin is going to do better with time and we need to be prepared because this bull market is going to be huge and profitable.

LOL, "US-issued cryptocurrencies". I love it!

Bitcoin: not "US-issued", so pay your capital gains tax on earnings!

Trump's currency: no taxes! yay!

Haypenny currencies: no taxes! yay!

I'm liking this new president more and more .

And it seems the reverse is the case now, as Trump won and everybody is wanting to invest their money into Bitcoin, which has made it to skyrocket in price from $68k per BTC, which was it's initial value on the day of US Presidential election, (November 5th  2024), to breaking several new "All Time High" within a space of hours, and now currently been value at $88k per BTC at the time of writing this post is less than 10days. As this shows the huge positive impact Donald Trump has over the price value of Bitcoin, which I'm sure is literally a win-win for both parties, as the crypto community supported Trump for his presidential election victory, and likewise this recent bull-run, must be Trump's way of saying "Thank you" to the crypto community.

I think this fits quite well into this thread: Since several hours there is a rumour that the Trump administration plans to eliminate capital gains taxes on US-issued cryptocurrencies (i.e. cryptos issued by US companies).

For now it seems to be only a rumour, and major crypto media outlets haven't confirmed it yet. IMO it is also strange that most affected altcoins aren't really pumping as a reaction to this news (some, like Cardano, are even falling). So take this with a huge grain of salt.

Of course this would benefit Trump's own shitcoin too, and this raises questions: wouldn't that be an unfair advantage for Trump's own family businesses?

But even if this was not true, the (quite positive) reactions to the X post which started the discussion about that rumour indicates that there is a part of the crypto community which has moved very, very far away from the initial Bitcoin ideals. So let's embrace Shitcoin nationalism instead of a permissionless global currency?  

And it's again proof that at least that some Trump supporters in the crypto community do not really care about Bitcoin, what they want is a better environment for centralized shitcoin scams.

Maybe because an engineer, a doctor, an athlete or a farmer is not an investment expert? Maybe because they're competing against professionals who study investing, geopolitics and macroeconomics all their careers and still fail to beat inflation caused by fiat currency?

Get outside your bubble, man.

Care to explain how "keeping the value of the money you make" translates to "make free money" to you?

It has existed in the past. It was gold. Are you following? I feel like there's complete breakdown in communication.

Why wouldn't they understand it? Again, you keep implying the people should be able to get free money without even trying. That's not the real world.



You are asking for something that doesn't exist, has never existed, and will never exist.

If continue to imply that Bitcoin will never ever ever go down in price, making it rather stupid for every investor entity on the planet to invest in anything but Bitcoin. I don't know that there is any arguing with that, except to agree to disagree--because the implications of that override every other possible argument .

Fiat currency is more like liability than an asset but Bitcoin is truly an asset, a storage of value. Value of Bitcoin increases a lot with time, then price on market increases sharply with time too. Fiat currency does not increase in its value, but oppositely its value or more accurately its purchasing power decreases a lot with time.

It's easy to pick a rising one than a falling one. Risk of losing money and chance of getting profit, you have to consider and assess them, but with me, Bitcoin is my choice because it is better than fiat currency and I am aware of risk too.

Whatever. If you don't see the problem with people's savings getting devalued every day from a few central bankers, forcing them to gamble their money on things they don't understand, otherwise experience losses, then I don't know what to say.

No. I would be robbed if I was forced to treat a constantly depreciating shitcoin as legal tender, and be practically forced to either save in that, or gamble my money in stocks.

I'm asking for the value of the money I work for to be preserved into the future. The problem is that your fiat brain can't comprehend this simple thing, because you've been indoctrinated to accept that "it's okay for people's money to predictably lose value."

As low as possible. Just as gold was low-risk under the gold standard.

So every investment that goes down in value is "robbery"?

Will you be "robbed" if Bitcoin goes down in price ever?


You can't do that with any investment--or for that matter, any aspect of your life. You ask asking for permanent free money without even thinking about it.

Sounds like what you actually want is... Social Security  .


Got it. Exactly how low must this risk be? Have you ever quantified it? And how do you know what is "possible"? Did God tell you that? Because as far as I know there would be no other way to know that.

People's savings are getting robbed in a stable, and predictable way. The problem is that to "opt-out" of this robbing, you need to play it investor. You can't just buy a gold coin, and sleep easy that it'll worth the same in 20 years, as people could a century ago. (Again for a variety of reasons, not need to be discussed in here.)

Supply of fiat currencies expands by around 14% per year, for the last 60 years, on a weighted average. That's not slow. It means that in 5 years, they've robbed half of the average human being's savings.

USD is a viable "investment" if you compare it with other more volatile investments. But, if you look at it from the perspective of someone simply wanting to preserve their wealth for the future, it's like a bucket full of holes.

No? I never said that? I want a world where I can work, make money, and be able to hold the value of that money into the future, with the lowest risk possible.

Correct me about my economic assumptions, then.

But all investments are risky. There's no such thing as a risk-free investment.


Yes. Now apply that to what you said above .



Yes, but mankind has never developed a zero-risk investment instrument. Never. Ever. If you have been told that one exists, or once did exist, then you have been lied to.



Sure. And the USD has been far less volatile over the last 40 years than almost any investment you can think of. Yes, it has lost value over that time, but in a relatively stable and predictable way, and very slowly. In the right context, and in diversified portfolio of many other instruments, USD has been a perfectly viable investment. It is a low risk, negative yield investment, which is something investors require from time to time (viz. Warren Buffet recently moved $300B into USD because he thinks Trump is going to crash the US economy and cause a recession, leading to all equities losing a ton of value--so he can then buy cheap after the new floor is found).


So you want a world where you just make money without even trying? Sounds awesome--but it's a fantasy. You want a world where people who know nothing at all about investing are able to make as much money than professional investors who work on it all day long?

But contrary to your negativity, we are on the cusp of an amazing revolution in finance that will bring professional-level investing to virtually every individual on earth. Apps like Robinhood allow people to have an investment portfolio that is run by experts and yet use it like a normal bank account with USD in it--you don't know (or care) how your wealth is being stored, and the system automatically converts into your transaction mechanism when you need it on the fly.

Again, stop thinking about finance the same way the Illuminati conspiracy buffs did when they invented that stuff in the 1960s. The world has drastically changed and all of your assumptions about economics are obsolete.

Nope, just the ones that follow critical thinking.

No, that's exactly what I'm trying to tell you. When you invest, you acknowledge there is risk of losing money. That's fine. The problem is that under the current system you have to invest, or your savings gradually disappear. People want to save money for their future, but they're forced to put them into risky instruments, or they won't have savings anymore.

Look. Everything in this life involves risk. Even walking down the street involves some risk. But, since the inception of civilization, humans develop instruments to store value. This is pretty much the cornerstone of civilization; the ability to store value for the future, because present is pretty certain. Lowering humans' time preference is the basis of civilization, because it enables forward thinking and progress.

Sure, even stores of value involve risk, but what distinguishes them is that they are the least risky. For example, in the past hundred years, gold has been pretty good store of value. There was nothing as least risky as gold in the past centuries, and this is why people were saving in gold. There's also not counterparty risk with gold. That's when the property is highly influenced by an entity. For example, stocks are 100% influenced by the course of their companies. This is why a store of value needs to be "dumb matter" (with good money properties, of course).

But today, things have changed, and stores of value such as gold are no longer effective, for a variety of reasons. Thus, people are forced to "play the investors" and start risking their money on things that have tangible risk, like investing in Nvidia. The alternative is a slow bleeding of wealth by the money masters. That's the scam.

Wow. Okay. I guess if you believe that, then... you'll believe... all kinds of things.

My only tip would be to not make major financial decisions in your personal life based on this nonsense...



So if the value of an investment goes down, you consider that "robbery"?

If Bitcoin comes down in price from it's current highs, will you consider that to be "robbery" too (and maybe the jews have gotten to Bitcoin! Oh no!).

You seem to be quite aware of the risks of the USD investment, and I think you'd need to dig pretty deep to find a person with any reasonable amount of money on the planet who has not heard of the concept of "inflation", so I don't think you can say that there's some sort of fraud associated with USD (etc.) either. Indeed, the primary reasons people place their money in investment funds and so forth is to trade out of USD--same as they do for cryptocurrencies as well.




No, they really aren't any different. All forms of saving/investing/speculating, regardless of the instrument, involves risk.

Anybody who tries to tell you that they have a "foolproof investment that can never possibly lose value" is lying to you, and most likely some kind of con artist.

USD is an investment, as is Bitcoin, as is NVDA, as is gold, as is buying shares of a local business, as is betting on a sports team winning on the weekend. All of these things involve varying degrees of risk, both upside and downside.

Yes, it is.

Yes it does. In contrast with AAPL and NVDA, people historically save on fiat currency. Under the gold standard, they used to save in gold (or at least, promises of gold), but after 1971 (and a few decades before that), everyone's savings sit on pieces of paper the Fed prints out of thin air.

Here's the genius of the scam: Opting out of the USD means you invest your money. Investing and saving are fundamentally different, because investing includes an acknowledged risk. For example, investing in Nvidia means you acknowledge that in case the next chip is a total disaster, you will lose money. Saving means you leave your money into something that stores its value. You do not want to trust your capital into someone else, you simply want to ensure that the value of your money will last into the future. Gold was once the primary means of saving money, valued for its resistance to inflation. However, due to technological advancements, it no longer serves this purpose as effectively. Today, it struggles resisting inflation.

So, under the fiat standard, you either choose to live a fragile life, risking your money in stocks, study geopolitics, macroeconomics, watching what the central banks announce, or as I like to call it, you gamble your money as you're not an investor (and even Wall Street investors fail to beat real inflation), or you experience bleeding of your wealth by the never-ending fiat currency dilution.

OMFG, the Illuminati stuff? I really really thought this nonsense would die soon after I first heard about it living in Orange County CA in the 1980s .

No, the world's money supply is not controlled by a secret cabal of jews. And no, the USD does not "rob people", any more than AAPL or NVDA or Bitcoin or gold or any other investment "robs people". People are free to trade out of USD any time they want, and USD itself is mostly used as a measurement mechanism and nothing else.

In other words, just because the screen on your investment app says, "$43,983.23" doesn't mean that has any relation to the USD itself as an investment, it's just the means of keeping score. USD is simply one investment along side of millions of others. Banks like Citibank do not have gigantic piles of physical hundred dollar bills sitting in a vault somewhere--they have a pile of contracts stating what they own, which they keep on a balance sheet.

Banking is a complicated subject (I mean, I'm a programmer, not a banker, so it's not impossible to understand it if you just do a little research), but the sad part is that populist politics likes to dumb it down so much as to score political points (antisemitism, for instance), that they want to turn a complex subject into a few soundbites--that are absolutely false and misleading.

Maybe rethink your notions of how the world's financial system actually operates. A realistic understanding of the world will allow you to make much better decisions with your own money...

I'm also expecting them to oppose this, because... the Federal Reserve is not controlled by the US government. The Federal Reserve is a cartel of private banks, and the US dollar is the way this cartel robs the world. A commitment to bitcoin would encourage everyone across the world to dump dollars for bitcoin, and they're absolutely not going to relinquish this enormous privilege and power they have held and exercised for centuries, because some random politician promised the people bitcoin.

So, don't worry. 

LOL, it doesn't make sense for anybody's "financial security" except for the tiny portion of the US population who currently holds a lot of Bitcoin .

And yes, frankly, I'm expecting Congress to oppose this. A few in Congress will want this--because they personally hold a lot of Bitcoin--but the rest will be holders of all kinds of other things and they will want their investments pumped instead. And then the whole thing will have problems with, um, "optics": Congress members fighting over whose investment gets free money from the US government .


This is just semantics. You can trade any sort of things and use it as currency, including cigarettes, or whatever.

As I have said before, I expect technology is going to decouple the notion of transacting from the notion of saving/investing/speculating. Bitcoin will never be suitable for everyday transacting, only the latter. But it stands along side literally millions of other "things" (call it a "product" or a "asset" or whatever you want) that will sit in people's portfolios.

I get that Bitcoin is your very, very favorite investment, and presumably the only one you have in your own portfolio. But it's rather arrogant to believe that should be the only thing everybody on the planet ever invest in again, to the point that the US government should give that one special favors.