Topic: Trust No One - page 66. (Read 161312 times)
Interesting comments by all!
and people laugh at me for my 30 characters long generated strings as password. now I'll show them. 
Yes i guess you're right.
Quote
If you are thinking that I might not be trustworthy, since I am writing this post about the issue, you are approaching the appropriate level of paranoia.
So true it hurts!
Seriously. Don't trust the exchanges, don't trust online wallet services, don't trust your anti-virus software, and don't trust anybody online.
If you absolutely must trust someone with your bitcoins, for the love, choose carefully!
Insurance? Impossible, you say. Not so!
When I needed people to trust me to hold bitcoins for a contest, I deposited 50 bitcoins as a bond with a well-respected forum member, so that even if I did something stupid and lost people's money, they would still be reimbursed. You can read about it here: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/finished-bet-on-bitcoin-future-price-here-july-1st-2011-10008
Consider carefully who you will trust. With bitcoins, elaborate scams may be profitable. For instance, someone may develop trust for their user name over many months with small transactions on this forum, then take advantage of that trust to make off with a lot of money. Such a scam would only be worth doing on this forum. No other forum in the world would be worth the effort.
If you want someone to hold your bitcoins for you, there are NO online services that have the transparency and security to make me comfortable using them for storing bitcoins for more than a short time in small amounts. The only way to do it is like I did - choose someone whom you believe to be trustworthy, and approach them. If they approach you, or in any way say or insinuate that they are a trustworthy person to hold your coins, STAY AWAY.
If you are thinking that I might not be trustworthy, since I am writing this post about the issue, you are approaching the appropriate level of paranoia.
If you want to store your bitcoins with maximum security, there are lots of resources about how to do it, such as this: https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Securing_your_wallet
Here's my summary:
1. Put all your coins in a new wallet that has never connected to the network
2. Encrypt that wallet with the maximum security you can find, using the most secure password you can keep track of
3. Delete the plaintext wallet, and distribute the encrypted wallet to every piece of physical media you own, store it online, and send it to several people you trust
Don't think you can generate and remember a secure enough password? Create a super-long password, and store clues to help you remember it. For instance, your password clue file might say:
My standard password + My throwaway password (backwards, all caps) + &#$%@ + First two sentences of first paragraph of page 19 of my favorite book (include all capitalization and punctuation) + My wife's mother's middle name + My son's favorite superhero + My favorite number times 8734 + food my wife hates (backwards, all caps) + 9-digit number stored with my paper will + 10-character password stored in my safety deposit box + . . . .
You can go on in this way to create as long a password as you want. Store this password clue file with your encrypted wallet, and optionally encrypt both with a simple standard password to keep out snoopers.
In this way, not only can you recover your coins from your "savings account" at a later date, if you get hit by a chicken truck tomorrow and die, your loved ones can probably piece together your password and recover the coins too (better make sure you trust them, and that between them they have or can get the answers to those clues).
I recommend that you practice your wallet encryption and recovery a few times with a small number of coins, until you are very comfortable with the process before you try it with the bulk of your savings.
And remember, this is how most bitcoins services get started:
Comic from: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/new-bitcoin-comic-13903
If you absolutely must trust someone with your bitcoins, for the love, choose carefully!
- Do you know their full name?
- Do you know where they are located?
- Have they demonstrated trustworthiness in the past?
- Are they asking you to trust them? (red flag)
- Do they have insurance?
Insurance? Impossible, you say. Not so!
When I needed people to trust me to hold bitcoins for a contest, I deposited 50 bitcoins as a bond with a well-respected forum member, so that even if I did something stupid and lost people's money, they would still be reimbursed. You can read about it here: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/finished-bet-on-bitcoin-future-price-here-july-1st-2011-10008
Consider carefully who you will trust. With bitcoins, elaborate scams may be profitable. For instance, someone may develop trust for their user name over many months with small transactions on this forum, then take advantage of that trust to make off with a lot of money. Such a scam would only be worth doing on this forum. No other forum in the world would be worth the effort.
If you want someone to hold your bitcoins for you, there are NO online services that have the transparency and security to make me comfortable using them for storing bitcoins for more than a short time in small amounts. The only way to do it is like I did - choose someone whom you believe to be trustworthy, and approach them. If they approach you, or in any way say or insinuate that they are a trustworthy person to hold your coins, STAY AWAY.
If you are thinking that I might not be trustworthy, since I am writing this post about the issue, you are approaching the appropriate level of paranoia.
If you want to store your bitcoins with maximum security, there are lots of resources about how to do it, such as this: https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Securing_your_wallet
Here's my summary:
1. Put all your coins in a new wallet that has never connected to the network
2. Encrypt that wallet with the maximum security you can find, using the most secure password you can keep track of
3. Delete the plaintext wallet, and distribute the encrypted wallet to every piece of physical media you own, store it online, and send it to several people you trust
Don't think you can generate and remember a secure enough password? Create a super-long password, and store clues to help you remember it. For instance, your password clue file might say:
My standard password + My throwaway password (backwards, all caps) + &#$%@ + First two sentences of first paragraph of page 19 of my favorite book (include all capitalization and punctuation) + My wife's mother's middle name + My son's favorite superhero + My favorite number times 8734 + food my wife hates (backwards, all caps) + 9-digit number stored with my paper will + 10-character password stored in my safety deposit box + . . . .
You can go on in this way to create as long a password as you want. Store this password clue file with your encrypted wallet, and optionally encrypt both with a simple standard password to keep out snoopers.
In this way, not only can you recover your coins from your "savings account" at a later date, if you get hit by a chicken truck tomorrow and die, your loved ones can probably piece together your password and recover the coins too (better make sure you trust them, and that between them they have or can get the answers to those clues).
I recommend that you practice your wallet encryption and recovery a few times with a small number of coins, until you are very comfortable with the process before you try it with the bulk of your savings.
And remember, this is how most bitcoins services get started:
Comic from: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/new-bitcoin-comic-13903
Voice o' Reason.
The best way to trade is to go in SMALL increments. It's only going to take an extra 5-10 minutes, and the benefits are great. You don't have to worry about losing $100's or anything. I do all my trades in increments of $20 or less, unless I truly trust the person. I haven't been scammed yet!
we have to trust somebody.....
What's the point of bitcoin if you have to be so paranoid?
I put this post in the Newbies area for a reason
I believe that bitcoin will someday be orders of magnitude more secure (and more valuable). If you buy bitcoins now, you are an early adopter getting in while prices are cheap and betting that security and utility will improve.
In the meantime, yes, you must be absurdly paranoid. These websites cannot be trusted any more than you absolutely have to. To actually hold onto your coins long enough for your investment to pay off, you need to push the paranoia up to the tinfoil-hat level. This is the price of being an early bitcoin adopter.
Trust nobody but Jesus
It certainly makes you think!!
Why should I trust you then? Is it not a safe assumption that the guardianship you put up is merely a ruse to get my BTC?
Nah, just kidding. 2 posts to go till I can post on the big boy forums! What a great system!
Nah, just kidding. 2 posts to go till I can post on the big boy forums! What a great system!
I honestly feel it is difficult for new users of BitCoin to understand the increased safety of using offline wallets for storage, lots of the intro tutorials on BitCoin fail to mention this
Thanks for the thread, it should be a 'must read' for all newbees!
Yeah unfortunately a friend and I lost money selling BTC.
Bitcoin is a great concept. However, like most institutions, freedom websites and protest movements it is quite possible it has wholly or partially been co-opted by the opposition.
I have recently had 2 bad experiences with 2 different bitcoin outfits and now consider that our best option is to hold a small propotion of funds in junk silver coins, that we have ready access to (think multiple hiding places,) rather than bitcoins, though I may keep a tiny number of bitcoins that I can afford to lose in a wallet.
Bad experience 1
- Mt Gox failed to initiate the requested process of withdrawal of funds to my bank account for sold bitcoins
- To initiate the withdrawal process they insisted on very precise re-checking of my personal details, though they already had my details on record (typical criminal Illuminati harvesting of non-criminal opposition locations/identities for later targeting.)
- After a week with no transfer to my bank account I contacted support and was told that the withdrawal was still being processed.
- After 14 days and multiple followups from myself, the funds finally cleared into my account - with the excuse that Mt Gox had been in the process of changing bank accounts?
- I then had an email asking me to rate the support representative, when, though the guy was certainly insensitive to my rights as a customer (how many could not buy the planned Christmas presents for their kids?), clearly he was not responsible for the tardy and ineffective Mt Gox process. Lets just put it this way the longer they keep our money, the more interest they earn on it.
Bad Experience 2
Luckily, I sold all my bitcoins and withdrew my funds from Bitmarket.eu recently considering that below is the email I recieved from them today.
My name is Maciej Trębacz and I'm the admin of BitMarket.eu bitcoin exchange. I'm writing to you, because BitMarket is in trouble, and I need help of everyone possible. Few months go, a situation arised that is mostly my fault, that put users' funds at risk. I regret it, but sadly it happened.
For the past two weeks, I had to cancel all trading on Bitmarket to sort this out, and the trading is now resumed. That said, user funds from that time are missing, and I'm doing everything I can to reimburse them. I can't do it alone though, that's why I ask for your help. If you want to help, there are following options:
- regardless of your situation, please consider a small donation to help this cause. You can use following Bitcoin address: 1Km5GFMat1DXcbvMTeH9ZvLGKvFCLBA9dM. All these funds will go directly to reimburse users, which funds are missing.
- if you are a Bitcoin trader, please consider selling your BTC through BitMarket. You already have an account, and if you're not verified, please just write to me and I'll verify you within 24 hours.
- if you are an entrepreneur/investor, maybe we can get an agreement that will both help Bitmarket users, as well as give you future BitMarket profits.
- if you run any Bitcoin service, I may be able to work for you in web/mobile/desktop development.
In either case, if you have some questions or ideas that might help, please write to me at: [email protected]
Thank you for reading this.
--
Best regards,
Bitmarket.eu team.
Who knows perhaps those we suspect of suspicios dealings may be victims not perpertratots of crime? However when it comes to protecting your hard earned dosh this thread is absolutley right. TRUST NO ONE!!!!!!
I have recently had 2 bad experiences with 2 different bitcoin outfits and now consider that our best option is to hold a small propotion of funds in junk silver coins, that we have ready access to (think multiple hiding places,) rather than bitcoins, though I may keep a tiny number of bitcoins that I can afford to lose in a wallet.
Bad experience 1
- Mt Gox failed to initiate the requested process of withdrawal of funds to my bank account for sold bitcoins
- To initiate the withdrawal process they insisted on very precise re-checking of my personal details, though they already had my details on record (typical criminal Illuminati harvesting of non-criminal opposition locations/identities for later targeting.)
- After a week with no transfer to my bank account I contacted support and was told that the withdrawal was still being processed.
- After 14 days and multiple followups from myself, the funds finally cleared into my account - with the excuse that Mt Gox had been in the process of changing bank accounts?
- I then had an email asking me to rate the support representative, when, though the guy was certainly insensitive to my rights as a customer (how many could not buy the planned Christmas presents for their kids?), clearly he was not responsible for the tardy and ineffective Mt Gox process. Lets just put it this way the longer they keep our money, the more interest they earn on it.
Bad Experience 2
Luckily, I sold all my bitcoins and withdrew my funds from Bitmarket.eu recently considering that below is the email I recieved from them today.
My name is Maciej Trębacz and I'm the admin of BitMarket.eu bitcoin exchange. I'm writing to you, because BitMarket is in trouble, and I need help of everyone possible. Few months go, a situation arised that is mostly my fault, that put users' funds at risk. I regret it, but sadly it happened.
For the past two weeks, I had to cancel all trading on Bitmarket to sort this out, and the trading is now resumed. That said, user funds from that time are missing, and I'm doing everything I can to reimburse them. I can't do it alone though, that's why I ask for your help. If you want to help, there are following options:
- regardless of your situation, please consider a small donation to help this cause. You can use following Bitcoin address: 1Km5GFMat1DXcbvMTeH9ZvLGKvFCLBA9dM. All these funds will go directly to reimburse users, which funds are missing.
- if you are a Bitcoin trader, please consider selling your BTC through BitMarket. You already have an account, and if you're not verified, please just write to me and I'll verify you within 24 hours.
- if you are an entrepreneur/investor, maybe we can get an agreement that will both help Bitmarket users, as well as give you future BitMarket profits.
- if you run any Bitcoin service, I may be able to work for you in web/mobile/desktop development.
In either case, if you have some questions or ideas that might help, please write to me at: [email protected]
Thank you for reading this.
--
Best regards,
Bitmarket.eu team.
Who knows perhaps those we suspect of suspicios dealings may be victims not perpertratots of crime? However when it comes to protecting your hard earned dosh this thread is absolutley right. TRUST NO ONE!!!!!!
This is very interesting and something i'll keep on board here. thanks
I did not follow the tips in this topic and I was fucked up with US$ 286,00. I'm really sad now. 
I know that feel bro
I did not follow the tips in this topic and I was fucked up with US$ 286,00. I'm really sad now.
Thank you for the warnings. I will stay on my heels here. Thanks
Good advice, but as other people have posted, you need to have some trust.
man I'm to trusting.. but not anymore..
thanks
thanks
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