Turkish Central Bank Forbids use of cryptocurrencies as a mean of Exchange. - page 2.

bryant.coleman

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Quote from: sujon5 on April 17, 2021, 11:31:33 PM

The Turkish government banned Bitcoin and crypto as a payment method, but the citizens can still buy invest in crypto. So I don't think it's such a serious problem.

Spot on. The Turkish Lira (national currency) has been facing issues for sometime now, and therefore it was not surprising to see the central bank curbing the usage of other currencies. During the last four weeks, the currency has devalued by more than 10%. The government is also facing acute revenue shortage, due to the fall in tourist arrivals. Still I have to admit that the Turkish government acted in a very mature manner, when compared to their colleagues in India and Nigeria.

TimeTeller

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Quote from: oHnK on April 18, 2021, 09:52:48 AM

Quote from: Lucius on April 18, 2021, 08:45:59 AM

From OP ->

Quote

Dissidents, democracy protestors, opposition leaders and independent journalists worldwide are beginning to realize this, from Minsk to Lagos to Los Angeles to Buenos Aires.

It seems to me that it was only a matter of time before a country like Turkey would make such a move, and it is possible that this is not the end, and that they just make a test balloon to feel the pulse of the nation. We all know how the 2016 coup attempt ended, and as a result, the Turkish authorities have become even more cautious and suspicious - and I believe that Bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies do not fit well into the existing system.

Anything that could in any way undermine the cohesion of the current politico-military system is basically undesirable - nothing we have not already seen in authoritarian regimes like China or Russia where Bitcoin has not fared well, or is still in the gray zone.

Regardless of the country's political problems, it is very clear that the Turkish government is running out of ways to solve the Crypto problem. With the current policies, the Turkish Government has lost the great potential of Crypto. If they take another policy by imposing all Crypto activities with KYC, and imposing taxes on all transactions then this is better than banning them. Crypto volatility is nothing to worry about. Just need a friendly policy. Because the Crypto ban is not the end of its users. There are many ways to keep investing in Crypto.

Crypto users residing in that country will always find a way how to get around with their government.
Because outside their jurisdiction, they can freely transact with crypto.
I don't think Turkey's Central Bank approach in crypto is a smart move from their end.
They can regulate the use of it and get the taxes, but totally banning it will just leave them behind on this technology.
While others are creating crypto-friendly cities, they are doing the opposite approach.

wxxyrqa

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I think that it is necessary to take into account the decisiveness of the head of state Erdogan and his character, as well as ambitions in solving various problems. No discontent of the people will cope with this and therefore the problem must be solved only on the political plane. Erdogan positions himself with a democratic president and therefore he needs to provide real facts in favor of cryptocurrency so that the Turkish government changes its decision.

oHnK

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Quote from: Lucius on April 18, 2021, 08:45:59 AM

From OP ->

Quote

Dissidents, democracy protestors, opposition leaders and independent journalists worldwide are beginning to realize this, from Minsk to Lagos to Los Angeles to Buenos Aires.

It seems to me that it was only a matter of time before a country like Turkey would make such a move, and it is possible that this is not the end, and that they just make a test balloon to feel the pulse of the nation. We all know how the 2016 coup attempt ended, and as a result, the Turkish authorities have become even more cautious and suspicious - and I believe that Bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies do not fit well into the existing system.

Anything that could in any way undermine the cohesion of the current politico-military system is basically undesirable - nothing we have not already seen in authoritarian regimes like China or Russia where Bitcoin has not fared well, or is still in the gray zone.

Regardless of the country's political problems, it is very clear that the Turkish government is running out of ways to solve the Crypto problem. With the current policies, the Turkish Government has lost the great potential of Crypto. If they take another policy by imposing all Crypto activities with KYC, and imposing taxes on all transactions then this is better than banning them. Crypto volatility is nothing to worry about. Just need a friendly policy. Because the Crypto ban is not the end of its users. There are many ways to keep investing in Crypto.

Lucius

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From OP ->

Quote

Dissidents, democracy protestors, opposition leaders and independent journalists worldwide are beginning to realize this, from Minsk to Lagos to Los Angeles to Buenos Aires.

It seems to me that it was only a matter of time before a country like Turkey would make such a move, and it is possible that this is not the end, and that they just make a test balloon to feel the pulse of the nation. We all know how the 2016 coup attempt ended, and as a result, the Turkish authorities have become even more cautious and suspicious - and I believe that Bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies do not fit well into the existing system.

Anything that could in any way undermine the cohesion of the current politico-military system is basically undesirable - nothing we have not already seen in authoritarian regimes like China or Russia where Bitcoin has not fared well, or is still in the gray zone.

sujon5

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The Turkish government banned Bitcoin and crypto as a payment method, but the citizens can still buy invest in crypto. So I don't think it's such a serious problem.

teosanru

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Quote from: Gyfts on April 17, 2021, 01:57:04 AM

Quote from: teosanru on April 16, 2021, 03:13:53 PM

Quote from: Gyfts on April 16, 2021, 03:01:12 PM

Quote from: teosanru on April 16, 2021, 02:49:18 PM

It's interesting to see that Turkey has come out with very generic guidelines. They have basically stopped anyone doing anything into cryptos and have even stopped everyone to create any business models around cryptocurrencies but this would hamper the growth of their blockchain industry too. Primarily also destroyed it as a medium of payment even in International Transactions. But here is a very interesting loophole at least for the investors/ traders that I have found:

Quote

(2) Payment and electronic money institutions cannot mediate on platforms offering trading, custody, transfer or issuance services regarding crypto assets or fund transfers from these platforms.

If we go by the literal explanation of these lines, this means that no exchange can be built up in Turkey and no person of turkey can operate an exchange or wallets. But there is no restriction on any person holding crypto in their private key wallets or in international exchanges. The law is applicable to the institutions and not the users of these institutions. Moreover, I cannot see the list of punishments in this circular? Is it that the defaulters will be tried under the Central Bank Act which already contains punishments.

The verbiage is clear, they want banks to have central authority on the currency in the country, and so anyone that establishes a competitor will be fined, or jailed. No one can stop anyone from using crypto, it's P2P. The whole idea of regulation is to scare people from mass adoption, and restricting companies from practicing freely. Realistically, most people need exchanges if they're going to turn their local currency into a crypto.

Turkey isn't the first country to do this. I noticed first world countries haven't been so explicit about banning crypto, but that's because they don't view crypto as a threat, yet.

I don't think in the current shape and form bitcoin is a big threat to the banks or fiat. 95% use cryptos and bitcoins only for investment holding and quick returns while rest 5% also don't transact with it on daily basis. So I don't think it's due to compeition. A more prominent reason could be liquidity. They would not want the liquidity of their currency to go out of the system as it could lead to devlation. Yes Scaring the people away is obviously the main idea and talking about companies, I don't really think a lot of companies outside US are looking at Bitcoin as an investment option.

People are holding right now, but what about the future?

Sure, people use it as a get rich quick type scheme, day trade, or treat it as an asset akin to gold or silver, but 5 years ago, people laughed at BTC as any sort of investment so it isn't unreasonable to think that down the line, it'd be used as a day to day currency. Plus, also consider that first world countries keep printing out bills of money as if it grows on trees, so at some point people are going to switch currencies when they realize their own country's currency has turn to rubbish due to inflation.

Uhh! I don't quite agree with you on this. Yes, it's true that people have changed a bit about cryptocurrencies but it's only because of profits that they are currently seeing due to the bull market. In the bear rally before this bull market, there weren't a lot of people investing in cryptos. Moreover using it as a currency is something altogether different and opposite. When you have entered into something with an idea that it's value will appreciate why would you decide to use it as a payment method?

Secondly, I am quite convinced with the fact that deflationary currency is not an answer to an inflationary currency. It's just trying things in a different way and not a solution at all. There are just theories around it so far.

Renampun

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Quote from: Findingnemo on April 17, 2021, 12:28:24 AM

Central banks don't understand the blockchain that is why they are saying blockchain network is in ban. Grin

Dump people are in control of a country's financial management is why many country never go in the growing direction. Anyway with this ban the p2p transactions will increase so the prices also may increase due to increased risk of trading on peer to peer so Holders will take more advantages while government lose their tax revenues.

blockchain technology is still new, it's natural that they still don't understand the benefits 'lol'...
taxes, taxes, and taxes, that's all they are really aiming for, without taxes they won't get their wages 'lol'. p2p trading will definitely be an option and let them bite their fingers for tax-loss 'lol'.

Kamarah

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Quote from: Ucy on April 16, 2021, 05:07:40 AM

Can a bank forbid people from exchanging goods and services for any kind of reward? If a citizen chooses to be rewarded in his/her community's tokens or with other assets... they mean the citizen has broken his country's law ?

Well, people could build Decentralized networks/systems/applications that can help "governments" regulate and earn from them without letting the governments violent their good ideals/principles. People who use them to commit serious crimes could lose their right to be protected by the network, or their rights to the benefit from the ideals.

Turkish central bank has issued a ban on using Bitcoin. They argue that there are many great risks for electronic money assets. Because encryption assets do not have to follow any management and monitoring mechanism, as well as not managed by central agencies. Market value of electronic money fluctuates excessively and they can be used for illegal operations such as money laundering. I wonder if this command gives a discount Bitcoin? There are all citizens in Turkey who will stop BTC.

davis196

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1.Nobody outside Turkey cares about the opinions of the Turkish central bank in regards to Bitcoin and cryptocurrencies.This news won't have an impact over the crypto markets.
2.Turkey is country,that has a very weak national currency.The Turkish central bankers are probably afraid that Turkey might become "the next Venezuela" and the people will dump the national currency for Bitcoin.
3.I guess that the Turkish central bank/government is in a "denial phase",when it comes to cryptocurrencies.
This is just a phase and the Turkish government might adopt crypto payments in the future.

Gyfts

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Quote from: teosanru on April 16, 2021, 03:13:53 PM

Quote from: Gyfts on April 16, 2021, 03:01:12 PM

Quote from: teosanru on April 16, 2021, 02:49:18 PM

It's interesting to see that Turkey has come out with very generic guidelines. They have basically stopped anyone doing anything into cryptos and have even stopped everyone to create any business models around cryptocurrencies but this would hamper the growth of their blockchain industry too. Primarily also destroyed it as a medium of payment even in International Transactions. But here is a very interesting loophole at least for the investors/ traders that I have found:

Quote

(2) Payment and electronic money institutions cannot mediate on platforms offering trading, custody, transfer or issuance services regarding crypto assets or fund transfers from these platforms.

If we go by the literal explanation of these lines, this means that no exchange can be built up in Turkey and no person of turkey can operate an exchange or wallets. But there is no restriction on any person holding crypto in their private key wallets or in international exchanges. The law is applicable to the institutions and not the users of these institutions. Moreover, I cannot see the list of punishments in this circular? Is it that the defaulters will be tried under the Central Bank Act which already contains punishments.

The verbiage is clear, they want banks to have central authority on the currency in the country, and so anyone that establishes a competitor will be fined, or jailed. No one can stop anyone from using crypto, it's P2P. The whole idea of regulation is to scare people from mass adoption, and restricting companies from practicing freely. Realistically, most people need exchanges if they're going to turn their local currency into a crypto.

Turkey isn't the first country to do this. I noticed first world countries haven't been so explicit about banning crypto, but that's because they don't view crypto as a threat, yet.

I don't think in the current shape and form bitcoin is a big threat to the banks or fiat. 95% use cryptos and bitcoins only for investment holding and quick returns while rest 5% also don't transact with it on daily basis. So I don't think it's due to compeition. A more prominent reason could be liquidity. They would not want the liquidity of their currency to go out of the system as it could lead to devlation. Yes Scaring the people away is obviously the main idea and talking about companies, I don't really think a lot of companies outside US are looking at Bitcoin as an investment option.

People are holding right now, but what about the future?

Sure, people use it as a get rich quick type scheme, day trade, or treat it as an asset akin to gold or silver, but 5 years ago, people laughed at BTC as any sort of investment so it isn't unreasonable to think that down the line, it'd be used as a day to day currency. Plus, also consider that first world countries keep printing out bills of money as if it grows on trees, so at some point people are going to switch currencies when they realize their own country's currency has turn to rubbish due to inflation.

Findingnemo

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Central banks don't understand the blockchain that is why they are saying blockchain network is in ban. Grin

Dump people are in control of a country's financial management is why many country never go in the growing direction. Anyway with this ban the p2p transactions will increase so the prices also may increase due to increased risk of trading on peer to peer so Holders will take more advantages while government lose their tax revenues.

Xinarae*

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The reason the Turkish central bank uses cryptocurrency is because they think that cryptocurrencies more profitable will improve their economy and trade a lot but it is very harmful for the poor people. They don't know anything about crypto and use Fiat currency online virtual currencies are being traded on various exchange platforms including Bitcoin, Etherium, Ripple and Litcoin. These virtual currencies are not legal tender issued by the legitimate authorities of any country there is no recognition of any financial claim the central banks need to think about the people of the country before the state takes such a step.

Kong Hey Pakboy

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Quote from: Leonardo7 on April 16, 2021, 08:51:40 PM

Very dumb move by the Turkish Central Bank. How do you even sensor Peer-peer payment system? Don't these people think before they act? they want to control everything and slowly make the people poor. This is going to have no negative effect on the crypto world, Turkish economy doesn't define world trade, it's a good trade and investment destination. The real crypto guys will bypass this and I expect some litigation against this Central Bank action.

They want to stimulate the circulation of fiat to fiat so I don't necessarily say that it is a dumb move, but you are right they can't really censor everything unless they become a totalitarian state. If it doesn't define world trade then we shouldn't worry about it, let them sort out their problem, I believe that this is going to be the same as what CBN did so I wouldn't worry that much.

Sithara007

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Quote from: Leonardo7 on April 16, 2021, 08:51:40 PM

Very dumb move by the Turkish Central Bank. How do you even sensor Peer-peer payment system? Don't these people think before they act? they want to control everything and slowly make the people poor. This is going to have no negative effect on the crypto world, Turkish economy doesn't define world trade, it's a good trade and investment destination. The real crypto guys will bypass this and I expect some litigation against this Central Bank action.

Check the original thread again. The central bank hasn't banned the P2P transactions. The ban only covers usage of cryptocurrency as a form of payment, to purchase goods and services. There is no ban, if you want to sell your cryptocurrency for fiat (either using the mainstream exchanges or the P2P platforms). So the solution is actually very simple. You first need to convert your BTC to fiat, before purchasing these goods/services.

Leonardo7

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Very dumb move by the Turkish Central Bank. How do you even sensor Peer-peer payment system? Don't these people think before they act? they want to control everything and slowly make the people poor. This is going to have no negative effect on the crypto world, Turkish economy doesn't define world trade, it's a good trade and investment destination. The real crypto guys will bypass this and I expect some litigation against this Central Bank action.

verita1

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With this law, Turkish Central Bank minimizes and prevents the advances that are being achieved with the use of cryptocurrencies in that country.
A few days ago I saw on Twitter a business in Turkey that said accepting AVAX. The announcement referred to the AVAX token of a new blockchain network and I assume that the owners of this premises also accept other cryptocurrencies. I was so happy and I started to imagine that in the future both in Turkey and anywhere in the world that is a good start. But the obstacles posed by the world's Central Banks to what can be achieved with bitcoin is unheard of. We must continue as we are doing not stop and conquer our financial freedom with cryptocurrencies.

Ryker1

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Well, as I can see it --the reason why Turkish central banks banned cryptocurrency is that they find it as a threat to their economy. As we know, Turkey’s economy is dramatically going down every month. And the inflations are heavy. They couldn’t afford to lose authority as they might shrink and that’s a pain in the ass on the government’s side. What I would suggest to them is that instead of banning the use of cryptocurrency they might simply consider taking advantage of it by creating a tax program exclusively for tax users. Adding VAT to crypto-assets might also be a good idea.

mindrust

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Quote from: fillippone on April 16, 2021, 03:53:32 PM

There is one little difference between the TRY and the USD.
Notwithstanding the huge amount of Brr, there is no better FIAT currency than USD. Surely not the EUR, nor the GBP (yet). CHF might be a better alternative, but the CHF economy is tiny and cannot hold the whole planetary demand.
If you cannot buy other stuff and you are caged in the FIAT pen, then USD is the place to be.

I know the USD is a reserve currency but I am not sure if that reserve currency status will be enough to save it this time. They are counting on the infinite USD demand but I can see that the inflation is gaining traction even in the US and as I said above, if everybody starts to see that... that demand will be gone very fast and it will be a dump fest starting from there.

During most of my financial life, I saved my savings in USD and EUR. There is one big difference this time, saving in USD isn't protecting me like it used to do.

I know it is still better than the lira but the prices are going nuts even against the dollar or they are raising the taxes, saving in USD don't make sense anymore. (not to me at least) I feel like I better buy real stuff instead. I haven't invested any in any FIAT starting this year and I am actually converting some of my FIAT to something else (some non-FIAT stuff) and reducing its weight in my portfolio.

From here every new administration in the US will keep printing multiple trillions of Dollars and it will never end until the Dollar is no more.

fillippone

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On the Turkish CB there is another document giving a little bit more information on the ban:

Source

Also, CoinDesk published an article on the matter:
Turkey to Ban the Use of Crypto for Payments; Bitcoin Falls

Topic: Turkish Central Bank Forbids use of cryptocurrencies as a mean of Exchange. - page 2. (Read 685 times)