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Topic: [UNO] Unobtanium Info & Discussion - Hardfork block 1042000 - Merge Mine w/BTC! - page 278. (Read 1047075 times)

legendary
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re:nasty little twist

""They are pretty sure they can get away with it, and I think they're right"".
Cry true for the short term but being fast and nasty with clients is foolish for those who want to remain in business.

""This new fee structure definitely encourages people to keep funds in the exchange.""
which suggests the custodian is short (goxxy)

The obvious answer is Exchanges want your coin for the same reason banks do. They can work with it, it gives them leverage or in the more concerning camp they are working/trading/manipulating with it (Something we know cryptsy does)
Which is ballsy considering Cry is residing in a jurisdiction that just said crypto is a commodity ... ie ... a fire breathing dragon is ready and able to swoop down upon them for some fine money.

Also the 0.5% tax to withdraw mean Crypsty will end up with 10% of a coins 'traded supply' after just 20 trades (assuming Withdrawn)

Can you say corner all the markets.

prediction:  Crypsty spots prices will run about 1% cheaper to adjust for the tax if you cash out policy.

prediction:  Solid coin communities will need their own exchanges, think more like shapeshift send btc/ltc get UNO (no account needed)  just a box on the website ... still will need a book management software so the community can post bids asks just the same ... think micro exchanges

guess what we have that already ... only better ;0
sr. member
Activity: 263
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I think its more they understand their market position.
They are pretty sure they can get away with it, and I think they're right.
Working with crypto's is pretty all consuming task, the apathy of customers to the addition burdon of new/more/other exchanges will not be changed by a 0.5% fee change.

They've also likely done the numbers and come up with a vast majority of customers already leaving the funds on floor reasoning that if the normal behavior is to do so then the fees won't be so poorly received.
legendary
Activity: 1260
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I am not surprised about the move especially considering how aggressive the exchange market is, though not announcing it is a nasty little twist.

Aggressive market or not, a fee structure change of that magnitude without notice = #amateurhour
sr. member
Activity: 263
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I should correct something I said above: "If they deposit to trade then withdraw immediately, as I prefer to do with the bulk of my funds, Bittrex and Cryptsy would be about equal in cost and it would depend on liquidity and which exchange you prefer to support."

Actually if you deposit to trade on Cryptsy then withdraw immediately, their new structure is twice as expensive as Bittrex. I guess I was imagining: Deposit BTC > buy Alt > Wait > Sell Alt > Withdraw bitcoin. In that case it would still be about the same cost, but that's unreasonable for people who like to store coins away from exchanges. This new fee structure definitely encourages people to keep funds in the exchange.

The obvious answer is Exchanges want your coin for the same reason banks do. They can work with it, it gives them leverage or in the more concerning camp they are working/trading/manipulating with it (Something we know cryptsy does)

I am not surprised about the move especially considering how aggressive the exchange market is, though not announcing it is a nasty little twist.
IMZ
legendary
Activity: 1498
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Morning, K.S.! I am sweating on getting some fiat into Bitcoin, so I can get some Uno.

Finally posted over at CBX about the UNO/CBX trading-pair on Cryptopia, and asked about otc trades. Details to follow.

Still pluggin' along with the Chinese exchanges.

"This new fee structure definitely encourages people to keep funds in the exchange."

Certainly seems so, Nat.!
full member
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anyone else getting bored with the .006's?  time to move up to the 7s  Cool
legendary
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twitter.com/natmcmolecule
I should correct something I said above: "If they deposit to trade then withdraw immediately, as I prefer to do with the bulk of my funds, Bittrex and Cryptsy would be about equal in cost and it would depend on liquidity and which exchange you prefer to support."

Actually if you deposit to trade on Cryptsy then withdraw immediately, their new structure is twice as expensive as Bittrex. I guess I was imagining: Deposit BTC > buy Alt > Wait > Sell Alt > Withdraw bitcoin. In that case it would still be about the same cost, but that's unreasonable for people who like to store coins away from exchanges. This new fee structure definitely encourages people to keep funds in the exchange.
legendary
Activity: 1848
Merit: 1001

We are dealing with an advanced cryptographic technology worth hundreds of thousands of dollars. People who have spent time to acquire skills should be treated with respect. If somebody uses blatantly disrespectful language and a toxic attitude their messages should be deleted, and with enough violations they should be banned from the thread. It's that simple, if somebody wants their voice heard they should know how to communicate like an adult. We should not allow overt trolling to take place in an effort to prevent censorship. It's important to remain open and free, but not at the cost of community morale and professionalism. Imagine that a group developing open-source software are having a meeting in a cafe to discuss an update, then a disheveled drunken crybaby barfly busts in swearing at people. The person organizing the meeting allows him to stay, so one of the coders leaves. That is basically what happened with Gekko, except I imagine he wouldn't act like that in real life. Just because this is the internet does not mean we should let the loud vulgar guy stay at the meeting. 


Not only did this happen everybody else at the table just sat around in silent approval of the behavior, I am pleased to hear someone speak out with clarity on the issue.

not everyone - but my post/s were deleted.

sr. member
Activity: 263
Merit: 250

We are dealing with an advanced cryptographic technology worth hundreds of thousands of dollars. People who have spent time to acquire skills should be treated with respect. If somebody uses blatantly disrespectful language and a toxic attitude their messages should be deleted, and with enough violations they should be banned from the thread. It's that simple, if somebody wants their voice heard they should know how to communicate like an adult. We should not allow overt trolling to take place in an effort to prevent censorship. It's important to remain open and free, but not at the cost of community morale and professionalism. Imagine that a group developing open-source software are having a meeting in a cafe to discuss an update, then a disheveled drunken man busts in swearing at people. The person organizing the meeting allows him to stay, so one of the coders leaves. That is basically what happened with Gekko, except I imagine he wouldn't act like that in real life. Just because this is the internet does not mean we should let the loud vulgar guy stay at the meeting. 


Not only did this happen everybody else at the table just sat around in silent approval of the behavior, I am pleased to hear someone speak out with clarity on the issue.
legendary
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@ B.N.:

' . . . the future is this ... 98.7% of people that will use cryptos will never download the wallets .... 99.99% will not bother to keep a blockchain up-to-date .... but they will be able to rattle off their top25 favorite digital assets and coins.'

Not if IndiaMikeZulu has its way! We wanna see every farmhouse on our 100-mile stretch eventually set up with an Unobtanium wallet.


@IMZ

Actually this is the perfect business model.  And not pie-in-the-sky.

Local social-business networks.  Okay.  Still abstract, loose.

But specific to a spot on the World map.  Now we are talking.  Also, this maybe "the product" that is identified with uno.

Anyone in the audience need more convincing?

1.  Farmers operate day in day out on trust ... example ... Farmer Joe does $15k of harvesting for Farmer Bart trusting he will get his $15k in 6 weeks.  Why because Farmer Bart lives 3 farms over and his family has owned tthe land for 80 years, and he pays on time for the last 7 years.  

2.  Social Networking ... see above ... but the old fashion kind ... word of mouth face 2 face.

3.  Farmers generate $2000-$800 of gross income per acre.  Literal cash crops.  Everybody needs to eat too.

4.  Farmers have keen business senses, else their wife does, if your a farmer and dunce about finance you ain't a farmer for too long.

Now if farmers can settle up for a couple of eggs, some fresh veggies, a milk goat with UNO on a smart phone.
Well then they start to think about doing the same for 50 head of cattle.  That's about $50k last I checked.

Australian Farmer uses Living Room of Satoshi for Chicken Feed, Electric Fence
https://bitcoinmagazine.com/21958/closing-loop-australian-organic-farm-creates-local-bitcoin-economy-among-farmers/
http://www.farmjournalmedia.com/



@natmccoy

excellent write up!

i'm disturbed by the 'none notice'.
in all forms of contracting at least 2 weeks notice before adjustments to the fee schedule take place.
any business with clients knows that.
IN THE BUSINESS OF MONEY ... not giving notice is stunning ... and reveals gross incompetence else certain malintent.
they need to act like fuduciary agents because they are.

--

yes team effort all the way
and some do more than others
but make sure you are rewarded via holding equity
this is the best route to re-imbursment

but the guys with quality C++ skills, and general mastery of coding
yeah i am cool with scheduling them first and foremost for some form of regular compensation
aka formal work for fixed pay

but this is stuff we discuss once in the $10-$20 range.

my position is that coders can be paid for labor
and hope is that we can actual offer a salary position once things get going.

but the best solution is to partner with other coin communities to create a coder studio or lab

(these positions differ from the job of Dev)
IMZ
legendary
Activity: 1498
Merit: 1000
Yup.

[I am still trying to contact the Chinese exchanges. Details to follow. And IndiaMikeZulu will chip in to a development fund -- certainly if the money goes to Siameze (or Cryptapus).]

legendary
Activity: 868
Merit: 1000
twitter.com/natmcmolecule
UNO markets, status of the day

Wow the Bittrex order book looks a lot better now Cheesy Someone filled that up nicely. The order books have tightened on both exchanges between 0.0065 and 0.0068. There was some really healthy action on Cryptsy today and judging by which orders were filled it appears legitimate. The Bittrex volume of $800 was mostly fake, I take it that it was one of you due to the delist warning, you went a little overboard and could have saved a few cents but w.e.

All things Cryptsy and comparing costs of trading

I'm definitely not anti-Cryptsy either, & I don't think this is a sign of exchange collapse. I don't understand their logic here, and I think it was disrespectful of them not to inform their users before hand (they simply knew many people would withdraw and they would earn more if they didn't inform us). Though I'll continue storing some funds there just to have buy and sell orders on the UNO books at all times. I have done my part to reduce the Cryptsy cold wallet size, I've moved a lot of UNO out of that site and keep <5% of my UNO there. The disappointing thing about this fee change is it will make people even less likely to move their funds from the site long-term. Maybe a few will get spooked and withdraw now, but long-term it will be harder to reduce the cold wallet size. But as discussed earlier, we still don't know the distribution of that cold wallet, maybe someone with 30,000 UNO died and that will be there until Cryptsy closes and liquidates the funds that aren't withdrawn (which could happen in a few months or 40 years, who knows).

I'm considering getting verified on Cryptsy, since now verified users get a share of fees proportional to their holdings. It's quite minimal, so it's not worth it to keep funds there just for that, but if you've got them there for orders anyway it may be worth it to become verified. Withdrawal fees are 0.5%, 2% of those fees go to verified members, and there are ~40,000 UNO in Cryptsy. So with 200 UNO on Cryptsy a verified member would get 0.00005 UNO for every 100 UNO withdrawn from the site, rather minuscule... I'll have to decide if it's worth a few milli-uno for Cryptsy to have my personal info, I'm honest with my Crypto activities on my taxes so I guess the only risk would be someone hacking the site then personally breaking into people's homes looking for cold storage, but I keep that in well-hidden encrypted drives anyway  Grin If anyone can think of another reason not to get verified let me know please.

I'm also disappointed in Cryptsy's lack of quality site improvements (like distribution data, order book depth etc.) as I've mentioned before, but that's not enough to keep me from trading there. A lot of our volume comes from Cryptsy so we've got to embrace it. One good thing about the change is that with no trade fees, our volume may increase, which always looks good. Also, it gives people more options; if they absolutely insist on keeping funds somewhere to trade, then Cryptsy should be their UNO exchange of choice. If they deposit to trade then withdraw immediately, as I prefer to do with the bulk of my funds, Bittrex and Cryptsy would be about equal in cost and it would depend on liquidity and which exchange you prefer to support. Cryptopia remains the cheapest option in that regard with 0.2% fees.

Getting listed on more exchanges

I never got a response from Yunbi, The Rock Exchange, or Bitcoin Indonesia. Let's keep trying though, I urge you to contact other exchanges to request that they list UNO, and continue voting on BTER.

Hashrate

I too would like to know where the reduction in hashrate came from, hopefully it was due to temporary downtime at a pool and not somebody dropping us from their merge-mining options.

IMPORTANT: Community thoughts on paid-development and hardware wallet support

Siameze commented on my Ledger Wallet thread here https://www.reddit.com/r/ledgerwallet/comments/3ldjsz/altcoin_support/ He said he was working on building API that could be used for UNO hardware wallet support and that he could share build notes with any developers who want to tackle the project. If you remember, he was turned away by Gekko's response to his willingness to accept payment from me for the Spanish translation. So in private message I offered to pay him secretly to finish the translation and build hardware wallet support but he declined. He said that kind of deal must be done in the open and with support of the community. I would like to hear everyone's thoughts on paying for development. I understand that an environment of cost-free collaboration is optimal but we cannot sit by and hope that just falls into place. I personally urge you all to consider paying for development of some worthy projects. I'm willing to contribute a few hundred dollars toward quality development. Done right, $1,000-$2,500 of investment may be the difference between a market cap of $300,000 and $1,000,000.

With a contract properly stored in a blockchain, Siameze may be willing to do some great projects such as hardware wallet support. He also said Cryptapus may be capable of that.

We are dealing with an advanced cryptographic technology worth hundreds of thousands of dollars. People who have spent time to acquire skills should be treated with respect. If somebody uses blatantly disrespectful language and a toxic attitude their messages should be deleted, and with enough violations they should be banned from the thread. It's that simple, if somebody wants their voice heard they should know how to communicate like an adult. We should not allow overt trolling to take place in an effort to prevent censorship. It's important to remain open and free, but not at the cost of community morale and professionalism. Imagine that a group developing open-source software are having a meeting in a cafe to discuss an update, then a disheveled drunken man busts in swearing at people. The person organizing the meeting allows him to stay, so one of the coders leaves. That is basically what happened with Gekko, except I imagine he wouldn't act like that in real life. Just because this is the internet does not mean we should let the loud vulgar guy stay at the meeting. 



legendary
Activity: 1260
Merit: 1001
I am not anti-Cryptsy, but I would like to see that giant cold storage wallet reduced in size.

And also would like to see a more active market on Trex.

Nor am I, would simply like to see the giant wallet destroyed so that if there is a bankruptcy / hack, we are not again victim to a flood of stolen coins foisted onto a market...

Storing at any exchange is simply unsafe and unadvisable...

EDIT: BTW, there seems to be a lot of action on the big wallet today. Reviewing the block explorer, the beast changed addresses at block 664842 and then again at block 664869. Got 'em on the run!  Wink

Also, hash is down to around 650k, did somebody big go offline?
IMZ
legendary
Activity: 1498
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@ B.N.:

' . . . the future is this ... 98.7% of people that will use cryptos will never download the wallets .... 99.99% will not bother to keep a blockchain up-to-date .... but they will be able to rattle off their top25 favorite digital assets and coins.'

Not if IndiaMikeZulu has its way! We wanna see every farmhouse on our 100-mile stretch eventually set up with an Unobtanium wallet.

@ Cryptsy: pulled my Uno.

@ Cryptsy wallet: death to the Cryptsy wallet!

legendary
Activity: 2450
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keybase.io/fallingknife/
I am not anti-Cryptsy, but I would like to see that giant cold storage wallet reduced in size.

And also would like to see a more active market on Trex.
legendary
Activity: 1260
Merit: 1001
Does Cryptsy have anyone in charge of PR or Marketing?

I mean really, what a sham! No notice whatsoever certainly should give pause to anyone with balances over there. Similar to a brokerage house that would entirely change its fee structure without any notice.

Vote with your feet and DRAIN THAT WALLET!
legendary
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Every great team has a:

1 storyteller
2 designer
3 builder
4 magician
5 stabilizer
6 fighter
7 explorer
8 dreamer
9 mentor
10 recruiter

be 10/10




legendary
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set a heavy bid on rex @ 0.0060 should level both field at once



$5.25 by dec 31 2015 is an easy call  Grin
legendary
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legendary
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9 hours remaining to submit your guess to win a brain wallet worth 1.12 UNO. (I extended the time by 2 days since FallingKnife submitted a bit late and we haven't gotten many submissions anyway). 6 guesses so far. BitcoinNational made his guess in USD instead of BTC in a different thread but I'll allow it because, whatever  Wink

https://www.reddit.com/r/Unobtanium/comments/3kly31/brain_wallet_phrase_worth_1kg_awarded_to_whoever/
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