Topic: Unobtanium In-House Exchange - page 71. (Read 104923 times)

Looks like the Nxt blockchain is stuck.  Now what??

"Recent Blocks" should show the last one downloaded onto my system, right?  It's stuck on a low number.

No, wait....It's got a few thousand more!.....  

Looks like it will eventually update completely, so...:



[ETA:  public key removed from this post - DO NOT USE; this wallet won't download the blockchain; 2nd computer system:  wallet won't install]

 

I agree, I don't speak foreign languages well enough to discuss crypto in threads, but has anyone put out the solicitation of TTs in the other language UNO forums? It will help spread the word of UNO...

Sounds interesting. I'd like to play, too! 

“For many gold enthusiasts it is an article of faith that QE would set off an inflationary spiral. Yet years have passed and most of the world is languishing in near deflationary conditions.

[Then he explains why ‘gold bugs’ are a bunch of dummies. Then . . . ]

[Now their] refrain is now changing. Zero rates, QE, and extreme debt may have deferred the day of reckoning . . . but the deluge will be all the worse when it comes.

[Now here comes the best part:]

On that they may be right.”

Ambrose Evans-Pritchard, Daily Telegraph UK, on the Swiss referendum ‘6,000-year gold bubble’

The Nxt assets get listed on 'outside' exchanges, guys. So, at first, 'Asset X' is traded -- against Nxt -- solely on the SAE.

Then some smartie does the bit of coding that allows, say, Poloniex to provide Asset X/Btc. You can see this by checking the 'Markets' of the assets in the Assets Section of Coinmarketcap.

But a Uno/DVC pair will never be available in the Nxt wallet simply because the assets are coloured coins of the Nxt blockchain, while Uno is a competing coin -- it would be like Supermarket A letting Supermarket B set up shop in its aisles.

Now, Benefactor is on the right track here: 'other derivatives'

Well . . . not derivatives, 'cause that takes us back to fractional reserves, the very thing we are moving against here. Rather, it takes us, down the track (ahem . . . when we have made DVC a success . . . ) to our next in-house instrument.

Guys, the 'in-houseness' is what will (a) give DVC value, and (b) allow us to control it, and thereby learn. I strongly counsel focusing our efforts, for the moment, on getting ten, twenty, thirty, forty TTs in on the project.

M 

I still haven't even seen the Nxt wallet, but, as we are just talkin' theory, this could be accomplished from trusted hodlers of UNO, who issue UNO or other derivative, like some variation of DVC/UNO.

Overall, it would be tough to convince people that the hodler is capable of the task and better than an average exchange.  We all know exchanges are notoriously poor places to keep hodling coinage.

“ . . . our community coherence and talent allows us to experiment with a range of ‘instruments’ that will serve to strengthen our coin and community. At this point, participation is the pivotal aspect. I am not in charge.”

@ Bitcoin Charlie: sorry, I copied before instead of after. Here it is:
http://indiamikezulu.com.au/454/list-of-trusted-traders

@ Bitcoin National: Ian and I have been discussing the ‘range’ of DVC for days.
I would suggest that we do allow dealers to ‘set up’ to hold DVC, but as a ‘community membership thing'; and that we make our general purchases with them in Uno.

Why? ‘cause DVC is a trading-instrument, and we want it to be in house and in use.

Your idea of ‘DVC 2.0’ is really what I wanna hear:

let’s restate this to clear the air:

our community coherence and talent allows us to experiment with a range of ‘instruments’ that serve to strengthen our coin and community. At this point, participation is the pivotal aspect. I am not in charge.

@ Sirsmokes: please read the info for B.N., above. It’s pivotally important to understand that DVC’s value comes from being in-house, rare, high-volume, and under constant supervision.

For instance, if someone unwittingly put a DVC on the SAE order book – the SAE is, after all, DVC’s ‘home’ – and it got sold, then . . .
it’d be lost because it would be in the hands of an unknown party.

First DVC may be issued today.

What is becoming clearer is that all 500 DVC may well end up in play. (Theoretically, my concern is with the ‘Hedges thing,' that is, how an instrument can 'smooth' price fluctuations for us.)

However, if it transpires that DVC is used (‘merely’) as an auxiliary currency to Uno, then that would be a triumph!
500 DVC backed by 2 oz each if 1 oz reaches $25US would make an in-house currency with a cap of $25,000


m

Holy Tuna Fish!  SirSmokes made my brain pop!

Yes if we can get CoaEx (or other dealers) to redeem DVC for physical.  That takes this whole idea up a quantum leap.

In turn we swap the dealers held DVC for btc/ltc/nxt or some other liquid coin.  This reduces merchant sell off pressure but forces TT players to hold a bunch of the big coins.  We play the role of liquidity makers.

People redeeming the DVC will probably have to pay a small premium, or CoaEx is generous and provides the services gratis.  But there is a bit of book keeping for them verses a coinpayment provider doing it for them(but there is a fee for those services too).  So maybe it all washes even.

Shipping is a bit of a hickup, but can be fixxed via the redeemer pays that separately.

Also, not sure on the Coaex markup from spot, so either the redeemer or us eats that.

This scales to other redeemables with other merchants too.

NOTE: DVC 1.0  is in-house only, but I think it only takes a solid game plan and listing the asset and DVC are public.
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The link is >> http://indiamikezulu.com.au/454/list-of-trusted-traders/

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Happy T Day

 

Distribution sounds like a good idea at this point. The idea of keeping coins isn't a bad idea at all when the idea of bullion merchants and things of that nature come into play.

If the shipments arrive from Coaex, perhaps they could be the first merchant in this DVC thing? To show appreciation for them taking the ride with us. Not sure how any of it would work but since they were willing to take the ride with UNO maybe try to play things out with them and DVC if they are at all interested?

Now would the DVC be given to merchants? If they are just given out, which is what i hope is done, but does it slightly dilute the over all value of the outstanding DVC? If that is how it would be done at all. I would rather have this talked about in depth now before we all get too vested into this. It could also help pull people into wanting to be a part of this if they can see "bigger things to come" and i don't see this act as blowing smoke as the merchant could very well like the stability that comes from trying the coin to a concrete commodity and escaping a lot of the volatility of the cryptoverse.

Maybe some people here are particular of dildos, they say sex sells I totally get the point. Adding merchants doesn't usually do more than further dilute the value of the coin because most merchants look to cash out to fiat nearly instantly and apply even more downward pressure. Vicious cycle.

Can we set up pairs through the nxt wallet for DVC/UNO? Or are the trades going to occur through here like:

I am selling .5 DVC for 5.25 uno (an example)

Then when someone takes that up i transfer the assets to them through nxt and they send me uno. It would so awesome if dvc/uno pairing could be exchanged through nxt wallet. Like the nxt wallet is a "multi" wallet platform or something like that. Anyone here capable of making something like that happen  ?


It is a login for wordpress forums. Since it is imz's website you need to make a new login. I didn't do it yet but it would be nice if that page could be viewed without having to sign up.

When I press the TT link, it asks me to login with a user and password. Is it supposed to work like that?

@ Bitcoin National: I apologise. It's never intentional. I really am half blind. Keep your hand on my elbow.

You are now a one-and-a-half star TT.

And blast the wallet! It's not my fault, but I feel bad. The moment you have both address and key, post both.

And we must add your insurance information to the daily Un-Ex post! It's a valuable asset.

So, any concerns or questions? Are we very nearly ready to begin issuing?

M

Bene can have 3.3 ✪✪✪.✪✪✪
also I've pledged to insure BeneX trades for upto 5 UNO
*^{still not sure how to insure, there needs to be signed contracts (basically yes we agree to trade) and then transID ... it's still a work in progress.}

---
now my turn to whine
I've got a trade here >https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.9526543
and did one hedge ...    can I have part of a star?

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NXT wallet ... NRS Version: 1.3.4 ... it was stuck on the block chain date Nov 23 ... I've given up and just started a new chain download ... so it might be 3 more days 

Six Trusted Traders ready to receive DVC, Benefactor.

Only ever one or two DVC per Verified TT.

Ian and I both standing neutral at present.

Each DVC, B., represents two ounces of bullion. So,1  DVC = $US35. 2 = $70.

And they are gonna be a toy with sharp corners -- that is, volatile in a zero-sum trading-environment, so I think it's wise to start small: this undertaking is an experiment in price-independence. No one in the crypto world has done anything like this.

Scaleability is baked in the cake, though. We not only want this project to become much much larger, we have a whole bunch of related ideas to introduce -- 'Global Mall Unobtanium!!'

But we gotta walk before we can crawl. The Hedges went very slowly. DVC (Hedges Phase Two) is lookin' much better -- and yep, you pile in forthwith.

M

No. I won't be holding any DVCs until after the bursar role has moved into a community agreed process.

At that point I'll get verified and be allocated my 2 DVC like anybody else.

The 6 are two for you, Mark, two for Ian, and two for BitcoinNational, right?  You can't have 6, while the rest of us have 2 max., or am I missing something?

Also, I'm all for each of us having a higher max.  2 isn't much.  I know it's experimental and all, though.  See, that's what I think all the remaining DVC's should be for.  We should eventually use them.  500 - I'm thinking half of the participants here could move some stuff around and issue all 500 single-handedly!

However, yes, it should be a gradual and fair process, one that includes and equates someone with only 10 ounces of Ag along with those of us who keep hundreds buried for a rainy day and have to beat away the ground squirrels and emus; (sorry little Uno (mascot), had to be said.)

Yay!!!  Bucket list complete!

I guess I will have to look into getting a Nxt wallet, now, and buy up all of the DVC's.  Damn.  Too lazy.  I was going to hold my abstinence as leverage for getting acknowledgement of the hallowed 3rd star.   

I now have 3 stars, but I am not in charge.   

Un-Ex 27/11/2014 [Western Australia – a half a day ahead of the U.S.]

Unobtanium: 'solid': .0072/.0060

https://www.cryptsy.com/markets/view/133
https://bittrex.com/Market/Index?MarketName=BTC-UNO
https://bleutrade.com/exchange/UNO/BTC
https://coinbroker.io/trade/?symbol=UNO.BTC;

Trusted Traders:

http://indiamikezulu.com.au/wp-admin/post.php?post=454&action=edit&message=6

Physical Bullion: $US16.32

DVC: 12.700

@ Benefactor: Abundance-of-Caution 100 Uno received. I beg your pardon. I haven't had my wallet open.

TT List update: unless there is dissent, you have 3.1 stars (Wa ha ha )

http://indiamikezulu.com.au/454/list-of-trusted-traders

It's so pleasing to have you asking questions. Failure awaits an uncriticised model:

here's the arithmetic, B.:

an asset is created with a permanently fixed number of units. Now, if we get 50 TTs with 2 DVC each Verified and trading, this Project will be a booming success.

The Nxt asset 'DVC' has 500 units. Thus, 100 as 'basic stock.' I suggest 20 as 'Specials.' And 380 to either hold in the vault or destroy. Destroying coin shouldn't be difficult. ('Proof of Burn.')

As with any coin, the coins are visible in their wallets. (And someone other than Ian or I should be the Invigilator.)

The great unsoundness of POS coins is that most have huge numbers of coins, and 'fuzzy' identifications in the first place. (For example, B., it's just too easy for the dev to masquerade as a couple of IPO-ers; or for a number of IPO-ers to in fact be the same player.)

However, Ian and I have theorised this coin v. carefully:

the total number of coins is tiny. The 'pre-existing' community is vigilant from Day One. The 'Bursar's Wallet' will be the only wallet to hold un-circulated coins.

What would back the Specials? Don't know -- but indeed, as per the principle in play here, they would need to be adequately and verifiably backed.

Decision-making: I agree with the '60%-two weeks' formula. Indeed, I'd like to see pretty much continuous discussion about how DVC will serve to develop and strengthen this community (Global Mall Unobtanium)

Finally, I apologise if the shift to Phase Two seemed abrupt. It was -- but the processes following the decision to create the coin have been slow and patient. (Eg: I suggest that Sabretooth be considered as 'Provisional' for a little while simply because he may pass rapidly from arrival to first trade to Verification.)

Gotta get B.N.'s Nxt wallet running, which will give us six TTs ready to go, and the Bursar standing by. And I expect that you will pop up with wallet address and public key shortly.

We are, at this point, ready to issue DVC.

m

There are 500 non decimal divisible DVCs.

We expect to use perhaps 100 - 200 at tops.

If I was to speculate a reason for holding addition DVCs in 'community bank', it would be to embrace commercial partners into the Trusted Trader arena.

i.e. To garner a relationship between the DVC core community group and a Bullion Supplier.
 
These commercial invitations would require a single point of contact (to establish the peer to peer trust) and a benefit to the community. As much as inviting Dildo and Co. to the UNO arena would look great in a press release it isn't the kind of merchant facility I can see being used within the community. Not to be harsh but waste not want not. Nothing superficial or 'high five us' is going to sustain any long term value for a community of this nature.

It is also worth considering: Within this community are technically apt service people. I would happily accept UNO/DVCs for any services I can provide to the community and I would happily pay UNO/DVCs for any services within the community I might need. We don't want to invite businesses interests into the community at the expense of 'real people' traders. I would wager we have web developers, technicians, coders and possibly a few specialists in said fields within this community.

I think at the stage where the core community begins to bulge we should consider extrapolating the project to prevent any easy to target points of centralization.

Imagine I had spent all this time working with the community acting as the logistics center and ran away with... a few hundred bucks of DVCs. Never going to happen.

However if the project explodes, that point of centralization becomes far more attractive target. Fewer coins, smaller tighter communities and a peer to peer level of appreciation respect and trust can supersede a lot of the potential for wrong doing however at some point there will always be enough profit to be gained for someone to do the legwork.

We can avoid that with small allocations and small communities. Hence 500 DVCs and an honest and open understanding that it is unlikely the current iteration of DVCs (NXT Asset) will be with us in years to come. It is an initial tool to facilitate the project (not a project to justify the use of a tool Which is something I see in internet communities).

My sincerest hope is that in the years to come as our community develops and additional projects spawn from this one, there will be the desire and obvious need to build our own tools from scratch, for the community by the community.

Definitely a good idea to have them on hand.  Were there more extras?  I think you said something about 'destroying' some?  Don't do that.  The bursar must always be responsible, though.  We can track these, right?  I mean, is there a way the whole community can always see them, like on the blockchain?  Then, we will at least know if there is something off.  If you have to change wallets or something, just announce the movement of the extras.

As for what to do with them...?  Don't they have to be based on actual bullion?  I say definitely yes, so they wouldn't be issued unless more bullion was held for them.

Whatever you/we do with extras, please don't ever be rash.  Even having a good, vigorous discussion with 60% of the posters here and then moving the extras within 24 hours is inadequate.  Give it at least a week for EVERYONE to have the opportunity to chime in with opinion and influence.  (I prefer a whole month, but things move faster here in Cryptoland.)