Are transfers to coinbase within the US?
Yes, Coinbase is domiciled in the US.
Topic: U.S. bank closing all of my deposit accounts because of bitcoins - page 4. (Read 20566 times)
Yes, Coinbase is domiciled in the US.
Stop using banks altogether - Bitcoin was created as an alternative to this monetary tyranny. Why should banks embrace it?
Your landlord takes Bitcoin?
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Stop using banks altogether - Bitcoin was created as an alternative to this monetary tyranny. Why should banks embrace it?
Are transfers to coinbase within the US?
I still use my account to deposit to mt.gox's account.
I never notice the strange rules from my bank.
I think your account should be locked by other reasons.
I never notice the strange rules from my bank.
I think your account should be locked by other reasons.
I recently spoke with someone who works as a compliance officer at a large bank (in the US) regarding this issue. She basically told me that accounts that move a lot of money in and out of the country automatically trigger alerts that put them into the so called high-risk category. These accounts then need to be kept under closer tabs, as in someone needs to manually track subsequent suspicious transactions and either file Suspicious Activity Reports or record down the reasons why the bank thinks that the transactions are not suspicious after all. (This could be as simple as someone from the bank calling you and asking you what these wire transfers are all about and then adding your response to the file.) Failure to do so could result in heavy fines against the bank. This is a lot of work for the bank, so at some point the bank just closes these troublesome accounts if they feel that the revenues that these accounts bring in do not justify the costs required to maintain regulatory compliance.
This is true for both personal and business accounts, but the handling of each is different.
This is true for both personal and business accounts, but the handling of each is different.
Why couldn't they just ask the customer to stop the undesired transactions rather the closing the account preemptively?
A) An individual account, if you're an ordinary person, isn't too important to them. In aggregate, they are, yes, but any single account, not so much.... much easier just to have a form letter go out and be done with it.
B) The bank is operating under the assumption that whatever activity that's going on in the account is activity that the account owner needs to do. So they'll say "well, when we opened the account, he was just a regular depositor like all the others, but now he's doing all these international wires and shifting money all over the place, we don't like that". They don't look at transactions as being optional (they'll never say "would you please stop depositing money into your account?" or "if you wouldn't mind, please stop making withdrawals" (second part, actually, they will for savings accounts and money market accounts; those account types are limited to 6 withdrawals or less per month otherwise they convert to checking accounts. Not like there's any difference in this day and age of 0% interest rates, but when that changes, there MIGHT become more of a difference between checking and savings)
I recently spoke with someone who works as a compliance officer at a large bank (in the US) regarding this issue. She basically told me that accounts that move a lot of money in and out of the country automatically trigger alerts that put them into the so called high-risk category. These accounts then need to be kept under closer tabs, as in someone needs to manually track subsequent suspicious transactions and either file Suspicious Activity Reports or record down the reasons why the bank thinks that the transactions are not suspicious after all. (This could be as simple as someone from the bank calling you and asking you what these wire transfers are all about and then adding your response to the file.) Failure to do so could result in heavy fines against the bank. This is a lot of work for the bank, so at some point the bank just closes these troublesome accounts if they feel that the revenues that these accounts bring in do not justify the costs required to maintain regulatory compliance.
This is true for both personal and business accounts, but the handling of each is different.
This is true for both personal and business accounts, but the handling of each is different.
Why couldn't they just ask the customer to stop the undesired transactions rather the closing the account preemptively?
For every action there is a reaction, equal in force and opposite in direction.
I recently spoke with someone who works as a compliance officer at a large bank (in the US) regarding this issue. She basically told me that accounts that move a lot of money in and out of the country automatically trigger alerts that put them into the so called high-risk category. These accounts then need to be kept under closer tabs, as in someone needs to manually track subsequent suspicious transactions and either file Suspicious Activity Reports or record down the reasons why the bank thinks that the transactions are not suspicious after all. (This could be as simple as someone from the bank calling you and asking you what these wire transfers are all about and then adding your response to the file.) Failure to do so could result in heavy fines against the bank. This is a lot of work for the bank, so at some point the bank just closes these troublesome accounts if they feel that the revenues that these accounts bring in do not justify the costs required to maintain regulatory compliance.
This is true for both personal and business accounts, but the handling of each is different.
This is true for both personal and business accounts, but the handling of each is different.
He was moving thousands of dollars through is personal accounts to do arbitrage across exchanges. You should at least talk to your branch manager before starting this kind of activity.
Agreed. Banks have to pay for all your transactions, and I doubt they're going to be willing to let you play with hundreds and thousands of deposits and withdrawals, using their system to do so. that costs them money. I understand why they closed it down, and it has nothing to do with some "war on bitcoin". Banks just dont want to pay the fees. They got pissed off at me because i was transferring money in and out of a savings account too much last month. And all i was doing was transferring to my other accounts. https://thebutterzone.wordpress.com/2013/02/10/bitcoins-u-s-savingsmoney-market-accounts-dont/
Moving to a different bank isn't an easy task.
of course it is:
Just go close the accounts, take your cashiers check and walk into any local credit union. Explain to them your business (arbitrage) and that you need whatever volume of wires over whatever time frame... I'm sure they'll be able to set you up with the accounts you need.
And then change you and your wife's direct deposits, move your safe deposit box (if the new bank has any room!), change the mortgage payment, the car payment, all of your credit card auto-pays, the water bill, the garbage bill, the insurance bill, order new checks, deal with a new ATM pin.
WAR ON BITCOIN WAR ON BITCOIN ! ! , it's this hysterical over excited posting that seems to be a part of every thread which is simply efforts to manipulate pricing.
In December last year I had my yorkshire bank accounts frozen after £15,000 of trading of Bitcoin this was lots of bank transfers in and out of my private account, the surge of business activity into a private bank account had caused the freeze not Bitcoin. They were happy for me to continue buying/selling bitcoin as long as I opened a business account within a month. In the end I opened the business account with Barclays who didn't have a problem with me buying and selling Bitcoin either.
In December last year I had my yorkshire bank accounts frozen after £15,000 of trading of Bitcoin this was lots of bank transfers in and out of my private account, the surge of business activity into a private bank account had caused the freeze not Bitcoin. They were happy for me to continue buying/selling bitcoin as long as I opened a business account within a month. In the end I opened the business account with Barclays who didn't have a problem with me buying and selling Bitcoin either.
One of the very best things for bitcoin would be if the USA started a "war on bitcoin"... every single 'war on' anything that the US starts fails miserably and their target becomes legal and/or legitimate.
'war on drugs' anyone?
Moving to a different bank isn't an easy task.
of course it is:
Just go close the accounts, take your cashiers check and walk into any local credit union. Explain to them your business (arbitrage) and that you need whatever volume of wires over whatever time frame... I'm sure they'll be able to set you up with the accounts you need.
it would be epic if you print a bitcoin symbol in a big white t-shirt and go roam around big banks....
Get a new bank, problem solved.
well, i'm freaking out cause there is no guarantee other bank will not do the same. I'll give wells fargo try. Spoke to them they dont mind bitcoins. The letter doesn't mention bitcoin. Did they tell you that part in some other communication?
when i called them to find out what the deal is they say cause i was buying bitcoins. I never told bank i will be using wires to buy bitcoins. I told them i will be buying e-currencies. I believe bitstamp account where i was wiring money to is flagged or something If you just mention "bitcoin" or "e currencies" or other abstract terms like that, most bankers won't have s clue what you're talking about and will just say yes. Explain lots of wires in and out, that more accurately describes what the bank will be dealing with.
I am sorry but I have never heard of this before. I have of freezing but not just random closing.
Please post letter or it didn't happen, Thanks!
Please post letter or it didn't happen, Thanks!
I'm sorry reading is hard for you. OP posted it on the first page.
here is what i got. it doesn say much. So when i called bank asking what rules i broke they told I was buying bitcoins . I didnt tell bank i was using it to buy bitcoins just ecurrencies. Somehow they find out
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/106526372/letter.jpg
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/106526372/letter.jpg
What sorts of transactions were you doing related to bitcoins?
all i was doing is arbitrage. buying in one place sell them in otherBanks suck!
I do deal with banks a LOT as part of my 9-5
I'd guess what freaked them out is your account was a personal account with ordinary "personal" type activity in it; all of a sudden a large-ish wire hit your account, possibly from overseas (ie mt gox, btc-e), and then they saw the money zip back out to another source (I'd guess btce). Do that a few more times (sell bitcoins on gox, transfer proceeds to you bank, transfer dollars to btce, buy bitcoins, transfer to gox, sell, transfer to your bank) and they're just seeing a lot of money moving around from basically unknown sources, etc. it'll send up lots of red flags. And unless you're a big customer, they don't like red flags. I almost guess their communication to you didn't mention bitcoin.
My only guess, is next time form a business, even a sole proprietorship, and explain what you'll be doing when you open the account. Don't necessarily need to mention bitcoins, just something like overseas securities trading, just so the bank is aware of the funds movements you account will likely see.
I am sorry but I have never heard of this before. I have of freezing but not just random closing.
Please post letter or it didn't happen, Thanks!
Please post letter or it didn't happen, Thanks!
He was moving thousands of dollars through is personal accounts to do arbitrage across exchanges. You should at least talk to your branch manager before starting this kind of activity.
Agreed. Banks have to pay for all your transactions, and I doubt they're going to be willing to let you play with hundreds and thousands of deposits and withdrawals, using their system to do so. that costs them money. I understand why they closed it down, and it has nothing to do with some "war on bitcoin". Banks just dont want to pay the fees. They got pissed off at me because i was transferring money in and out of a savings account too much last month. And all i was doing was transferring to my other accounts. 
It was probably due to the extra paperwork they were having to do because of the amount of funds you were moving. Banks and currency exchangers are subject to reporting to the FINCEN. Here's a pdf the FINCEN issues to banks for whose accounts they need to report:
www.fincen.gov/statutes_regs/guidance/pdf/bsa_quickrefguide.pdf
www.fincen.gov/statutes_regs/guidance/pdf/bsa_quickrefguide.pdf
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