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Topic: USD inflation affect on BTC? - page 4. (Read 6924 times)

hero member
Activity: 532
Merit: 500
FIAT LIBERTAS RVAT CAELVM
November 09, 2012, 03:09:43 PM
#29
The fact that gold's value appear to be nearly constant just mean that it had time to converge (ie roughly everybody knows it, and their opinion on it's value is kinda constant). And everything is not about the dollar. It's about the value of everything compared to the value of everything else.

Fair point, and I agree with you that when Bitcoin's value does finally converge, it will be much higher than it is now.

There's no reason for the FED to stop, or even slow printing of new dollars, "fiscal cliff" or no, though, so I think we can count on it's price in fiat continuing rise, too.
sr. member
Activity: 434
Merit: 251
November 09, 2012, 02:59:08 PM
#28
So if the US economy has to print more $$$ to deal with this fiscal cliff I've been reading about in the news will the inflation of the USD cause an increase in BTC price? Or are BTCs relatively pegged to USD?

Not saying the FED will stop printing anytime soon, but are you implying that since the US gov will increase tax revenue, they'll have to borrow more ? Sound logical to you ?
And yes, there's some (inverse) correlation between USD and BTC, but clearly USD value won't be the reason why BTC will go to the moon (ultimately)

The value of BTC will stay roughly equal. Just like Gold. Back in the day, a gold coin would get you a nice toga, some sandals, and a high-quality bag to put your stuff in. Nowadays, selling a gold piece will net you enough cash for a nice suit, quality shoes, and a briefcase. Don't confuse the number after the $ for a value. It's a price. As the supply of the dollar skyrockets, the price of BTC, denominated in dollars will necessarily rise.

As has been noted, the only way for BTC value to rise is if there's greater demand.

His point was the fiscal cliff involves tax increases and spending cuts.  There is nothing in the "fiscal cliff" which would result in increased printing.  The FED may (continue to) increase printing but that has nothing to do with the fiscal cliff.

Thanks D&T, you got my point.

And regarding BTC value, yep I think it'll go up (and I know the difference between price and value).

At the moment, most people don't know about BTC, so to them we could say that the value they attach to BTC is null. Still a lot of people don't understand it, thus they think it's a bad idea, and that their value is also null. With time (hopefully), more and more people will discover BTC and understand it, find it valuable, thus to them, the value they attach to it will increase.
Now imagine a kind of "global" value, ie the market value. This is the one which is reflected in the price. This is a function of the opinion of every actor in "The Market". This is not a constant, and it's increasing.

The fact that gold's value appear to be nearly constant just mean that it had time to converge (ie roughly everybody knows it, and their opinion on it's value is kinda constant). But "nearly constant" is an overreach. For example, gold's price went up 5 folds in the last 10 years. Fortunately it doesn't mean that USD value went down 80% in the same timeperiod. Everything is not about the dollar. It's about the value of everything compared to the value of everything else.
hero member
Activity: 532
Merit: 500
FIAT LIBERTAS RVAT CAELVM
November 09, 2012, 01:59:02 PM
#27
So if the US economy has to print more $$$ to deal with this fiscal cliff I've been reading about in the news will the inflation of the USD cause an increase in BTC price? Or are BTCs relatively pegged to USD?

Not saying the FED will stop printing anytime soon, but are you implying that since the US gov will increase tax revenue, they'll have to borrow more ? Sound logical to you ?
And yes, there's some (inverse) correlation between USD and BTC, but clearly USD value won't be the reason why BTC will go to the moon (ultimately)

The value of BTC will stay roughly equal. Just like Gold. Back in the day, a gold coin would get you a nice toga, some sandals, and a high-quality bag to put your stuff in. Nowadays, selling a gold piece will net you enough cash for a nice suit, quality shoes, and a briefcase. Don't confuse the number after the $ for a value. It's a price. As the supply of the dollar skyrockets, the price of BTC, denominated in dollars will necessarily rise.

As has been noted, the only way for BTC value to rise is if there's greater demand.

His point was the fiscal cliff involves tax increases and spending cuts.  There is nothing in the "fiscal cliff" which would result in increased printing.  The FED may (continue to) increase printing but that has nothing to do with the fiscal cliff.

I love how "cut" has been redefined to mean "reduced increase."
donator
Activity: 1218
Merit: 1079
Gerald Davis
November 09, 2012, 01:54:01 PM
#26
So if the US economy has to print more $$$ to deal with this fiscal cliff I've been reading about in the news will the inflation of the USD cause an increase in BTC price? Or are BTCs relatively pegged to USD?

Not saying the FED will stop printing anytime soon, but are you implying that since the US gov will increase tax revenue, they'll have to borrow more ? Sound logical to you ?
And yes, there's some (inverse) correlation between USD and BTC, but clearly USD value won't be the reason why BTC will go to the moon (ultimately)

The value of BTC will stay roughly equal. Just like Gold. Back in the day, a gold coin would get you a nice toga, some sandals, and a high-quality bag to put your stuff in. Nowadays, selling a gold piece will net you enough cash for a nice suit, quality shoes, and a briefcase. Don't confuse the number after the $ for a value. It's a price. As the supply of the dollar skyrockets, the price of BTC, denominated in dollars will necessarily rise.

As has been noted, the only way for BTC value to rise is if there's greater demand.

His point was the fiscal cliff involves tax increases and spending cuts.  There is nothing in the "fiscal cliff" which would result in increased printing.  The FED may (continue to) increase printing but that has nothing to do with the fiscal cliff.
hero member
Activity: 532
Merit: 500
FIAT LIBERTAS RVAT CAELVM
November 09, 2012, 01:23:24 PM
#25
So if the US economy has to print more $$$ to deal with this fiscal cliff I've been reading about in the news will the inflation of the USD cause an increase in BTC price? Or are BTCs relatively pegged to USD?

Not saying the FED will stop printing anytime soon, but are you implying that since the US gov will increase tax revenue, they'll have to borrow more ? Sound logical to you ?
And yes, there's some (inverse) correlation between USD and BTC, but clearly USD value won't be the reason why BTC will go to the moon (ultimately)

The value of BTC will stay roughly equal. Just like Gold. Back in the day, a gold coin would get you a nice toga, some sandals, and a high-quality bag to put your stuff in. Nowadays, selling a gold piece will net you enough cash for a nice suit, quality shoes, and a briefcase. Don't confuse the number after the $ for a value. It's a price. As the supply of the dollar skyrockets, the price of BTC, denominated in dollars will necessarily rise.

As has been noted, the only way for BTC value to rise is if there's greater demand.
sr. member
Activity: 434
Merit: 251
November 09, 2012, 01:17:18 PM
#24
So if the US economy has to print more $$$ to deal with this fiscal cliff I've been reading about in the news will the inflation of the USD cause an increase in BTC price? Or are BTCs relatively pegged to USD?

Not saying the FED will stop printing anytime soon, but are you implying that since the US gov will increase tax revenue, they'll have to borrow more ? Sound logical to you ?
And yes, there's some (inverse) correlation between USD and BTC, but clearly USD value won't be the reason why BTC will go to the moon (ultimately)
donator
Activity: 2772
Merit: 1019
November 09, 2012, 12:44:08 PM
#23
So if the US economy has to print more $$$ to deal with this fiscal cliff I've been reading about in the news will the inflation of the USD cause an increase in BTC price? Or are BTCs relatively pegged to USD?

Ceteris paribus, the more USD available, the higher the BTC price.

It's just a supply and demand thing. If the supply of USD rises, then their price (in bitcoins) falls.

How long do you think it will take to see this effect? How far will bitcoin price trail inflation?

-10 minutes. Ben got into bitcoin Wink
legendary
Activity: 896
Merit: 1001
November 09, 2012, 12:27:36 PM
#22
So if the US economy has to print more $$$ to deal with this fiscal cliff I've been reading about in the news will the inflation of the USD cause an increase in BTC price? Or are BTCs relatively pegged to USD?

Ceteris paribus, the more USD available, the higher the BTC price.

It's just a supply and demand thing. If the supply of USD rises, then their price (in bitcoins) falls.

How long do you think it will take to see this effect? How far will bitcoin price trail inflation?
hero member
Activity: 518
Merit: 500
November 09, 2012, 08:58:26 AM
#21
So if the US economy has to print more $$$ to deal with this fiscal cliff I've been reading about in the news will the inflation of the USD cause an increase in BTC price? Or are BTCs relatively pegged to USD?

Ceteris paribus, the more USD available, the higher the BTC price.

It's just a supply and demand thing. If the supply of USD rises, then their price (in bitcoins) falls.
newbie
Activity: 56
Merit: 0
November 09, 2012, 04:53:16 AM
#20
So if the US economy has to print more $$$ to deal with this fiscal cliff I've been reading about in the news will the inflation of the USD cause an increase in BTC price? Or are BTCs relatively pegged to USD?

Ceteris paribus, the more USD available, the higher the BTC price.
legendary
Activity: 1904
Merit: 1002
November 09, 2012, 04:36:10 AM
#19
gold and silver wont pan out as well as they planed... why? Because Bitcoin  Wink

Weird. At this point usually cypherdoc jumps in and posts something about the daaash for digital caaash.

He's travelling and likely hasn't seen the thread yet.
donator
Activity: 2772
Merit: 1019
November 09, 2012, 01:59:49 AM
#18
gold and silver wont pan out as well as they planed... why? Because Bitcoin  Wink

Weird. At this point usually cypherdoc jumps in and posts something about the daaash for digital caaash.
hero member
Activity: 518
Merit: 500
November 08, 2012, 10:35:18 PM
#17
If 1 bitcoin will buy 1 gram of weed (on silk road), it does not matter what the price of USD is. If they print a bunch of USD, but the supply and demand of bitcoins and weed remain steady, then 1 bitcoin will still but one gram of weed, but that bitcoin will buy more dollars than before. So the USD inflation does not have any afect on BTC, but the USD/BTC rate will go up.

Taking a different view, if the USD starts going into faster inflation, then more people will start looking for places to put their money that are not subject to the inflation, so more people will want to put their savings into bitcoins. This will raise the value of bitcoins (maybe 1 bitcoin will then buy 2 grams of weed, or 10 grams of weed).
legendary
Activity: 1904
Merit: 1037
Trusted Bitcoiner
November 08, 2012, 09:54:17 PM
#16
So the strategy is to have USD inflation happen slower than the other currencies, so that purchasing USD seems like a good idea, then print that money and leverage the demand to try to keep a stable value? I guess when you are running from a lion, you only have to worry about staying ahead of the slowest companion.

Except every other central bank is trying to do the same thing.  I mean it is zero sum.   Manipulating currency doesn't generate wealth.  Increased productivity produces wealth.  All these central bank games do is rearrange the slices of the pie, usually to the benefit of the ultra rich (forget 1% more like 0.0001%) at the expense of the entire rest of the planet.   Parasitic class for the win.  Remember "money" is simply an accounting system.  If inflation is causing you to "lose" (harder to make ends meat, erodes your savings, etc) then it is making someone else "win".

"Give me control of a nation's money and I care not who makes the laws."
- Mayer Amschel Rothschild

you have to believe that ONE DAY, this retarded system is going to be replaced.... i mean its build in such a way that make its doom inevitable. the rich know this... they are buying up assets, and banking on gold and silver (why do you think they have been shooting up for the past 10 years, why do you think china built ghost cities and bought 1 bazillion pounds of copper  Shocked)

gold and silver wont pan out as well as they planed... why? Because Bitcoin  Wink
hero member
Activity: 532
Merit: 500
FIAT LIBERTAS RVAT CAELVM
November 08, 2012, 09:50:01 PM
#15
So the strategy is to have USD inflation happen slower than the other currencies, so that purchasing USD seems like a good idea, then print that money and leverage the demand to try to keep a stable value? I guess when you are running from a lion, you only have to worry about staying ahead of the slowest companion.

Except every other central bank is trying to do the same thing.  I mean it is zero sum.   Manipulating currency doesn't generate wealth.  Increased productivity produces wealth.  All these central bank games do is rearrange the slices of the pie, usually to the benefit of the ultra rich (forget 1% more like 0.0001%) at the expense of the entire rest of the planet.   Parasitic class for the win.  Remember "money" is simply an accounting system.  If inflation is causing you to "lose" (harder to make ends meat, erodes your savings, etc) then it is making someone else "win".

"Give me control of a nation's money and I care not who makes the laws."
- Mayer Amschel Rothschild

Aside from the fact that he probably never actually said that, You're dead right. Whether he said it or not, it's certainly the way things work.
donator
Activity: 1218
Merit: 1079
Gerald Davis
November 08, 2012, 09:39:32 PM
#14
So the strategy is to have USD inflation happen slower than the other currencies, so that purchasing USD seems like a good idea, then print that money and leverage the demand to try to keep a stable value? I guess when you are running from a lion, you only have to worry about staying ahead of the slowest companion.

Except every other central bank is trying to do the same thing.  I mean it is zero sum.   Manipulating currency doesn't generate wealth.  Increased productivity produces wealth.  All these central bank games do is rearrange the slices of the pie, usually to the benefit of the ultra rich (forget 1% more like 0.0001%) at the expense of the entire rest of the planet.   Parasitic class for the win.  Remember "money" is simply an accounting system.  If inflation is causing you to "lose" (harder to make ends meet, erodes your savings, etc) then it is causing someone else to "win".

"Give me control of a nation's money and I care not who makes the laws."
- Mayer Amschel Rothschild
hero member
Activity: 532
Merit: 500
FIAT LIBERTAS RVAT CAELVM
November 08, 2012, 09:32:24 PM
#13
legendary
Activity: 896
Merit: 1001
November 08, 2012, 04:17:34 PM
#12
So the strategy is to have USD inflation happen slower than the other currencies, so that purchasing USD seems like a good idea, then print that money and leverage the demand to try to keep a stable value? I guess when you are running from a lion, you only have to worry about staying ahead of the slowest companion.
donator
Activity: 2772
Merit: 1019
November 08, 2012, 12:01:21 PM
#11
lol

i think for ever point the USD goes down bitcoin gains 2 points  Wink

it should be noted that the USD is still holding up pretty damn good despite QE3

I just heard on CapitalAccount that the FED hasn't expanded it's balance sheet for the last 2 months (despite deciding QE3). Is that true?
donator
Activity: 1218
Merit: 1079
Gerald Davis
November 08, 2012, 09:44:05 AM
#10
lol

i think for ever point the USD goes down bitcoin gains 2 points  Wink

it should be noted that the USD is still holding up pretty damn good despite QE3



If US inflates 5% and the EU central bank inflates 5% then everything else being equal the exchange rate shouldn't change.
If the US hyperinflates 50% and the EU central bank hyperinflates 50% then everything else being equal the exchange rate shouldn't change.

However you can't (at least yet) hyperinflate the gold supply (or the corn supply, or the oil supply, etc) so when failing central banks try to out compete each other in "inflation wars" the effect will be seen in the prices of commodities not in inter-currency exchange rates.
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