Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion - page 18887.

AlexGR

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Quote from: poncom on May 05, 2016, 11:17:04 AM

I was hodling no matter what happened to the price, then Gavin announced Craig Wright had proved he is Satoshi. I panic dumped right at the bottom, then had to buy back after it became clear it was all bull. I'd never have panic dumped if it wasn't for all the Satoshi lies.

Seriously, what was your rationale for dumping?

poncom

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Quote from: edgar on May 05, 2016, 11:10:37 AM

Quote from: poncom on May 05, 2016, 10:50:32 AM

Quote from: marcus_of_augustus on February 05, 2016, 07:45:53 PM

Quote from: poncom on February 05, 2016, 07:35:25 PM

Quote from: marcus_of_augustus on February 05, 2016, 07:02:43 PM

Gavin's big dial with the shit-eating grin on front of r/bitcoin again ... dump incoming.

edit: notice how he releases these controversial posts at critical timings for technical price breakouts ... or coincidence?

What has he controversially posted? I don't read r/bitcoin and I can't face wading through page after page to find his post. Is it another post about the block size combined with another alternate Bitcoin wallet? The last thing I heard about Gavin was he climbed down to suggesting going for 2MB blocks.

Dumpus_Maximus just posted about arbitrary numbers and binaries for "crassic"
usual thing, brigade voted to the top in no time by the usual paid shills, trolls, zealots and agent provocateurs
https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/
... dump incoming as per expected, cheap coinz for his bankster buddies.

I see what you mean about Gavin releasing controversial posts at critical timings for technical price breakouts with a shit-eating grin. He cost me a packet by backing up Craig Wright, I would never have believed Craig Wright except for with Gavin's back up. That's the last faith I had in Gavin gone.

how exactly did gavin backing craig cost you a packet?

I was hodling no matter what happened to the price, then Gavin announced Craig Wright had proved he is Satoshi. I panic dumped right at the bottom, then had to buy back after it became clear it was all bull. I'd never have panic dumped if it wasn't for all the Satoshi lies.

edgar

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Quote from: poncom on May 05, 2016, 10:50:32 AM

Quote from: marcus_of_augustus on February 05, 2016, 07:45:53 PM

Quote from: poncom on February 05, 2016, 07:35:25 PM

Quote from: marcus_of_augustus on February 05, 2016, 07:02:43 PM

Gavin's big dial with the shit-eating grin on front of r/bitcoin again ... dump incoming.

edit: notice how he releases these controversial posts at critical timings for technical price breakouts ... or coincidence?

What has he controversially posted? I don't read r/bitcoin and I can't face wading through page after page to find his post. Is it another post about the block size combined with another alternate Bitcoin wallet? The last thing I heard about Gavin was he climbed down to suggesting going for 2MB blocks.

Dumpus_Maximus just posted about arbitrary numbers and binaries for "crassic"
usual thing, brigade voted to the top in no time by the usual paid shills, trolls, zealots and agent provocateurs
https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/
... dump incoming as per expected, cheap coinz for his bankster buddies.

I see what you mean about Gavin releasing controversial posts at critical timings for technical price breakouts with a shit-eating grin. He cost me a packet by backing up Craig Wright, I would never have believed Craig Wright except for with Gavin's back up. That's the last faith I had in Gavin gone.

how exactly did gavin backing craig cost you a packet?

Ultrafinery

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Shameful, Gentlemen. This will surely come back to haunt us.

yefi

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Quote from: ImI on May 03, 2016, 04:09:49 AM

Quote from: yefi on May 02, 2016, 09:12:11 PM

If he publicly and verifiably signs a message from the genesis block, I'll give your newbie butt 1 shiny bitcoin. Quote it.

Guess I'll be keeping it then Wink

Gyrsur

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Bitcoin Legal Tender Countries: 2 of 206

poncom

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Quote from: marcus_of_augustus on February 05, 2016, 07:45:53 PM

Quote from: poncom on February 05, 2016, 07:35:25 PM

Quote from: marcus_of_augustus on February 05, 2016, 07:02:43 PM

Gavin's big dial with the shit-eating grin on front of r/bitcoin again ... dump incoming.

edit: notice how he releases these controversial posts at critical timings for technical price breakouts ... or coincidence?

What has he controversially posted? I don't read r/bitcoin and I can't face wading through page after page to find his post. Is it another post about the block size combined with another alternate Bitcoin wallet? The last thing I heard about Gavin was he climbed down to suggesting going for 2MB blocks.

Dumpus_Maximus just posted about arbitrary numbers and binaries for "crassic"
usual thing, brigade voted to the top in no time by the usual paid shills, trolls, zealots and agent provocateurs
https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/
... dump incoming as per expected, cheap coinz for his bankster buddies.

I see what you mean about Gavin releasing controversial posts at critical timings for technical price breakouts with a shit-eating grin. He cost me a packet by backing up Craig Wright, I would never have believed Craig Wright except for with Gavin's back up. That's the last faith I had in Gavin gone.

JimboToronto

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You're never too old to think young.

Good mornin' B-coinland. Still sideways I see.

Is Craig Wright really Dorian Nakamoto? I tend to agree with Dan Kaminsky.

https://dankaminsky.com/2016/05/02/validating-satoshi-or-not/
_________

Just as I was ready to post I noticed this:

http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/gadgets-and-tech/news/bitcoin-creator-craig-wright-who-claimed-to-satoshi-nakamoto-posts-message-saying-sorry-for-claims-a7014941.html

LOL

Syke

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Quote from: Elwar on May 05, 2016, 08:23:30 AM

AAAAANNNNNNDDDDD scene

Quote

I'm Sorry.

I believed that I could do this. I believed that I could put the years of anonymity and hiding behind me. But, as the events of this week unfolded and I prepared to publish the proof of access to the earliest keys, I broke. I do not have the courage. I cannot.

When the rumors began, my qualifications and character were attacked. When those allegations were proven false, new allegations have already begun. I know now that I am not strong enough for this.

I know that this weakness will cause great damage to those that have supported me, and particularly to Jon Matonis and Gavin Andresen. I can only hope that their honour and credibility is not irreparably tainted by my actions. They were not deceived, but I know that the world will never believe that now. I can only say I'm sorry.

And goodbye.

http://www.drcraigwright.net/homepage.jpg

Emphasis added. That part of his post is true. He cannot because he does not have the keys because he was never Satoshi.

Mrpumperitis

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LdvQTwjVmrE

35.30min wright says...." he has 15th most powerful supercomputer in world and for past few yrs has been working on bitcoin scalabiity, Will release papers this yr ,lol

Fatman3001

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Make Bitcoin glow with ENIAC

Quote from: Elwar on May 05, 2016, 10:15:50 AM

Quote from: Fatman3001 on May 05, 2016, 10:14:00 AM

BTW, where's segwit?

Currently in use but should be on the blockchain any day now.

sweeet

Quote from: tomothy on May 05, 2016, 10:18:45 AM

Two weeks...

Ok, so they've got Josh Zerlan working on it?

He was in the special forces, you know.

You have to trust a SEAL, or you're a traitor.

tomothy

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Two weeks...

Elwar

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Viva Ut Vivas

Quote from: Fatman3001 on May 05, 2016, 10:14:00 AM

BTW, where's segwit?

Currently in use but should be on the blockchain any day now.

[img][/http://www.segway.com/media/1170/04_professional_segway.pngimg]

Fatman3001

legendary

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Make Bitcoin glow with ENIAC

BTW, where's segwit?

tomothy

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http://www.metzdowd.com/pipermail/cryptography/2016-May/029323.html

[Cryptography] Proof-of-Satoshi fails Proof-of-Proof.
ianG iang at iang.org
Wed May 4 18:44:46 EDT 2016
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On 3/05/2016 04:43 am, Robert Hettinga wrote:
>
>> On May 2, 2016, at 2:17 PM, Erik Granger wrote:
>>
>> I'll believe it when he signs arbitrary messages with satoshis key. No signature, no story.
>
> Spend the coins.
>
> Pics or it didn’t happen.
>
> Cheers,
> RAH

That ain't gonna happen, sorry folks! Not to rag at RAH, I'm just
picking up his perfect foil, and for reasons he'll wryly smile to:
Physics. Humanity. Frailty. Complexity. Of the sort that we've all being
talking about since forever on this list and many others.

Let's break it down.

Firstly, we all on this list know that cryptographic keys prove that a
private key did a maths transform that a public key can confirm. Full Stop.

What cryptographic proofs do not confirm is that a human said something
meaningful to another human. Indeed, the more that the Bitcoin community
and the tabloid press demand a proof-of-spend and examine the results
they're given, the more it demonstrates how humans seem to be isolated
by cryptography not joined.

In theory, keys are mathware, humans are wetware and the two do not
easily mix.

How does this play out in real life? We know that the human experiment
known as cryptographic signing has failed. We know that there is at
least one tiny little country - Estonia - clinging to the European dream
of using smart cards to identify humans, but statistically the world has
failed to make human signing with public key cryptography work. People
write books about this, I simply point it out as a significant data
point of where many thousands of people really really tried to use keys
to prove meaningful human things. And failed.

Let's get more topical. There are strident, demanding calls for people
who make statements concerning the identity of one said Satoshi Nakamoto
to back those statements up with cryptographic proof. Yet these demands
are .. unfounded, and that is the kindest thing that could be said about
them. Why?

Anyone offering information to the world has no necessary call to offer
more information. When I say that Craig Wright was the leader of the
team known as Satoshi Nakamoto, I do not contract to say more. Nor did
Gavin or Jon or others in any sense contract to say more than they did.
They don't owe anyone anything. Even if they made errors, it is not on
them to correct them. "Extraordinary claims calls for extraordinary
proof" is only a standard for academia, it has little place in human
affairs, especially in that democratic tradition known as open
discourse, nor in the human standards of proof that have been honed over
a thousand years of legal history.

In fact, I contracted to say less - as well all do, when we join the
encryption business, we covenant to keep peoples' privacy. When I
started what became Project Prometheus a few years ago, I promoted their
privacy as a goal - because the team known as Satoshi Nakamoto asked for
their privacy by posting here in 2008 and disappearing entirely 2 years
later. Now, when I come out and say that Craig Wright was the leader of
Satoshi Nakamoto, it is only because he himself finally announced it. I
remain committed to privacy even if the community Satoshi wrought is
revealing themselves to be a pack of rabid statist wolves looking to rip
the wool off of the backs of the sheep that they call their customers
and future users.

Sorry, guys, it gets worse, and I hope the Bitcoin community dissolves
itself in collective shame as to their inability to even contemplate
protecting their own.

As we know in cryptographic affairs, key management is hard. Keys can be
lost. Misplaced. Traded. Breached and stolen. Keys can be spoofed - we
have an entire cryptographic security system called SSL/HTTPS which is
blighted by phishing, based on misuse of cryptographic proof of
identity. Let's not go into the details, but I shall revise here FTR the
claim of secure browsing: the identities are cryptographically proven.
Which apparent claim does not reveal itself to the humans in sufficient
reliability in order to defeat basic common or garden social
engineering. If the IETF's biggest, bravest and most educated can fail
to protect the browsing public from the obvious, known and counted
threat, what hope the rest?

Even if the above were not sufficient, let me get precise and particular
as to why the Proof-of-Satoshi is dead-on-arrival. There are several
facts which apply in this case.

Firstly, Satoshi Nakamoto is not one human being. It is or was a team.
Craig Wright named one person in his recent communications, being the
late Dave Kleinman. Craig did not name others, nor should I. While he
was the quintessential genius who had the original idea for Bitcoin and
wrote the lion's share of the code, Craig could not have done it alone.
Satoshi Nakamoto was a team effort.

Indeed, a sort of proof is right there in front of you - when you look
at Craig Wright, you do not see Satoshi. When you look at Satoshi
Nakamoto, you're seeing some measure of the influence of Dave Kleinman,
and it isn't possible for Dave to prove anything anymore to anyone.
Team Satoshi is ephemeral, and no cryptographic multisig can now capture
those that aren't around any more.

This team effort was one of a most severe cost to all members of that
team, and only privacy is holding us back from recognising it.

Further, the keys that controlled critical parts were moved several
times between various persons. Which is to say that control of the keys
does not indicate more than the holder being trustworthy to the goals of
the team at a point in time. Even if Craig manages to sign over a coin,
it does not and cannot prove he is "the one," only that he was at one
point in time a trusted member of the team. Albeit, the team that he
founded, but a wise leader controls for all risks, including those risks
posed by the leader himself.

More: control at any time does not necessarily indicate ownership,
either in the minds of the team nor in the eyes of the law. Recalling
the reports of late 2015, can you rule out that the keys haven't been
stolen?

Finally, as has been reported, the headline bulk of the value is
controlled by a trust. Any movement of those coins needs to operate
according to trust rules; if not, then we are in a state of sin. What
that means is not something that can be described in mathematical terms,
but it can certainly be described in hysterical terms - the logic de
jure of the Bitcoin community. As an aside, I really strongly suggest
that the Bitcoin community not press for the breaking of the trust. If
unsure on this point, ask your miners to explain that old curse "be
careful what you wish for." Breaking the trust is way off the scale of
what anyone will desire.

I suggest that it is therefore impossible for any reasonable person to
conclude that a "spend" of a Bitcoin coin proves anything beyond that
the erstwhile signer was at some point in some way related to a key. A
host of factors make the 'proof' too impractical to describe at a press
or media level. And, if we have to call in opposing experts to argue the
case, what's the point of the "proof"?

It is with incredible sadness that I watch an entire community
misunderstand the lesson that Satoshi originally taught - trust in
mathematics to prove accountancy. Yes, cryptography can prove that a
coin is available and disposable pending an attempt to further dispose
it. But the Bitcoin design was deliberately weak when it came to proof
of persons. Especially, when it comes to known and now revealed
weaknesses in the persona once known as Satoshi Nakamoto, there is no
proof in mathematics that can satisfy that community's yearning for yet
another meal.

By all means, take that lamb for yet another feast of slaughter, but do
not soil the good name of mathematics for your Pavlovian hunger.

iang, CARS.

ps; after writing this, I stumbled across:
http://hackingdistributed.com/2016/05/04/logical-fallacies-hunt-satoshi/

pps; This post reflects no commercial agenda or position of myself or
any person related to me. I have no position in BTC and have never had
any BTC other than a few pence lost in some test wallet somewhere.
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Gyrsur

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Bitcoin Legal Tender Countries: 2 of 206

Quote from: edgar on May 05, 2016, 09:53:35 AM

i have this page open but cant copy/paste anything and all links are 'dead';

http://www.drcraigwright.net/jean-paul-sartre-signing-significance/

can probably take screen grabs if anyone requires..

https://archive.is/6DH8w

edgar

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i have this page open but cant copy/paste anything and all links are 'dead';

http://www.drcraigwright.net/jean-paul-sartre-signing-significance/

can probably take screen grabs if anyone requires..

Searing

copper member

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Clueless!

Quote from: Elwar on May 05, 2016, 08:50:54 AM

Quote from: Ultrafinery on May 05, 2016, 08:39:03 AM

Quote from: Elwar on May 05, 2016, 08:23:30 AM

AAAAANNNNNNDDDDD scene
...
http://www.drcraigwright.net/homepage.jpg

It's a brand new domain which could belong to anyone?

He made his announcement from that site.

If Wright IS (still) Satoshi (give me a bit here)

And wanted to 'deflect' his 'outing'

You do this dog and pony show....wait a month...make Satoshi email announcement and say 'I am not Craig Wright' We are all Satoshi!

And move 1 million coins out and back and go poof for good

2020 comes Craig Wright touches NO early wallets of Satoshi

Folk. By then would be utterly convinced and Satoshi pulls off the double fake😄

( I don't buy it either just saying) 😇

Heh. Deflection Score!

AlexGR

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Google confirms it's the right domain where his blog posts were:

Jean-Paul Sartre, Signing and Significance - Dr. Craig Wright Blog
www.drcraigwright.net/jean-paul-sartre-signing-significance/
3 days ago - Dr. Craig Wright explains the process of verifying a set of cryptographic keys.

Extraordinary Claims Require Extraordinary Proof - Dr. Craig Wright Blog
www.drcraigwright.net/extraordinary-claims-require-extraordinary-proof/
2 days ago - Yesterday, Andreas Antonopoulos posted a fantastic piece on Reddit. Andreas said something critically important and it bears repeating: “I ...

dreamspark

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