Topic: When are you going to cash out? - page 3. (Read 11109 times)

I'm not going to "Cash out". There will just come a time where it makes as much sense to spend them as acquire them.

sell them all every chance I get

Looks like you only know one way to spend money. When I spend money most of the time I am not consuming, I am investing, Holding bitcoins does not create wealth it doesn't create a thing when you acquire btc. . When I invest in my business that creates wealth. When you hold bitcoins you create nothing! Really a poor post here I am guessing this is sarcasm.

Hoarding = spending. Just delayed in time.

BTC will be used as a saving target. Suppose each IT generation people knows about BTC and put some of their savings in BTC, they are at least 100 million, even average saving is only $1000, that is $4762 per BTC. Since most of the coins are hoarded, the actual price will be much higher, so it is not very difficult to reach a market price of $50000 per coin, if more people join, that price will be even higher

Of course this is a long term projection and there are many potential risks in BTC itself, currently the biggest uncertainty comes from the block chain's transaction limit

In that case you can simply exchange your bitcoins to fiat, which is getting easier every day. Or use a Bitcurex Electron card which works quite well afaik. In the future one can probably use a BitInstant debit card as well.

Many of the products in Bitcoin Store can't be bought cheaper anywhere. I don't buy the "stuff bought with bitcoins are expensive" argument at all, not anymore at least.

Although I'm from Finland which is not one of the cheapest countries in the world, on the contrary. That perspective might affect my views.

Yes, but I can buy these things locally with fiat or credit card, at a lower price

You actually can buy almost anything these days. What are you looking to buy?

Electronics: http://www.bitcoinstore.com (500 000 products and good prices)

Precious metals: http://www.coinabul.com/

Mobile phone credit: http://www.bitcoinwireless.com/

Coffee: http://bitcoincoffee.com/ & http://bitbrew.net/

Chocolate: http://bitchocolate.com/

Jewelry: http://allthingsluxury.biz/ (I've used this store myself so I can recommend it personally)

These are just a few examples, I'm not going to list everything. With the exception of physical grocery stores, there is actually not that much that you can't buy with bitcoins already.

When trading:

I only buy panic
I usually sell euphoria

That's it. But I don't trade bitcoins. I'm not in BTC to "cash out". I'm in it because I believe in it. Because it's a clever and sound currency. I don't want to exchange my BTC for fiat, I want to exchange my BTC for goods and services.

But seriously: what can we buy with BTC, apart from drugs on SR? I'm not a blogger, I don't need web hosting at the moment. This is something we need to address ASAP.

+1

Thanks for the link.



I see now that the most recent dividend payment was on Feb 1st and 2nd. I see that the IPO back in August 2012 was 10M out of 100M shares, but I'm not seeing a list of share issues / tranches since then. Is there a list of quantities issued since?

I see your point about fact checking. I wish I could put in enough time to read thread-upon-thread to locate quality info about SatoshiDice more recent than August 2012. In the past, I did have time to browse threads collecting info on the big scams going around (pirateat40) and warn others to the best of my ability. But nobody pays me to do Due Diligence on likely scams, so I appreciate direct links to quality info. Its reassuring both to myself and others who are rightly skeptical.



Like I already said, of course anyone can check the math on the volume of coins which pass through the satoshidice addresses. But it would be quite a bit harder to verify those coins are genuine players and not house funds being spun through.


If they're playing with house funds, any losses go back directly to the house, not through dividends. But you are right that fraud is less likely the longer that dividends are being paid (unless new capital is being raised, which makes fraud more likely).




The purpose is maximum gain for the issuer, at whatever price they can sell shares. The price of the stock is only important to the buyers hopeful to resell for gains later.

Question: is that ~60% price less than stated here: "All future share issuance will be made only a) subject to approval by MPEx and b) at a price no less than the higher of the 1 day average price and the 30 day average price then current on MPEx." 2.2. The Terms of the IPO. section a



I'm also sorry to hijack the thread. I didn't start my own thread for exactly what you mention, that I would prefer to have quality research and fact checking. But that's a huge time sink when most of the info is scattered among various forum threads (another red flag in itself). As for FUD, I don't consider myself a conspiracy-minded individual. You don't see me all over the BFL threads accusing them of fraud (enough BFL doubters already). I called out pirate (and as many of his associates as I had time for) not because of "sour grapes" nor because I get kicks from conspiracy-trolling. I called them out because I was rightly skeptical.

You are right that some SD skeptic (just myself and EskimoBob, anyone else?) should start a consolidated thread. That somebody hasn't already goes to show the gullibility (or willing-to-believe) of many "investors" in bitcoin "Securities".

You are describing consumption, which is actually the opposite of wealth creation.

In truth, you create wealth when you acquire bitcoin.  And if you hold them, you are abstaining from consuming that wealth, which makes all of us wealthier.  So, go on and "hoard" guys!

thank you for actually taking my statements serious. I agree with you on the need for skepticism. I continues to be among the best tools in the box. With it goes observation, experimentation, attitude and the self fulfilling prophecy.

The assumption of "cashing out" is that you would be done with bitcoin.
                                             =    
Really what happens is  "recieving reward for distribution"!

Please guys, you give me creeps. Not even one has yet pointed out that "greed" originally does not mean you want to get ahead with your *own* life!

"Greed" is that you want an unfair, unjust, unlawful, fraudulent, or coerced gain from *others*. So that they are worse off.

Doing or not doing something with your own, can never be greed. Hoarding is not greed. Envying somebody's hoard is greed.

In classical economics this statement about wealth is true, but today supply and demand is the only measurement of value

There are many illusions in today's world: An iphone, an HDTV, a movie... They did not really bring you anything physically but you feel happy looking and playing with them, it is the happiness level affect the demand of an illusion. Wealth does not only contain physical things, psychologic demand could also create wealth

FED created an illusion called USD, and US government sell bonds to FED to get USD, bankers sell their loans to FED to get USD... an illusion works as long as some one want it

People want BTC, at least it can give them confident to fight inflation

It is hard to tell you what asset class to get into. In a fiat debt based monetary system it is difficult to find undervalued assets. I would recommend 10% silver 20% cash 40% real estate 30% digital currency. I believe that the world is going to enter into a huge deflationary collapse in the next decade. You should have a strategy of preserving wealth. I would not be 100% invested in btc! and I would not buy now. (22.37)     

What is stopping you?  Clearly you can make a lot of money by being an early adopter of a currency?
Or if money does not interest you, think about how you will save all future bitcoin users from this horrible bitcoin experiment.

Mark my words holiday you will lose it all. Why should you not hold bitcoins? because there are no barriers to entry, it can be done better, it is volatile. The wealth isnt the bitcoin. Bitcoin will not just go forever. You dont create wealth by holding bitcoins you create wealth when you sell btc and buy something real.
The money is an illusion the wealth is real, an investment is not an investment if it doesn't make you wealth. 

Fittest means those most adapted to ensure offspring survival.  This can aided by cooperation, greed, intelligence, stupidity, physical strength or whatever, it all depends on the local environment at that point in time.



I'll admit I am a greedy pig that wants to get rich easy.  Honestly, who doesn't?  
But bitcoin in itself is a system which I value greatly principally as well.  What problem do you see with a decentralised open-source, non-inflatable-to-oblivion kind of currency?
Also, peoples opinion on who does good and who is selfish varies greatly.  Some would say the person who has a large company is a selfish fat-cat that profits on the labor of his workers, others believe he created the framework to employ a lot of people and provide valuable services to the community...  While I am personally inclined to the second opinion, I suppose the real answer is somewhere in between, but relies mostly on the details of each particular case.

Procreation of the most greedy, or "survival of the fittest", is a myth perpetuated by sociopaths who don't understand evolution. On both a biological level and a societal level, the rule of thumb is "survival of the most cooperative." Mutual aid and benefit is the only way organisms thrive in an environment. It starves and goes extinct if it eats the last bit of its food source, so for long-term success it must act in a way that is mutually beneficial to its food source.

Same with humans; acting greedy might be advantageous in the very short-term, but to thrive long-term requires acting in cooperative ways that are mutually beneficial to the social environment. If not, you'll be a societal outcast and have nobody to trade with, and you'll starve if you aren't jailed/killed.

"the rule of thumb is "survival of the most cooperative." Mutual aid and benefit is the only way organisms thrive in an environment." This is what the greedy bitcoin community needs to learn. Selfishness is a virtue if you realize that helping other people is a act of selfishness. If the quality of life of your neighbor is better your quality of life will be better. Markets reward the individuals that do the most good for other people and punish the greedy and selfish. If you think you are going to game the system and hoard the coins and make millions you are a fool the market will punish you.