Topic: Why do Atheists Hate Religion? - page 402. (Read 901367 times)

Would logical proof be able to tell us "what God wants", such as rules, laws and stuff we should or shouldn't do?

No one should first formulate their beliefs and then use the Bible to prove them. Obviously, I think everyone can agree on that. People will always want to make themselves feel better, and many like to pick and choose what they want to believe in and what they want to ignore. It's always best to pray before reading the bible and ask for discernment in being able to see what it says and not read into it what you want to, even if it means you find you're sinning when you didn't think you were.

The bible is a wonderful guide on how to act. That's just the way it is. It's frustrating to see people think it's a bad thing, when by following the guidelines, people shouldn't be hating on each other, shouldn't be killing each other, shouldn't be doing most of what people get angry at Christians for doing. Christians are all sinful people too, to judge them as if they're sinless is crazy. To judge the bible as bad solely because people do sinful things in the name of it, is crazy too. Just like people say you can't blame the gun for killing someone, when a person clearly pulled the trigger with a purpose.

As far as homosexuals, I know it's a touchy subject. I believe people handle it poorly all around. I'll attempt not to. It's a tricky subject because it's pretty obvious that the bible is against it. The bible says it's a sin.

It angers me to see Christians say that homosexuals can't be Christians, or can't get into heaven. It's considered a sin, but if homosexuals can't get into heaven over that in particular, than neither can liars or thieves, or murderers (I'm not saying any of these sins are greater or less than each other, they're all just sins)

And the point is everyone sins, and everyone can be forgiven for those sins if they ask for forgiveness. Yes, I know people don't like to hear that it's a sin. There are quite a few things that people don't like to hear are sins (lust is one, white lies another), so they can continue to do them. As for those who continue to believe it's not a sin and continue to live that life, but believe in Jesus, I still think they can go to Heaven. Just IMHO, based on the fact that I don't think everyone knows (is aware) that the sins they're committing are sins all of the time, and I don't think that would keep anyone from Heaven, as long as they ask for forgiveness for the ones they know of. But we are supposed to pray to be made aware of our sins.

I know what was written here isn't a popular opinion. Just saying what the bible says. I'm not sure why some Christians are so anti-homosexuals though to the point of bullying or violence, or whatever. I never really got that. Even though believing it's a sin is from the bible, to focus on what others are doing wrong versus your own sin is a sin too....

Matthew 7:2 "For in the way you judge, you will be judged; and by your standard of measure, it will be measured to you. 3 "Why do you look at the speck that is in your brother's eye, but do not notice the log that is in your own eye? 4 "Or how can you say to your brother, 'Let me take the speck out of your eye,' and behold, the log is in your own eye?

The bible doesn't "bring unnecessary pain, harm, and suffering." People do.

 https://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20090327202028AAkUAN3

roccopaperiello view :

Well, You are the exception when you state: " I am a Christian but have no problem with people who are gay,atheist, or from a different religion."

I would gather from this statement -- as opposed to the stand of many Christians -- that you would allow an atheist to hold public office -- NOT allowed in many areas of the country, and agree that gays TOO have the civil right to marriage.

Too often, some "religious believers" DO have such trouble with opposing beliefs. And when they characterize people with different beliefs, (or no religious belief) as sinners and immoral, and worse not even capable of living a moral life, then many people, including atheist, start to object.

Too often these "religious believers" practice unjust discrimination toward people who believe differently.

In some fanatical cases it even escalates into violence.

You ask about RESPECT? I am sorry. I CAN NOT respect anyone who because of their irrational and inherently contradictory "beliefs" bring unjust suffering and pain into this world. When "believers" teach their children to ignore logic and reason in favor of bigotry and blind faith, then this is destructive to society.

Too often the phrase "I love the sinner but hate the sin" leads to hatred of the supposed sinner. Some Christians (and others of other faiths) may STATE that they love their fellow man, but their ACTIONS prove otherwise.

When bigoted "believers" start spending millions to pass hate legislation and to deny segments of our society their JUST civil rights in the name of their "religion" THEN sorry I simply can NOT respect their beliefs.

And they are correct, too often in the past, religion HAS led to unjust war, persecutions, violence, and such" just read some history. When religious fanatics obtain secular power, all manner of injustice and horrific persecutions Proceed. Just look at the history of the Catholic Church in the Middle ages.

It is BECAUSE many people of 'religious belief" CAN NOT in fact respect the differing beliefs of others which causes the problem.

And even when egregious actions do not take place, just by the fact that so many "religious people" condemn and judge others around them, and make every effort to alienate from family, government, and church, and other societal institutions, those who "believe differently" this itself brings too much unnecessary pain and suffering to innocent people.

Just read some of the replies on this forum concerning abortion, gay rights, gay marriage, and even something as inflammatory as evolution, and you will see my point.

When a child is taught to ignore scientific evidence, to ignore logic, to ignore reason, and make their moral judgments based on ignorance and bigotry and moral codes which no reasonable person can follow, and on obviously UNTRUE statements (or untrue interpretations of statements) found in writings 2000 years old, this is itself seen by many (including atheists) as IMMORAL and damaging to the very children they are raising.

Bad psychology is bad theology. Yet many people of religious belief totally ignore the consequences of their beliefs and the forcing of these beliefs on too many vulnerable children.

For just one small example, the suicide rate in this country of gay teens is not 4 to 10 times that of non-gay teens because of nothing. Violence towards gays did not increase 4 fold in CA after the fighting over Prop 8 for nothing. People's beliefs have consequences, and when these consequences bring harm to innocent people, then sorry I can NOt respect those beliefs.

And you obviously do not know your 10 commandments. Please explain which one speaks of do not hate your fellow man? And this brings in an important issue. NO ONE today, NO ONE follows the 10 commandments as they were understood by the Hebrew when they were FIRST written. MORAL CODE changes!

People today do NOT follow the Bible -- and for this we should be VERY thankful. But to claim that the Bible is an inerrant source for moral code today IS A LARGE PART OF THE PROBLEM! First of all, nothing could be further from the truth. But on the other hand, most people FIRST formulate their beliefs, and THEN use the Bible to validate them.

PLEASE -- this is WHY atheist so adamantly dislike your religion. STOP formulating moral code based on an ignorant so-called book of revealed truth formulated by ignorant men, when such moral code brings unnecessary pain, harm, and suffering.

There is much of human wisdom written in the Christian scriptures. But to claim that ALL of this scripture is to be used as a conclusive source of moral code is the height of ignorance, irrationality, and limits the pursuit of justice in today's society..

It's impossible to prove whether God exists via empirical evidence, i.e. via observation.  It is not impossible via logical proof.  Logical proof is proof of a higher order.

By the way, you conveniently ignored my response to your foot-in-mouth comment:

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.11715833

Because of the highly advanced, organized complexity of nature, which exhibits itself in the greatness of the thinking mind of mankind,

and because there doesn't seem to be  a reason for the existence of such advanced complexity (most scientific theory is based in "if this or that happened, then..." making it science fiction),

and because we see entropy everywhere in everything,

the odds that God exists are almost infinitely greater than the odds that He doesn't.

This makes atheism a religion, because it is faith-based, since the far greater odds are that God DOES exist.

Atheists believe that God does not exist, are against all those who think that, and hate religion because 95 percent of the population of the world has its own religion and they want to be different.

Related: How to create a universe.

God has never laid down any rules for Christians to follow, only man made the rules.
As explained before, "what God wants" is impossible, as this would prove Gods existence, which as we both know, is impossible.

No, I'm not interested in considering I'm wrong. I've already gone through the development stage where I asked what if God didn't exist, the answer came back that He does. Having lived life, and seeing things in that light, makes everything else fall into place. Atheists aren't much better, in not wanting to consider God exists, they found their answer a long time ago too.

How does it feel to you to know that you are someone who doesn't want to understand life properly? To ignore what's really going on?

Here's a question for anyone: Why are Christians supposed to follow those rules that God lays down?
Hint: The answer isn't simply to get to heaven or to be saved from hell. Because no one gets to heaven from good works alone.

Isaiah 64:6 We have all become like one who is unclean, and all our righteous deeds are like a polluted garment. We all fade like a leaf, and our iniquities, like the wind, take us away.

Romans 3:23 For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God

Ephesians 2:8-9 For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast.

Says the theist who, by definition, lives in a demon-haunted world.

There are no demons in an atheist world, just other human beings. Some of them are healthy and well-balanced neurologically-speaking, others are damaged and toxic. There is no 'good and evil' there is only functional and dysfunctional.


For someone clearly so ill-informed about atheism and atheists, you sure are making some boldly ignorant statements. You *do* know, right, that simply asserting something doesn't make it true? You have to have a reasonable argument to support your claims, which you do not.

Actually, God already did it.

We have no knowledge of anything other than cause and effect. Some people have used the term, "the devil made me do it."

While God tells us that we have free will, nothing that we see or understand in science and nature shows us free will. The closest we can come is the artificial free will that makes us think that we have free will, because most of the time we don't see the underlying things that motivate us to do anything -
like the particular meal of fish that we just ate,
that caused some brain proteins to send off some extra electrons,
along certain synapses that wouldn't have been activated if we hadn't eaten the fish,
and because of it we do something that we wouldn't have otherwise done,
all according to what looks and feels like free will to us.

Your whole life has been planned out and laid out for you. If you don't use the tiny bit of free will that you have to seek God,
and implore Him to save you (from yourself),
He will destroy you in the judgment, at your indirect request,
because you requested destruction by not attempting to seek God,
God the only Thing that holds you alive,
through cause and effect that He has imbedded into all nature.

because people fight over something thats not there  makes no sense  :-\killing each other over god
or say thats god punishing you
or pray to god ..  why what will he do

It would be my guess the religious folk are the ones living in fear. Remember, every day they worry they might get their God angry over something silly and get their heaven pass revoked. Atheists have no such issues.

How do you know other living beings aren't Atheist?

Atheists are more fearful people in this world, they hate religion due to the fear of being living independently oppose to their own wishes, they never want to adopt the life which pave the path to live modestly in this world, All living beings are faithful to it's creator except the human kind.

No, no they don't. Trouble is, you aren't actually interested in considering that you may be mistaken. You aren't interested in applying a little critical thinking to your belief because you are conditioned to reject anything which might force you to suspend your special-pleading intellectual dishonesty.

How does it feel to know that you are someone who doesn't want to understand life properly?

Because that is exactly what you are when you refuse to submit your beliefs to objectively reasoned analysis. For example, we know how to induce 'spiritual' sensations into people, 'presence of God', even 'alien abduction', simply by applying some intense magnetic impulses to particular parts of the brain. Neurological responses cause subjective psychological and emotional experiences.

We understand how the brain can easily be fooled and we understand how our senses and our perceptions cannot be relied upon for much of anything when it comes to demonstrable knowledge, without independent verification from other data sources outside of our unreliable perception.

We can easily explain how religions come into existence, how the psychology of the theist mind is constructed and how, as a group, the myths and legend develop and are reinforced through symbolism and ritual.

You *do* know, don't you, that all your special symbols and rituals don't actually do anything, right? I mean, if I genuflect and I scratch my balls halfway through, does it count as the magic needed to induce, well, whatever it is you believe you are inducing by genuflecting?

So, in that we can rationally explain everything as long as intellectual integrity is maintained, there is only self-deception left for you to cling to. Which is what you and your kind do, with much vigour and desperation. Trying to get you to understand that you are mistaken is no different to trying to reason with somebody suffering from amphetamine-induced psychosis. You both *know*, I mean absolutely 100% *know* that you are right about what you are perceiving . . . that anybody who tries to explain otherwise to you is a threat.

Q:What's different about the speed-freak curtain-twitcher who is convinced that he is being watched and you who believes likewise?

A: The tweaker could actually be under surveillance

Your proposition towards the existence of an omnipotent invisible super-being who has a set a rules we're all supposed to follow is less credible, even, than those who believe they have been abducted by aliens. They, at least, invoke things which could be measurably real in our Universe.

If we're going onto that tangent, lol....

Did you know some believe those ET's to be demons and abductions to be demonic attacks? Abductions stop in the name of Jesus Christ

Well, I don't hate anything or anyone but I certianly dislike the idea of religion. I believe everything must be backed by something

i dont believe in god but i believe in a higher power i believe in Extraterrestrial Dimensional Beings

Okay let's set this straight. Nobody should ever generalize (even though he isn't)  things. He has just encountered bad people (atheists or not). I do not have anything against people who believe in various things, unless you start forcing your nonsense on me or argue with me using false evidence. I'm perfectly okay with it, as long as people behave properly, nor have I tried converting anyone that I know aside from sharing some insight.
Religions are a cause of many bad things,however let's not get started with this discussion as we have multiple examples from history. I'm just going to mention The Inquisition, The Witch Hunt, Thuggee Murders and such. Let's just leave it at that.

Well as someone who used to be christian, I do not agree with this. I'm too tired to continue the science debate, however you probably are partially right. As long as you do not show a stance toward the subject such as BADecker (currently on ignore), you have a fine character.

Things happen in the name of Jesus Christ that wouldn't if you didn't call upon him and His power. I believe that and have seen it, others believe that too. That is what makes it God versus something else. I know anything I say that's happened from calling upon Him, you will still argue it was something else, maybe a self fulfilling prophecy. I'm not going to argue that with you.

When people see things that cannot be explained and miracles, they can either be explained away by science, or it's proof of something else going on that science has not explained (which means a religion may be right). I never really believed this: but atheists do seem to put a lot of faith in science, to the point it seems like a religion, since science has not explained everything, and continues to learn, and has changed the way we perceive things from the past scientific explanations. (http://undsci.berkeley.edu/article/0_0_0/howscienceworks_20)

I don't argue science can't be helpful, but to believe only what you've seen, it cannot give you the whole picture. That's why there's so many theories in science, and why things change when people get better at looking at the evidence. Like what's the smallest thing in the universe? (http://www.livescience.com/23232-smallest-ingredients-universe-physics.html) Who's to say in a few hundred years what science believes now won't seem silly?