Why do people in USA fear socialism so much? - page 24.

Elwar

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Quote from: dancupid on September 29, 2011, 01:37:48 PM

Quote from: Elwar on September 29, 2011, 01:36:07 PM

Quote from: dancupid on September 29, 2011, 01:24:22 PM

Quote from: Elwar on September 29, 2011, 01:10:55 PM

Quote from: dancupid on September 29, 2011, 01:09:32 PM

I'm amazed no one has pointed out that free education for children is socialism.

Free education for children is socialism.

I'm amazed

Well, there is the caveat that there could be free education that is not socialist.

Teachers could decide to voluntarily provide their services every day. Janitors could volunteer to take care of the school. Construction workers could volunteer to build the building. Donors could donate materials.

Or someone could voluntarily give their money to pay for the school for the child's free education.

Or the child can be home schooled.

Otherwise someone has to pay. Or under socialism you steal money from someone and give it to the school.

It's called tax. That's how teachers get payed

I already covered that...

FredericBastiat

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Quote from: Hawker on September 29, 2011, 03:56:07 PM

You can call yourself anything. Its persuading everyone else that the idea isn't daft is your problem.

It isn't hard to convince most people, especially when you call it law, that if there was no consequence for theft, that they would have less compunction. That's easy. It's requires less labor to steal than produce when there are few barriers to entry. It's even easier when you can get your minions to do it for you so you don't have to get your hands dirty, then almost everybody wants to get in on the game.

Hawker

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Quote from: FredericBastiat on September 29, 2011, 03:50:59 PM

Quote from: Hawker on September 29, 2011, 02:27:39 PM

We've been though that. If its the state, its not theft. Its a legal thing.

I've got a cute idea then, I'll get a name change and call myself State Government (you can call me SG for short). You know, it's just a legal thing. Theft never came so easily.

You can call yourself anything. Its persuading everyone else that the idea isn't daft is your problem.

FredericBastiat

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Quote from: Hawker on September 29, 2011, 02:27:39 PM

We've been though that. If its the state, its not theft. Its a legal thing.

I've got a cute idea then, I'll get a name change and call myself State Government (you can call me SG for short). You know, it's just a legal thing. Theft never came so easily.

Hawker

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Quote from: FredericBastiat on September 29, 2011, 02:22:51 PM

Quote from: Hawker on September 29, 2011, 02:16:28 PM

Thats just your opinion. You are outvoted.

Cue Fred tearfully comparing his plight to people being tortured and killed in Bahrain.

Theft has no conditional element to it. Just cuz you make a law to permit theft, doesn't make it more benevolent.

Cue Hawker being slowly boiled like a frog in a pot. Do I smell cooked flesh? Let me know when it gets too hot for you.

We've been though that. If its the state, its not theft. Its a legal thing.

FredericBastiat

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Quote from: Hawker on September 29, 2011, 02:16:28 PM

Thats just your opinion. You are outvoted.

Cue Fred tearfully comparing his plight to people being tortured and killed in Bahrain.

Theft has no conditional element to it. Just cuz you make a law to permit theft, doesn't make it more benevolent.

Cue Hawker being slowly boiled like a frog in a pot. Do I smell cooked flesh? Let me know when it gets too hot for you.

Hawker

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Quote from: FredericBastiat on September 29, 2011, 02:11:44 PM

Quote from: dancupid on September 29, 2011, 01:37:48 PM

It's called tax. That's how teachers get payed

Let me finish that for you: and taxing is theft and that's how the teachers get paid.

Thats just your opinion. You are outvoted.

Cue Fred tearfully comparing his plight to people being tortured and killed in Bahrain.

FredericBastiat

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Quote from: AyeYo on September 29, 2011, 01:37:54 PM

No, no. What you actually do is tax someone that's benefiting by living in a society with public education. You have to pay for that benefit. There's a price for all benefits. You don't get to have all the indirect benefits of government programs without having to contribute to the government programs.

I could probably do a lot of good things with your money AyeYo. I'll do a cost/benefit analysis for you. (.....calculating.....) Yep, it's a good idea to steal your money and give it to needy children for their education. I hope you don't mind.

Of course you probably don't have enough to go around, so I'll take it from your neighbor and your neighbors' neighbor... A law sure could make this handy...

FredericBastiat

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Quote from: dancupid on September 29, 2011, 01:37:48 PM

It's called tax. That's how teachers get payed

Let me finish that for you: and taxing is theft and that's how the teachers get paid.

AyeYo

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Quote from: Elwar on September 29, 2011, 01:36:07 PM

Or under socialism you steal money from someone and give it to the school.

No, no. What you actually do is tax someone that's benefiting by living in a society with public education. You have to pay for that benefit. There's a price for all benefits. You don't get to have all the indirect benefits of government programs without having to contribute to the government programs.

dancupid

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Quote from: Elwar on September 29, 2011, 01:36:07 PM

Quote from: dancupid on September 29, 2011, 01:24:22 PM

Quote from: Elwar on September 29, 2011, 01:10:55 PM

Quote from: dancupid on September 29, 2011, 01:09:32 PM

I'm amazed no one has pointed out that free education for children is socialism.

Free education for children is socialism.

I'm amazed

Well, there is the caveat that there could be free education that is not socialist.

Teachers could decide to voluntarily provide their services every day. Janitors could volunteer to take care of the school. Construction workers could volunteer to build the building. Donors could donate materials.

Or someone could voluntarily give their money to pay for the school for the child's free education.

Or the child can be home schooled.

Otherwise someone has to pay. Or under socialism you steal money from someone and give it to the school.

It's called tax. That's how teachers get payed

kokjo

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You are WRONG!

Fuck you people! can't you just not be friends? its you people that are waging war, be happy people!
two facts of politics:
extreem liberalism is BAD!
extreem socialism is BAD!

make a blend!
get over it!

Elwar

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Quote from: dancupid on September 29, 2011, 01:24:22 PM

Quote from: Elwar on September 29, 2011, 01:10:55 PM

Quote from: dancupid on September 29, 2011, 01:09:32 PM

I'm amazed no one has pointed out that free education for children is socialism.

Free education for children is socialism.

I'm amazed

Well, there is the caveat that there could be free education that is not socialist.

Teachers could decide to voluntarily provide their services every day. Janitors could volunteer to take care of the school. Construction workers could volunteer to build the building. Donors could donate materials.

Or someone could voluntarily give their money to pay for the school for the child's free education.

Or the child can be home schooled.

Otherwise someone has to pay. Or under socialism you steal money from someone and give it to the school.

NghtRppr

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Elder Crypto God

Quote from: AyeYo on September 29, 2011, 01:29:07 PM

All problems in society are the government's fault.
All good things in society come from wealth and big business.

That's just your straw man argument. It's no wonder you disagree with us when you don't even comprehend our position. Though, maybe you do but you're just trolling...

AyeYo

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Quote from: JA37 on September 29, 2011, 12:57:51 PM

Why does it have to be an extreme form of socialism? Why not do what most of Europe has done and have socialism in some areas and capitalism in others? Granted some states have failed to do proper calculations and haven't balanced their income with the benefits they give their citizens, but most have done a fairly good job.
The fact that the banks also failed in their responsibilities and lent money to overspending states is a major concern right now, but that's not a failure of socialism, that's capitalism failing.

Because the world is black and white, thus I can't comprehend anything in between.

All problems in society are the government's fault.
All good things in society come from wealth and big business.

NghtRppr

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Elder Crypto God

Quote from: AyeYo on September 29, 2011, 09:59:43 AM

Quote from: NghtRppr on September 28, 2011, 05:45:17 PM

Quote from: AyeYo on September 28, 2011, 05:08:36 PM

Quote from: NghtRppr on September 28, 2011, 02:52:15 PM

Quote from: JA37 on September 28, 2011, 01:23:07 PM

Why didn't the target organizations of these regulations lobby the OSHA/State government to prevent this regulation. If it's that easy to get your way through lobbying I'd wager that your dentist, along with a few colleagues, could have stopped it.

They probably had no idea about it. If they did, they probably had fewer resources to throw at a single issue than would a large corporation that's going to make a lot of money from it.

HAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHHAHA OMFG the irony is too much!

Don't you see it? You're pointing out blatant problems WITH YOUR OWN SYSTEM.

How so?

Are you really that stupid?

How about information disparity (can't protect/defend myself from things I don't know exist), highlighted in blue, and power/wealth disparity (biggest gun makes the rules), highlighted in red.

Can you see it now??

No. Instead of blurting out non sequiturs, perhaps you could put forth a complete argument?

dancupid

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Quote from: Elwar on September 29, 2011, 01:10:55 PM

Quote from: dancupid on September 29, 2011, 01:09:32 PM

I'm amazed no one has pointed out that free education for children is socialism.

Free education for children is socialism.

I'm amazed

Elwar

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Viva Ut Vivas

Quote from: JA37 on September 29, 2011, 12:57:51 PM

Why does it have to be an extreme form of socialism?

It is as ok as just having a little bit of cancer.

Sure it may not kill you, but most likely all of the bad things that are happening to your body are most likely related to the cancer.

And then there is the fact that it has been known to grow.

Elwar

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Quote from: dancupid on September 29, 2011, 01:09:32 PM

I'm amazed no one has pointed out that free education for children is socialism.

Free education for children is socialism.

dancupid

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Activity: 955

Merit: 1002

In Europe a socialist is just a liberal. In The US it means communist.
Even the most right wing European governments are socialist by American standards.
Treating a child with cancer for free is considered socialism in the US. Make em pay with their hard earned pocket money. Make them do a paper round or something.
I'm amazed no one has pointed out that free education for children is socialism.

Topic: Why do people in USA fear socialism so much? - page 24. (Read 34889 times)