Why Online Slots Are Not Provably fair? - page 2.

leonair

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Quote from: memehunter on September 24, 2024, 07:14:54 AM

I do not think the majority of online slot providers are provably fair (please correct me if I am wrong). As per my research, only BGaming (among the top 10 slot providers) allows you to verify slot outcomes using provably fair technology. Most of them claim to have third-party verification, but there is no way for a player to verify. Why aren't major slot providers like Pragmatic, Hacksaw, Microgaming, etc. adopting this system? It would only boost their credibility and transparency.
I mean, there is a widespread belief that online slots are rigged, but no one says that about dice games because of provably fair technology, so why not do the same for slots? I am not saying third-party test labs are not doing their jobs; all I am saying is that there is no way for a player to verify (which could easily be done using provably fair technology), so why not have both? Or am I asking too much? Grin

. I mean, come on, we all had this feeling;

In slots games, an invisible machine gambles with you. And I can say that you just bet blindly on Win Expectation because I don't see any way to predict here. It can only be tracked how many wins they give after losses most of the time. But even tracking it doesn't help much. Because of this, it is completely up to luck to win in slots games. But it's a lot of fun to play as there are occasional big unbelievable wins here. This is the specialty of slots game. Those who can win here because of a good luck think slots game is fair. But for those who don't have good luck and always lose I think it's not fair

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I don’t think you can make the statement that online slots are or aren’t provably fair. There are so many different options that are no doubt all different in the way they determine winners and losers. Some are likely not operating fairly while others are proven to be fair to their players. Just do your research if you’re concerned about it.

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Quote from: panjul07 on September 24, 2024, 11:30:16 AM

I dont think most players will care about it because as what we can see ourselves that slot games are played by so many people even though there is no provably fair system.

Yes, that's, because inasmuch as other gamblers have gambled on the same slot games by these providers and won huge, it will be literally hard for them to believe these games aren't probably fairly, which is what gambling is all about, as you can either win big or lose big, depending on how lucky or unlucky you are, since the aspect of luck can never be always be eradicated from it, be it probably fair or not, which is why gambling is seen to be a lucrative industry due house-edge.

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Quote from: zuzie on September 24, 2024, 10:44:13 AM

Quote from: TribalBob on September 24, 2024, 10:34:46 AM

Quote from: irsykes on September 24, 2024, 10:19:10 AM

Quote from: ethereumhunter on September 24, 2024, 09:45:56 AM

I am not think much about that because slot game is one of gambling games which is based on the luck. You don't have to think much about provably fair or not because that will make you can not accept when you lose your money. That will make you search for how to verify the game and you will not enjoy the game because you always think about provably fair.

Gamblers will think about how they can win the slot game and how they can withdraw their money. Maybe some gamblers will trying to verify the provably fair but they should remember that will need time before they can prove it.

slot games do not need strategy or tricks in my opinion it is true that slot games are just a matter of luck. The RTP of the game is not a guarantee that a big win will come. because the concept of a different algorithm slot, just waiting for the time given a big win will happen. but no one knows because they control the machine. there will be time lost and everything will come back

I don't know where people came from saying that slots use tricks because in reality slot games only end with luck, not using tricks or anything, where players just scroll and scroll

In my opinion, slots only rely on courage and confidence, meaning that they are very sure that the slot game they choose will bring them luck even though they have dared to bet quite a lot of money there so that they are very busy and too focused on pursuing that luck even though behind the slot the dealer has made a trick where the slot game is not easily obtained by gamblers, maybe only a few will be lucky there.

personal experience seeing friends in the environment who often play slot gambling. what I catch material, when repeated defeats to achieve a big win target can happen but do not know it will happen. the dealer system may have historical data on members who lose and win. which prepares the time when a lucky day will occur, but statistically the money back may only be 80%/90%

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Quote from: memehunter on September 24, 2024, 07:14:54 AM

I do not think the majority of online slot providers are provably fair (please correct me if I am wrong). As per my research, only BGaming (among the top 10 slot providers) allows you to verify slot outcomes using provably fair technology. Most of them claim to have third-party verification, but there is no way for a player to verify. Why aren't major slot providers like Pragmatic, Hacksaw, Microgaming, etc. adopting this system? It would only boost their credibility and transparency.
I mean, there is a widespread belief that online slots are rigged, but no one says that about dice games because of provably fair technology, so why not do the same for slots? I am not saying third-party test labs are not doing their jobs; all I am saying is that there is no way for a player to verify (which could easily be done using provably fair technology), so why not have both? Or am I asking too much? Grin

. I mean, come on, we all had this feeling;
~~~

Playing gambling was never meant to make money in the first place. If you do tend to have that kind of perception or approach that you could be able to win up and make yourself rich
then you are really that bound on trying to wreck up your life because of gambling and this is something that you should realize in the first place. Online slots are not provably fair?
Of course they would really be always have the edge on which you would really be losing more the longer you do play and this is something thats normal. Somehow there would really be
those instances or situations on which a gambler could be able to hit up a jackpot or big amount and thats why on the moment that this thing happens then you should really know on when
to take profits and secure it out.

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I don't know so much about this and I may be completely wrong. Therefore I stand to be corrected. First if one plays in a highly reputable casino they do not have to be worried about provably fair of the slot. Secondly to the best of my understanding random number generators" (RNGs) are one of the features of slot games that to an extent can be used to measure the fairness of a game. And reputable casinos always have the randomness displayed in the game window. Anyways what do I know, one can always reach out to their customer agent to ask about these things and get clarifications better than our responses here.

the rise

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There is still a lot we don't know about how slot operations work, so it's hard to say whether it's fair or unfair, slot games are very easy to play, just a little touch and the image will spin, so it's only natural that slot games are popular with many people, we are looking for justice because we keep losing, right? Grin

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Quote from: retreat on September 24, 2024, 11:24:55 AM

Most of the players just think about playing the game without thinking about such complicated things - if they win, then it's their luck, and if they lose then it's their bad luck - that's usually the thinking of slot players. And moreover, aren't operators unfair from the start? I mean, they have a house edge, meaning no matter how you play, they will win. That's why I don't want to think too far to question the fairness or not of the casino I play because whatever casino it is, they have a house edge and they are the ones who always win compared to the gamblers.

Yes, the casino has an advantage over the gambler, but that does not mean that all their operations are conducted honestly, so some people and want the process of the game was more transparent. I quite understand such people although I myself I am not very interested in this as I try to play only in casinos with a good reputation. You could say that I take their word for it. The desires of such people are quite understandable, as they are used to full transparency in the cryptocurrency sphere, so they demand that casinos have the ability to provide evidence of fair play.

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Quote from: retreat on September 24, 2024, 11:24:55 AM

Most of the players just think about playing the game without thinking about such complicated things - if they win, then it's their luck, and if they lose then it's their bad luck - that's usually the thinking of slot players. And moreover, aren't operators unfair from the start? I mean, they have a house edge, meaning no matter how you play, they will win. That's why I don't want to think too far to question the fairness or not of the casino I play because whatever casino it is, they have a house edge and they are the ones who always win compared to the gamblers.

Yep, I think if all gamblers do aware what's house edge and it's impact, I'm expect most people will quit gambling immediately since it's really stupid to think gambling can be a source of income. Not many gamblers are playing for fun because they always regret and bad mood when they lose their bets.

Even the providers allow the gamblers to verify their bets, I'm not sure they will use that tools.

panjul07

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As a slot player who have started playing slot since years ago, this question came to my mind as well but I cant get the real answer till now.
IMO, the possible reason is because it can be because it is too complicated to have provably fair system in slot so the developer of the provider use simple RNG system.
By the way even if most slot providers provide provably fair system, I dont think most players will care about it because as what we can see ourselves that slot games are played by so many people even though there is no provably fair system.

retreat

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Most of the players just think about playing the game without thinking about such complicated things - if they win, then it's their luck, and if they lose then it's their bad luck - that's usually the thinking of slot players. And moreover, aren't operators unfair from the start? I mean, they have a house edge, meaning no matter how you play, they will win. That's why I don't want to think too far to question the fairness or not of the casino I play because whatever casino it is, they have a house edge and they are the ones who always win compared to the gamblers.

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Quote from: TribalBob on September 24, 2024, 10:34:46 AM

Quote from: irsykes on September 24, 2024, 10:19:10 AM

Quote from: ethereumhunter on September 24, 2024, 09:45:56 AM

I am not think much about that because slot game is one of gambling games which is based on the luck. You don't have to think much about provably fair or not because that will make you can not accept when you lose your money. That will make you search for how to verify the game and you will not enjoy the game because you always think about provably fair.

Gamblers will think about how they can win the slot game and how they can withdraw their money. Maybe some gamblers will trying to verify the provably fair but they should remember that will need time before they can prove it.

slot games do not need strategy or tricks in my opinion it is true that slot games are just a matter of luck. The RTP of the game is not a guarantee that a big win will come. because the concept of a different algorithm slot, just waiting for the time given a big win will happen. but no one knows because they control the machine. there will be time lost and everything will come back

I don't know where people came from saying that slots use tricks because in reality slot games only end with luck, not using tricks or anything, where players just scroll and scroll

In my opinion, slots only rely on courage and confidence, meaning that they are very sure that the slot game they choose will bring them luck even though they have dared to bet quite a lot of money there so that they are very busy and too focused on pursuing that luck even though behind the slot the dealer has made a trick where the slot game is not easily obtained by gamblers, maybe only a few will be lucky there.

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Quote from: irsykes on September 24, 2024, 10:19:10 AM

Quote from: ethereumhunter on September 24, 2024, 09:45:56 AM

I am not think much about that because slot game is one of gambling games which is based on the luck. You don't have to think much about provably fair or not because that will make you can not accept when you lose your money. That will make you search for how to verify the game and you will not enjoy the game because you always think about provably fair.

Gamblers will think about how they can win the slot game and how they can withdraw their money. Maybe some gamblers will trying to verify the provably fair but they should remember that will need time before they can prove it.

slot games do not need strategy or tricks in my opinion it is true that slot games are just a matter of luck. The RTP of the game is not a guarantee that a big win will come. because the concept of a different algorithm slot, just waiting for the time given a big win will happen. but no one knows because they control the machine. there will be time lost and everything will come back

I don't know where people came from saying that slots use tricks because in reality slot games only end with luck, not using tricks or anything, where players just scroll and scroll

irsykes

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Quote from: ethereumhunter on September 24, 2024, 09:45:56 AM

I am not think much about that because slot game is one of gambling games which is based on the luck. You don't have to think much about provably fair or not because that will make you can not accept when you lose your money. That will make you search for how to verify the game and you will not enjoy the game because you always think about provably fair.

Gamblers will think about how they can win the slot game and how they can withdraw their money. Maybe some gamblers will trying to verify the provably fair but they should remember that will need time before they can prove it.

slot games do not need strategy or tricks in my opinion it is true that slot games are just a matter of luck. The RTP of the game is not a guarantee that a big win will come. because the concept of a different algorithm slot, just waiting for the time given a big win will happen. but no one knows because they control the machine. there will be time lost and everything will come back

Apocollapse

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I guess people don't care and they still play the games regardless it can be verified or not, that's it.

I mean like, the gambling providers see there are a lot people gamble on their games, so why they need to bother and put extra work, right? if many gamblers start to avoid playing in games that can't be verified, they would do something in order to strengthen their transparency and get more gamblers.

memehunter

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Quote from: YOSHIE on September 24, 2024, 08:48:24 AM

Quote from: memehunter on September 24, 2024, 07:14:54 AM

Why Online Slots Are Not Provably fair?

what you expect can lead you to disappointment, that's for sure, you might not believe me if I say that slots are controlled by gambling operators, However you think the slot is fair it is fair, unfair is unfair.

Even if that is not true, your statement reveals a widespread belief in this idea. This further strengthens the need for a provably fair system.

Quote from: Yatsan on September 24, 2024, 09:06:17 AM

That's a reasonable argument when it comes to the health of online slot operators. Technology that might prove unfair to most professional healers has certainly induced skepticism among players. Especially when they see it work properly in other types of games, like say world games, the ability for players to be able to verify results without being forced to blindly trust them will certainly help increase trust and credibility. It is interesting to see why such companies like Pragmatic and Microgaming haven't leveraged these opportunities. Because it can be the difference in a very competitive market.

Yeah! exactly I too wonder why slot providers are not seeing it as a opportunity to build reputation and transparency.

Quote from: bitbollo on September 24, 2024, 09:09:47 AM

if I remember correctly, some gambling houses offer "provably fair" slots (specific to the crypto gambling). There is not only BCgame...
In my country, each game is registered to a sort of monopoly that allows to verify the integrity of the game... I have never heard of fraud, in the end they would always win Roll Eyes

they don't need to cheat Wink

I was talking about the top 10 online slot providers. I'm not arguing that if you implement provably fair, the house will lose its edge. No, you will still lose, but at least there will be no doubt about manipulations.

Quote from: Jody.Drummer on September 24, 2024, 09:09:53 AM

in my opinion this one game is quite fair

And how did you arrive at this conclusion? How do you know their payouts are fairly randomized? Do you trust third party regulators more than your own judgment?

Quote from: Kemarit on September 24, 2024, 09:10:02 AM

I know the feeling mate of losing, but we should know that there is also this element of luck, that maybe that one spin will make your rich as you will hit the jackpot. Or you are unlucky that you lost and you think that the game are not provably fair.

I am not complaining about any loses. My effort is to build more transparency in crypto gambling at the same time boosting confidence in players. And no one just 'thinks' they are NOT Provably Fair.

Quote from: seoincorporation on September 24, 2024, 09:29:20 AM

Slots are not provably fair because they don't offer a House Edge, what they offer is an RTP better known as Return To Player

RTP and house edge are essentially the same concept. They both refer to the mathematical advantage a casino has over a player in a game.

ethereumhunter

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I am not think much about that because slot game is one of gambling games which is based on the luck. You don't have to think much about provably fair or not because that will make you can not accept when you lose your money. That will make you search for how to verify the game and you will not enjoy the game because you always think about provably fair.

Gamblers will think about how they can win the slot game and how they can withdraw their money. Maybe some gamblers will trying to verify the provably fair but they should remember that will need time before they can prove it.

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Quote from: seoincorporation on September 24, 2024, 09:29:20 AM

Slots are not provably fair because they don't offer a House Edge, what they offer is an RTP better known as Return To Player, that way they ensure the house always wins, and that's what the slots provider really offers.

Aren't these two sides of the same coin, though? I had always thought both concepts were equivalent, although expressed in a different wat. That is, if you're talking about a house edge of 2% is the same as a return to player of 98%.

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Slots are not provably fair because they don't offer a House Edge, what they offer is an RTP better known as Return To Player, that way they ensure the house always wins, and that's what the slots provider really offers. An engine that will give profit even if the gambler is lucky as hell. With provably fair games the house can get in trouble or in debt if the gambler is a high roller and luck is on his side, that way the gambler can leave the casino in red numbers, but that will not happen on slots because when a player wins big then the slot will start filling the bag again before pay a big win again.

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Quote from: memehunter on September 24, 2024, 07:14:54 AM

I do not think the majority of online slot providers are provably fair (please correct me if I am wrong). As per my research, only BGaming (among the top 10 slot providers) allows you to verify slot outcomes using provably fair technology. Most of them claim to have third-party verification, but there is no way for a player to verify. Why aren't major slot providers like Pragmatic, Hacksaw, Microgaming, etc. adopting this system? It would only boost their credibility and transparency.
I mean, there is a widespread belief that online slots are rigged, but no one says that about dice games because of provably fair technology, so why not do the same for slots? I am not saying third-party test labs are not doing their jobs; all I am saying is that there is no way for a player to verify (which could easily be done using provably fair technology), so why not have both? Or am I asking too much? Grin

. I mean, come on, we all had this feeling;

It's based on RTP (Return to Player), and yeah, there are ways to check if they are probably fair, but I guess there are players that really can't take it. That they are losing and blame everything except themselves.

I know the feeling mate of losing, but we should know that there is also this element of luck, that maybe that one spin will make your rich as you will hit the jackpot. Or you are unlucky that you lost and you think that the game are not provably fair.

Topic: Why Online Slots Are Not Provably fair? - page 2. (Read 334 times)