Topic: XMR vs DRK - page 24. (Read 69785 times)

By all means, here they are:

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.10924115

It also - for that same reason - doesn't have a dual mode network that can solve a ton of problems. 'Masternodes' are not a separate network, they are the same daemon as regular wallets just running in an extended mode. They are just as decentralised (because anyone can set one up).

It's a question of homogeneous vs heterogeneous network function, not one of centralisation or decentralisation.

It was the fact that networks started to diversify in function that lead to the explosion of the internet. Client-server computing and service oriented architectures massively increased the efficiency and power of software. Darkcoin / Dash has found a way to extend this paradigm in a decentralised way - i.e. instead of distinct clients and servers, a node can operate in both modes and be reproduced as many times as you like throughout the network.

I don't agree with what DeboraMeeks posted above about Dash not being "around in 5 years" - not that nonsense about a "rickety bus". I think this architecture is solving so many problems right now that it will come to be seen as the obvious way forward for many applications.

Well, my first thought would be that it's going to be susceptible to the same gaming I just mentioned, as actually splitting your transaction up and sending it to multiple physical locations, or addresses only present based on physical collateral based on uptime just sounds .. well .. what would happen if one or two went offline? I mean this is a process that just took me hours.

Either way, I'm not sure specifically how it works yet so I guess I'll just wait until the implementation comes up to mainnet, so that there are plenty of easily usable tools to present the case (specifically the block explorer).

This amazes you? Comparing a network of 2,400 servers in 30+ countries running daemons forked off Bitcoin Core with open-source enhancements....to rickety school buses?

No, because your transaction is easily traceable through the blockchain.


Well, if you get away with it, then that transaction is 'funged' yes. But 'BitcoinFog' is a trusted mixing service that could be keeping logs, reporting up to your adversary or creating some other shitstorm that you might not care to weather.



yes it does, that is the critical point. If you can mix the coins at will, in a trustless and sufficiently secure manner then there's your fungibility.


Well, no. See above.

ok you genuine so i will reply...

first thing is please bare in mind if you just read 1000 posts from XMR people it's like entering an alternate reality where there is this duel to the death between Dash and Monero - there isn't.

Monero was a clone rushed out after DRK along with at least 13 other CryptoNote coins, all cut and paste some code that has very dubious origins - no actual innovation themselves.

DRK rejected Cryptonote in favour of own system based on coinjoin but transposed to a 2nd tier (fullnodes that also provide services), but was closed source so the clones had to use the best tech available at the time - Cryptonote, which they all did including Monero.  (and I think DRK rejected CN because main aspect of the architecture is that if any backdoor or shortcut is found in the cryptology or implementation, your whole history can be deanonimized anytime in the future just from the blockchain - in basic architectural terms your anonimity is at much higher risk than system like DRK whereby anonymization cannot be reversed without compromising nearly all masternodes at the time of the anonymisation. in the future if a whole is found in any cryptonote implementation, bang, the whole currency dies.  In drk, if wholes are found, they can be patched as they go along which they have been whenever they were found)

What's happening now is that DRK invented Instant transactions (which evolved out of the 2-tier innovation), which is obviously a lot bigger than just an 'anon coin' so the market is taking notice - my own opinion is that all alts are essentially proof of concept, they will nevere work in the full market because no one wants to wait 1-15 minutes to pay for something, espeically at point of sale.  Solving this makes first viable alt to Bitcion because it's something that will really help crypto get out of the underground and into Guy-on-the-street's wallet.

Then DRK price rises in accordance, and suddenly wave after wave of XMR post accusing of instamine, centralization, etc comes in day after day - so does XMR look like it's in a position of strength or that it's bitter that DRK is leaving it behind in an Anon coin space, which Drk created, without a paddle?

So (coupled with the other issues I said about XMR market situation which i won't go into) this is just all smoke and mirrors by XMR to try to show some symetry to boost XMR price and keep it relevant (with non-instant transactions and 'anon coin' branding).  But it's fatal mistake because XMR needs to fight to stay relevant by *developing new features the market wants* which is not something they appear to be doing quite the opposite.

For new investors to DASH if you are on this thread it comes down to if you buy the accusations of early emission being a deliberate scam and if masternodes are centralized (which for be being there from week 2 is just fluff).

Sorry, there isn't a whitepaper yet or even a detailed post about it, but it's described as using 20 random Masternodes for mixing with the process indicated in my earlier post to pass the transactions around the masternodes. Hopefully we will know more very soon, it's testing on testnet at the moment I believe.

I will ask some technical questions over at dashtalk.org if I have time tomorrow. Clarity on this subject would be of great interest to me.

Because if someone identifies outputs I own as being tainted then they can be blocked by merchants or exchanges or whatever.

"But you can just Darksend them!" is the reaction I have seen. Except that in Bitcoin you can send them to yourself and boom - new outputs. Does that make Bitcoin magically fungible? Or what if I mix the outputs using BitcoinFog, does that make Bitcoin perfectly fungible?

Fungibility is destroyed the minute you can trace transactions through the blockchain, it doesn't matter how you mix them and who is involved. Otherwise just use Bitcoin and send the funds back to yourself if they're tainted, no Dash needed!

i was trying to find your unanswered questions. Can u repost?

Also, I was the proud recipient of the deleted post. Because I quoted something and replied "THIS"

Got it, as blinding is not in effect to date .. could you give me a rundown of what it's supposed to be like? Any links please?

I can try to simulate the effects, provided that the result is supposed to be equivalent to x or xx rounds of darksend. Just not sure what x or xx (or xxx? That would likely require something more)I should be aiming for?

It's not bad like Bitcoin, but the point of vulnerability where Dash can cross the "not fungible" threshold lies in the Masternode scheme. CryptoNote does not have this vulnerability.

How does it? I really want to know but nobody will tell me   

You can check my post history and confirm that I have taken an interest in exactly zero altcoins. I recently started getting a little bit interested in Dash because I see Bitcoin's fungibility problems. Unfortunately Dash has the same fungibility problems no matter how much they try and hide it, and the sheer stupidity of the community members is not inspiring.

That does not mean I am interested in Monero, except maybe in the technology underlying it. I am not going to divest in Dash and invest in Monero. I am just going to divest in Dash and hold Bitcoin for the moment. Maybe in a few months or years I'll take another look at Monero, but saying that I'm "XMR people" is wrong.

What an amazing analogy.

You obviously do not know what liquidity is or you're somehow interpreting its definition wrong. Why not just admit you're clueless? You keep changing your arguments over and over again when proved wrong. You previously stated that volume had nothing to do with liquidity, which makes abolsutely no sense, but hey, that's what you said. You also lied and said that XMR's liquidity has never been as high as Dash's, to which I took one of your own posts to show your lie, and how XMR's liquidity was actually higher than Dash's before the pump, which is the point I was making in the first place. This is the definition of liquidity, we've gone over it before:  The degree to which an asset or security can be bought or sold in the market without affecting the asset's price. Therefore, the # of coins is the biggest determinator of liquidity for a cryptocurrency(Disregarding denominations since they almost never used outside daytrading), Dash keeping more than 50% of it's coins at any given time on masternodes is bad for liquidity. Simple as that, stop lying and trying to manipulate by changing your incorrect arguments, thank you.

I've read his account as well, and he puts it on as if it were a mistake. The problem with that is that if it were a mistake, why was it never owned up to? He could have relaunched the coin without an instamine, but as even your fellow Dash supporters have said, he himself instamined at least 300,000 Dash/DRK. It just comes down to money and greed then, no morals. And, given the extremely low chance that it was a mistake(Which it most likely isnt or he would have relaunched the coin), then thats no excuse for having an instamine where the actual block reward and coin max supply was cut after the fact, by more than half. No excuse.

I wouldn't take the posts of a couple of guys to be indicative of the entire Dash community, or indeed the fundamentals of the coin.

Head over to dashtalk.org and read some of the more considered views there.

no offense, really bored of arguing with XMR people and reading Bitcion analogies at this stage.  If I answer your post there will be 10 others spinning in all kinds of fabulous directions and then tomorrow the same questions come back. Most XMR people start their post with 'are you stupid?' so you seem nicer than most.  Anyway yeh, this is a big waste of time i have to get on with real work

Because their ongoing stupidity has highlighted my own stupidity in buying into this in the first place.

I wanted to buy a MasterNode because I calculated that my Dash would be safe in cold storage and that I would be able to double my Dash over 3 or 4 years. I can see now that Dash won't be around in 3 or 4 years because it is being propped up by people with no knowledge or sense (I don't mean you this is just a general observation).

Sure, that was a great post and I thanked you for it. It's the other technical questions I'm talking about....see my post a little way up the thread - it has the three unanswered questions.