2019 NBA Pre-Season - page 1594. | Bitcointalksearch.org

Vaculin

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Winding down.

Quote from: Bttzed03 on September 07, 2021, 10:48:26 PM

Quote from: freedomgo on September 07, 2021, 10:30:00 PM

~
lol.. that would only prove that NBA is soft,

It has gone soft and that's already proven Grin

That started when Lebron started winning as well. lol
Maybe the young generation will appreciate the NBA today, but if they will look at the old games, they will appreciate more what is basketball.
I know it's not MMA but seeing a game that is physical, just makes it more exciting than just a 3 point shooting competition which looks like an all star game.

Quote from: Bttzed03 on September 07, 2021, 10:48:26 PM

Quote from: freedomgo on September 07, 2021, 10:30:00 PM

why would they oppose on the right thing to do, flopping should be illegal as it's destroying the real purpose of the NBA which is to compete physically, not an acting competition.

NBA management probably wants stricter rules and heavier fines but they still do not want to miss out on revenues from ticket sales, ads and paid views. NBPA would oppose higher fines because most of the popular/influential players does it too.

That makes sense, they always protect their star players as they are actually the reason why the fans are watching the game, that's why in games, they don't usually get fouled but they are easily fouled. Grin

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Quote from: freedomgo on September 07, 2021, 10:30:00 PM

~
lol.. that would only prove that NBA is soft,

It has gone soft and that's already proven Grin

Quote from: freedomgo on September 07, 2021, 10:30:00 PM

why would they oppose on the right thing to do, flopping should be illegal as it's destroying the real purpose of the NBA which is to compete physically, not an acting competition.

NBA management probably wants stricter rules and heavier fines but they still do not want to miss out on revenues from ticket sales, ads and paid views. NBPA would oppose higher fines because most of the popular/influential players does it too.

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Quote from: Bttzed03 on September 07, 2021, 09:50:03 PM

Quote from: dwyane36 on September 07, 2021, 07:04:55 PM

~ I think serious injuries most often occur due to general fatigue of players, not hard fouls.

I agree that it's mostly on wear and tear but I'm reminded of Olynyk's arm pulling which resulted to Kevin Love being sidelined for a long time. Also, with Kahwi's landing on Pachulia's foot which wasn't supposed to be there. CMIIW but these were called as normal fouls.

Who would not remember that, dirty players has no room in NBA. That Patchulia's act really impact the future of the Spurs as they had a good chance of beating the Warriors in that serious, and I think that foot of Pachulia really has the intention to hurt Kawhi the best player of the spurs.

Quote from: Bttzed03 on September 07, 2021, 09:50:03 PM

Quote from: dwyane36 on September 07, 2021, 07:04:55 PM

Quote from: Japinat on September 07, 2021, 04:28:55 PM

I guess at this point where every team has included "flopping" as part of their training, the commissioner has to make a stop of this by putting a heavy penalty on a player that is proven flopping, high paid players gets the biggest penalty, and let's see if they'll still continue to do it.

You're probably right that penalties for players would be an effective way to stop flopping, but I doubt that NBA will do it in the coming years.

They won't do that because players might launch another protest through the NBPA causing another standoff.

lol.. that would only prove that NBA is soft, why would they oppose on the right thing to do, flopping should be illegal as it's destroying the real purpose of the NBA which is to compete physically, not an acting competition.

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Quote from: dwyane36 on September 07, 2021, 07:04:55 PM

~ I think serious injuries most often occur due to general fatigue of players, not hard fouls.

I agree that it's mostly on wear and tear but I'm reminded of Olynyk's arm pulling which resulted to Kevin Love being sidelined for a long time. Also, with Kahwi's landing on Pachulia's foot which wasn't supposed to be there. CMIIW but these were called as normal fouls.

Quote from: dwyane36 on September 07, 2021, 07:04:55 PM

Quote from: Japinat on September 07, 2021, 04:28:55 PM

I guess at this point where every team has included "flopping" as part of their training, the commissioner has to make a stop of this by putting a heavy penalty on a player that is proven flopping, high paid players gets the biggest penalty, and let's see if they'll still continue to do it.

You're probably right that penalties for players would be an effective way to stop flopping, but I doubt that NBA will do it in the coming years.

They won't do that because players might launch another protest through the NBPA causing another standoff.

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Another good read about the Ben Simmons drama. I'll just quote some important things.
https://www.foxsports.com.au/basketball/nba/nba-2021-trade-news-updates-ben-simmons-philadelphia-76ers-doc-rivers-cleveland-cavaliers-daryl-morey/news-story/fc6123daad37d87bf26fb6b750c2e346

Quote

Simmons is prepared to be fined $1.3 million if it means skipping training camp

I wish I have the same wallet size as him. Grin

Quote

Rivers publicly revealed his lack of confidence in Simmons after Philadelphia’s Game 7 defeat to Atlanta in the playoffs last season.

IIRC, this is the time when Hawks are doing the "Hack-a-Ben" method, that's why they sit him down.

Quote

Morey, meanwhile, had previously insisted he would not trade Simmons, claiming he was an “important part” of the franchise’s future

Box of lies?

Quote

Noise is growing louder that Cleveland is interested in the 25-year-old, with NBA reporter Marc Stein revealing on Wednesday that the Cavaliers are eyeing a potential trade.

I was actually thinking about this at the time they want to buyout Kevin Love. Ben Simmons is their target to be listed in their roster but they need more space to build a team around him.
To conclude, I don't think Ben will ever be back in Philly and I don't know how the fans will react but some sides of the story is not yet revealed.

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Quote from: danherbias07 on September 07, 2021, 01:48:42 AM

Quote from: TravelMug on September 06, 2021, 09:20:46 PM

Perhaps it's the second coming of Detroit that give them their last championship, Chauncey Billups, Rip Hamilton, the Wallace's (Ben and Rasheed).

Perhaps there were still be teams currently or coaches that will preach "Defense win games". Maybe some players in the 80's-90's who are now coach can still implement this in their system since they know how it's important even in the era today wherein we have a lot of attempts outside the arc.

There are still a lot of coaches who uses this kind of strategy. Lakers Coach Frank Vogel is a defensive type strategist and they won the bubble championship because of it. He maximized the strength of Dwight Howard, Rondo, Morris and Danny Green on the defensive end that's why they gain the upper hand against the Miami Heat.
I think with just the right players in their roster they could make the same performance as their championship year and it's already happening that's why they let go some players to balance their team again.

But they let go of the majority of their players that help them win the championships under Lebron and AD. And that's what's surprising to see, players like Howard, Green, Rondo, Javale was replaced and they have paid the price, they lost their grip because of Lebron and AD's injury.

But the Lakers quickly fixes this issue this season, bring back Howard and Rondo and them some good players as well. So Frank Vogel may have accepted the fact that they really need some key players for defense to win games and championships.

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I wish LaMarcus Aldridge a healthy season. He probably won't get much time but his contribution to the team will be significant.

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Quote from: Oasisman on September 07, 2021, 05:17:58 PM

Quote from: wheelz1200 on September 07, 2021, 03:48:47 PM

Quote from: CryptoBuds on September 07, 2021, 12:58:03 PM

Quote from: Oasisman on September 07, 2021, 07:01:08 AM

The game of basketball, especially the NBA has a huge changes. Flopping was a part of the game even before, but because of the physicality soft fouls was usually uncalled. So, players like LeBron, Harden, and others who didn't get enough calls will exaggerate the contact, thus flopping will be the result. The calls was changed too, they added too many soft calls that even taunting an opponent after a highlight moves will be a technical foul today.
Also, the defense was also changed maybe because of the range the players can do to score today.

I feel like soft calls should be called. Because if soft calls are uncalled, physical players as you mentioned like (Lebron or Harden) will somewhat abuse that. That does not help in a tactical point of view in my opinion. Yes, physicality in a sport is important, but I don't want it to get prioritized over the tactical side of the game.

The soft calls like hand checking fouls are terrible for game flow. It stops the momentum of the game and general watchability. Allowing for some physical play also gets rivals going. Watching in the 80s and 90s was so much better than now.

That's crazy and I agree to that. Soft calls like that are a momentum killer, not only for the game but also for the players. Players get frustrated and will starting to lose their composure.
The 80's and 90's NBA offers a real competitiveness feeling to the audience because of it's physicality where almost no place for the soft calls.
But then again, today's NBA has changed so much and there's nothing we can do but to accept the fact that terrible flopping is part of the game now. So, I guess the officials will have a tougher assignment today in identifying which legitimate foul to call.

And that's why officiating has also change a lot we have the technology now to review a replay and coaches can contest calls now, so the game has really evolved so much since the 80's-90's.

So for OG fans who have been watching the games in the 80's-90's will have a hard time accepting soft calls, but it is, what it is, the game 'needs' to evolved as time goes by.

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Quote from: Fredomago on September 07, 2021, 04:23:38 PM

That's a big part of these changes. NBA stars now are a big investment, so allowing those hard fouls will affect the players. They don't want to lose millions of dollars just because of a hard foul that results in major injuries.

Of course, current nba players get larger contracts than before, but it shouldn't be a reason for 'soft' play. I think serious injuries most often occur due to general fatigue of players, not hard fouls.

Quote from: Japinat on September 07, 2021, 04:28:55 PM

I guess at this point where every team has included "flopping" as part of their training, the commissioner has to make a stop of this by putting a heavy penalty on a player that is proven flopping, high paid players gets the biggest penalty, and let's see if they'll still continue to do it.

You're probably right that penalties for players would be an effective way to stop flopping, but I doubt that NBA will do it in the coming years.

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Quote from: wheelz1200 on September 07, 2021, 03:48:47 PM

Quote from: CryptoBuds on September 07, 2021, 12:58:03 PM

Quote from: Oasisman on September 07, 2021, 07:01:08 AM

The game of basketball, especially the NBA has a huge changes. Flopping was a part of the game even before, but because of the physicality soft fouls was usually uncalled. So, players like LeBron, Harden, and others who didn't get enough calls will exaggerate the contact, thus flopping will be the result. The calls was changed too, they added too many soft calls that even taunting an opponent after a highlight moves will be a technical foul today.
Also, the defense was also changed maybe because of the range the players can do to score today.

I feel like soft calls should be called. Because if soft calls are uncalled, physical players as you mentioned like (Lebron or Harden) will somewhat abuse that. That does not help in a tactical point of view in my opinion. Yes, physicality in a sport is important, but I don't want it to get prioritized over the tactical side of the game.

The soft calls like hand checking fouls are terrible for game flow. It stops the momentum of the game and general watchability. Allowing for some physical play also gets rivals going. Watching in the 80s and 90s was so much better than now.

That's crazy and I agree to that. Soft calls like that are a momentum killer, not only for the game but also for the players. Players get frustrated and will starting to lose their composure.
The 80's and 90's NBA offers a real competitiveness feeling to the audience because of it's physicality where almost no place for the soft calls.
But then again, today's NBA has changed so much and there's nothing we can do but to accept the fact that terrible flopping is part of the game now. So, I guess the officials will have a tougher assignment today in identifying which legitimate foul to call.

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Quote from: Fredomago on September 07, 2021, 04:23:38 PM

Quote from: Questat on September 07, 2021, 03:54:04 PM

I really missed those times, players are not relying so much on their 3 point shooting, they are more into physical plays like driving inside to score and get fouled.

As even Larry Bird who can really shot from the ark is also making his shots closers to the basket, they are not relying with the long 3's but they wanted to keep challenging the defense and make an in your face dunks or twisted shots to avoid the blocking defense.

That was the old times but I don't see a lot of games in the past due so I was not able to appreciate it a lot.
now, we have the internet, we can just watch the highlights in youtube so we can easily get familiar with the players, but I agree, compared to now, in the past, it's more physical and more entertaining to watch.

Quote from: Fredomago on September 07, 2021, 04:23:38 PM

Quote

I guess the NBA organization has realized that if they will not make it soft, their players will easily be injured and their investment will be at risk, so I don't think we will ever see the 80's-90's style in NBA again.

That's a big part of these changes. NBA stars now are a big investment, so allowing those hard fouls will affect the players. They don't want to lose millions of dollars just because of a hard foul that results in major injuries.

No more Jordan rules, a plain head to head and if the defense collapses, then so be it.

I guess at this point where every team has included "flopping" as part of their training, the commissioner has to make a stop of this by putting a heavy penalty on a player that is proven flopping, high paid players gets the biggest penalty, and let's see if they'll still continue to do it.

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Quote from: Questat on September 07, 2021, 03:54:04 PM

I really missed those times, players are not relying so much on their 3 point shooting, they are more into physical plays like driving inside to score and get fouled.

As even Larry Bird who can really shot from the ark is also making his shots closers to the basket, they are not relying with the long 3's but they wanted to keep challenging the defense and make an in your face dunks or twisted shots to avoid the blocking defense.

Quote

I guess the NBA organization has realized that if they will not make it soft, their players will easily be injured and their investment will be at risk, so I don't think we will ever see the 80's-90's style in NBA again.

That's a big part of these changes. NBA stars now are a big investment, so allowing those hard fouls will affect the players. They don't want to lose millions of dollars just because of a hard foul that results in major injuries.

No more Jordan rules, a plain head to head and if the defense collapses, then so be it.

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Quote from: wheelz1200 on September 07, 2021, 03:48:47 PM

Quote from: CryptoBuds on September 07, 2021, 12:58:03 PM

Quote from: Oasisman on September 07, 2021, 07:01:08 AM

The game of basketball, especially the NBA has a huge changes. Flopping was a part of the game even before, but because of the physicality soft fouls was usually uncalled. So, players like LeBron, Harden, and others who didn't get enough calls will exaggerate the contact, thus flopping will be the result. The calls was changed too, they added too many soft calls that even taunting an opponent after a highlight moves will be a technical foul today.
Also, the defense was also changed maybe because of the range the players can do to score today.

I feel like soft calls should be called. Because if soft calls are uncalled, physical players as you mentioned like (Lebron or Harden) will somewhat abuse that. That does not help in a tactical point of view in my opinion. Yes, physicality in a sport is important, but I don't want it to get prioritized over the tactical side of the game.

The soft calls like hand checking fouls are terrible for game flow. It stops the momentum of the game and general watchability. Allowing for some physical play also gets rivals going. Watching in the 80s and 90s was so much better than now.

I really missed those times, players are not relying so much on their 3 point shooting, they are more into physical plays like driving inside to score and get fouled. I guess the NBA organization has realized that if they will not make it soft, their players will easily be injured and their investment will be at risk, so I don't think we will ever see the 80's-90's style in NBA again.

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Quote from: CryptoBuds on September 07, 2021, 12:58:03 PM

Quote from: Oasisman on September 07, 2021, 07:01:08 AM

The game of basketball, especially the NBA has a huge changes. Flopping was a part of the game even before, but because of the physicality soft fouls was usually uncalled. So, players like LeBron, Harden, and others who didn't get enough calls will exaggerate the contact, thus flopping will be the result. The calls was changed too, they added too many soft calls that even taunting an opponent after a highlight moves will be a technical foul today.
Also, the defense was also changed maybe because of the range the players can do to score today.

I feel like soft calls should be called. Because if soft calls are uncalled, physical players as you mentioned like (Lebron or Harden) will somewhat abuse that. That does not help in a tactical point of view in my opinion. Yes, physicality in a sport is important, but I don't want it to get prioritized over the tactical side of the game.

The soft calls like hand checking fouls are terrible for game flow. It stops the momentum of the game and general watchability. Allowing for some physical play also gets rivals going. Watching in the 80s and 90s was so much better than now.

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Quote from: CryptoBuds on September 07, 2021, 12:58:03 PM

Quote from: Oasisman on September 07, 2021, 07:01:08 AM

The game of basketball, especially the NBA has a huge changes. Flopping was a part of the game even before, but because of the physicality soft fouls was usually uncalled. So, players like LeBron, Harden, and others who didn't get enough calls will exaggerate the contact, thus flopping will be the result. The calls was changed too, they added too many soft calls that even taunting an opponent after a highlight moves will be a technical foul today.
Also, the defense was also changed maybe because of the range the players can do to score today.

I feel like soft calls should be called. Because if soft calls are uncalled, physical players as you mentioned like (Lebron or Harden) will somewhat abuse that. That does not help in a tactical point of view in my opinion. Yes, physicality in a sport is important, but I don't want it to get prioritized over the tactical side of the game.

I'm sorry but I have to disagree with you, Harden is not a Physica IMO, he is soft as I thought, he masters the flopping that's why he takes a lot of free throw in the game, James also did the same, so there's no NBA star now that doesn't know how to flop, it's been part fo the game already, what a shame.

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Quote from: Oasisman on September 07, 2021, 07:01:08 AM

The game of basketball, especially the NBA has a huge changes. Flopping was a part of the game even before, but because of the physicality soft fouls was usually uncalled. So, players like LeBron, Harden, and others who didn't get enough calls will exaggerate the contact, thus flopping will be the result. The calls was changed too, they added too many soft calls that even taunting an opponent after a highlight moves will be a technical foul today.
Also, the defense was also changed maybe because of the range the players can do to score today.

I feel like soft calls should be called. Because if soft calls are uncalled, physical players as you mentioned like (Lebron or Harden) will somewhat abuse that. That does not help in a tactical point of view in my opinion. Yes, physicality in a sport is important, but I don't want it to get prioritized over the tactical side of the game.

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Quote from: justdimin on September 07, 2021, 07:41:28 AM

Quote from: danherbias07 on September 07, 2021, 01:48:42 AM

There are still a lot of coaches who uses this kind of strategy. Lakers Coach Frank Vogel is a defensive type strategist and they won the bubble championship because of it. He maximized the strength of Dwight Howard, Rondo, Morris and Danny Green on the defensive end that's why they gain the upper hand against the Miami Heat.
I think with just the right players in their roster they could make the same performance as their championship year and it's already happening that's why they let go some players to balance their team again.

You can play as defensive as you want but at the end of the day we are not in 2004 anymore and almost everything is a foul. Sure you can play better defense compared to other teams, but without hand checking, without proper body defending, it is all getting offensive, and if you do not have a proper offense then your defense doesn't even matter.
Utah is a great defensive team, do you see them at anywhere near the top when talking about teams? Hell Clippers has 2 of the best perimeter defenders in the entire game and they always fail at playoffs. Long story short it is not about defense anymore, Lakers won a bit of thanks to their defense of course, but their offense was Lebron James and AD, can you say their offense wasn't amazing as well? You could basically improve to a point, but we will never have 2004 pistons level of defense in the league ever again.

There is a reason people say that,

Quote

'offence wins you games, but defense wins you trophies.'

A team with a good defense and a good defensive strategy will most of the time if not always have the upper hand in the long run. That's because defending is always more consistent than attacking. Same goes for Lakers and their coach. If they can hold onto that same strategy, I see that they will be a good contender for the title.

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Quote from: Oasisman on September 07, 2021, 07:01:08 AM

The game of basketball, especially the NBA has a huge changes. Flopping was a part of the game even before, but because of the physicality soft fouls was usually uncalled. So, players like LeBron, Harden, and others who didn't get enough calls will exaggerate the contact, thus flopping will be the result. The calls was changed too, they added too many soft calls that even taunting an opponent after a highlight moves will be a technical foul today.
Also, the defense was also changed maybe because of the range the players can do to score today.

Changes a lot and players needs to adopt that, both of you have that point which really affects the tempo of the game, flopping is being caught have a penalty if I remember it correctly $5000 for the first caught then $15K in the second and $30K in their third offense, though not that huge amount compared to the salaries of the players.

In your point, indeed, there are calls that not being given weight and refs are just letting it go, to the point that players need to act that they are really being hit hard to bring the attention of the refs.

We will see more of this and as a fan, I would appreciate if how super stars and their coaches will adopt and adjust with these unexpected calls that being thrown to their respective teams.

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Quote from: danherbias07 on September 07, 2021, 01:48:42 AM

There are still a lot of coaches who uses this kind of strategy. Lakers Coach Frank Vogel is a defensive type strategist and they won the bubble championship because of it. He maximized the strength of Dwight Howard, Rondo, Morris and Danny Green on the defensive end that's why they gain the upper hand against the Miami Heat.
I think with just the right players in their roster they could make the same performance as their championship year and it's already happening that's why they let go some players to balance their team again.

The question arises from here on out on why they haven't keep that balance or the recent championship team they have from the bubble? I think if they keep even Green, Howard and Rondo they still are the best they have from the bubble. Well, I think they got the right player right now but the playing time with this updated Lakers roster will surely be unbalanced but never doubt they can come up with a strategy for that.

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Quote from: justdimin on September 07, 2021, 07:41:28 AM

Long story short it is not about defense anymore, Lakers won a bit of thanks to their defense of course, but their offense was Lebron James and AD, can you say their offense wasn't amazing as well?

Yes their offense is amazing, I didn't doubt that. But remember good offense comes from great defense. It boosts players whenever they make stops.
That's why I said before defense is not being highlighted anymore. Most fans are just looking at the plain view of dunks and 3 points but didn't really appreciate what is happening on the other side. I doubt they ever will.

Anyway, for those who mentioned the flop, it's not just the flop but also the hand check.
Pistons championship was the last time we saw hand checks. They banned it after that. It is also the one reason why offense was so high today. Even if you are the best outside defender in the league like Draymond or Batum, it won't be easy to make a pivot the same way the offense will and you need to give them room or if not, the ref will whistle.

Topic: 2019 NBA Pre-Season - page 1594. (Read 914689 times)