Topic: 22 Messages From Creationists To People Who Believe In Evolution - page 13. (Read 18771 times)

I said this in my other post.  Christianity is the one religion where we don't have to change to come to God.  We come just as we are.  It is up to God to make the difference in our lives.  It is not about us being "holy" on our own.  We can't be, even if we wanted to be.  It is admitting we are not perfect then accepting Jesus. 

Islam is about earning salvation.  It is pointless to try to earn it and any religion that encourages Jihad or killing others for a higher "ranking" in the eternal world is problematic.

Not if you're following the wrong religon. If Islam is true you're probably fucked. Personally, even if there was a god I'm not going to give into bullying and death threats. If god won't take me as I am and how he made me he can go to hell.

that's actually not true, I know that Cornelius Tacitus did write about him, altough the thing I think you wanted to write is that no one wrote that he actually resurrected except for the bible..

I will provide this link: http://www.provethebible.net/T2-Divin/D-0201.htm
Basically a rundown of historical sources outside of the bible supporting the existence of Christ.

Jesus, as portrayed in the Bible, was never here. Outside of the Bible, there are practically zero historical documents speaking of him. But sure, there were lots of people who believed they were the Messiah back in those days, just like there are today:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_messiah_claimants

Historically, a Person named "Jesus" existed, but historically nothing of what he was claimed to do is proven to have ever happened. Those few sources reporting "wonders" or anything alike all point to the same human sources and are therefor not reliable.

Also, every religion has something that "differentiates itself from other religions" (that's not a one-way-road).
"Do we accept or reject ?" is a manipulative pseudo-argument well-known and understood in behavioural sciences. If given this question, I would answer "Option 3 - none of all above".

And I hate to mention that, but Jesus does nothing anymore. He's dead (so much we know, which is of little surprise). Let that poor guy (whoever that was) RIP.

Historically Jesus was really here so Jesus was not "invented."

Also, like I said in other posts, the one thing that differentiates Christianity from other religions is that the other ones required salvation to be earned by our own merit.  Christianity is not about what we can do to earn our way to heaven, it is about what God already did and our response to that.  Do we accept or reject?  It is really that simple.  Of course, in accepting Jesus our lives do change.  He changes us from the inside out.  Instead of hate he puts love in our hearts as we let Him change us and we have more compassion on others and so on.

I've read it. There's not much truth or wisdom in it, unfortunately. The "predictions" are wrong, and the whole book is full of oxymorons, inconsistencies, lies, fairytales, delusions and -- last but not least -- immoral, evil behavior (by God) that would be frowned upon by most modern humans, including self-professed Christians. Some "predictions" are so vague and general, however, that they can be interpreted to fit into any historical era, in any culture. Sort of like the "prophecies" of Nostradamus.

Yes, not only were they written without any such influence, even their original scripts got lost and oldest remaining versions could not even be correctly translated anymore.
All bibles we know are based on interpretations of earlier interpretations of a very shaky and broken translation attempt.

Technically speaking, "the bible" has ceased to exist approx. 400AD and is non-recoverable. So even when avidly reading the oldest translated versions you could find, you're not even reading "the bible" anymore.
You're reading something like "The holy bible, 25th Edition, 25th revision", Lost-in-Translation-Special Edition.

They didn't put all that stuff in there for no reason. It's likely the first recorded example of "applied psychology of the masses" that allowed a small group of clergymen to control a very large part of the population and impose rules/taxes/control that otherwise would have been logistically absolutely impossibly to achieve.
In that respect, it is the most successful Instruction Manual "how to effectively herd human livestock" in existence. With all the known, catastrophic results that made a very small group of people masters of large parts of the planet at virtually no cost and allowed them to accumulate insane amounts of wealth - at a very high price for the herd which got abused/squeezed/bled out and killed left&right over millenia.

"You shall not covet your neighbor's house. You shall not covet your neighbor's wife, or his manservant or maidservant, his ox or donkey, or anything that belongs to your neighbor."

And women are property!

I would encourage all of you bashing God and the Bible to read through it, and ask yourself if you really think the contents were written without supernatural influence.  Do you think the truth, wisdom, predictions concerning the state of the world were simply put down on paper by 40 random people by chance?  By accident?  Just for fun?

Or maybe the logical choice is to accept one (or several) of the other 300 million gods invented by humans?

How did Jesus save anyone?
Adam and Eve sinned when they disobeyed God in the Garden of Eden.  They were cast from the garden.  But God promised He would send them salvation through a "child" which was Jesus. Then God established a relationship with the Israelites (now the Jews) in which he gave them the 10 commandments.  These were God's laws that we are all accountable for.  There needed to be a sacrifice for sins and it was done in the form of a lamb.  (I am not sure why God chose this for the payment of sins but that is what God did.)Jesus became the ultimate atonement for our sins.  He paid the price and all we have to do is accept His payment for our sins or we can just deny that we have any sin or deny that God is real.  We have that choice but we are still accountable to the 10 Commandments.  I personally do not want to die and stand before God without having my sins be atoned for.  That won't end well.  I am forever grateful for what Jesus has done for me.

If we are accountable to God's law of 10 commandments, wouldn't it be loving of God to provide a way to be saved from the price we needed to pay for our crimes?  That seems like a pretty amazing gift.  Basically Jesus paid our life sentence for us and what do most people do, they mock Him, laugh, say it is "bullshit."

It seems far riskier to live life laughing at God then serving Him.  Let's say I am totally wrong.  Let's say that I am asking God for forgiveness for breaking one or two of the 10 commandments only to die and realize that I was "wrong."  Then what?  I won't suffer any different fate than those of you that don't believe.

But what if I am right?  What if Hell is a real place and the only way to heaven is through accepting Jesus?  The logical choice is to accept Him.  

Are you serious? He sent down his only son to be crucified? How exactly did him dying save anyone? How did he die for my sins? Why was it even necessary? It's bizarre and completely perverse to think a loving god would do this. And how is Jesus his only son? Aren’t we all his children. I also wouldn't respect my father if he had me crucified and threatened that I'd burn forever if I didn't love him. That's pure psychological abuse and murderous sadomasochism.

And if god gave a shit about you or anyone else he wouldn't let abuse happen in the first place.

Religion = excessive Paranoia married with Stockholm syndrome...

To truly grasp that God, out of love for us, would send His only son to die for our sins, is what changes the perception of a vengeful God into a merciful God.  That said, He still is to be respected, just as we would respect our Father figure (or should respect our fathers.  Many kids do not seem to anymore unfortunately.)

The Bible is also a historical book that shows man's evil choices and even God's vengeance on those that have made their choice against Him.  Usually God's hand is moved out of compassion on those who are trying to serve Him and are being abused.  I know that I have experienced this in my life first hand.  A strange and sudden death occurred for a guy that had abused me and other kids.  It was several years the abuse occurred for me but perhaps God said "enough" and then allowed His sudden death?  I will never know for sure. God is patient but there does come a time when he removes His hand and allows people to suffer the consequences of their choices.   That does not change who He is though.  He is faithful, just, forgiving and kind and compassionate to those that truly seek Him.

He only seems to have love for those who grovel out of fear to him. There's no choice or love there. It's love me or else you'll pay. It's 100% an abusive relationship. You also didn't answer how you know the bible is the correct book. How do you know you've not been duped by Satan into believing the wrong religion? There's also lots of hateful things in the bible.

The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom.  It is foolish NOT to fear God.

Shouldn't we fear and respect the one that has the power to send us to hell?

The Koran is not a book of Love. Sure there are some "truths" in all religions, or people would not follow them.  Like I said in other posts, the one thing that differentiates Christianity from the rest is that Christianity is not about what we can do to earn our way to "heaven" or whatever heightened spiritual place the religion teaches.  Christianity is all about what God, out of His great love for us, has done.  We have the choice to accept that or reject that.  Then out of fear and reverence we then follow Him because of His love.  It is like a healthy father/child relationship.  One where the child knows the Father's place and listens to Him and does what He asks, even when it does not always make sense because we can trust He really does know what is best for us.

This is a key part. You only love or believe in him out of fear. It's exactly like an abusive relationship. If god really loves us all I don't think he'd be bothered when people use their god-given intelligence to cast doubt on his existence. Especially when the only evidence for him is in a book. I'm also not sure how we're meant to know which book is true or not. What if the bible is the work of the devil and the Koran (or something else) is the one true book?