[ActiveMining] The Official Active Mining Discussion Thread [Self-Moderated] - page 184.

Mabsark

legendary

Activity: 826

Merit: 1004

Quote from: minerpart on January 02, 2014, 11:26:16 AM

Quote from: Mabsark on January 02, 2014, 11:17:45 AM

With US investors getting screwed by ActM and the SEC being there to protect US investors, why would the SEC not take action against Ken?

Because they don't prosecute legitimate businesses unless they have deliberately flaunted legislation to scam, defraud, or avoid taxes.

The SEC have already shown their colours here. They have troddon softly with cease and desist letters instead of Police raids or InterPol/extradition requests. The Bitcoin economy now has official sanction in the US, no legitimate BTC mining business will be closed down if they follow SEC guidance after direct contact. Ken appears to be doing that.

A lot of people are claiming that ActM are ripping them off and Ken seems to be going out of his way to give such claims legitimacy. If someone claims Ken has stolen their shares, could that not be interpreted as true if they have no access to those shares? If someone claimed Ken had stolen their dividends could that not be interpreted as true if Ken hasn't paid divs for weeks?

minerpart

sr. member

Activity: 280

Merit: 250

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Quote from: DoloresHazed on January 02, 2014, 11:51:25 AM

Sure Pirateat40 case is relevant. It takes away the "it's just a game, nothing of value is being traded" rationalization that Burnside tried using on his gameserver. How old are you, bro?

It's relevant as to what? He ran a Ponzi scheme and de-frauded investors of 150k BTC. That is why he's in trouble and every Ponzi scheme operator is a serious criminal. Are you saying that's news bro? It's not bro. OK bro? See ya crumbs.

DoloresHazed

newbie

Activity: 7

Merit: 0

Quote from: minerpart on January 02, 2014, 11:45:31 AM

re: Trendon Shavers - Ponzi schemes world-wide are always prosecuted - it's got nothing to do with the currency used.

I'll say again. The SEC are not prosecuting Ukyo, they are guiding and instructing this industry not prosecuting it.

Sure Pirateat40 case is relevant. It takes away the "it's just a game, nothing of value is being traded" rationalization that Burnside tried using on his gameserver. How old are you, bro?

VinceSamios

sr. member

Activity: 448

Merit: 250

Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: VinceSamios on January 02, 2014, 10:48:46 AM

FYI - there is a limit on the number of shareholders in a private company under which they would have a lot of freedoms.

I believe it is currently still a limit of 500 shareholders however legislation is in process to increase that to over 1000 through the "Jumpstart Our Business Startups Act" which has been approved but will be added to the JOBS Act and therefore requires another vote and presidential signature (I'm not sure if this has happened yet)

The latest list of ActiveMining investors shows 323 people (http://bitfunder.firstitinc.com/asset-list/assetlist-2013-12-07-01:40.txt) although we need to take into consideration that a lot of people tendered shares prior to this.

Searching for a pre-bitfunder shutdown list (http://bitfunder.firstitinc.com/asset-list/assetlist-2013-11-01-23-50.txt.bz2) shows 768 investors. We can guestimate this is higher as not all BTCT.co investors would have moved across prior to this. (if I understand correctly)

It might have been recommended, possibly even by the SEC, for Ken to delay listing the shares until the amendment to the JOBS Act has been passed (it may already have been, I haven't bothered googling it).

Get your facts straight. Ken has illegally issued shares.

1. SEC doesn't care where you are, if you sell shares to US persons you follow their rules or face prosecution. If you live in Shenzen province you might get a pass, but that isn't going to help you or Ken.
2. To legally sell securities publicly, ALL investors must be accredited and you must have proof of their status.
3. You must file a schedule D with the SEC
4. Timing: the government moves slow. I expect prosecution will happen after the SEC gains a conviction against Trendon Shavers. If you haven't found a new bag holder for this disaster by the spring, expect to be trapped in it until all legal proceedings end.

Technically you are wrong on all counts...

minerpart

sr. member

Activity: 280

Merit: 250

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re: Trendon Shavers - Ponzi schemes world-wide are always prosecuted - it's got nothing to do with the currency used.

I'll say again. The SEC are not prosecuting Ukyo, they are guiding and instructing this industry not prosecuting it.

webgypsy

newbie

Activity: 9

Merit: 0

Quote from: VinceSamios on January 02, 2014, 11:33:24 AM

Quote from: webgypsy on January 02, 2014, 11:27:13 AM

Quote from: VinceSamios on January 02, 2014, 11:24:30 AM

Quote from: knybe on January 02, 2014, 11:13:31 AM

fuck this.

woulda been better off sinking all my money into KnC miners and doing it myself.

WE SHOULD HAVE BEEN MINING WEEKS AGO TO HAVE MADE THIS PROJECT WORTH WHILE.

% network share is the same BTC ROI regardless - and with BTC price increases we've got just as good a chance as before regardless of difficulty.

I think you, and others, need to grow a pair.

The only problem being this: To secure the same percentage of the total hashrate, you now need many more chips, many more cases, many more power supplies.
Grow a brain.

Isn't it lucky the price of BTC has gone up so substantially since the first estimates were made.

bye troll

Vinny, please remember that you have invested BTC, not dollars. This has been discussed to death.
If you invest 1BTC to get .1BTC back, you're being a fool, regardless of the exchange rate.

minerpart

sr. member

Activity: 280

Merit: 250

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Quote from: VinceSamios on January 02, 2014, 11:22:05 AM

Not a lot, but it seemed to be in the consumer protection vein - this was just after the bitfunder shutdown.

This will be their main concern in the BTC arena.

We need to remember that they are also bound by the laws of the US and they can't barge into a business premises and close them down without serious evidence or serious criminality. They do not want to be taken to court for a multi-million dollar law-suit, which is what they would face if they closed down any legitimate business that is serving it's customers and investors well. If they have issues then a company is wise to follow their advice or instruction but so far they have decided to guide the industry down he right path rather than kill it. Bitcoin will create tens of thousands of jobs in the US, if Ken and others don't do this business in the US then the Chinese will simply steal the share of the market. That's not good for the US economy or US investors.

VinceSamios

sr. member

Activity: 448

Merit: 250

Quote from: webgypsy on January 02, 2014, 11:27:13 AM

Quote from: VinceSamios on January 02, 2014, 11:24:30 AM

Quote from: knybe on January 02, 2014, 11:13:31 AM

fuck this.

woulda been better off sinking all my money into KnC miners and doing it myself.

WE SHOULD HAVE BEEN MINING WEEKS AGO TO HAVE MADE THIS PROJECT WORTH WHILE.

% network share is the same BTC ROI regardless - and with BTC price increases we've got just as good a chance as before regardless of difficulty.

I think you, and others, need to grow a pair.

The only problem being this: To secure the same percentage of the total hashrate, you now need many more chips, many more cases, many more power supplies.
Grow a brain.

Isn't it lucky the price of BTC has gone up so substantially since the first estimates were made.

bye troll

webgypsy

newbie

Activity: 9

Merit: 0

Quote from: VinceSamios on January 02, 2014, 11:24:30 AM

Quote from: knybe on January 02, 2014, 11:13:31 AM

fuck this.

woulda been better off sinking all my money into KnC miners and doing it myself.

WE SHOULD HAVE BEEN MINING WEEKS AGO TO HAVE MADE THIS PROJECT WORTH WHILE.

% network share is the same BTC ROI regardless - and with BTC price increases we've got just as good a chance as before regardless of difficulty.

I think you, and others, need to grow a pair.

The only problem being this: To secure the same percentage of the total hashrate, you now need many more chips, many more cases, many more power supplies.
Grow a brain.

minerpart

sr. member

Activity: 280

Merit: 250

IIIIII====II====IIIIII

Quote from: Mabsark on January 02, 2014, 11:17:45 AM

With US investors getting screwed by ActM and the SEC being there to protect US investors, why would the SEC not take action against Ken?

Because they don't prosecute legitimate businesses unless they have deliberately flaunted legislation to scam, defraud, or avoid taxes.

The SEC have already shown their colours here. They have troddon softly with cease and desist letters instead of Police raids or InterPol/extradition requests. The Bitcoin economy now has official sanction in the US, no legitimate BTC mining business will be closed down if they follow SEC guidance after direct contact. Ken appears to be doing that.

VinceSamios

sr. member

Activity: 448

Merit: 250

Quote from: knybe on January 02, 2014, 11:13:31 AM

fuck this.

woulda been better off sinking all my money into KnC miners and doing it myself.

WE SHOULD HAVE BEEN MINING WEEKS AGO TO HAVE MADE THIS PROJECT WORTH WHILE.

% network share is the same BTC ROI regardless - and with BTC price increases we've got just as good a chance as before regardless of difficulty.

I think you, and others, need to grow a pair.

VinceSamios

sr. member

Activity: 448

Merit: 250

Quote from: minerpart on January 02, 2014, 11:15:39 AM

Quote from: VinceSamios on January 02, 2014, 11:13:16 AM

I had a call myself from the SEC about ActM

What was their line of inquirery? And when was the call?

Not a lot, but it seemed to be in the consumer protection vein - this was just after the bitfunder shutdown.

Cropcircle

newbie

Activity: 9

Merit: 0

Quote from: Bargraphics on January 02, 2014, 11:11:01 AM

Quote from: minerpart on January 02, 2014, 10:47:07 AM

Well you (and numerous others) have registered just to post on the ACtM thread, so I guess the answer to your question is - you want them. Cheesy

Crumbs alt was banned

Quote from: webgypsy on January 01, 2014, 09:49:23 AM

NickDanger, a virtual identity which I chose for you as my manifestation on this forum, was banned without a warning.

All of his other Alts have commented on that thread including webgypsy (admittedly), cropcircle, and thumper650. This list also includes Doloreshaze, Dolor, Doloresmaze, accountmarketing.

Please understand who you are talking to on this thread as he is going through great lengths to create multiple accounts.

Carry on.

Bargraphics, whose sock are you? You didn't join this forum in June just to unload your Terrahash preorder on some sucker, did you? I mean, IN YOUR FIRST POST?

You're not the only one entitled to socking, don't get so uppity & butthurt when others do it.

Mabsark

legendary

Activity: 826

Merit: 1004

Quote from: minerpart on January 02, 2014, 11:10:02 AM

This is already very old. The SEC sent a desist letter to Bitfunder (months ago). He acted and they didn't prosecute Ukyo/Jon.

He would have been a huge scalp if that's what they were after - they are not, they are out to protect US investors.

So clearly they have no intention of prosecuting this industry unless instructions and guidance are ignored.

So nothing to worry about, if there was, ACtM would be shut down already.

With US investors getting screwed by ActM and the SEC being there to protect US investors, why would the SEC not take action against Ken?

knybe

hero member

Activity: 658

Merit: 500

decentralize EVERYTHING...

Quote from: minerpart on January 02, 2014, 11:15:39 AM

Yes Bargraphics - that's what I was saying. The Trolls are after the shares - we know who they are.

at this point they're just trolling to be mean.

based on other "no info" bitcoin projects results, I'm afraid the trolls may be right…

minerpart

sr. member

Activity: 280

Merit: 250

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Quote from: VinceSamios on January 02, 2014, 11:13:16 AM

I had a call myself from the SEC about ActM

What was their line of inquirery? And when was the call?

Yes Bargraphics - that's what I was saying. The Trolls are after the shares - we know who they are.

knybe

hero member

Activity: 658

Merit: 500

decentralize EVERYTHING...

fuck this.

woulda been better off sinking all my money into KnC miners and doing it myself.

WE SHOULD HAVE BEEN MINING WEEKS AGO TO HAVE MADE THIS PROJECT WORTH WHILE.

VinceSamios

sr. member

Activity: 448

Merit: 250

Quote from: Cropcircle on January 02, 2014, 11:00:50 AM

Quote from: VinceSamios on January 02, 2014, 10:19:18 AM

Devils Advocate:

The company is registered in Belize (I believe) which solves most of the problems of offering shares in a company. If those shares become publicly tradable then the US imposes it's own laws (rightly or wrongly) which prohibit trading with US citizens. In that respect ActM might need to limit access to share trading with US citizens.

Don't let your confirmation bias lead you - this has to be a consideration for ActM, weather it turns out to be an issue or not.

The fact that Ken egistered a company in Belize does not change the fact that ken sold his unregistered securities to US persons. Fact.
Even a full buyback won't absolve him any more than returning the money stolen from a bank would absolve a bank robber. Fact.
The law was already broken, the only thing to be done now is wait & see if Ken's daring do was interesting enough for the SEC to go after. If Ken didn't lie about the SEC contacting Jon about Active Mining, my guess is Ken should get a love letter from them sometime soon.

I had a call myself from the SEC about ActM

Bargraphics

hero member

Activity: 518

Merit: 500

Every man is guilty of all the good he did not do.

Quote from: minerpart on January 02, 2014, 10:47:07 AM

Well you (and numerous others) have registered just to post on the ACtM thread, so I guess the answer to your question is - you want them. Cheesy

Crumbs alt was banned

Quote from: webgypsy on January 01, 2014, 09:49:23 AM

NickDanger, a virtual identity which I chose for you as my manifestation on this forum, was banned without a warning.

All of his other Alts have commented on that thread including webgypsy (admittedly), cropcircle, and thumper650. This list also includes Doloreshaze, Dolor, Doloresmaze, accountmarketing.

Please understand who you are talking to on this thread as he is going through great lengths to create multiple accounts.

Carry on.

minerpart

sr. member

Activity: 280

Merit: 250

IIIIII====II====IIIIII

This is already very old. The SEC sent a desist letter to Bitfunder (months ago). He acted and they didn't prosecute Ukyo/Jon.

He would have been a huge scalp if that's what they were after - they are not, they are out to protect US investors.

So clearly they have no intention of prosecuting this industry unless instructions and guidance are ignored.

So nothing to worry about, if there was, ACtM would be shut down already.

Topic: [ActiveMining] The Official Active Mining Discussion Thread [Self-Moderated] - page 184. (Read 771520 times)