Topic: all finished - page 3. (Read 16598 times)

Better call Saul!

Waldo, I know this is additional work for you but please step-up in these critical times. I know that you are not directly interested what will happen next, but for many of us this is very important. Thanks for understanding this.

The only proper thing to do for you is to organize official voting what should we do, and to PM all group buyers in your HF group buys to take part in the voting. This is important because people who do not follow forum closely will get email notification to take part in the vote. For those who will not vote we have to assume they agree with the majority, we can't wait forever for them to make up their minds.

There's also another lawyer which can be a valid option:
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.4377215
He is not that expensive as the first one you've mentioned, he takes 40% of the money above the official refund sum of 5,600 US$, but he is less experienced than the first one. I can help you sorting proper lawyer information for the voting if you want me, just please PM. There should be 3 options for the vote:
a) Take lawyer A (all info about the lawyer A)
b) Take lawyer B (all info about the lawyer B)
c) Do nothing and wait what will happen next
There is a possibility to add option
d) Accept HF refund request and wait for 5600 US$ per machine
but I personally think nobody sane would vote for this, let the others say if we should put this option in the vote at all.

Please organize the voting as soon as possible, if we are late and HF goes down in the meantime we could be left with no compensation at all!

They are doing shit. Promising delivery... fail... not paying back and then setting us under pressure to take dollars

Are they actually shipping?

Tell them that we are expecting them to pay back the full amount in BTC or we take legal action. And they need to decide till tomorrow - those fu*** fa*****

take te equips and wait for the MPP. becouse a lwyer its too expensive and the equip mine 50% faster than they predicts... its not the best but may be is te best retourn on our investment. (srry for my crepp inglish)

What about this lawyer? https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.4377215

did we file for full refunds (btc 4 btc) in this group by yet.

My mistake, let's hope for some good news soon.

No news from HF yet?

So, are you really still trying to sell shares in this? I noticed the thread title has changed to BTC.5 = 20GH/s.  Aren't you attempting to get a refund?  Why would you still be attempting to sell shares in a miner you are actively trying to get a refund on?

When the current refund being offered is only a very small percentage of what we originally paid, this seems a bit shady.  If someone bought a share today and then we got our refund in 2 weeks, would you refund their entire BTC amount or the discounted amount that everyone else would receive? 

This GB should be closed if you are seeking a refund.

Please give us an update on what you are doing.

If a USD refund is sought, I would also suggest that waldo not sign the document HF is trying to force on customers that releases HF of any obligations. I believe there is and should be further dialog on a full BTC refund, given that the founders of the company did make those guarantees.

That said, I can be persuaded either way.  If HF really can deliver more hashing power to make up for lost time, that would be cool.  I have strong doubts now, but I do think the company had good intentions.

So, in this current state of uncertainty, are we leaning towards going the usd refund route? Even though it's a major haircut, anything we get back now will be a bonus and I really don't think that waiting a month or two for upgraded products will pan out. Instead of bickering about the past which can't be changed, I'd like to see some brain storming about what our particular outcome is going to look like. And yes, I've covered the main HF thread but am interested in what way we'll roll.

You bought a share of a product HashFast was selling. Everything else is payment details, the fact Waldo payed in advance was just a safenet and convenience for shareholders to be certain their money won't just stay at Waldo's wallet for a while and then returned back. That payment in advance was a main reason I joined Waldo's group buy and not some other. This is a group buy, we bought HashFast product together, paying through Waldo. Please stop whining and read opening post once again, everything was and is clear about this.

I know for sure that I saw a note once where he said he would go ahead and order the miners once a certain percentage of shares are paid.  It might be some of his own money used or it might be that 90% of the shares covered 100% of the actual cost.

However, whether the miner was paid for by him or those who bought shares makes no difference.  Either way, you purchased a share of a miner that was to be delivered at a future date.  He clearly said in the offer that he cannot be responsible for the manufacturer failing to deliver.  You knew there was a risk that they would not deliver.  This happened with BFL and Hash Fast had no products on the market.

What Hash Fast said was that they would refund the money if they failed to deliver.  Right now, they're saying they will only return the USD equivalent of the cost, whereas they apparently said they would return one's BTC.  I posted a link above to one of the founders saying he guaranteed buyers' BTC.  So, Hash Fast lied.  Waldohoover made no false claim, nor did he make any misleading statements.  You would not be complaining if the machine had been delivered on time.  It was not and there's nothing waldohoover can do about it.  If there is any one part of the offer that should stand out in your mind, it's that statement where he said he cannot be responsible for the fact a miner was not delivered.

In any case, it looks like you will at least be able to get a refund for the USD equivalent of what you spent, if the others in the group want to get a refund.  I don't know what the group wants to do, but waldohoover has just a few days to submit a request for a refund.  He might even opt for filing a lawsuit against Hash Fast, since they did apparently guarantee buyers' BTC.  However, this is really up to him (as the recognized purchaser) and, to a lesser extent, those who contributed to the pool.

Anyway, I fully appreciate your frustration.  Not all investments work out the way you plan and you should know that.  There's nothing misleading in what waldohoover offered.  Just sit back and enjoy the ride.  I'd guess everyone would love their BTC back, but Hash Fast likely does not have the funds to return it.  Another option they do have, though, is to provide even more hashing power.  I doubt they'll do that, either.  Likely, they're going to go broke over this fiasco.

There is something important: What "All Miners PAID" in the title of the post means for each other…

malvino: All Miners PAID = Waldo paid for the miner with his own money and then is selling shares.

paulej: All Miners PAID = He is collecting money from people and using that money to buy the miners. Sometimes, he puts a little of his own money in to buy miners, too, which is why I think he marks them paid.  He indicated somewhere that when he gets to about 90% funded, he buys the miners.

Who's right?

I'm struggling with this claim. The thing is, he did not sell the miners. Rather he sold shares of the miners. He also made it clear that he is not responsible of Hash Fast does not deliver.

The important point here is that he was just offering to run the equipment for you and others. It was you who took the risk on Hash Fast delivering.

Your Mac logo example isn't right. Sure, if you have no computer, you can't make logos. However, if you bought a different computer you could make the logos.  With the equipment used for hashing, he is not buying the boxes and leaving you to dry. Rather, he is collecting money from people and using that money to buy the miners. Sometimes, he puts a little of his own money in to buy miners, too, which is why I think he marks them paid.  He indicated somewhere that when he gets to about 90% funded, he buys the miners.

You really shouldn't complain to waldohoover. I'm sure he is as unhappy with Hash Fast as you are. He cannot control what the company does.

Paulej,

The thing is that I made business with Waldo, not with HashFast.

I'm graphic designer. Imagine you want a logo. And I make an offer: logos for $100. I'll design them with a MacBook Pro I've already paid and will arrive in November. You pay me $100. Apple is late and till now didn't send it. You ask me for a refund and I say it's not my fault. It's Apple. As you say you must be angry with Apple, and only Apple is responsible for the situation. Really?

And in that time you see me buying a HP and making the same offer: logos for $100 made with an HP I've already paid. You don't have money to make a refund but you have it to buy another computer… Nice!

Really? hahaha

I paid something in BTC and the refund will be in USD

This whole story is a joke. It´s like "hey guys! we steal you but... smile!"

malvino,

Considering the news from HashFast of late, it looks like you might just get more angry. It would appear from this page that Simon Barber did say HasFast would refund BTC and that the BTC was guaranteed. There's a more colorful dialog here.

But the letter that went out to all customers requires them to give up all rights if they want a refund and the refund will only be the USD equivalent of what you paid.

Nobody is happy about this situation, but don't take it out on our leader here. He can't control the company, but it does look bad.

Personally, I'd say request a refund and say no to the release. Nothing in the original purchase agreement said customers had to sign the release.  It's better to leave options open.

That said, I'm not sure what folks want. Refund or wait?