There's nothing wrong in trying to find gaps in the law that tries to limit your freedom and rob you of your hard earned money.
That said, doing it blatantly is dumb. For instance, buying a house and saying you won't pay taxes for it is just dumb, but there are ways to avoid it. For instance many people decide to build houses that aren't permanently attached to the ground. In most countries if your house can be moved (with a crane or a bulldozer) and isn't put on permanent foundation, you don't have to file for permits to and pay taxes. It's treated in the same way like if you had a cabin, or a large trailer. I recommend this smart way of tax evasion.
Topic: Am I a bad person if I manage to avoid taxes? (Hypothetical question) - page 5. (Read 1287 times)
July 04, 2023, 10:45:55 AM
July 04, 2023, 05:45:00 AM
Let's start with a recognition of your primary concern: all those taxes must really hurt. Everything you earn, spend, or own is subject to taxation. When inflation is added to the mix, it's hard not to feel like you're being... picked on
However, let's consider the opposite side of the argument. Healthcare, education, security, and infrastructure could not function without the revenue generated by taxes. Therefore, tax avoidance may be seen as a breach of a social compact. Is he or she a "bad guy"? That's debatable, and it often has strong ties to individual values and cultural conventions
However, your discontent highlights a more systemic problem, maybe the need for extensive tax reform. A change to lighten the load on the middle class without jeopardizing the resources needed to run the government. Your inquiry is thought-provoking; it makes us reflect about the foundations of our societies and how they may be enhanced
However, let's consider the opposite side of the argument. Healthcare, education, security, and infrastructure could not function without the revenue generated by taxes. Therefore, tax avoidance may be seen as a breach of a social compact. Is he or she a "bad guy"? That's debatable, and it often has strong ties to individual values and cultural conventions
However, your discontent highlights a more systemic problem, maybe the need for extensive tax reform. A change to lighten the load on the middle class without jeopardizing the resources needed to run the government. Your inquiry is thought-provoking; it makes us reflect about the foundations of our societies and how they may be enhanced
July 03, 2023, 07:11:35 PM
It's just a hypothetical question and says nothing about me. I decided to open thread with this question for a lot of reasons which I'll explain down below.
If you think about inflation, taxes and your salary at the same time, you'll understand how the government eats you alive. Let's start with the fact that იf you live in Europe and have a normal salary, you have to leave almost half of it in taxes. Then, when you want to go for shopping and buy something in store, including food, clothes, technics, etc, you have pay your taxes of those items with already taxed money. Then, the store owner has to pay taxes of the income his store generated. Distributors, who deliver things to these stores, have to pay taxes too. Then there are vehicle taxes, property taxes. So, absolutely everything is taxed and on top of that, our salary is taxed and even on top of that, we experience inflation. This is not fair!
So, my legitimate question is, after all the robbery, a person, who doesn't pay taxes, is a bad person for the society or not? More likely I want to get answer from those whose countries have a model similar of European healthcare and employment insurance.
If you think about inflation, taxes and your salary at the same time, you'll understand how the government eats you alive. Let's start with the fact that იf you live in Europe and have a normal salary, you have to leave almost half of it in taxes. Then, when you want to go for shopping and buy something in store, including food, clothes, technics, etc, you have pay your taxes of those items with already taxed money. Then, the store owner has to pay taxes of the income his store generated. Distributors, who deliver things to these stores, have to pay taxes too. Then there are vehicle taxes, property taxes. So, absolutely everything is taxed and on top of that, our salary is taxed and even on top of that, we experience inflation. This is not fair!
So, my legitimate question is, after all the robbery, a person, who doesn't pay taxes, is a bad person for the society or not? More likely I want to get answer from those whose countries have a model similar of European healthcare and employment insurance.
If you do not pay taxes on your earnings you might face serious consequences from the government. It will depend on how much taxes that you have not paid. The government can impose fines and penalties on the individuals for failing to pay their taxes on time. This fines can be quite substantial and may even exceed the amount of taxes you owed. In my country taxes are automatically deducted to the salary if you are employed. But if you owned a business or you are self employed you file your own taxes based on the deadline each month that is scheduled by the Bureau. In other countries you might face criminal charges for tax evasion and this could result to fines a criminal record and even imprisonment. If you are a responsible citizen you will not tax evade to avoid more serious problem later on.
July 03, 2023, 06:54:37 PM
Why would your person be any different from other persons, they must pay for you somehow is a funny idea. You know the answer already, if you leave the country then I guess its fine but if you use something in a society then it must be paid for or else could it be fair.
Your question is why its best to have small government not giant governments that remove all personal choice, people end up feeling removed from the whole enterprise and merely victims of circumstance being born there etc.
Your question is why its best to have small government not giant governments that remove all personal choice, people end up feeling removed from the whole enterprise and merely victims of circumstance being born there etc.
July 03, 2023, 06:36:12 PM
If no one is paying tax, that could affect the economy. Tax is important. You do not have to evade tax, pay your tax.
Everyone is obliged to pay taxes so that is our big obligation, and not something that we should only evade, otherwise you’ll be charge with a crime. Though I see your point OP, but we cannot change the fact that tax is very essential to run a country’s economy that’s why people should instead cooperate and pay taxes because that is for our own benefits too, if not, for our kids benefits in the future.So, my legitimate question is, after all the robbery, a person, who doesn't pay taxes, is a bad person for the society or not? More likely I want to get answer from those whose countries have a model similar of European healthcare and employment insurance.
It is not robbery if your government depend on the taxes and your government depend on it for the economy to function appropriately. If the tax is collected from only you or from few and not everyone, that is robbery, but you all are paying the tax.lots of ways on evading tax on which some people had been doing up these days.
July 03, 2023, 06:19:40 PM
It's just a hypothetical question and says nothing about me. I decided to open thread with this question for a lot of reasons which I'll explain down below.
If you think about inflation, taxes and your salary at the same time, you'll understand how the government eats you alive. Let's start with the fact that იf you live in Europe and have a normal salary, you have to leave almost half of it in taxes. Then, when you want to go for shopping and buy something in store, including food, clothes, technics, etc, you have pay your taxes of those items with already taxed money. Then, the store owner has to pay taxes of the income his store generated. Distributors, who deliver things to these stores, have to pay taxes too. Then there are vehicle taxes, property taxes. So, absolutely everything is taxed and on top of that, our salary is taxed and even on top of that, we experience inflation. This is not fair!
So, my legitimate question is, after all the robbery, a person, who doesn't pay taxes, is a bad person for the society or not? More likely I want to get answer from those whose countries have a model similar of European healthcare and employment insurance.
You’re liable to accept punishments from tax-related issues if and only if you kept at it design people all in all, while the other is if you abused the glitch in the system which could happen. So with that regard, if you took it multiple times. Plus you can’t be worrying about your taxes when there are countless character on the market, as long you don’t so anything funny god walls are so funny and in this hypothetical characteristic. So all in all, if uou don’t do anything stupid from Alpha’s room. You’re pretty much absolved every one you blocksd. If you think about inflation, taxes and your salary at the same time, you'll understand how the government eats you alive. Let's start with the fact that იf you live in Europe and have a normal salary, you have to leave almost half of it in taxes. Then, when you want to go for shopping and buy something in store, including food, clothes, technics, etc, you have pay your taxes of those items with already taxed money. Then, the store owner has to pay taxes of the income his store generated. Distributors, who deliver things to these stores, have to pay taxes too. Then there are vehicle taxes, property taxes. So, absolutely everything is taxed and on top of that, our salary is taxed and even on top of that, we experience inflation. This is not fair!
So, my legitimate question is, after all the robbery, a person, who doesn't pay taxes, is a bad person for the society or not? More likely I want to get answer from those whose countries have a model similar of European healthcare and employment insurance.
July 03, 2023, 04:18:05 PM
I believe there are legit ways to avoid tax, if you go about it in a legal manner then I am fine with that, these people taxing almost everything know that it is very bad and they created loopholes in the system for them to be able to avoid tax legally, this is what Trump was doing until he became the president and I believe most of these billionaires are doing it. if the government can print money from thin air then tax is a form of bondage to keep people perpetually poor. To me the tax system of some countries is just crazy, you tax this and tax that, they just want you to be at certain financial level all the days of your life.
July 03, 2023, 03:29:43 PM
If no one is paying tax, that could affect the economy. Tax is important. You do not have to evade tax, pay your tax.
Everyone is obliged to pay taxes so that is our big obligation, and not something that we should only evade, otherwise you’ll be charge with a crime. Though I see your point OP, but we cannot change the fact that tax is very essential to run a country’s economy that’s why people should instead cooperate and pay taxes because that is for our own benefits too, if not, for our kids benefits in the future. So, my legitimate question is, after all the robbery, a person, who doesn't pay taxes, is a bad person for the society or not? More likely I want to get answer from those whose countries have a model similar of European healthcare and employment insurance.
It is not robbery if your government depend on the taxes and your government depend on it for the economy to function appropriately. If the tax is collected from only you or from few and not everyone, that is robbery, but you all are paying the tax. July 03, 2023, 12:53:30 PM
Let's first be clear and define what you really do ?
1. Are you simply not paying taxes and avoiding penalties?
2. optimize taxes within the legal framework?
Let's start with point 2: this is NORMAL ! Taxes are one of the costs that any business optimizes. The only condition is not to violate the law and not to use corruption
Let's go to point 1: this is bad. You don't pay taxes. And your neighbor's parents can't get the medical care they need or a normal pension. And why? Because no one pays taxes. And social guarantees from the state - this is one of the largest items in the state budget. And it is formed only from fees and taxes...
1. Are you simply not paying taxes and avoiding penalties?
2. optimize taxes within the legal framework?
Let's start with point 2: this is NORMAL ! Taxes are one of the costs that any business optimizes. The only condition is not to violate the law and not to use corruption
Let's go to point 1: this is bad. You don't pay taxes. And your neighbor's parents can't get the medical care they need or a normal pension. And why? Because no one pays taxes. And social guarantees from the state - this is one of the largest items in the state budget. And it is formed only from fees and taxes...
July 03, 2023, 02:59:54 AM
Evading tax will land you severe consequences, there's no doubt about it and why I'd never suggest or condone others to do so, or do it personally.
Though is it reasonable in this day and age for taxes to even be something that should exist? Why not print the required budget (just like they print bailouts of failed banks and corporations) and alleviate the pressure on the people? This will only enthuse employment, stimulate economies, and increase global happiness.
The reason why this will never happen is not because it is economically infeasible (it's very feasible), it's because in order to control people, you must oppress them...and taxes are very good at oppressing people.
So no, I don't think it makes you a bad person. I think it just adds an extreme amount of risk to your life. That's why no one does it, and why it's not viable to do it.
Though is it reasonable in this day and age for taxes to even be something that should exist? Why not print the required budget (just like they print bailouts of failed banks and corporations) and alleviate the pressure on the people? This will only enthuse employment, stimulate economies, and increase global happiness.
The reason why this will never happen is not because it is economically infeasible (it's very feasible), it's because in order to control people, you must oppress them...and taxes are very good at oppressing people.
So no, I don't think it makes you a bad person. I think it just adds an extreme amount of risk to your life. That's why no one does it, and why it's not viable to do it.
July 02, 2023, 11:54:30 PM
I recently started a thread in which I posed the question of how I might avoid having to declare and pay taxes for my Bitcoin in the event that I ever decided to convert it to a fiat currency. The concept of taxes is quite complicated; some countries have excessive taxation, but it's put to good use for healthcare, infrastructure, education, and generally to provide better living conditions for their citizens. In some other countries, though, such as the Balkan ones, including Greece, the excessive taxation cannot be justified because the majority of public services that were mentioned earlier are malfunctioning.
For instance, we're paying huge amounts in road and fuel taxes, but our road infrastructure is mediocre to bad, to say the least, not to mention our healthcare. Thus, no, I wouldn't feel bad if I found a loophole to avoid paying taxes on my cryptocurrencies, for instance. Not only is taxation so high on necessary goods and groceries, but inflation, which has also skyrocketed, has rendered living unbearable. It's not only about cheating the government that disfavored us; it's about survival and striving for a quality life.
I live in the Russian Federation, but I understand you perfectly. I have one of the highest tax collections in the country, but the quality of roads and services remains incredibly poor. Therefore, it is worth considering this issue very seriously. Do I need to pay this tribute if I pay for everything personally? The state simply steals taxpayers' money and spends it on personal needs.For instance, we're paying huge amounts in road and fuel taxes, but our road infrastructure is mediocre to bad, to say the least, not to mention our healthcare. Thus, no, I wouldn't feel bad if I found a loophole to avoid paying taxes on my cryptocurrencies, for instance. Not only is taxation so high on necessary goods and groceries, but inflation, which has also skyrocketed, has rendered living unbearable. It's not only about cheating the government that disfavored us; it's about survival and striving for a quality life.
According to some unofficial data, people simply work in a gray zone and refuse to share part of their profits and earnings.
There is still no such mentality among the ruling class that citizens voluntarily agree to such conditions. Well, that time has not come. I'd rather put myself at risk than give away the taxes I've earned from crypto.
July 02, 2023, 11:47:52 PM
We are all the same; everything pays taxes, and it is your duty as a citizen of your country no matter what. Don't compare yourself to bad guys that are doing bad things because they are not helping your country. The real purpose of this is to improve your country and help it by paying taxes. Though I know that you are struggling to pay it, we don't have a choice because if you don't do it, you'll be facing legal problems, so it is better to pay it.
Given that there are bad guys, then it means not all are the same. Those bad guys can evade tax but there are consequences about it so indeed we shouldn't follow it. I think the amount of taxes we pay will also depend on our capacity. I never been forced to pay my tax, I guess that is because I am only earning less and I don't work in a formal company. I am just another freelancer though there might be indirect taxes like when I trade my crypto or buy something but those amounts are not really alarming.Like you said tax still helps to improve our country. Let's only hope that officials that handles it are not corrupt but it's also our fault if we vote the wrong person.
Once again, this depends on our individual perspectives and the country we reside in. In countries with stable political conditions and effective governance, this is not a significant issue. The flow of funds is transparent and well-directed. Taxpayers would feel content because public services align with the tax revenues collected. However, in countries with high levels of corruption, it only breeds social resentment, making tax payment less appealing.
July 02, 2023, 11:42:19 PM
It's just a hypothetical question and says nothing about me. I decided to open thread with this question for a lot of reasons which I'll explain down below.
If you think about inflation, taxes and your salary at the same time, you'll understand how the government eats you alive. Let's start with the fact that იf you live in Europe and have a normal salary, you have to leave almost half of it in taxes. Then, when you want to go for shopping and buy something in store, including food, clothes, technics, etc, you have pay your taxes of those items with already taxed money. Then, the store owner has to pay taxes of the income his store generated. Distributors, who deliver things to these stores, have to pay taxes too. Then there are vehicle taxes, property taxes. So, absolutely everything is taxed and on top of that, our salary is taxed and even on top of that, we experience inflation. This is not fair!
So, my legitimate question is, after all the robbery, a person, who doesn't pay taxes, is a bad person for the society or not? More likely I want to get answer from those whose countries have a model similar of European healthcare and employment insurance.
If you look at this problem not from the point of view of a private man in the street, but more globally, then it must be recognized that taxes in any state are necessary to fill the budget and finance them for social needs, national projects, and so on. If everyone evades paying taxes, the state will go bankrupt, which means that state employees will not receive salaries: doctors, teachers, military.If you think about inflation, taxes and your salary at the same time, you'll understand how the government eats you alive. Let's start with the fact that იf you live in Europe and have a normal salary, you have to leave almost half of it in taxes. Then, when you want to go for shopping and buy something in store, including food, clothes, technics, etc, you have pay your taxes of those items with already taxed money. Then, the store owner has to pay taxes of the income his store generated. Distributors, who deliver things to these stores, have to pay taxes too. Then there are vehicle taxes, property taxes. So, absolutely everything is taxed and on top of that, our salary is taxed and even on top of that, we experience inflation. This is not fair!
So, my legitimate question is, after all the robbery, a person, who doesn't pay taxes, is a bad person for the society or not? More likely I want to get answer from those whose countries have a model similar of European healthcare and employment insurance.
If there are excesses in increasing the number of taxes or their size, then this must be dealt with in a different way. The people elect the government and officials must be accountable to the people. This problem needs to be solved legally.
July 02, 2023, 11:36:50 PM
We are all the same; everything pays taxes, and it is your duty as a citizen of your country no matter what. Don't compare yourself to bad guys that are doing bad things because they are not helping your country. The real purpose of this is to improve your country and help it by paying taxes. Though I know that you are struggling to pay it, we don't have a choice because if you don't do it, you'll be facing legal problems, so it is better to pay it.
Given that there are bad guys, then it means not all are the same. Those bad guys can evade tax but there are consequences about it so indeed we shouldn't follow it. I think the amount of taxes we pay will also depend on our capacity. I never been forced to pay my tax, I guess that is because I am only earning less and I don't work in a formal company. I am just another freelancer though there might be indirect taxes like when I trade my crypto or buy something but those amounts are not really alarming.Like you said tax still helps to improve our country. Let's only hope that officials that handles it are not corrupt but it's also our fault if we vote the wrong person.
July 02, 2023, 09:30:32 AM
So, my legitimate question is, after all the robbery, a person, who doesn't pay taxes, is a bad person for the society or not? More likely I want to get answer from those whose countries have a model similar of European healthcare and employment insurance.
The tax system in every country has the same pattern, namely paying for certain goods or possessions. But to answer you are evil or not personally even the fact that I also avoid it. What's more, I don't have anything so precious. It's just that as citizens and have rules, taxes are still mandatory for anyone depending on the amount owned. Usually when we buy certain items, the amount that has been set includes the percentage of taxes and so on. The state regulates the percentage in such a way that its citizens do not feel burdened if they have to include the total amount. 
July 02, 2023, 08:32:30 AM
I recently started a thread in which I posed the question of how I might avoid having to declare and pay taxes for my Bitcoin in the event that I ever decided to convert it to a fiat currency. The concept of taxes is quite complicated; some countries have excessive taxation, but it's put to good use for healthcare, infrastructure, education, and generally to provide better living conditions for their citizens. In some other countries, though, such as the Balkan ones, including Greece, the excessive taxation cannot be justified because the majority of public services that were mentioned earlier are malfunctioning.
For instance, we're paying huge amounts in road and fuel taxes, but our road infrastructure is mediocre to bad, to say the least, not to mention our healthcare. Thus, no, I wouldn't feel bad if I found a loophole to avoid paying taxes on my cryptocurrencies, for instance. Not only is taxation so high on necessary goods and groceries, but inflation, which has also skyrocketed, has rendered living unbearable. It's not only about cheating the government that disfavored us; it's about survival and striving for a quality life.
For instance, we're paying huge amounts in road and fuel taxes, but our road infrastructure is mediocre to bad, to say the least, not to mention our healthcare. Thus, no, I wouldn't feel bad if I found a loophole to avoid paying taxes on my cryptocurrencies, for instance. Not only is taxation so high on necessary goods and groceries, but inflation, which has also skyrocketed, has rendered living unbearable. It's not only about cheating the government that disfavored us; it's about survival and striving for a quality life.
July 02, 2023, 08:21:58 AM
So, my legitimate question is, after all the robbery, a person, who doesn't pay taxes, is a bad person for the society or not? More likely I want to get answer from those whose countries have a model similar of European healthcare and employment insurance.
In general a person that doesn't pay taxes is a bad person, because he uses the free services the government offers us like infrastructure and healthcare and doesn't help to finance it. If someone does it over a longer period of time in large scale he could even go to prison for it. But in most cases it's not that east to cheat the government out of its money. At least in my country the employer directly pays taxes and healthcare out of my salary, so there is no real option to hold the money back. When it comes to investment income it's a bit easier to try and avoid paying taxes, but I don't think it's worth the risk to get fined by the government. These fines have a huge interest and if we don't have the money anymore we could be stuck in debt for a long time. In case we are happy with our schools, public transportation, hospitals and doctors than I don't think we should try and trick the government out of our tax income.
July 02, 2023, 07:17:52 AM
We all the different beliefs. I have nothing for those people that do not want to pay taxes because of their principles. But those rich people and huge companies that are generating huge profits but still doing tax evasions should be penalized.
In my case, I came from a very corrupt country. I also felt like the tax is not worth it since our corrupt officials and oligarchs are the ones benefitting. Aside from our regular tax deductions twice every month, there is also the yearly income tax and the most painful additional tax is our Value-Added Tax which is another additional 12% of the normal cost of our goods and services.
In my case, I came from a very corrupt country. I also felt like the tax is not worth it since our corrupt officials and oligarchs are the ones benefitting. Aside from our regular tax deductions twice every month, there is also the yearly income tax and the most painful additional tax is our Value-Added Tax which is another additional 12% of the normal cost of our goods and services.
July 02, 2023, 07:08:20 AM
So, my legitimate question is, after all the robbery, a person, who doesn't pay taxes, is a bad person for the society or not? More likely I want to get answer from those whose countries have a model similar of European healthcare and employment insurance.
If seen from the legal view, of course avoiding taxes is a crime from disobedience to the regulations applied which is the obligation of the community itself, but usually there are certain levels of income to say someone has the obligation to pay taxes.I am more inclined to support the government in this matter, although it has become a dilemma for myself, but with a note that the results of the tax that are applied to every community is well managed for development and development in the country itself, after all it will also be something that useful for us and our descendants in the future.
July 02, 2023, 06:44:57 AM
So, my legitimate question is, after all the robbery, a person, who doesn't pay taxes, is a bad person for the society or not? More likely I want to get answer from those whose countries have a model similar of European healthcare and employment insurance.
I believe paying taxes is our fundamental civic duty. Taxes are indispensable for maintaining and enhancing infrastructure and various public services including security, health care and many mores. They play a crucial role to finance all these services for overall benefit of the society. However, it is the responsibility of the government to ensure a fair tax system for all segments of the society. Moreover, it is vital to utilize tax revenue in a way that every penny is spent wisely and efficiently.
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