[AMC]-The Official Active Mining Cooperative Discussion - page 88.

kslaughter

sr. member

Activity: 476

Merit: 250

Quote from: Birdy on June 28, 2013, 09:34:48 AM

So, basically this is a 1 million $ loan and the interest rate is in 10% royalties.
No thanks, I will pass.
I don't think risk/reward are fairly shared here.

The difference is if it was a loan you would only get the 10% on the balance of the loan. With the 10% royalty you get the NRE paid back and you still get 10% on all the sales. This is a big difference.

ChronoX5

member

Activity: 72

Merit: 10

Quote from: Birdy on June 28, 2013, 09:34:48 AM

So, basically this is a 1 million $ loan and the interest rate is in 10% royalties.
No thanks, I will pass.
I don't think risk/reward are fairly shared here.

I think you are missing the point where VMC provides their miners at production cost to AMC. That's the biggest benefit in my opinion.

lewicki

sr. member

Activity: 294

Merit: 250

Quote from: Birdy on June 28, 2013, 09:34:48 AM

So, basically this is a 1 million $ loan and the interest rate is in 10% royalties.
No thanks, I will pass.
I don't think risk/reward are fairly shared here.

Plus the dividends for 20,000 avalon chips, 300GH from klondikes, and at cost first in line new VMC miners.

Birdy

sr. member

Activity: 364

Merit: 250

So, basically this is a 1 million $ loan and the interest rate is in 10% royalties.
No thanks, I will pass.
I don't think risk/reward are fairly shared here.

Vbs

hero member

Activity: 504

Merit: 500

Quote from: lysr on June 28, 2013, 09:30:33 AM

Price has been dropping. If Ken is unable to meet the budget to fund his own VMC, he might lower the price again and again until 0.0008 which is the minimum price point he promised. I won't be surprised he would even break his promise as he had done that before. Good luck to all AMC shareholders.

The funding for the chip is already guaranteed, thanks to the initial shareholders (revenue from bought hardware) and current sales so far.

Quote from: Vbs on June 28, 2013, 05:52:29 AM

Quote from: grimholt on June 28, 2013, 02:24:18 AM

.0025 Shares sold on Bifunder: 432,649
.0025 Shares sold on BTC-TC: 511,678
Total: 944,327

944323/4000000 = 0.23608075 = ~23.6 % funded

Thanks!

The raised capital from those is already more than enough. Even if not a single more share is sold, and considering tough difficulty estimates, the revenue from the incoming hardware (especially the 20.000 Avalon chips) is more than enough to put AMC above the $1M mark (see last row).

Vbs

hero member

Activity: 504

Merit: 500

Quote from: lysr on June 28, 2013, 09:27:16 AM

I don't get the part AMC is using its shareholder's money to fund the project of VMC and only get 10% royalty in return.

No, AMC is loaning $1M to VMC to pay for the NRE costs. That $1M is completely recovered by AMC at the expense of VMC forfeiting 100% chip sales profits to AMC, until that $1M is returned.

Only then AMC gets 10% royalty.

Overall, AMC gets a "free" NRE and 10% royalty from there on.

lysr

member

Activity: 161

Merit: 11

Price has been dropping. If Ken is unable to meet the budget to fund his own VMC, he might lower the price again and again until 0.0008 which is the minimum price point he promised. I won't be surprised he would even break his promise as he had done that before. Good luck to all AMC shareholders.

lysr

member

Activity: 161

Merit: 11

I don't get the part AMC is using its shareholder's money to fund the project of VMC and only get 10% royalty in return.

Vbs

hero member

Activity: 504

Merit: 500

Quote from: ?? on ??

Learn how CafePress works before you post more shits on the matter.

There is no proof whatsoever eASIC ever heard of AMC or is about to make chips for AMC, VMC or whatever. The news is as valuable as me saying
AMD or Intel will be designing my own ASIC chips.

Quote from: Vbs on June 27, 2013, 06:00:27 PM

we are going with eASIC

Prove it.

You are asking the wrong questions. When you invest into something, you have to value the entry price vs risk/reward.

When I bought my first AMC shares at 0.0005, there was no hardware delivered, only a promise of 6 avalons. Thus, the price reflected the risk then. From there on, many more hardware has been purchased, and the 6 avalons delivered, so the risk gets smaller.

What you are asking is "Is the 0.0025 price justified at the current risk?". Maybe not for you. Maybe it can only be justified for you after there is an official PR from eASIC. Everyone values risk differently.

Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: Vbs on June 27, 2013, 06:13:08 PM

eASIC Announces easicopy™ ASIC

(...)

Do you see any mention of AMC, VMC, kslaughter, Bitcoin mining or something along those lines? It is just generic corporate news, dumbfuck.

That post was about the validity of the easicopy process, and how it enables a seamless transition to cheaper and more efficient chips.

If you do not believe AMC is getting eASIC to do the chips, then do not buy AMC at the current price point/risk. Define what risk you choose to accept first.

lewicki

sr. member

Activity: 294

Merit: 250

Quote from: ?? on ??

Bitcoin Megastore is a store opened on official CafePress website. CafePress is company in Print-On-Demand business for 14 years now. Learn
who is who there and what are responsibilities of parties involved before you post more shit. Like many other retards around here, you are attempting
to discredit me and thus eventualy discredit my valid concerns on AMC and VMC shits. Problem there is you picked absolutely wrong matter on which
one might discredit me.

What are you arguing about? I conceded the point about your particular case. Recognize that all new companies without any previous trust that has been gained through affiliating themselves with some other entitity that has trust, has to gain said trust on their own. And to do that, they need customers to place faith in said company.

I never discredited you. I was using what I thought was a company that seemed to be generating business in the traditional sense.

lewicki

sr. member

Activity: 294

Merit: 250

Quote from: ?? on ??

Learn how CafePress works before you post more shits on the matter.

Insert any bitcoin store that runs a business in the traditional sense then. There will always be a first customer that has to place faith in a company delivering.

What's with the language?

lewicki

sr. member

Activity: 294

Merit: 250

Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: FloatesMcgoates on June 27, 2013, 05:51:40 PM

Quote from: stereotype on June 27, 2013, 05:46:50 PM

That was not the reaction i was expecting on the order books. Seems to be a stunned calm at the mo, not knowing what to make of it, and/or taking it in. Huh

The news on the chips seems to have been exactly what people were suspecting, so the effect the news had on the share price had already been factored in at this point.

There is no proof whatsoever that chips will be made yet people are buying shares, what a fucked up world.

Was there no proof that your Bitcoin store would ship merchandise when you opened it either? I'm not sure what you are trying to say.

How does one get proof of a chip being built when they are actively trying to raise funds to do so?

Vbs

hero member

Activity: 504

Merit: 500

Quote from: stereotype on June 28, 2013, 08:03:40 AM

Seems to be .0022/23 currently. If you're right, im thinking .0018 or/and then, .0014

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.2602610

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.2602698

stereotype

legendary

Activity: 1554

Merit: 1000

Quote from: ThickAsThieves on June 28, 2013, 07:52:14 AM

Quote from: ChefBorjan on June 28, 2013, 03:14:54 AM

I'm curious, when do people think the undercutting will stop and more importantly why?

Still, the good news to take is that a sizable portion of the released 2 million have been eaten into and its only been a couple of days. Lets just hope the momentum can continue...

It will end when every smart investor has sold the shares purchased for < 25. Whatever the new price consolidates at after that, will be the price Ken lowers his shares on offer to.

Seems to be .0022/23 currently. If you're right, im thinking .0018 or/and then, .0014

ThickAsThieves

hero member

Activity: 518

Merit: 500

Quote from: ChefBorjan on June 28, 2013, 03:14:54 AM

I'm curious, when do people think the undercutting will stop and more importantly why?

Still, the good news to take is that a sizable portion of the released 2 million have been eaten into and its only been a couple of days. Lets just hope the momentum can continue...

It will end when every smart investor has sold the shares purchased for < 25. Whatever the new price consolidates at after that, will be the price Ken lowers his shares on offer to.

chsados

hero member

Activity: 662

Merit: 545

Quote from: FNG on June 28, 2013, 06:50:57 AM

Quote from: ChronoX5 on June 28, 2013, 04:47:37 AM

Quote from: ChefBorjan on June 28, 2013, 03:14:54 AM

I'm curious, when do people think the undercutting will stop and more importantly why?

Still, the good news to take is that a sizable portion of the released 2 million have been eaten into and its only been a couple of days. Lets just hope the momentum can continue...

It would be helpful if Bitcoin wouldn't tank right now. I think AMC will remain fairly stable for the next few weeks but the BTC/$ course might still drop, so there's no reason to invest.

Here's a thought...Bitcoin is going down because bitcoin is flooding into AMC which is being dumped on the market for cash.

Just a thought...

Delusional...

Vbs

hero member

Activity: 504

Merit: 500

Some more information about eASIC:

"eASIC's vision and technology": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aQsvbvv2Dww&hd=1

"The Big eASY, eASIC Debuts 45nm FPGA Killer", a 2008 article that explains very well their eCell design, please read it attentively: http://www.eejournal.com/archives/articles/20080805_easy/

"The devices use a logic cell structure that is analogous to the LUT fabric of an FPGA, but programming is accomplished by a “configurable via” that bridges between routing metal layers. Since this is a single mask layer, there is very little cost or risk involved in programming/customizing the devices. Furthermore, in early production, the via layer can be programmed via e-beam, allowing for very small (as in 1 unit) production runs. The company can easily produce a wafer with many designs from different companies, so there is no “minimum quantity” issue for setting up the fabrication process."

ninjaboon

legendary

Activity: 2128

Merit: 1002

Quote from: FNG on June 28, 2013, 06:50:57 AM

Quote from: ChronoX5 on June 28, 2013, 04:47:37 AM

Quote from: ChefBorjan on June 28, 2013, 03:14:54 AM

I'm curious, when do people think the undercutting will stop and more importantly why?
Still, the good news to take is that a sizable portion of the released 2 million have been eaten into and its only been a couple of days. Lets just hope the momentum can continue...

It would be helpful if Bitcoin wouldn't tank right now. I think AMC will remain fairly stable for the next few weeks but the BTC/$ course might still drop, so there's no reason to invest.

Here's a thought...Bitcoin is going down because bitcoin is flooding into AMC which is being dumped on the market for cash.
Just a thought...

I thought BTC price was lower due to all the DDOS attacks
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.2589301

ninjaboon

legendary

Activity: 2128

Merit: 1002

Quote from: Exocyst on June 28, 2013, 06:29:07 AM

I want to know more about eASIC. How do they perform their simulations? Can we see some of the 16 GH/s results? I don't ask these questions out of skepticism. I ask out of enthusiasm. A little bit of evidence could re-energize shareholders and draw in new investment. Also, does AMC have some sort of exclusive arrangement with eASIC?, in other words, eASIC won't develop hashing chips for other miners while under contract with AMC? Or at least AMC's design would be proprietary? Anything about these potential partners would be helpful.

I've known Ken for some time now and didn't know eASIC was working with them (AMC+VMC). All the best to them in this endeavor.

Vbs

hero member

Activity: 504

Merit: 500

Quote from: Exocyst on June 28, 2013, 06:29:07 AM

I want to know more about eASIC. How do they perform their simulations? Can we see some of the 16 GH/s results? I don't ask these questions out of skepticism. I ask out of enthusiasm. A little bit of evidence could re-energize shareholders and draw in new investment. Also, does AMC have some sort of exclusive arrangement with eASIC?, in other words, eASIC won't develop hashing chips for other miners while under contract with AMC? Or at least AMC's design would be proprietary? Anything about these potential partners would be helpful.

You are correct, the more released information, the better.

Simulations take a few days to run, and should be pretty accurate, due to the way the chip structure is already built (this is not a fully custom design, just using a custom metal layer on standardized logic circuits, their "eCells").

I'm sure they'll do a press release after the first part of the NRE is paid.

I'm not sure about the exclusivity for all chips (there's still an NDA in place), but yes, AMC's design is proprietary, so no one else gets that.

Topic: [AMC]-The Official Active Mining Cooperative Discussion - page 88. (Read 223316 times)