AMHash1: Cost-Effective Mining Contract - page 164.

ThunderSheep

member

Activity: 88

Merit: 10

The sheep who walks through walls.

Quote from: zefir on October 28, 2014, 05:34:10 AM

1) IPO price
Prospectus says 1.25 mBTC, while price displayed at IPO order is 1.3 mBTC. Is this a rounding error, or do you adapt the price towards $0.5?

The price is rounded to 0.0013 because of the 4 decimal places displayed. If you look at the asset overview, you'll see that the last trade was 0.00125.

Edit: It's probably time for Havelock to add a couple of decimal places to their display. Their own offering appears to be worth nothing.

hashie

full member

Activity: 322

Merit: 100

DATABLOCKCHAIN.IO SALE IS LIVE | MVP @ DBC.IO

Quote from: newzhj on October 27, 2014, 06:57:50 PM

I am Chinese user ，forum should request, the following text use Baidu translation:

Glad to see also AMhash contract in the domestic forum, but most of the customers have doubts about compulsory repurchase, we want to know what is your starting point to make such a statement?

Doubts are as follows:

In the calculation of force began to take effect within 45 days of the company's right to roast the cat (the sale price - pay income) 120% buy back price of all stress, repurchase notification shall be 3 days in advance notice.
This TM is too pit, if the money up, grilled cat repurchase is force; if the currency price, roast cat let user shall bear the losses, is that what you mean?

Web site: http://www.cybtc.com/article-1443-1.html

Grilled cat isn't going to arbitrary buyback during the early IPO period. There will only be a buyback if something changes.

-Sahra

zefir

donator

Activity: 919

Merit: 1000

Quote from: Dexter770221 on October 28, 2014, 03:37:57 AM

Spread hashrate sounds like good idea to minimize bad luck (and decentralize bitcoin network) but it still will be existent. Do you plan to have some buffer in case that income < calculated payout?
Mentioned pools have merged altcoin mining enabled. What will happen with that altcoins?

The payout calculation based on theoretical income (100% PPS after deducting upkeep cost) is the best possible and most fair one for the buyer, since it shifts all potential risk to operator. If you ever ran in situations where your mining rig idled over a longer period of time (pool DDoS'd, ISP down, PSU shutdown) or you sent your shares for days to a pool that suffered a withholding attack, you'll know how preferable this offer is (or why PPS pools used to have fees in the 5% range). Even if there was some potential to earn 1-2% on altcoins (no idea what they are worth meanwhile), I think it is not enough to compensate the involved risks.

@amhash: could you please comment on the following points:
1) IPO price
Prospectus says 1.25 mBTC, while price displayed at IPO order is 1.3 mBTC. Is this a rounding error, or do you adapt the price towards $0.5?
2) exchange risk
Would it be possible to move AMHash shares into some external vault (like done with AM direct shares)?
3) volume discount
Given the fair pricing, this might sound shameless but worth trying: do you offer discounts for larger block buys (like what we had with AM IPO)?

Thanks.

trek27

full member

Activity: 172

Merit: 100

Quote from: NotLambchop on October 27, 2014, 02:19:20 PM

Quote from: trek27 on October 27, 2014, 10:41:26 AM

...
I can give two examples of publicly available contracts ...

Could you answer the original question? Which contract were you invested in and when did you purchase it?
thx.

Sorry, everything I could say about this is in the previous post.

Dexter770221

legendary

Activity: 1029

Merit: 1000

Quote from: amhash on October 27, 2014, 11:26:52 PM

1. not solo mine, AMHash will also mine in BTCguild, Ghash or other pools;
2.mining in which pool will not affect investors' profit, AMHash will pay them on theory calculation.

Spread hashrate sounds like good idea to minimize bad luck (and decentralize bitcoin network) but it still will be existent. Do you plan to have some buffer in case that income < calculated payout?
Mentioned pools have merged altcoin mining enabled. What will happen with that altcoins?

amhash

full member

Activity: 129

Merit: 100

Quote from: Dexter770221 on October 27, 2014, 07:32:12 AM

Which pool is/will be used? Or maybe solo mine?

1. not solo mine, AMHash will also mine in BTCguild, Ghash or other pools;
2.mining in which pool will not affect investors' profit, AMHash will pay them on theory calculation.

Blazed

legendary

Activity: 2128

Merit: 1119

Quote from: xhomerx10 on October 27, 2014, 08:29:29 PM

Quote from: newzhj on October 27, 2014, 06:57:50 PM

I am Chinese user ，forum should request, the following text use Baidu translation:

Glad to see also AMhash contract in the domestic forum, but most of the customers have doubts about compulsory repurchase, we want to know what is your starting point to make such a statement?

Doubts are as follows:

In the calculation of force began to take effect within 45 days of the company's right to roast the cat (the sale price - pay income) 120% buy back price of all stress, repurchase notification shall be 3 days in advance notice.
This TM is too pit, if the money up, grilled cat repurchase is force; if the currency price, roast cat let user shall bear the losses, is that what you mean?

Web site: http://www.cybtc.com/article-1443-1.html

This is a good question. I think this is a standard buy-back clause which would allow them to buy back the shares should the need arise. Imagine that there might be an unscrupulous person in the Bitcoin world (I know this is hard to imagine... please play along) who would buy up all the shares and rebrand the operation in order to expand their own enterprise. Maybe Sam Cole needs to add some inexpensive hashing power to one of his many Datorhalls, or maybe Sonny Vleisides and Josh Zerlan are looking to bring some innovation to BFL (lord knows they could use some inexpensive innovation right about now), or maybe Creativex aka Eric Corlew is looking to make a come-back with bASIC-mining so he can repay his shareholders (hey, we can dream)... Anyway, AMHash could then buy back the shares and regain control of their own operation. I realize these are rather extreme examples but as you can see, it protects AMHash as well as the shareholders. These are bargain basement prices for hashing power and maintenance fees. I would not be surprised at all if someone would try to exploit this offering in such a way but I do not believe that the clause is there to take advantage of AMHash shareholders.

lol what? The buyers will not have access to the hashing power...they just get divs from it. Never mind...just go buy a bunch of shares and profit Cheesy

xhomerx10

legendary

Activity: 3808

Merit: 7912

Quote from: newzhj on October 27, 2014, 06:57:50 PM

I am Chinese user ，forum should request, the following text use Baidu translation:

Glad to see also AMhash contract in the domestic forum, but most of the customers have doubts about compulsory repurchase, we want to know what is your starting point to make such a statement?

Doubts are as follows:

In the calculation of force began to take effect within 45 days of the company's right to roast the cat (the sale price - pay income) 120% buy back price of all stress, repurchase notification shall be 3 days in advance notice.
This TM is too pit, if the money up, grilled cat repurchase is force; if the currency price, roast cat let user shall bear the losses, is that what you mean?

Web site: http://www.cybtc.com/article-1443-1.html

This is a good question. I think this is a standard buy-back clause which would allow them to buy back the shares should the need arise. Imagine that there might be an unscrupulous person in the Bitcoin world (I know this is hard to imagine... please play along) who would buy up all the shares and rebrand the operation in order to expand their own enterprise. Maybe Sam Cole needs to add some inexpensive hashing power to one of his many Datorhalls, or maybe Sonny Vleisides and Josh Zerlan are looking to bring some innovation to BFL (lord knows they could use some inexpensive innovation right about now), or maybe Creativex aka Eric Corlew is looking to make a come-back with bASIC-mining so he can repay his shareholders (hey, we can dream)... Anyway, AMHash could then buy back the shares and regain control of their own operation. I realize these are rather extreme examples but as you can see, it protects AMHash as well as the shareholders. These are bargain basement prices for hashing power and maintenance fees. I would not be surprised at all if someone would try to exploit this offering in such a way but I do not believe that the clause is there to take advantage of AMHash shareholders.

newzhj

newbie

Activity: 18

Merit: 0

I am Chinese user ，forum should request, the following text use Baidu translation:

Glad to see also AMhash contract in the domestic forum, but most of the customers have doubts about compulsory repurchase, we want to know what is your starting point to make such a statement?

Doubts are as follows:

In the calculation of force began to take effect within 45 days of the company's right to roast the cat (the sale price - pay income) 120% buy back price of all stress, repurchase notification shall be 3 days in advance notice.
This TM is too pit, if the money up, grilled cat repurchase is force; if the currency price, roast cat let user shall bear the losses, is that what you mean?

Web site: http://www.cybtc.com/article-1443-1.html

NotLambchop

sr. member

Activity: 378

Merit: 254

Quote from: trek27 on October 27, 2014, 10:41:26 AM

...
I can give two examples of publicly available contracts ...

Could you answer the original question? Which contract were you invested in and when did you purchase it?
thx.

TheFuneral

sr. member

Activity: 356

Merit: 250

What happens if the IPO doesn't sell out?

trek27

full member

Activity: 172

Merit: 100

Quote from: Blazed on October 27, 2014, 08:41:43 AM

Quote from: NotLambchop on October 27, 2014, 07:00:03 AM

Quote from: trek27 on October 27, 2014, 02:50:59 AM

...Some time ago I bought cloud mining contract that already returned above ROI and is still paying...

Could you be specific? What contracts, when bought.
thx

Yes do tell...as I have never seen one that did well. It must be a private setup?

I can give two examples of publicly available contracts with which it was possible to ROI (in coins terms). One is mining bitcoins and it's PBMining - if bought in February it'd be already positive. Second is mining altcoins and it's LTCGear - the best time to buy them was at the time they allegedly deployed new chips (around July).
However, I don't have 'smoking gun' evidence of legitimacy in both cases.
In PBMining case positive ROI if calculated as of today in fiat would require successful hedging of your investment and would be more difficult to achieve.

hdbuck

legendary

Activity: 1260

Merit: 1002

cex.io rate = 0,0026 BTC/Gh Shocked

imho AMhash is the best rate available on the market (0,00125BTC/Gh).

+ FCs risk control seems quite fair for potential investors:

Quote

Risk control
1. Before IPO closes, ASICMiner has the right to buy back at the price of IPO price * 100.5%.
2. During the first 45 days after IPO closes, ASICMiner has the right to buy back at the price of (IPO price - total payouts) * 120%. The notification period is 3 days.
3. If the delay of payment happens, all unpaid payments will be accounted separately on daily basis and increase by 0.02% per day(flat rate based on the initial unpaid payment amount, no compound rate) after three days.

so one should buy IPO, get first 20 days or so of divs and then short: PROFIT.

Blazed

legendary

Activity: 2128

Merit: 1119

Quote from: NotLambchop on October 27, 2014, 07:00:03 AM

Quote from: trek27 on October 27, 2014, 02:50:59 AM

...Some time ago I bought cloud mining contract that already returned above ROI and is still paying...

Could you be specific? What contracts, when bought.
thx

Yes do tell...as I have never seen one that did well. It must be a private setup?

ujka

hero member

Activity: 630

Merit: 500

Quote from: Dexter770221 on October 27, 2014, 07:32:12 AM

Which pool is/will be used? Or maybe solo mine?

I'm interested in that, too.

They say that (quote from havelock page):

Quote

...hashrate monitor platform will be provided and fully disclosed

And I would like to see the bitcoin mining address, also.

There was some speculation about address 1GcF7j3YH8Qs8hvNEe7zbrQZftMU6sRLfu being their solo mine (https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.9305327).
amhash answer: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.9310661

Dexter770221

legendary

Activity: 1029

Merit: 1000

Which pool is/will be used? Or maybe solo mine?

NotLambchop

sr. member

Activity: 378

Merit: 254

Quote from: trek27 on October 27, 2014, 02:50:59 AM

...Some time ago I bought cloud mining contract that already returned above ROI and is still paying...

Could you be specific? What contracts, when bought.
thx

trek27

full member

Activity: 172

Merit: 100

Quote from: Blazed on October 27, 2014, 12:31:07 AM

I do not think anyone has trust issues with AM or RM (both companies are legit). Everyone knows that these types of investments NEVER make the buyer a profit...only the issuer. You guys have a lower cost for maintenance, but it still will not return a positive ROI.

Not so sure. Timing is key. Some time ago I bought cloud mining contract that already returned above ROI and is still paying. However, predicting future difficulty is a very tricky task and being consistently right would probably require either crystal ball or "Back To The Future" Almanach.

As for AMhash. Buying it is similarly cost effective as buying Prismas - details varying on specific individual cases. It could give positive ROI (though probably not that much).

From a perspective of AM shareholder situation is a bit different because buying AMhash helps AM to resurface as successful operation. So, an AM shareholder buying AMhash while retaining realistic chance to earn a few coins effectively gives AM a hand. Frankly, the last conclusion increases my personal risk tolerance.

Blazed

legendary

Activity: 2128

Merit: 1119

Quote from: amhash on October 26, 2014, 11:54:45 PM

Update

Q1. AMHash1 price is so competitive, why still sold slowly?
A1: Distrust, some people don't believe cloud ming when they hurt by someone, the other people just suspect cost control of AMHASH.We are company established for long term , people know who we are and where we live; AM found some partners who hold very vey low electricity power factories.

Q2. When will the contract start?
A2:Contract will start on 31st Oct, investors will get payment from that day.

Q3.How can AMHash and HAVELOCK supply more trust, how can u let people trust no gather capital and run away?
A3: AMHash will leave bitcoins on platform for dividends, and HAVELOCK will be the third party to monitor and operate the dividends.

I do not think anyone has trust issues with AM or RM (both companies are legit). Everyone knows that these types of investments NEVER make the buyer a profit...only the issuer. You guys have a lower cost for maintenance, but it still will not return a positive ROI.

amhash

full member

Activity: 129

Merit: 100

Update

Q1. AMHash1 price is so competitive, why still sold slowly?
A1: Distrust, some people don't believe cloud ming when they hurt by someone, the other people just suspect cost control of AMHASH.We are company established for long term , people know who we are and where we live; AM found some partners who hold very vey low electricity power factories.

Q2. When will the contract start?
A2:Contract will start on 31st Oct, investors will get payment from that day.

Q3.How can AMHash and HAVELOCK supply more trust, how can u let people trust no gather capital and run away?
A3: AMHash will leave bitcoins on platform for dividends, and HAVELOCK will be the third party to monitor and operate the dividends.

Topic: AMHash1: Cost-Effective Mining Contract - page 164. (Read 304259 times)