Topic: [ANN] [888] [SCRYPT] OctoCoin ◦ The Power of Eight ◦ Don't Blink - page 17. (Read 297651 times)
January 31, 2015, 10:35:41 AM
January 31, 2015, 10:15:40 AM
I have skimmed through proof of burn before, yes. No, I did no read it again.
As for how easy it is, if you know about it then awesome!
I'm telling you, as far as some of the tech side, I am very limited. I can usually do things when I follow instructions but I'm telling you I'm no dev and i hate reading code. I usually relied on Joshycoin for the more technical stuff. Or I would follow posts where people were arguing different sides of the technical stuff.
If you and others are confident that we can officially burn octocoin to a non spendable address, then I'm all for it. It makes it so we don't have to spend the money on assistance from another party i'm all for it. Besides technical assistance the thing you get from vennd is a well-known name you can pitch around in the media.
On the crowd-sale front. Vennd makes the vending machine so that you can install it on your web site and accept Bitcoin payments from Counterwallet and it returns a Counterparty asset to that address. The awesome thing is, it's open source so you can install the basic vending machine on your own, you can edit the code for more features on your own and if you don't know crap or need assistance you can pay vennd.io to do it for you or for assistance.
I was coming at this from a purely, i don't know shit about code, i will pay for the assistance and media attention vennd would bring. But we don't have to do that. If we have knowledgable people here that can implement what we want and we trust them and we even want to pay them in bitcoin or the new octoparty, then we could do that and do it a lot cheaper.
Thanks for your response Squids. I'm glad you understand the burn feature. I was hoping the more guys here read into it somebody would.
I think after re-thinking what Derek from ScotCoin and I talked about on Skype, he may have meant the burned it for real to a unspendable address. I was thinking that he meant they didn't because they scrapped the blockchain. But for us, we cannot do that unless we control the blockchain. And, do we really need that? If we only have a small % of users participating in the burn I would guess no. I do think that it would be important to truly burn the coins so they cannot be spent. I think that it means more when we take the mining and bitcoin we spent and even though we aren't listed, we all know that at one point we had some value holding octocoin. So the only true way to transfer that value and also to ensure that nobody holds on to private keys in case octocoin blockchain starts up again, is to burn.
The post I made, I did say burn, so I see why you responded that way. I should have chose better wording to separate the other idea of simply doing a trade, not a burn, to an address that nobody would use. I think that is a horrible idea and would tarnish switching to CP. If the original blockchain became something because Bholzer or any dev comes along and makes it something, and somebody cashes out the group of octocoins in those trade addresses, it would scream scam and the FUD and backlash would suck. Plus, if the original amount of octoparty created wasn't burned, i don't know that we could get other people invested in octoparty. I think most people would think, why am I paying you Bitcoin for an asset you created and distributed to your friends out of thin air. At least with a burn, we can say that all the first batch of octoparty distributed still comes from a burned alt that was mined and bought with Bitcoin. I know some may think that's semantics, but I do think that it can psychologically affect people's thought process. We don't want them to think it's a scam or a pump n dump. We want to have a good 1-3 projects lined up that will make the coin useful, give it value, possibly profit so you could pay a dividend, if we think that's a smart way to attract investors.
I'll go back and re-read the proof-of-burn even though that shit intimidates me
I hope that besides you Squids, that some more technically minded people read what you posted, and that if we feel comfortable doing it on our own, that we do it. I'm all for saving $1500 if we can do it right on our own.
As for how easy it is, if you know about it then awesome!
I'm telling you, as far as some of the tech side, I am very limited. I can usually do things when I follow instructions but I'm telling you I'm no dev and i hate reading code. I usually relied on Joshycoin for the more technical stuff. Or I would follow posts where people were arguing different sides of the technical stuff.
If you and others are confident that we can officially burn octocoin to a non spendable address, then I'm all for it. It makes it so we don't have to spend the money on assistance from another party i'm all for it. Besides technical assistance the thing you get from vennd is a well-known name you can pitch around in the media.
On the crowd-sale front. Vennd makes the vending machine so that you can install it on your web site and accept Bitcoin payments from Counterwallet and it returns a Counterparty asset to that address. The awesome thing is, it's open source so you can install the basic vending machine on your own, you can edit the code for more features on your own and if you don't know crap or need assistance you can pay vennd.io to do it for you or for assistance.
I was coming at this from a purely, i don't know shit about code, i will pay for the assistance and media attention vennd would bring. But we don't have to do that. If we have knowledgable people here that can implement what we want and we trust them and we even want to pay them in bitcoin or the new octoparty, then we could do that and do it a lot cheaper.
Thanks for your response Squids. I'm glad you understand the burn feature. I was hoping the more guys here read into it somebody would.
I think after re-thinking what Derek from ScotCoin and I talked about on Skype, he may have meant the burned it for real to a unspendable address. I was thinking that he meant they didn't because they scrapped the blockchain. But for us, we cannot do that unless we control the blockchain. And, do we really need that? If we only have a small % of users participating in the burn I would guess no. I do think that it would be important to truly burn the coins so they cannot be spent. I think that it means more when we take the mining and bitcoin we spent and even though we aren't listed, we all know that at one point we had some value holding octocoin. So the only true way to transfer that value and also to ensure that nobody holds on to private keys in case octocoin blockchain starts up again, is to burn.
The post I made, I did say burn, so I see why you responded that way. I should have chose better wording to separate the other idea of simply doing a trade, not a burn, to an address that nobody would use. I think that is a horrible idea and would tarnish switching to CP. If the original blockchain became something because Bholzer or any dev comes along and makes it something, and somebody cashes out the group of octocoins in those trade addresses, it would scream scam and the FUD and backlash would suck. Plus, if the original amount of octoparty created wasn't burned, i don't know that we could get other people invested in octoparty. I think most people would think, why am I paying you Bitcoin for an asset you created and distributed to your friends out of thin air. At least with a burn, we can say that all the first batch of octoparty distributed still comes from a burned alt that was mined and bought with Bitcoin. I know some may think that's semantics, but I do think that it can psychologically affect people's thought process. We don't want them to think it's a scam or a pump n dump. We want to have a good 1-3 projects lined up that will make the coin useful, give it value, possibly profit so you could pay a dividend, if we think that's a smart way to attract investors.
I'll go back and re-read the proof-of-burn even though that shit intimidates me
I hope that besides you Squids, that some more technically minded people read what you posted, and that if we feel comfortable doing it on our own, that we do it. I'm all for saving $1500 if we can do it right on our own. January 31, 2015, 09:31:17 AM
So, I talked to one of the guys from ScotCoin. They pretty much gutted their blockchain and turned it into a CP asset. He said they did their own burn without help from a third party. You just have to create a wallet and do all the work manually. So if a user has 20,000 octo they send it in to the burn address with their counterwallet address i'm assuming with an email and a screenshot of your balance.) and you just manually return the amount of your new CP asset.
We could do that probably pretty easy since we don't have a ton of people burning. It may take a team of us to to do it. But we would save $1500 that way.
We would still have to raise money for the crowd sale because I don't think we could manually process tons of orders in btc to sell the new Octo asset, plus you have to have media attention for that so you need another party that can get that for you.
One thing that made me think it would be better to burn the coins was the fact that we don't want FUD or the scam accusations. If someone came along and did something with the original blockchain you don't want one person or a team of people to have a wallet full of millions of octocoins to cash out with. So I was thinking we could do this: After the burn is complete, anyone who participates is emailed the .dat file with the public and private keys to the wallet. That way everyone has access to the wallet. Granted, someone could come and take off with all the octocoins in one transaction. But honestly, do we really expect anyone to come along and do something with octocoin?
So, do we burn ourselves for free? Or do we pay for legitimacy of vennd.io doing it? Does one really bring more legitimacy or does it really matter?
If you were a btc holder and had the chance to buy some coins for a project, would it make a difference about the coins already issued and how they were burned? Just something to think about.
We could do that probably pretty easy since we don't have a ton of people burning. It may take a team of us to to do it. But we would save $1500 that way.
We would still have to raise money for the crowd sale because I don't think we could manually process tons of orders in btc to sell the new Octo asset, plus you have to have media attention for that so you need another party that can get that for you.
One thing that made me think it would be better to burn the coins was the fact that we don't want FUD or the scam accusations. If someone came along and did something with the original blockchain you don't want one person or a team of people to have a wallet full of millions of octocoins to cash out with. So I was thinking we could do this: After the burn is complete, anyone who participates is emailed the .dat file with the public and private keys to the wallet. That way everyone has access to the wallet. Granted, someone could come and take off with all the octocoins in one transaction. But honestly, do we really expect anyone to come along and do something with octocoin?
So, do we burn ourselves for free? Or do we pay for legitimacy of vennd.io doing it? Does one really bring more legitimacy or does it really matter?
If you were a btc holder and had the chance to buy some coins for a project, would it make a difference about the coins already issued and how they were burned? Just something to think about.
Nobody should have access to the private key in the first place, it should be possible to create a burn address without ever knowing it's private key;
https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Proof_of_burn
i know that... i'm not talking about if we have someone who knows what they are doing do a burn.... i was talking about if we didn't pay $1500 to vennd.io and found a way to do it ourselves, which to my knowledge nobody here knows how to make a burn address....
pay attention to the differences i'm talking about. that whole paragraph was about NOT DOING A BURN and finding a way to trade out the coins like ScotCoin did.
if we don't want to spend money as some of you have clearly said you don't or won't, we can just trade them out manually. if we create a wallet with an address there will be a private key.
hence the reason you actually pay vennd the $1500 burn the coins instead... if nobody has a private key there's no room for someone to come back later with everyone's coins and dump them should the octocoin blockchain revive.
My point was we can spend money but we don't have to. And if there are very few participants then maybe there's no need in spending that money.
I was actually trying to help. I made a quick post in a rush with every intention of coming back later and pledging my full support for all of this so thanks for the shitty response.
Did you bother to read a few lines from the link I posted? If you did you'd have realised how easy it is to create a non-spendable address (i.e. WITHOUT A PRIVATE KEY BEING KNOWN TO ANYBODY). Once you have that everybody can confidently burn to that address and prove they did via a message in the wallet console;
So I did a little further research myself and using these articles;
http://earlz.net/view/2014/10/22/0340/provably-spendable-altcoin-burn-addresses
https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Technical_background_of_Bitcoin_addresses
http://bitcoin.stackexchange.com/questions/1851/how-to-generate-a-valid-bitcoin-address-for-destroying-bitcoins
plus looking at octocoin source and a few other references I created a python script to generate valid Octocoin addresses from a known pubkey hash for which nobody can have pre-determined the private key (as I understand it, if they can then bitcoin itself is broken);
Code:
#!/usr/bin/python
import base58
import hashlib
class SHA256:
new = hashlib.sha256
address_byte = "12"
ripemd160_pubkeyhash = "8888888888888888888888888888888888888888"
hexstring = address_byte + ripemd160_pubkeyhash
checksum = SHA256.new(SHA256.new(str(bytearray.fromhex( hexstring ))).digest()).hexdigest()[0:8]
string2encode = hexstring + checksum
burn_address = base58.b58encode(str(bytearray.fromhex(string2encode)))
print(burn_address)
You could either use the address as generated above (shown below) or you could have a bunch of community members post one or two hex chars each to form the 40 character ripemd160 pubkey hash used to generate the address.
Code:
sendtoaddress 8TXnBYf96LvSRZrLeuhyTKn7bgaMCAYxqr 1 "i just burnt this (SquidsIn)"
You could process these manually or semi-automatically using a block explorer to verify the amount sent and apportion the amount of OCTOPARTY at whatever the exchange rate is. The only trust required is that you will issue the OCTOPARTY, you certainly won't be able to pick up the 888 and spend it later and neither will anybody else.
My point was/is that you can do a burn yourself without paying anybody AND everybody can be absolutely confident that NOBODY has the private key for the burn address and those coins have been put beyond use regardless of what happens in the future.
There are two issues with any plan to burn at the moment;
1) AFAIK there is no active block explorer
2) The blockchain is hugely insecure, anybody with ~ 60Mh/s can take it over whilst you're mid-burn
The first could easily be resolved, the second would depend on how much hashing power we can collectively muster during the burn process.
January 30, 2015, 08:51:37 PM
January 30, 2015, 08:35:07 PM
January 30, 2015, 07:27:16 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LBBvay6n5kc
great video about Counterparty, vennd.io, swarm and different things you can do.
great video about Counterparty, vennd.io, swarm and different things you can do.
January 30, 2015, 07:19:31 PM
http://bravenewcoin.com/news/vennd-powers-next-gen-crowd-funding/
interesting article.. also explains how you can pay out dividends using CP. that is kinda interesting. you could pay out dividends in Bitcoin to holders of OCTOPARTY in any time frame... i believe even per transaction. of course you'd have to have profits to do that.. but interesting nonetheless. my guess for projects we are talking about doing you could be out quarterly, bi-annually or yearly, a certain % to all coin holders. the more coins you hold, the more of a dividend would be paid out to you. granted, most companies keep dividend % fairly small and there's risk with dividends when stock prices drop.
def a good read though.
interesting article.. also explains how you can pay out dividends using CP. that is kinda interesting. you could pay out dividends in Bitcoin to holders of OCTOPARTY in any time frame... i believe even per transaction. of course you'd have to have profits to do that.. but interesting nonetheless. my guess for projects we are talking about doing you could be out quarterly, bi-annually or yearly, a certain % to all coin holders. the more coins you hold, the more of a dividend would be paid out to you. granted, most companies keep dividend % fairly small and there's risk with dividends when stock prices drop.
def a good read though.
January 30, 2015, 07:09:33 PM
well, if we did a burn, the point is to move to the counterparty platform and run on the bitcoin blockchain.
the purpose of "burning" coins is sending them to an address that is not spendable in the future. once they are there nobody can come back to the octocoin blockchain even if someone picks it up and makes the original octocoin valuable. once they are locked into that address they are locked forever. just like when people spent Bitcoin to create Counterparty's XCP coin. the bad part is: we don't know how to burn a coin. the good part is: we can pay someone who is a legit verifiable professional to do it. www.vennd.io
of course, if we are cheap, we could find other ways to trade out octocoin for the new octoparty token... but you can't ensure that it will never be spent again if you don't "burn" it.
yes, if anyone wants to they could repair the withdrawal issue and take over the original blockchain for octocoin.
but it's been months and nobody has. even if they took over the coin, do you trust them? what will they do with the coin when they take it over? are you going to pay them bitcoins and octocoins to fix this shit? you trust them? enough to pay them?
i am not a developer. i have a large stake in octo. i have friends with an even larger stake in octo. i know people on this board with millions of octo. i want the issue fixed and the coin to be worth something. that's why i started pushing this idea.
however, i don't have the technical capability, nor do i think most alt blockchains will sustain long term. i can however, help guide and put in time to do something to make the coin valuable. there are ways to let the community drive the coin and hire real devs to do real projects to give the coin value.
some people may not trust or like the burning of coins or moving to CP. the best part about that is that you do not have to participate or you can only send what you want to be burned. but i am pretty confident what we are talking about doing will be way safer and more transparent than what we got from the original dev/s. and i know that with multi sig wallets, timelines that pay devs based on meeting milestones and having multiple people in charge of paying out the dev, the voting system that you can verify on the blockchain are all more realistic and safe than giving some random bitcointalk.org "dev" a bunch of bitcoin and octocoins and hoping he fixes a withdrawal issue and does something even remotely good with the current blockchain.
if you aren't convinced or don't trust it, then don't gamble all your octos away. but if i were you i'd at least burn some in case what we are doing is successful and worth something.
if we fail, then you didn't lose all your octo. if we win, then you win.
and what happens to the rest of the coins on this blockchain is anyone's guess. maybe some bitcointalk.org "dev" or bholzer or the original octo devs can save you.
i'm not waiting around. and i don't think people with at least close to 5 million octocoins are either.
the purpose of "burning" coins is sending them to an address that is not spendable in the future. once they are there nobody can come back to the octocoin blockchain even if someone picks it up and makes the original octocoin valuable. once they are locked into that address they are locked forever. just like when people spent Bitcoin to create Counterparty's XCP coin. the bad part is: we don't know how to burn a coin. the good part is: we can pay someone who is a legit verifiable professional to do it. www.vennd.io
of course, if we are cheap, we could find other ways to trade out octocoin for the new octoparty token... but you can't ensure that it will never be spent again if you don't "burn" it.
yes, if anyone wants to they could repair the withdrawal issue and take over the original blockchain for octocoin.
but it's been months and nobody has. even if they took over the coin, do you trust them? what will they do with the coin when they take it over? are you going to pay them bitcoins and octocoins to fix this shit? you trust them? enough to pay them?
i am not a developer. i have a large stake in octo. i have friends with an even larger stake in octo. i know people on this board with millions of octo. i want the issue fixed and the coin to be worth something. that's why i started pushing this idea.
however, i don't have the technical capability, nor do i think most alt blockchains will sustain long term. i can however, help guide and put in time to do something to make the coin valuable. there are ways to let the community drive the coin and hire real devs to do real projects to give the coin value.
some people may not trust or like the burning of coins or moving to CP. the best part about that is that you do not have to participate or you can only send what you want to be burned. but i am pretty confident what we are talking about doing will be way safer and more transparent than what we got from the original dev/s. and i know that with multi sig wallets, timelines that pay devs based on meeting milestones and having multiple people in charge of paying out the dev, the voting system that you can verify on the blockchain are all more realistic and safe than giving some random bitcointalk.org "dev" a bunch of bitcoin and octocoins and hoping he fixes a withdrawal issue and does something even remotely good with the current blockchain.
if you aren't convinced or don't trust it, then don't gamble all your octos away. but if i were you i'd at least burn some in case what we are doing is successful and worth something.
if we fail, then you didn't lose all your octo. if we win, then you win.
and what happens to the rest of the coins on this blockchain is anyone's guess. maybe some bitcointalk.org "dev" or bholzer or the original octo devs can save you.
i'm not waiting around. and i don't think people with at least close to 5 million octocoins are either.
January 30, 2015, 04:27:09 PM
What's the point with all this burning? The coin should be able to repair and trade as normal coin, no? (is it even broken?)
January 30, 2015, 09:09:01 AM
So, I talked to one of the guys from ScotCoin. They pretty much gutted their blockchain and turned it into a CP asset. He said they did their own burn without help from a third party. You just have to create a wallet and do all the work manually. So if a user has 20,000 octo they send it in to the burn address with their counterwallet address i'm assuming with an email and a screenshot of your balance.) and you just manually return the amount of your new CP asset.
We could do that probably pretty easy since we don't have a ton of people burning. It may take a team of us to to do it. But we would save $1500 that way.
We would still have to raise money for the crowd sale because I don't think we could manually process tons of orders in btc to sell the new Octo asset, plus you have to have media attention for that so you need another party that can get that for you.
One thing that made me think it would be better to burn the coins was the fact that we don't want FUD or the scam accusations. If someone came along and did something with the original blockchain you don't want one person or a team of people to have a wallet full of millions of octocoins to cash out with. So I was thinking we could do this: After the burn is complete, anyone who participates is emailed the .dat file with the public and private keys to the wallet. That way everyone has access to the wallet. Granted, someone could come and take off with all the octocoins in one transaction. But honestly, do we really expect anyone to come along and do something with octocoin?
So, do we burn ourselves for free? Or do we pay for legitimacy of vennd.io doing it? Does one really bring more legitimacy or does it really matter?
If you were a btc holder and had the chance to buy some coins for a project, would it make a difference about the coins already issued and how they were burned? Just something to think about.
We could do that probably pretty easy since we don't have a ton of people burning. It may take a team of us to to do it. But we would save $1500 that way.
We would still have to raise money for the crowd sale because I don't think we could manually process tons of orders in btc to sell the new Octo asset, plus you have to have media attention for that so you need another party that can get that for you.
One thing that made me think it would be better to burn the coins was the fact that we don't want FUD or the scam accusations. If someone came along and did something with the original blockchain you don't want one person or a team of people to have a wallet full of millions of octocoins to cash out with. So I was thinking we could do this: After the burn is complete, anyone who participates is emailed the .dat file with the public and private keys to the wallet. That way everyone has access to the wallet. Granted, someone could come and take off with all the octocoins in one transaction. But honestly, do we really expect anyone to come along and do something with octocoin?
So, do we burn ourselves for free? Or do we pay for legitimacy of vennd.io doing it? Does one really bring more legitimacy or does it really matter?
If you were a btc holder and had the chance to buy some coins for a project, would it make a difference about the coins already issued and how they were burned? Just something to think about.
Nobody should have access to the private key in the first place, it should be possible to create a burn address without ever knowing it's private key;
https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Proof_of_burn
i know that... i'm not talking about if we have someone who knows what they are doing do a burn.... i was talking about if we didn't pay $1500 to vennd.io and found a way to do it ourselves, which to my knowledge nobody here knows how to make a burn address....
pay attention to the differences i'm talking about. that whole paragraph was about NOT DOING A BURN and finding a way to trade out the coins like ScotCoin did.
if we don't want to spend money as some of you have clearly said you don't or won't, we can just trade them out manually. if we create a wallet with an address there will be a private key.
hence the reason you actually pay vennd the $1500 burn the coins instead... if nobody has a private key there's no room for someone to come back later with everyone's coins and dump them should the octocoin blockchain revive.
My point was we can spend money but we don't have to. And if there are very few participants then maybe there's no need in spending that money.
January 30, 2015, 05:25:23 AM
It sounds good to me. I'm ready to burn.
January 30, 2015, 04:12:52 AM
Around 1.5 M octocoins here, ready to burn
January 30, 2015, 03:46:18 AM
im down for burning have a few coins.
January 30, 2015, 03:46:01 AM
So, I talked to one of the guys from ScotCoin. They pretty much gutted their blockchain and turned it into a CP asset. He said they did their own burn without help from a third party. You just have to create a wallet and do all the work manually. So if a user has 20,000 octo they send it in to the burn address with their counterwallet address i'm assuming with an email and a screenshot of your balance.) and you just manually return the amount of your new CP asset.
We could do that probably pretty easy since we don't have a ton of people burning. It may take a team of us to to do it. But we would save $1500 that way.
We would still have to raise money for the crowd sale because I don't think we could manually process tons of orders in btc to sell the new Octo asset, plus you have to have media attention for that so you need another party that can get that for you.
One thing that made me think it would be better to burn the coins was the fact that we don't want FUD or the scam accusations. If someone came along and did something with the original blockchain you don't want one person or a team of people to have a wallet full of millions of octocoins to cash out with. So I was thinking we could do this: After the burn is complete, anyone who participates is emailed the .dat file with the public and private keys to the wallet. That way everyone has access to the wallet. Granted, someone could come and take off with all the octocoins in one transaction. But honestly, do we really expect anyone to come along and do something with octocoin?
So, do we burn ourselves for free? Or do we pay for legitimacy of vennd.io doing it? Does one really bring more legitimacy or does it really matter?
If you were a btc holder and had the chance to buy some coins for a project, would it make a difference about the coins already issued and how they were burned? Just something to think about.
We could do that probably pretty easy since we don't have a ton of people burning. It may take a team of us to to do it. But we would save $1500 that way.
We would still have to raise money for the crowd sale because I don't think we could manually process tons of orders in btc to sell the new Octo asset, plus you have to have media attention for that so you need another party that can get that for you.
One thing that made me think it would be better to burn the coins was the fact that we don't want FUD or the scam accusations. If someone came along and did something with the original blockchain you don't want one person or a team of people to have a wallet full of millions of octocoins to cash out with. So I was thinking we could do this: After the burn is complete, anyone who participates is emailed the .dat file with the public and private keys to the wallet. That way everyone has access to the wallet. Granted, someone could come and take off with all the octocoins in one transaction. But honestly, do we really expect anyone to come along and do something with octocoin?
So, do we burn ourselves for free? Or do we pay for legitimacy of vennd.io doing it? Does one really bring more legitimacy or does it really matter?
If you were a btc holder and had the chance to buy some coins for a project, would it make a difference about the coins already issued and how they were burned? Just something to think about.
Nobody should have access to the private key in the first place, it should be possible to create a burn address without ever knowing it's private key;
https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Proof_of_burn
January 29, 2015, 06:51:58 PM
So, I talked to one of the guys from ScotCoin. They pretty much gutted their blockchain and turned it into a CP asset. He said they did their own burn without help from a third party. You just have to create a wallet and do all the work manually. So if a user has 20,000 octo they send it in to the burn address with their counterwallet address i'm assuming with an email and a screenshot of your balance.) and you just manually return the amount of your new CP asset.
We could do that probably pretty easy since we don't have a ton of people burning. It may take a team of us to to do it. But we would save $1500 that way.
We would still have to raise money for the crowd sale because I don't think we could manually process tons of orders in btc to sell the new Octo asset, plus you have to have media attention for that so you need another party that can get that for you.
One thing that made me think it would be better to burn the coins was the fact that we don't want FUD or the scam accusations. If someone came along and did something with the original blockchain you don't want one person or a team of people to have a wallet full of millions of octocoins to cash out with. So I was thinking we could do this: After the burn is complete, anyone who participates is emailed the .dat file with the public and private keys to the wallet. That way everyone has access to the wallet. Granted, someone could come and take off with all the octocoins in one transaction. But honestly, do we really expect anyone to come along and do something with octocoin?
So, do we burn ourselves for free? Or do we pay for legitimacy of vennd.io doing it? Does one really bring more legitimacy or does it really matter?
If you were a btc holder and had the chance to buy some coins for a project, would it make a difference about the coins already issued and how they were burned? Just something to think about.
We could do that probably pretty easy since we don't have a ton of people burning. It may take a team of us to to do it. But we would save $1500 that way.
We would still have to raise money for the crowd sale because I don't think we could manually process tons of orders in btc to sell the new Octo asset, plus you have to have media attention for that so you need another party that can get that for you.
One thing that made me think it would be better to burn the coins was the fact that we don't want FUD or the scam accusations. If someone came along and did something with the original blockchain you don't want one person or a team of people to have a wallet full of millions of octocoins to cash out with. So I was thinking we could do this: After the burn is complete, anyone who participates is emailed the .dat file with the public and private keys to the wallet. That way everyone has access to the wallet. Granted, someone could come and take off with all the octocoins in one transaction. But honestly, do we really expect anyone to come along and do something with octocoin?
So, do we burn ourselves for free? Or do we pay for legitimacy of vennd.io doing it? Does one really bring more legitimacy or does it really matter?
If you were a btc holder and had the chance to buy some coins for a project, would it make a difference about the coins already issued and how they were burned? Just something to think about.
January 29, 2015, 06:51:17 PM
@OCTOPARTY I'm all for it and would be happy to participate in the 'burn in' please notify me when skype session is taking place as I'm not always checking this thread! I would be happy to contribute some BTC, but would like to know what the ratio of Octo/Octoparty would be.
January 29, 2015, 12:37:16 AM
for myself and the dozens who have no idea about, nor even heard of before... what is counterparty?
are we burning octo into another coin that already exists? is counterparty a coin?
or are we burning through counterparty which is a service, and it will turn into octoparty which is our new currency?
i'm glad to see some progress being made on taking control, but i'm just in the dark as to what this is really entailing. and what the $1500 is actually for.
also, there doesn't seem to be discussion on what to do with a new currency once we have it.
i'll say it again, as i've done 1000 times here already, we need a gaming portal. a simple, even text-based online poker app which people can bet with our currency. that's gotta be #1, and would make our currency immediately more useful than 99% of others, as you can actually USE it for something.
online gambling is where 888 needs to stay. and we need to keep the 888 ticker, i'm not burning 888 into CP.
are we burning octo into another coin that already exists? is counterparty a coin?
or are we burning through counterparty which is a service, and it will turn into octoparty which is our new currency?
i'm glad to see some progress being made on taking control, but i'm just in the dark as to what this is really entailing. and what the $1500 is actually for.
also, there doesn't seem to be discussion on what to do with a new currency once we have it.
i'll say it again, as i've done 1000 times here already, we need a gaming portal. a simple, even text-based online poker app which people can bet with our currency. that's gotta be #1, and would make our currency immediately more useful than 99% of others, as you can actually USE it for something.
online gambling is where 888 needs to stay. and we need to keep the 888 ticker, i'm not burning 888 into CP.
Firstly, Octo was never intended to be just a gambling coin. The gaming aspect was only one of the eight promised applications... and even that was hinted at being developed for one of their "investors". There were many aspects to the devs plans/scam/whatever, none of which ever materialized.
As far as burning your OctoCoin into OctoParty... Nobody is being forced to do it. That is your decision and only you can make it. But instead of getting your knickers in a twist about it, maybe you should wait and see what the plans are for OctoParty. When frameLAlife posts the times for the Skype calls, get in on them and listen to what is planned and give your opinions. Of course, you could always send them to Xnigma and dump them into that 1 satoshi buy order there...
We want everyone that is holding Octo to be involved in the decision making process. We all started out in this thing nearly a year ago as a community following a "dev team". Now it is time for the community to take the reins and make Octo into something that we can once again believe in.
on the gambling aspect...
it was only 1/8 promised apps. i see his point on the 888 ticker as far as gaming/gambling.
the thing is there's barely any money in poker/gambling in bitcoin alone. there's some. and there's plenty that try and go down specially here in the states. if you get big enough they will come after you. we've seen it in regular online poler with pokerstars, etc. we've seen small cases in bitcoin. unless it's decentralized and you put your servers overseas you risk losing a lot. now block chain gambling is an option. they already have a betting option in wallet but it's blocked for us IP addresses. but a vpn can fix that or you just market it to non US. but i don't think a simple poker game is enough.
we could still have that developed and vennd.io is currently doing a crowd sale raising bitcoin for a CP asset called bitnplay that's been on bitcoin sites news recently. i contacted them and they seem like they only want to have decentralized poker. but what if we contract out to them to create decentralized poker or blackjack or a blockchain text based like djslick is talking about on the blockchain? that is an option and there's value there. but we need to discuss all the things that come along with gambling.
we can't post here what we are talking about yet... but on the skype call we can talk about it. we have thought about something that is close to what dj wants but will be less headaches in some ways but more headaches in others but could give the coin a great first application that has use and value. and if we follow in octocoins footsteps, get one up and going and lets shoot for 8.
but lets discuss ideas. there may be something that calvert and i haven't thought of that's better or something that we haven't thought of that would make our idea hard to do or not as great an idea as we thought, that's the point of the skype call.
you don't have to join the burn party. realistically we could do this whole thing with very little or few of the original octocoins or holders. we could just create a total new coin with zero octo, but octo gives this a good community from the start, it gives us a chance to turn this negative shitcoin into a positive, and it gives us a good story to tell about ourselves and the coin when we market it. more than anything it gives us a chance to test a community driven coin with voting and transparency to see how well it can be done and how far we could take it.
as for the 888 ticker. XCP is the only 3 letter token on CP. all the others are required to have a 4-12 letter name. we could do:
8888
XCP888
XOP888
OCTO888
OCTOPARTY888
or any combo 4-12
and we could distribute vote tokens and have the community vote on what the actual ticker is.
i'd suggest if you really don't know that much about CP djslick to check out the wallet and youtube or google counterparty XCP or any of the coins. you really don't know much about it and have already shut it down dude. this gives us a lot of options without having to be a dev and running our own blockchain. plus most counterparty created tokens, coins and such are all doing very well price wise. look em up on coinmarketcap or wherever you trust. look at what each coin does to give it value.
or burn a few of your coins to octoparty and keep the rest as octocoin in case someone does something with this blockchain and you want to support that. you have plenty of options but i think you'll be really surprised at what we can do with CP. and read my earlier post... maybe you should be around for octoparty to be the voice of oppositon, after the way octocoin went i see nothing wrong with someone playing devils advocate against everything. it makes you have to perform when people like you are here to call out BS... but please, make sure you look into CP before bashing it and saying you just won't do it... you don't know enough about it to bash it yet....
January 28, 2015, 11:30:11 PM
https://forums.counterparty.io/discussion/975/escrow-for-games-with-counterparty-assets
forum question about the payouts from winning a game on a website.
the betting feature in wallet may work now but smart contracts should allow this escrow in the future. they copied ethereums smart contract code and added it to Counterparty but it's not usable yet in counterwallet. but it should be down the road i'd think as far as some of the projects we could plan around this coin for gaming, betting, tippping, etc.
ok i'm beat, i'm done for the night.
cya guys.
forum question about the payouts from winning a game on a website.
the betting feature in wallet may work now but smart contracts should allow this escrow in the future. they copied ethereums smart contract code and added it to Counterparty but it's not usable yet in counterwallet. but it should be down the road i'd think as far as some of the projects we could plan around this coin for gaming, betting, tippping, etc.
ok i'm beat, i'm done for the night.
cya guys.
January 28, 2015, 11:21:57 PM
Is there any transparency with anyone in this plan? Why does the PTCCRYPTO.com site have the domain information hidden?
PTCRYPTO was a site that Joshycoin and I created. We are roommates. We never followed through with it really. We tried but where we live in KY nobody gives 2 shits about Bitcoin. Every business I talked to wasn't interested in accepting Bitcoin for the most part.
My normal screen name on here is frameLAlife.
As far as the domain info I dunno why it's hidden. Josh registered the site on squarespace with his card and his personal info. He is kinda burned out on crypto from getting burnt with Octocoin.
So I have a wallet full of cryotocoin called PTCRYPTO that I thought about doing something with but never did. We never held a crowd sale for it or anything.
PTCRYPTO doesn't have much to do with Octo though. I can use that created token to show you how counterwallet works though.
as for transparency, that's exactly what we want.
we don't want the old octo devs treatment.
1. we want to raise bitcoin and have multiple community members to hold it in a multi sig wallet to prevent people from stealing the bitcoin.
2. we want community voting on almost everything to ensure that we are doing whats best for all of us and you can do that with counterparty tokens. give options, create tokens and distribute to all coin holders and let them send to certain addresses to vote for certain options!
3. set milestones and goals and hold devs of projects to them. you don't get any bitcoin until you show progress on the projects or promotion. you can do this by having multi sig wallets. you can even involve devs from vennd or whomever does the crowdsale so that you have to have signatures from community members and an outside party confirming that things have been done and progress has been shown by a certain time before we sign off on releasing bitcoin as payment.
4. i have no interest in necessarily being a leader or running the show. i have no interest in being one of the people that holds power over the multi sig wallet. if you need 3/5 signatures for the transaction to go through we can easily ask vennd.io dev to be one person and elect 4 people from the octo community to sign off on paying devs. that way you have to have communication and support of progress being shown before our money goes down the drain,
5. i'm all for having one of the people holding a key to the multi sig wallet being the most skeptical. so if DJSlick wants to be voted in as one so we have balance i'm all for it. that way if people are drinking the kool aid a skeptic and someone who questions everything can be on that team and point out any BS they see. granted he'd have to convince 3 other octo members and a dev of vennd.io that they don't need to sign off on something that he considers bs. that's the beauty of multi sig wallets, tokens for community voting and having another party involved that has no stake in the coin like vennd.io. it's layers of visibility and discussion before money is spent and should keep scams out.
Thoughts?
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