Thanks for getting back to me at all my questions :-)
I am actually quite enthusiastic about this project.
I even like that you guys make the final decisions yourself.
What happens with tokens not sold?
How much cash did the pre ico investors put in?
Are the CEO (Akshath) and CTO (Rohan) trading themselves? In the interview a team of 5-6 traders was mentioned. They are not in the website. It would be helpful to check out their profiles to have the illusion of any possibility of judging their trading experience.
If this project is legit, to me it looks like one of the higher potential 'ico gambles' around in my opinion.
Topic: [ANN] [ICO] Target Coin - World's FIRST And ONLY Bonus Paying Crypto Fund - page 18. (Read 27680 times)
July 13, 2017, 03:42:11 PM
July 13, 2017, 03:05:06 PM
Here are a number of trades we shared on our Telegram and twitter, on both long and short side and reached the targets
https://twitter.com/TargetCoin/status/880927990745411584
https://twitter.com/TargetCoin/status/880064317986488321
https://twitter.com/TargetCoin/status/880063383222927360
https://twitter.com/TargetCoin/status/879999845674524672
https://twitter.com/TargetCoin/status/879999845674524672
https://twitter.com/TargetCoin/status/879656956113240064
https://twitter.com/TargetCoin/status/879647653549662209
https://twitter.com/TargetCoin/status/879645626417397762
https://twitter.com/TargetCoin/status/879289218261958657
https://twitter.com/TargetCoin/status/879262700202799104
https://twitter.com/TargetCoin/status/879233298488205312
https://twitter.com/TargetCoin/status/879070645438431232
https://twitter.com/TargetCoin/status/879037588572483584
https://twitter.com/TargetCoin/status/878998658246516736
https://twitter.com/TargetCoin/status/878615618257207296
https://twitter.com/TargetCoin/status/878609186065530882
https://twitter.com/TargetCoin/status/876491870787870721
https://twitter.com/TargetCoin/status/876396176400015360
https://twitter.com/TargetCoin/status/880927990745411584
https://twitter.com/TargetCoin/status/880064317986488321
https://twitter.com/TargetCoin/status/880063383222927360
https://twitter.com/TargetCoin/status/879999845674524672
https://twitter.com/TargetCoin/status/879999845674524672
https://twitter.com/TargetCoin/status/879656956113240064
https://twitter.com/TargetCoin/status/879647653549662209
https://twitter.com/TargetCoin/status/879645626417397762
https://twitter.com/TargetCoin/status/879289218261958657
https://twitter.com/TargetCoin/status/879262700202799104
https://twitter.com/TargetCoin/status/879233298488205312
https://twitter.com/TargetCoin/status/879070645438431232
https://twitter.com/TargetCoin/status/879037588572483584
https://twitter.com/TargetCoin/status/878998658246516736
https://twitter.com/TargetCoin/status/878615618257207296
https://twitter.com/TargetCoin/status/878609186065530882
https://twitter.com/TargetCoin/status/876491870787870721
https://twitter.com/TargetCoin/status/876396176400015360
July 13, 2017, 02:55:38 PM
One more thing, what is the 10% (8 million dollars) used for except for just salary? How many people are on the payroll except the 5-6 traders mentioned in the interview from the link?
Based on what I read Target Coin is using platforms like Polo, Kraken, Bitstamp, so there won't be huge development costs for a trading platform, or did I miss something?
It does sound 'a bit' self enriching to me, although good traders could actually be worth every dime.. Please convince me to invest, if you still want me after these few critical points of view and critical questions :-)
Based on what I read Target Coin is using platforms like Polo, Kraken, Bitstamp, so there won't be huge development costs for a trading platform, or did I miss something?
It does sound 'a bit' self enriching to me, although good traders could actually be worth every dime.. Please convince me to invest, if you still want me after these few critical points of view and critical questions :-)
Hi, we have invested personal money into the fund and got the coins at a discounted price. We do not charge management fee on the 400 Million tokens sold during the pre-ICO round.
Here is a link of our equity holdings - http://imgur.com/a/TK8Hn
Our trading profits have been significantly higher. The founders have managed a long-short hedge fund Alexandrite Capital before and have beat the index for more than 6+ years.
Will share an entire audited track record of our trading history soon.
We are investing a significant amount of money into building HFT crypto trading algorithms and TargetX. The 10% management fees are for the first year, which we will revise and reduce after the first year. We also give a guaranteed quarterly bonus which comes out to be 3% per year and 70-200% of annual risk adjusted returns.
July 13, 2017, 02:47:51 PM
Sorry for the separate post.
Just wanted to go through some numbers.
Example 1: the fund makes no money but just plays even. Fund intrinsic value = 80 million for 100% of the coins. Team gets 8 million (10%). This seems so weird to me. Does the fund have to make up the fee before dividends are started?
Hi, we are not charging the management fee for the pre-ICO sale. At 1.34 Bn coins, we raise $52 million and $5.2mn annual performance fee.
The guaranteed quarterly bonus will be given out.
Example 2: the fund loses 40 million, fund intrinsic value = 40 million for 100% of the coins. Team gets 4 million? This seems very wrong for me. I see no mention of a high water mark. Why are you guys not working with a high water mark if you are so confident you will make money? I am sure this would ease the minds of potential investors.
Hi, our watermark is the performance of the Bitcoin.
Target Coin team is taking 13 % of the coins (80 * 0.13) 10.4 million worth of coins. Besides dividend on these coins 15% of total profit. With all this in mind I think 10% standard fee + no high water mark (investopedia is your friend if you dont know what this means) sends a wrong signal, conflicting with the confidence that the white paper sends.
Target Coin team is buying the coins at a discounted price, putting in personal capital into the fund. We share back 85% of the profits back with the investors, unlike no profit sharing with the other cryptos and the price being purely speculative price.
With a normal, customary 1.5-2% fee and a high water mark this would be a no brainer for me as I believe the project has so much potential (although it would be nice to see some track record).
In the linked interview this comes along:
Does the team have a history of trading other assets?
The team as well as me have over 18 years of experience in trading and investing in equities, foreign exchange as well commodity markets. Our primary focus has been the concentrated equities portfolio which as we speak is up over 90% in the past 3 years.(i.e a CAGR of over 28% YoY)
90% over the past 3 years is not normal. Not a single hedgefund in the world makes 28% per year consistently.I am not saying scam at all! I actually believe Crypto gives a lot of opportunity for long/short funds, but I would like to see what the 70-200% RISK ADJUSTED return is based on/how it is calculated.
Here is the snapshot of our equity holdings - http://imgur.com/a/TK8Hn
You can also check our analysis and calls that we made on twitter. 90% of them hit the target in the past one month! We called for ethereum short when it was at 360 and 270 with the targets of 190.
The 70-200% risk adjusted returns are achieved by maintaining a high reward to risk ratio. With a minimum of risk to reward ratio of 1:2.5 and accuracy being just 50%, it generates 75% returns.
Yes, the entire fund won't be levered up at any point of time, but on an average we plan to generate a minimum of 50% returns.
Finally, if 85% of profit is paid to token holders, and 15% is charged as a performance fee. You start with 80 mln, aim to be 500 mln in 2019, where does the other 420 mln come from? All the profits after 10% fee go to the team and the token holders. Perhaps I am missing something really simple, so please enlighten me :-)
The team plans to reinvest most of the management and performance fees. Depending on our performance and investor demand, we plan to raise additional capital without diluting the existing tokens.
Don't get me wrong, I am very disturbed by the ridiculous 10% fee and the lack of high water mark, but good traders in immature volatile markets have so much potential, I could still put my money in this ICO!
10% fees are for the first year. 3% guaranteed bonus will be give back that leaves us with 7% management fees. We plan to invest a significant amount of money into HFT crypto trading and TargetX software which will be free for all token holders. We plan to revise the management fee after the first year.
Thank you for your questions.
Just wanted to go through some numbers.
Example 1: the fund makes no money but just plays even. Fund intrinsic value = 80 million for 100% of the coins. Team gets 8 million (10%). This seems so weird to me. Does the fund have to make up the fee before dividends are started?
Hi, we are not charging the management fee for the pre-ICO sale. At 1.34 Bn coins, we raise $52 million and $5.2mn annual performance fee.
The guaranteed quarterly bonus will be given out.
Example 2: the fund loses 40 million, fund intrinsic value = 40 million for 100% of the coins. Team gets 4 million? This seems very wrong for me. I see no mention of a high water mark. Why are you guys not working with a high water mark if you are so confident you will make money? I am sure this would ease the minds of potential investors.
Hi, our watermark is the performance of the Bitcoin.
Target Coin team is taking 13 % of the coins (80 * 0.13) 10.4 million worth of coins. Besides dividend on these coins 15% of total profit. With all this in mind I think 10% standard fee + no high water mark (investopedia is your friend if you dont know what this means) sends a wrong signal, conflicting with the confidence that the white paper sends.
Target Coin team is buying the coins at a discounted price, putting in personal capital into the fund. We share back 85% of the profits back with the investors, unlike no profit sharing with the other cryptos and the price being purely speculative price.
With a normal, customary 1.5-2% fee and a high water mark this would be a no brainer for me as I believe the project has so much potential (although it would be nice to see some track record).
In the linked interview this comes along:
Does the team have a history of trading other assets?
The team as well as me have over 18 years of experience in trading and investing in equities, foreign exchange as well commodity markets. Our primary focus has been the concentrated equities portfolio which as we speak is up over 90% in the past 3 years.(i.e a CAGR of over 28% YoY)
90% over the past 3 years is not normal. Not a single hedgefund in the world makes 28% per year consistently.I am not saying scam at all! I actually believe Crypto gives a lot of opportunity for long/short funds, but I would like to see what the 70-200% RISK ADJUSTED return is based on/how it is calculated.
Here is the snapshot of our equity holdings - http://imgur.com/a/TK8Hn
You can also check our analysis and calls that we made on twitter. 90% of them hit the target in the past one month! We called for ethereum short when it was at 360 and 270 with the targets of 190.
The 70-200% risk adjusted returns are achieved by maintaining a high reward to risk ratio. With a minimum of risk to reward ratio of 1:2.5 and accuracy being just 50%, it generates 75% returns.
Yes, the entire fund won't be levered up at any point of time, but on an average we plan to generate a minimum of 50% returns.
Finally, if 85% of profit is paid to token holders, and 15% is charged as a performance fee. You start with 80 mln, aim to be 500 mln in 2019, where does the other 420 mln come from? All the profits after 10% fee go to the team and the token holders. Perhaps I am missing something really simple, so please enlighten me :-)
The team plans to reinvest most of the management and performance fees. Depending on our performance and investor demand, we plan to raise additional capital without diluting the existing tokens.
Don't get me wrong, I am very disturbed by the ridiculous 10% fee and the lack of high water mark, but good traders in immature volatile markets have so much potential, I could still put my money in this ICO!
10% fees are for the first year. 3% guaranteed bonus will be give back that leaves us with 7% management fees. We plan to invest a significant amount of money into HFT crypto trading and TargetX software which will be free for all token holders. We plan to revise the management fee after the first year.
Thank you for your questions.
July 13, 2017, 02:33:23 PM
Many traders switch (partly) to crypto because of bigger volatility and margins. I love the idea to size up.
Just a couple of questions:
1. Are losses shares by investors? If profit is made after a loss, is the div based on net or just the profit? If the fund losse money is the 10% still paid out (10% is very much on the high side compared to approx 2 in normal hedgefund in my opinion)
2. After each quarter the max intrinsic value of the fund is the starting value because of fee and dividends?
3. More in delth info about track record, trading history would be appreciated.
4. High yields are definitely achievable. Could you please show the calculation for the RISK ADJUSTED return?
Looking forward to your answers!
Just a couple of questions:
1. Are losses shares by investors? If profit is made after a loss, is the div based on net or just the profit? If the fund losse money is the 10% still paid out (10% is very much on the high side compared to approx 2 in normal hedgefund in my opinion)
2. After each quarter the max intrinsic value of the fund is the starting value because of fee and dividends?
3. More in delth info about track record, trading history would be appreciated.
4. High yields are definitely achievable. Could you please show the calculation for the RISK ADJUSTED return?
Looking forward to your answers!
1. The dividend is based on net profit. If the fund loses money, guaranteed bonus is paid out while the profits will be paid out in the next quarter. If the fund makes a net annual loss, we will not charge the entire 10% fee. The 10% fees are higher for the first year because of the initial development, maintenance and research costs, which we shall revise after the first year.
2. Yes. Max intrinsic value of the fund is the starting value.
3. We have been trading in the traditional financial markets since years and have been fund managers previously managing a $25mn hedge fund - Alexandrite Capital. Will share a snap of our crypto fund here in a separate post soon.
4. Risk adjusted return means minimising your downside in any trade.
i.e Your average risk to reward ratio for each trade is 1:2
That means that for every dollar you risk, you make sure that you make at least $2. In that case, even if the fund manager is right for just 50% of the times, the fund will make (0.5*2 - 0.5*1)*100 = 50% returns.
At Target Coin we plan to maintain a minimum risk to reward ratio of 2.5 for each trade, making the downside minimum for each investors.
July 13, 2017, 02:20:28 PM
Do you think current timing as in ongoing saga of segwit and August 1 approaching, which is actually making every coin go downhill will effect the sale in a negative manner?
We don't think it will affect the sale drastically.
July 13, 2017, 12:26:33 PM
One more thing, what is the 10% (8 million dollars) used for except for just salary? How many people are on the payroll except the 5-6 traders mentioned in the interview from the link?
Based on what I read Target Coin is using platforms like Polo, Kraken, Bitstamp, so there won't be huge development costs for a trading platform, or did I miss something?
It does sound 'a bit' self enriching to me, although good traders could actually be worth every dime.. Please convince me to invest, if you still want me after these few critical points of view and critical questions :-)
Based on what I read Target Coin is using platforms like Polo, Kraken, Bitstamp, so there won't be huge development costs for a trading platform, or did I miss something?
It does sound 'a bit' self enriching to me, although good traders could actually be worth every dime.. Please convince me to invest, if you still want me after these few critical points of view and critical questions :-)
July 13, 2017, 11:59:02 AM
Sorry for the separate post.
Just wanted to go through some numbers.
Example 1: the fund makes no money but just plays even. Fund intrinsic value = 80 million for 100% of the coins. Team gets 8 million (10%). This seems so weird to me. Does the fund have to make up the fee before dividends are started?
Example 2: the fund loses 40 million, fund intrinsic value = 40 million for 100% of the coins. Team gets 4 million? This seems very wrong for me. I see no mention of a high water mark. Why are you guys not working with a high water mark if you are so confident you will make money? I am sure this would ease the minds of potential investors.
Target Coin team is taking 13 % of the coins (80 * 0.13) 10.4 million worth of coins. Besides dividend on these coins 15% of total profit. With all this in mind I think 10% standard fee + no high water mark (investopedia is your friend if you dont know what this means) sends a wrong signal, conflicting with the confidence that the white paper sends.
With a normal, customary 1.5-2% fee and a high water mark this would be a no brainer for me as I believe the project has so much potential (although it would be nice to see some track record).
In the linked interview this comes along:
Does the team have a history of trading other assets?
The team as well as me have over 18 years of experience in trading and investing in equities, foreign exchange as well commodity markets. Our primary focus has been the concentrated equities portfolio which as we speak is up over 90% in the past 3 years.(i.e a CAGR of over 28% YoY)
90% over the past 3 years is not normal. Not a single hedgefund in the world makes 28% per year consistently.I am not saying scam at all! I actually believe Crypto gives a lot of opportunity for long/short funds, but I would like to see what the 70-200% RISK ADJUSTED return is based on/how it is calculated.
Finally, if 85% of profit is paid to token holders, and 15% is charged as a performance fee. You start with 80 mln, aim to be 500 mln in 2019, where does the other 420 mln come from? All the profits after 10% fee go to the team and the token holders. Perhaps I am missing something really simple, so please enlighten me :-)
Don't get me wrong, I am very disturbed by the ridiculous 10% fee and the lack of high water mark, but good traders in immature volatile markets have so much potential, I could still put my money in this ICO!
Just wanted to go through some numbers.
Example 1: the fund makes no money but just plays even. Fund intrinsic value = 80 million for 100% of the coins. Team gets 8 million (10%). This seems so weird to me. Does the fund have to make up the fee before dividends are started?
Example 2: the fund loses 40 million, fund intrinsic value = 40 million for 100% of the coins. Team gets 4 million? This seems very wrong for me. I see no mention of a high water mark. Why are you guys not working with a high water mark if you are so confident you will make money? I am sure this would ease the minds of potential investors.
Target Coin team is taking 13 % of the coins (80 * 0.13) 10.4 million worth of coins. Besides dividend on these coins 15% of total profit. With all this in mind I think 10% standard fee + no high water mark (investopedia is your friend if you dont know what this means) sends a wrong signal, conflicting with the confidence that the white paper sends.
With a normal, customary 1.5-2% fee and a high water mark this would be a no brainer for me as I believe the project has so much potential (although it would be nice to see some track record).
In the linked interview this comes along:
Does the team have a history of trading other assets?
The team as well as me have over 18 years of experience in trading and investing in equities, foreign exchange as well commodity markets. Our primary focus has been the concentrated equities portfolio which as we speak is up over 90% in the past 3 years.(i.e a CAGR of over 28% YoY)
90% over the past 3 years is not normal. Not a single hedgefund in the world makes 28% per year consistently.I am not saying scam at all! I actually believe Crypto gives a lot of opportunity for long/short funds, but I would like to see what the 70-200% RISK ADJUSTED return is based on/how it is calculated.
Finally, if 85% of profit is paid to token holders, and 15% is charged as a performance fee. You start with 80 mln, aim to be 500 mln in 2019, where does the other 420 mln come from? All the profits after 10% fee go to the team and the token holders. Perhaps I am missing something really simple, so please enlighten me :-)
Don't get me wrong, I am very disturbed by the ridiculous 10% fee and the lack of high water mark, but good traders in immature volatile markets have so much potential, I could still put my money in this ICO!
July 13, 2017, 11:20:29 AM
Many traders switch (partly) to crypto because of bigger volatility and margins. I love the idea to size up.
Just a couple of questions:
1. Are losses shares by investors? If profit is made after a loss, is the div based on net or just the profit? If the fund losse money is the 10% still paid out (10% is very much on the high side compared to approx 2 in normal hedgefund in my opinion)
2. After each quarter the max intrinsic value of the fund is the starting value because of fee and dividends?
3. More in delth info about track record, trading history would be appreciated.
4. High yields are definitely achievable. Could you please show the calculation for the RISK ADJUSTED return?
Looking forward to your answers!
Just a couple of questions:
1. Are losses shares by investors? If profit is made after a loss, is the div based on net or just the profit? If the fund losse money is the 10% still paid out (10% is very much on the high side compared to approx 2 in normal hedgefund in my opinion)
2. After each quarter the max intrinsic value of the fund is the starting value because of fee and dividends?
3. More in delth info about track record, trading history would be appreciated.
4. High yields are definitely achievable. Could you please show the calculation for the RISK ADJUSTED return?
Looking forward to your answers!
July 13, 2017, 10:11:44 AM
Any bounty?
copper member
Activity: 2800
Merit: 1179
Leading Crypto Sports Betting & Casino Platform
July 13, 2017, 09:50:43 AM
Do you think current timing as in ongoing saga of segwit and August 1 approaching, which is actually making every coin go downhill will effect the sale in a negative manner?
We can not say what will happen but it will surely affect the coins though it's the bitcoin that will be affected mainly by that segwit, a threat of splitting on bitcoin. July 13, 2017, 08:53:40 AM
Do you think current timing as in ongoing saga of segwit and August 1 approaching, which is actually making every coin go downhill will effect the sale in a negative manner?
copper member
Activity: 2800
Merit: 1179
Leading Crypto Sports Betting & Casino Platform
July 13, 2017, 07:09:39 AM
Filipino thread for this ANN is now available via this link: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/ph-target-coin-ang-una-at-nag-iisang-bonus-paying-crypto-fund-sa-mundo-2018321
Goodluck to this wonderful project wherein the investors will gain even on the falling of prices.
A very good business plan and investment strategy.
Goodluck to this wonderful project wherein the investors will gain even on the falling of prices.
A very good business plan and investment strategy.
July 13, 2017, 12:48:34 AM
i don't quite katch it
so it's a trading bot that pays guaranteed amount of interest to investors via smart contract??
so it's a trading bot that pays guaranteed amount of interest to investors via smart contract??
Hi,
We use trading algorithms along with our fund managers trading manually for some part.
We use multiple strategies to invest and trade in cryptos. We use machine learning for historical pattern trading, technical analysis, quantitative arbitrage across exchanges and long term investments in promising cryptos.
We share 85% of the quarterly profits with the investors.
1. What will happen if loss is made, does it mean I lose my investment or it reduces considering that we all know that in crypto world profit is not of certainty.
2. Is there a way on how to monitor the profit being made on a daily basis in other to ensure transparency and also be sure of the quarterly profit to be distributed.
Hi,
Yes, Crypto Currencies market is full of uncertainties. If losses are made you can sell or redeem your coins.
To ensure full transparency we will track, record and timestamp all trading activity and will share it with all token holders daily.
Thank You.
July 12, 2017, 01:23:16 PM
i don't quite katch it
so it's a trading bot that pays guaranteed amount of interest to investors via smart contract??
so it's a trading bot that pays guaranteed amount of interest to investors via smart contract??
Hi,
We use trading algorithms along with our fund managers trading manually for some part.
We use multiple strategies to invest and trade in cryptos. We use machine learning for historical pattern trading, technical analysis, quantitative arbitrage across exchanges and long term investments in promising cryptos.
We share 85% of the quarterly profits with the investors.
1. What will happen if loss is made, does it mean I lose my investment or it reduces considering that we all know that in crypto world profit is not of certainty.
2. Is there a way on how to monitor the profit being made on a daily basis in other to ensure transparency and also be sure of the quarterly profit to be distributed.
July 12, 2017, 05:01:29 AM
Are there any bounties?If so, i'd like to join in .It looks like a good project.
I would like to))) 
July 11, 2017, 11:45:03 PM
This is a great project. Hoping for the best result for the investors and the dev. It would be wise if the ivestors invest in this project as early as possible.
July 11, 2017, 11:29:27 AM
Great initiation sir, you seems amazing to promote the project with the all possible proper channels. I am happy to part of it one medium. I wish to learn about it bro. If you have a slack channel or Skype group. Please let me know to learn about the Targetcoin ICO and other things.
July 11, 2017, 10:35:43 AM
where's the algo of this coin?? 
July 11, 2017, 10:07:26 AM
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