[ANN] SafeDice.com - 0.5% Variable House Edge - page 3.

shitaifan2013

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monero

Quote from: CoinCollect on November 17, 2014, 11:27:06 AM

and i think there is a bug, you said max profit 0.05.
i bet 0.0001 x 980 and wont almost 0.097 btc

check

i dont think thats a bug, since you can aim for a higher max profit if youre willing to deal with a increasing house edge.

at least thats the way I understood the explanation in this thread somehwere above.

CoinCollect

sr. member

Activity: 770

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and i think there is a bug, you said max profit 0.05.
i bet 0.0001 x 980 and wont almost 0.097 btc

check

CoinCollect

sr. member

Activity: 770

Merit: 250

I have withdraw 0.1788 but site wa laggy did not withdraw for me, then i played again and withdraw 0.1905 and i did not recieve
just recieved 0.1788
please check my account
nick: Azmy

Sam.Walton

newbie

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Quote from: Coef on November 17, 2014, 05:55:05 AM

Quote from: marcotheminer on November 17, 2014, 05:33:42 AM

Had we not known Mark Karpeles' information matters would be much, much worse.

Agree. But what I want to say is that knowing the owners' info may help a bit in gaining trust, but the effect won't be enough IMO.

Quote from: marcotheminer on November 17, 2014, 05:33:42 AM

Quote from: Coef on November 17, 2014, 03:15:31 AM

On the other hand, having doog control (or co-control) the server seeds and cold wallet could work IMO.

Yet that defeats the purpose of gaining trust or even setting up a gambling site if a reputable member comes in and pretty much takes over (sever seeds and cold wallet funds are the things which show ownership and control). Actually, involving dooglus just makes him run another gambling site, instead of Sam.Walton runnning a new one.

Yup you are right. Maybe you could even call the site JD 2 then.

I guess it depends on what OP wants.
If he wants to make himself and his site trusted, it will be a slow and costly process.
If he simply wants to make his site trusted and earn some bitcoin through running it, partnering with a trusted bitcoiner (and sharing part of the site profit) could be a much easier and faster way to do it.

Exactly, that will be the options that we are considering, another option is to run the site with our own fund as bankroll (but of course we'll have to find another source of fund Cheesy

, which is challenging as well).

We are pretty much open for certain possibilities at the moment.. Lets see how this will go. This is very exciting moment for SafeDice. Also, whichever decision will we take, we will need to improve the site features and usability, so that will be our focus in parallel.

Quote from: zinger on November 17, 2014, 05:59:39 AM

Why is doog not replying safedice's messages?

Messages? Do you mean in this thread?

zinger

newbie

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Why is doog not replying safedice's messages?

Coef

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Exhausted

Quote from: marcotheminer on November 17, 2014, 05:33:42 AM

Had we not known Mark Karpeles' information matters would be much, much worse.

Agree. But what I want to say is that knowing the owners' info may help a bit in gaining trust, but the effect won't be enough IMO.

Quote from: marcotheminer on November 17, 2014, 05:33:42 AM

Quote from: Coef on November 17, 2014, 03:15:31 AM

On the other hand, having doog control (or co-control) the server seeds and cold wallet could work IMO.

Yet that defeats the purpose of gaining trust or even setting up a gambling site if a reputable member comes in and pretty much takes over (sever seeds and cold wallet funds are the things which show ownership and control). Actually, involving dooglus just makes him run another gambling site, instead of Sam.Walton runnning a new one.

Yup you are right. Maybe you could even call the site JD 2 then.

I guess it depends on what OP wants.
If he wants to make himself and his site trusted, it will be a slow and costly process.
If he simply wants to make his site trusted and earn some bitcoin through running it, partnering with a trusted bitcoiner (and sharing part of the site profit) could be a much easier and faster way to do it.

marcotheminer

legendary

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┴puoʎǝq ʞool┴

Quote from: Coef on November 17, 2014, 03:15:31 AM

Quote from: marcotheminer on November 16, 2014, 07:25:20 AM

I suggest the following: Sam.Walton why don't you provide your personal information directly to dooglus? I understand that you wouldn't want too (and you have absolutely no obligation to do so), however this would improve community trust in you ten fold, once dooglus verifies the information. Otherwise, you could involve dooglus somehow (for example having him hold server seeds as he offered with dicebitco.in). Once again, you have no obligation to do any of the above.

But how is dooglus going to verify the personal information?
Also IMHO, knowing the site owner's identity won't help much in gaining trust, as knowing who Mark Karpeles is doesn't help recovering ones' mtgox fund...

Had we not known Mark Karpeles' information matters would be much, much worse.

Quote from: Coef on November 17, 2014, 03:15:31 AM

On the other hand, having doog control (or co-control) the server seeds and cold wallet could work IMO.

Yet that defeats the purpose of gaining trust or even setting up a gambling site if a reputable member comes in and pretty much takes over (sever seeds and cold wallet funds are the things which show ownership and control). Actually, involving dooglus just makes him run another gambling site, instead of Sam.Walton runnning a new one.

Coef

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Activity: 882

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Quote from: marcotheminer on November 16, 2014, 07:25:20 AM

I suggest the following: Sam.Walton why don't you provide your personal information directly to dooglus? I understand that you wouldn't want too (and you have absolutely no obligation to do so), however this would improve community trust in you ten fold, once dooglus verifies the information. Otherwise, you could involve dooglus somehow (for example having him hold server seeds as he offered with dicebitco.in). Once again, you have no obligation to do any of the above.

But how is dooglus going to verify the personal information?
Also IMHO, knowing the site owner's identity won't help much in gaining trust, as knowing who Mark Karpeles is doesn't help recovering ones' mtgox fund...

On the other hand, having doog control (or co-control) the server seeds and cold wallet could work IMO.

Sam.Walton

newbie

Activity: 28

Merit: 0

Quote from: marcotheminer on November 16, 2014, 07:25:20 AM

I suggest the following: Sam.Walton why don't you provide your personal information directly to dooglus? I understand that you wouldn't want too (and you have absolutely no obligation to do so), however this would improve community trust in you ten fold, once dooglus verifies the information. Otherwise, you could involve dooglus somehow (for example having him hold server seeds as he offered with dicebitco.in). Once again, you have no obligation to do any of the above.

Thanks for the suggestion marco. We will explore these ideas as well

marcotheminer

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┴puoʎǝq ʞool┴

I suggest the following: Sam.Walton why don't you provide your personal information directly to dooglus? I understand that you wouldn't want too (and you have absolutely no obligation to do so), however this would improve community trust in you ten fold, once dooglus verifies the information. Otherwise, you could involve dooglus somehow (for example having him hold server seeds as he offered with dicebitco.in). Once again, you have no obligation to do any of the above.

Sam.Walton

newbie

Activity: 28

Merit: 0

Quote from: KaozTiposta on November 16, 2014, 06:53:37 AM

Quote from: Sam.Walton on November 16, 2014, 04:20:47 AM

And Doog, if you have the time, would you be interested to test this new feature when it is finished, but before it launches to the public?

Everytime same thing is happenning. I can imagine after this:

Quote

Sam.Walton : Doog tested our site, we are trustable, good, fair, we won't run with investors money when reach to xxx btc. Come to us!

And then one night run away. Simple.

UI is good but isn't giving any confidence. Maybe it's just a hoodwink? I don't like your anonymity.

We were asking dooglus for help simply because we take him as our hero, I think a lot of other people appreciate and admire him as we do. When dooglus replied our thread, we were not just excited, but were determined to not disappoint people like other bad examples.

We think that if we can be as successful as JD, we can have a very decent incoming without being cursed, and no one wants to be cursed because of stealing people's money. It's not cool.

We also believe that, a sustainable dice site is helpful to the bitcoin community, we are believers but now speculators of bitcoin, and don't want to do anything bad to it.

For the anonymity, please understand that, we do that for the safety reason, we'll also provide the best anonymity for our players, that's why there's an onion address for the site.

To build the reputation takes a long time, and we're prepared to do it anyway.

KaozTiposta

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Quote from: Sam.Walton on November 16, 2014, 04:20:47 AM

And Doog, if you have the time, would you be interested to test this new feature when it is finished, but before it launches to the public?

Everytime same thing is happenning. I can imagine after this:

Quote

Sam.Walton : Doog tested our site, we are trustable, good, fair, we won't run with investors money when reach to xxx btc. Come to us!

And then one night run away. Simple.

UI is good but isn't giving any confidence. Maybe it's just a hoodwink? I don't like your anonymity.

Sam.Walton

newbie

Activity: 28

Merit: 0

Quote from: dooglus on November 16, 2014, 03:39:41 AM

Quote from: Sam.Walton on November 16, 2014, 03:17:44 AM

Sorry for I didn't think it clearly enough. Yes for a default of 0.5% max win with a 1% edge, it's impossible for a player to take the bankroll through a single bet, it only happens when the max win is 1% of bankroll under 1% edge. But the chance is just too tiny which is like a jackpot Tongue

Will you be allowing investors to specify the maximum percentage of their investment that they are prepared to risk on a single roll?

It's possible that some of them wouldn't want to risk 50% of their coins on a single roll no matter how high the house edge was.

We don't think so Doog, it would be complicated. It's also doesn't make sense if a player bet on a super high HE, just as you said, in that case they'd be better off betting on another site with higher BR.

So, our current idea is to cap the HE between 0.5% to 10%, depends on their profit on win / bankroll ratio (we'd like to keep it at half kelly). Do you think this would be a good idea?

Another thing to consider is that the site will be deciding a bet's HE in real time, so if there's an invest/divestment when the bet request is sent from the client to the server, there might be a slight difference between the HE shown on the client and the server's calculation.

And Doog, if you have the time, would you be interested to test this new feature when it is finished, but before it launches to the public?

LOBSTER

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Quote from: dooglus on November 16, 2014, 03:39:41 AM

Quote from: Sam.Walton on November 16, 2014, 03:17:44 AM

Sorry for I didn't think it clearly enough. Yes for a default of 0.5% max win with a 1% edge, it's impossible for a player to take the bankroll through a single bet, it only happens when the max win is 1% of bankroll under 1% edge. But the chance is just too tiny which is like a jackpot Tongue

Will you be allowing investors to specify the maximum percentage of their investment that they are prepared to risk on a single roll?

It's possible that some of them wouldn't want to risk 50% of their coins on a single roll no matter how high the house edge was.

That would be a great feature!!!

dooglus

legendary

Activity: 2940

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Quote from: Sam.Walton on November 16, 2014, 03:17:44 AM

Sorry for I didn't think it clearly enough. Yes for a default of 0.5% max win with a 1% edge, it's impossible for a player to take the bankroll through a single bet, it only happens when the max win is 1% of bankroll under 1% edge. But the chance is just too tiny which is like a jackpot Tongue

Will you be allowing investors to specify the maximum percentage of their investment that they are prepared to risk on a single roll?

It's possible that some of them wouldn't want to risk 50% of their coins on a single roll no matter how high the house edge was.

Sam.Walton

newbie

Activity: 28

Merit: 0

Quote from: dooglus on November 16, 2014, 12:15:12 AM

Quote from: Sam.Walton on November 15, 2014, 10:49:19 PM

Currently, the house edge is capped at 3%, and we'll lift it to unlimited very soon, that means you can take away the whole bankroll with a single bet under a high house edge, stay tuned guys!

I don't think so:

You can win 0.5% of the bank with a 1% edge,
Win 1% of the bank with a 2% edge, etc.

So to win 100% of the bank, the house edge would need to be 200%.

percentage_chance_to_win = (100 - house_edge_percent) / payout_multiplier

If the house edge goes bigger than 100%, the player's chance to win goes negative...

So the most you can let a player win in a single bet is 49.99% of the bankroll.

At that point, supposing they want to double their money, their chance to do so is (100 - 99.98) / 2 = 0.02/2 = 0.01%.

So that's a one-in-ten-thousand chance of doubling their money.

In other words, there's a point at which it becomes silly, and the player would be better off just using a site with a bigger bankroll...

Sorry for I didn't think it clearly enough. Yes for a default of 0.5% max win with a 1% edge, it's impossible for a player to take the bankroll through a single bet, it only happens when the max win is 1% of bankroll under 1% edge. But the chance is just too tiny which is like a jackpot Tongue

dooglus

legendary

Activity: 2940

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Quote from: Sam.Walton on November 15, 2014, 10:49:19 PM

Currently, the house edge is capped at 3%, and we'll lift it to unlimited very soon, that means you can take away the whole bankroll with a single bet under a high house edge, stay tuned guys!

I don't think so:

You can win 0.5% of the bank with a 1% edge,
Win 1% of the bank with a 2% edge, etc.

So to win 100% of the bank, the house edge would need to be 200%.

percentage_chance_to_win = (100 - house_edge_percent) / payout_multiplier

If the house edge goes bigger than 100%, the player's chance to win goes negative...

So the most you can let a player win in a single bet is 49.99% of the bankroll.

At that point, supposing they want to double their money, their chance to do so is (100 - 99.98) / 2 = 0.02/2 = 0.01%.

So that's a one-in-ten-thousand chance of doubling their money.

In other words, there's a point at which it becomes silly, and the player would be better off just using a site with a bigger bankroll...

Sam.Walton

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Quote from: cheekychap on November 15, 2014, 06:26:36 PM

Nice to see that the site isn't exactly a prime dice clone. What percentage of the bankroll is the max bet?

Quote from: elephantas1 on November 15, 2014, 05:48:51 PM

Max win is 0.05247555 ?? thats one of the smallest ive ever seen you should make it bigger asap

By default, the house edge is 1% and the max win if 0.5% of the bankroll, but the house edge and max win are floated.

On the high bets tab, you can see this bet https://safedice.com/bet/33843 , the player-160 bet 0.15830207 BTC for a 1.95959596 payout, that's because when the max win is bigger than 0.5% of the bankroll, the house edge floated accordingly.

Currently, the house edge is capped at 3%, and we'll lift it to unlimited very soon, that means you can take away the whole bankroll with a single bet under a high house edge, stay tuned guys!

And thanks to dooglus again for the great advices:)

cheekychap

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Nice to see that the site isn't exactly a prime dice clone. What percentage of the bankroll is the max bet?

marcotheminer

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Quote from: elephantas1 on November 15, 2014, 05:48:51 PM

Max win is 0.05247555 ?? thats one of the smallest ive ever seen you should make it bigger asap

The bankroll of the site determines this amount. The more there is invested the greater the 0.5% portion of the bankroll that can be risked per bet.

Topic: [ANN] SafeDice.com - 0.5% Variable House Edge - page 3. (Read 7973 times)