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Topic: [ANN][CRW] CROWN (SHA256) | Platform | Governance | Systemnodes | Masternodes | - page 83. (Read 317079 times)

newbie
Activity: 83
Merit: 0
Hi all,

To gain a bit more traction in publicity around Crown, an event has been added to Cryptocurrency Calendar.
Please vote on the event to increase notability.


Unfortunately you'll have to go through this process twice if you want to vote on both events.

Thanks!

Done, whats the second event, I could only find one?

Oh I see, they've been merged. Will update my post. Thanks for voting!
member
Activity: 87
Merit: 10
Nice to see different local communities getting set up.  

For the dev team -- anything more that can be discussed in terms of what the original "skeleton keys" are evolving into, specifically around how the network will "license" different "agents" to enable the different capabilities discussed in Atomic, but in a what should be amore distributed and resilient way than other solutions?  A drawing or 1 pager on this would be awesome to help people (including me) -- understand....

Also -- this helps the developing network of ambassadors start to plan how an initial communications and education role in a local community would be able to develop into a business.  Snoops 2nd reddit update expressed that better than I ever could.  

Love seeing the consistent progress from Ashot on the system nodes.  Would just be great to have some visibility for the community into the work Artem & Chaositec are doing as well.  

I don't think people who haven't been to one of the meetings quite get the scope of the project, and the potential of using different keys to unlock different capabilities within a crypto systems -- and not just using the keys to sign a transfer of tokens, but having more uses for the keys and more uses for the tokens too....

And when you think of it that way it is also obvious why having a cryptographer like Artem involved now is essential (thank you defunctec!).  

I've had to step back from actively working on CRW for personal reasons -- but this project is different than anything else I've come across in crypto, and has much more potential than anyone really appreciates (in my opinion).  

Every other decent project I looked at (including bitcoin and ethereum) has been "captured" by some limiting factor -- either a fundamental architecture problem or an core economic community or interest group or a specific application.  By building on lessons the core team learned from other projects and also just working quietly during this year's coin frenzy -- Crown may be in the process of managing to sneak up on the competition... or that is what I would like to believe.

I tend to read and think too much -- but the problem that we are really trying to solve with these networks isn't a "token" problem -- but to create a system for managing a Common Pool Resource -- a commons.  First off, you can't create a commons with an ICO -- it has to be built on top of a community... The most iconic work on this subject is probably Elinor Ostrom's nobel prize winning notes: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elinor_Ostrom -- and her principles for the management of common pool resources.  And within this -- all these guys who want to create a new internet are kind of screwing up too... sorry IPFS...  you aren't creating a network -- you are using a network to create a common pool resource.  The problem has been a problem of composition / framing...  and damn I have taken a beating from some for making this point -- because most of us have only read about one thing or another and we are too specialized in our knowledge.

A crypto-commons or kerckhoff social network (fuck the whole crypto-currency thing -- it's so 2009)... but a crypto-commons which is a common pool resource managed by the governance structure of the network and with it's resources allocated by the token which is intrinsic to the network... and where that commons has an interface on iOs & Android (2.6 B smart phones at current count) --- well this is a new sort of nervous system for, well, the world... and that is when your Ostrom needs to be informed by Stuart Kaufmann's insights into networks, complexity and evolution.  I was introduced to Kaufman by someone I met on the Crown Mattermost who used to work with him decades ago and suggested that an understanding of Kaufmann's work was what I was missing.... and he was right.  The key to Kaufmann is in understanding the characteristics of different network structures and the range between rigidity and chaos -- which helps one think about how to structure a network which is a mix of stability and chaos... or where you push the edges of the network to the edge of chaos, but keep the core of the network stable... there are plenty of examples of this in nature... the book to start with on Kaufmann is probably At Home in the Universe -- chapter 4.  Kaufmann's insights on networks actually help explain why 2 tiered governance structures are so common and stable -- a unified structure is too rigid, but as you get into 3 or more layers -- it gets exponentially more complex (roughly) to get agreements, so it becomes to unstable -- so 1 is too rigid, 3 is too fluid.... and it turns out that golidlocks was wise beyond her years.  

Then the final step in the back ground stuff -- is that Kaufmann ultimately connects to the importance of the sacred -- or something which is taken as given at the core of a system.  I think of this in terms of Gödel's incompleteness theorem -- we must start with an assumption and that assumption is what is sacred... for Crown, the assumption that I imagine that it starts with is that human agency and freedom are what is sacred -- or what is assumed to be good.  And this is where I lose many folks... and where I think most of crypto would say I am full of shit... but this is where the opportunity is too...  because there is some reason everyone is doing this?  For many it is probably a sort of gambling addiction and just fun -- but we are playing with amazing technologies which can do a lot more than laundering money and avoiding taxes or providing amusement...

You just have to step into a different frame and imagine what could be if you start with the idea that human agency should be sacred and encouraged, and that we have a network structure which can be designed with evolutionary principles to be both self-governing and stable at the core and dancing on the edge of chaos with different agents out on the edges, and owned by no one, but governed by itself following the principles we have learned from observing the goverance of other common resources in societies over centuries.

Just an idea... this is the shared imagination referred to in the first of the crown papers.  But it doesn't exist yet -- people have to build it.
hero member
Activity: 615
Merit: 502
Hi all,

To gain a bit more traction in publicity around Crown, an event has been added to Cryptocurrency Calendar.
Please vote on the event to increase notability.


Unfortunately you'll have to go through this process twice if you want to vote on both events.

Thanks!

Done, whats the second event, I could only find one?
member
Activity: 82
Merit: 10
Only 2 days left, dev will bring more exciting announcement and update at Friday. Crown is too good for hold for long term.
newbie
Activity: 83
Merit: 0
Hi all,

To gain a bit more traction in publicity around Crown, an event has been added to Cryptocurrency Calendar.
Please vote on the event to increase notability.



Thanks!
newbie
Activity: 26
Merit: 0
Part 2 of the Nexus Reflections is available on our reddit page: https://redd.it/73y1m1  Smiley
hero member
Activity: 808
Merit: 500


OFFICIAL SYSTEM NODES UPDATE 02/10/2017

SystemNode development is in full swing. Ashot (The SystemNode developer) has produced a small update explaining how Systemnodes work and the problems he has yet to resolve.

After discussion it seems SystemNodes will be available for testing within October. Please be prepared for testing if you would like to help us out.

We will release another update at the end of the week.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1GVfVH7AoSzDvaAV6NwQB_Ijvq_7GpOmKvV6vEwYXvj8/edit?usp=sharing
hero member
Activity: 808
Merit: 500

I just saw this interesting discussion video about law and smart contracts by aantonop, not sure if you guys have seen it.  Here is the text:

"Reading and writing the word of the law, but judging according to the spirit of the law - how does this apply to code for legal frameworks? We already have plenty of institutions that allow you flexibility to have your problem adjudicated in front of an impartial judge or a jury of your peers.

Law students will leave believing in the spirit of the law and be gradually ground down in the system of prosecution and courts until eventually they don't believe in anything other than winning the case. We are now looking at building systems where the outcome is known based on the formula of a neutral contract. It will not always work, sometimes it will backfire badly and we will have another DAO-saster.

How can law create a safety net? The worst case is that a smart contract fails and then parties in the contract geo-locate each other to sue them in whatever court they choose at the time. New York Convention on Arbitration, an international treaty that allows you to claim independent legal arbitration within a private system of law in 156 countries. Distinguishing between use and abuse of the system with normative judgement. In a system that has no spirit of law, only rule, there is no distinction between use and abuse; if the consensus algorithm allowed it, it is not abuse.

The lesson of TheDAO wasn't "do we fork or not fork?", it was that you don't put $150 million in an untested contract, you idiots! That is a lesson that is self-correcting because people got hurt. The caveat of these new systems is that they are free-market, collaborative, voluntary participation: caveat emptor - "buyer beware."

Is it true that "accounting jobs will be gone in five years because of smart contracts"? The jobs will not be gone, they will be radically transformed. If you don't embrace this new technology, or you fight it, you will find yourself in a smaller and smaller niche that is less important to the rest of the world. Smart contracts are neither "smart," nor "contracts." They are programs which are rather 'dumb.' Decentralisation is a powerful force and we are living the century of decentralisation."

Video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K-TRzuPwJCc

Thanks very much btct22 for sharing that, very useful for our Atomic designs, I have shared it in our Atomic private channel.
 Wink
hero member
Activity: 615
Merit: 502

I just saw this interesting discussion video about law and smart contracts by aantonop, not sure if you guys have seen it.  Here is the text:

"Reading and writing the word of the law, but judging according to the spirit of the law - how does this apply to code for legal frameworks? We already have plenty of institutions that allow you flexibility to have your problem adjudicated in front of an impartial judge or a jury of your peers.

Law students will leave believing in the spirit of the law and be gradually ground down in the system of prosecution and courts until eventually they don't believe in anything other than winning the case. We are now looking at building systems where the outcome is known based on the formula of a neutral contract. It will not always work, sometimes it will backfire badly and we will have another DAO-saster.

How can law create a safety net? The worst case is that a smart contract fails and then parties in the contract geo-locate each other to sue them in whatever court they choose at the time. New York Convention on Arbitration, an international treaty that allows you to claim independent legal arbitration within a private system of law in 156 countries. Distinguishing between use and abuse of the system with normative judgement. In a system that has no spirit of law, only rule, there is no distinction between use and abuse; if the consensus algorithm allowed it, it is not abuse.

The lesson of TheDAO wasn't "do we fork or not fork?", it was that you don't put $150 million in an untested contract, you idiots! That is a lesson that is self-correcting because people got hurt. The caveat of these new systems is that they are free-market, collaborative, voluntary participation: caveat emptor - "buyer beware."

Is it true that "accounting jobs will be gone in five years because of smart contracts"? The jobs will not be gone, they will be radically transformed. If you don't embrace this new technology, or you fight it, you will find yourself in a smaller and smaller niche that is less important to the rest of the world. Smart contracts are neither "smart," nor "contracts." They are programs which are rather 'dumb.' Decentralisation is a powerful force and we are living the century of decentralisation."

Video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K-TRzuPwJCc
member
Activity: 87
Merit: 10


Crown Atomic weekly update to the Community - 29.9.2017

The Crown dev team has agreed that a regular weekly update to the community will be communicated by every Friday. This will make the progress on the Atomic features more transparent

During this week the core Atomic team led by Artem, defunctec and chaositec worked hard to discuss and specify details of the Crown Atomic system and new actors in the Crown Governance System. Some of the previous design ideas were abandoned.

The discussion took place about the way of licensing masternodes, verify identities, encryption private data of identities, types of agreements in the network, cross-country and legal jurisdiction issues, how the system will empower actors (agents) with specific roles in the network, and how it will revoke them in case they start behaving dishonestly. Some fresh ideas have been discussed and approved by the team. It brings some new technical challenges though, so we work to design, specify and document different use cases of the system.

There are also changes to opcodes/transactions workflow, so new prototypes have been created according to the high-level design changes. The workflow became more complex including different multisig scenarios, but it seems to be more secure and decentralized way to create the system that we want. To make the system reliable and user-friendly some new subsystems may emerge (personal data confidentiality mechanism, mutisig communication) but they won't be a part of the first release of Crown Atomic, they will be planned for the next phases.

Nice work guys.  I know this is complicated but also know that you are close to having it wrapped up.  Keep up the good work.
legendary
Activity: 1358
Merit: 1002
I have summed up some questions about running a service node.

  • How can i run a service node? Or can i outsource this somewhere?
  • If i run one from my wallet, wont this mean my wallet is easy to access? Considering risk i dont know if it is worth it?
  • Is it possible to run it from a Raspberry Pi or something? I need to keep electricity cost at a minimum. If yes, how?

 Huh
We have a compiled version for raspberry pi, so its basically just follow any masternode setup more or less (there will be specifics on how to set up systemnodes, but besides that process will be the same)

also we should have the option of running a hot/cold setup  - just like the way thrones are running now, so your coins wont be in a running wallet, and you can lock your wallet
newbie
Activity: 30
Merit: 0
I have summed up some questions about running a service node.

  • How can i run a service node? Or can i outsource this somewhere?
  • If i run one from my wallet, wont this mean my wallet is easy to access? Considering risk i dont know if it is worth it?
  • Is it possible to run it from a Raspberry Pi or something? I need to keep electricity cost at a minimum. If yes, how?

 Huh

No doubt there will be services that come along and offer Service node hosting. However if you wanted to host yourself then a vps is ideal. Just like masternodes Service nodes will require 1IP4 address per servicenode.

ServiceNode will change to SystemNode, as new comers may get confused about the application layer offering services and servicenodes (systemnodes) offering the network services.
hero member
Activity: 808
Merit: 500


Crown Atomic weekly update to the Community - 29.9.2017

The Crown dev team has agreed that a regular weekly update to the community will be communicated by every Friday. This will make the progress on the Atomic features more transparent

During this week the core Atomic team led by Artem, defunctec and chaositec worked hard to discuss and specify details of the Crown Atomic system and new actors in the Crown Governance System. Some of the previous design ideas were abandoned.

The discussion took place about the way of licensing masternodes, verify identities, encryption private data of identities, types of agreements in the network, cross-country and legal jurisdiction issues, how the system will empower actors (agents) with specific roles in the network, and how it will revoke them in case they start behaving dishonestly. Some fresh ideas have been discussed and approved by the team. It brings some new technical challenges though, so we work to design, specify and document different use cases of the system.

There are also changes to opcodes/transactions workflow, so new prototypes have been created according to the high-level design changes. The workflow became more complex including different multisig scenarios, but it seems to be more secure and decentralized way to create the system that we want. To make the system reliable and user-friendly some new subsystems may emerge (personal data confidentiality mechanism, mutisig communication) but they won't be a part of the first release of Crown Atomic, they will be planned for the next phases.
newbie
Activity: 50
Merit: 0
I have summed up some questions about running a service node.

  • How can i run a service node? Or can i outsource this somewhere?
  • If i run one from my wallet, wont this mean my wallet is easy to access? Considering risk i dont know if it is worth it?
  • Is it possible to run it from a Raspberry Pi or something? I need to keep electricity cost at a minimum. If yes, how?

 Huh
member
Activity: 63
Merit: 10
Small update.

ServiceNode (SN) development is underway, our second new developer is working hard to bring v1 of SN's to testnet.
v1 will be without NTP timekeeper servers at first, but will be implemented in v2 of SN's.

We would like the SN network to grow and stabilise before we add NTP as the first service.
So far SN's will require 1/20th of the collateral of a Masternode (10,000CRW) = 500CRW per SN and will be rewarded appropriately.

Follow SN development here

https://github.com/Crowndev/crowncoin/tree/servicenode

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Separately the team are quite sure we have the correct framework for the application platform to go ahead and start specifying work tasks.
Documentation will be made available in the coming days boasting the breakthrough we made.

More infomation coming soon.

this is really great news, do the service nodes also need a dedicated ip?  same as a throne?


The intention is for a dedicated IP to not be required, subject to us confirming that that doesn't introduce security issues.

One of the main purposes of service nodes is to provide a different point of entry for the community to provide services and be paid, without the hassle of setting up a Tron.
i see, but does that ,ean you could run a throne and a SN using the same ip? but sure i can understand the security issue

To do this, you'd have to have coins in a wallet on your Throne which is highly inadvisable.
is it still the same if i use different computers? same ip but on different wallets
newbie
Activity: 26
Merit: 0
 I just posted the first part of a handful of reflections from the Nexus Conference that Fin and I attended over the past weekend. It can be found here: https://redd.it/72yqlt
Cheers  Smiley
legendary
Activity: 1722
Merit: 1002
Decentralize Everything
Small update.

ServiceNode (SN) development is underway, our second new developer is working hard to bring v1 of SN's to testnet.
v1 will be without NTP timekeeper servers at first, but will be implemented in v2 of SN's.

We would like the SN network to grow and stabilise before we add NTP as the first service.
So far SN's will require 1/20th of the collateral of a Masternode (10,000CRW) = 500CRW per SN and will be rewarded appropriately.

Follow SN development here

https://github.com/Crowndev/crowncoin/tree/servicenode

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Separately the team are quite sure we have the correct framework for the application platform to go ahead and start specifying work tasks.
Documentation will be made available in the coming days boasting the breakthrough we made.

More infomation coming soon.

this is really great news, do the service nodes also need a dedicated ip?  same as a throne?


The intention is for a dedicated IP to not be required, subject to us confirming that that doesn't introduce security issues.

One of the main purposes of service nodes is to provide a different point of entry for the community to provide services and be paid, without the hassle of setting up a Tron.
i see, but does that ,ean you could run a throne and a SN using the same ip? but sure i can understand the security issue

To do this, you'd have to have coins in a wallet on your Throne which is highly inadvisable.
member
Activity: 63
Merit: 10
Small update.

ServiceNode (SN) development is underway, our second new developer is working hard to bring v1 of SN's to testnet.
v1 will be without NTP timekeeper servers at first, but will be implemented in v2 of SN's.

We would like the SN network to grow and stabilise before we add NTP as the first service.
So far SN's will require 1/20th of the collateral of a Masternode (10,000CRW) = 500CRW per SN and will be rewarded appropriately.

Follow SN development here

https://github.com/Crowndev/crowncoin/tree/servicenode

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Separately the team are quite sure we have the correct framework for the application platform to go ahead and start specifying work tasks.
Documentation will be made available in the coming days boasting the breakthrough we made.

More infomation coming soon.

this is really great news, do the service nodes also need a dedicated ip?  same as a throne?


The intention is for a dedicated IP to not be required, subject to us confirming that that doesn't introduce security issues.

One of the main purposes of service nodes is to provide a different point of entry for the community to provide services and be paid, without the hassle of setting up a Tron.
i see, but does that ,ean you could run a throne and a SN using the same ip? but sure i can understand the security issue
legendary
Activity: 1722
Merit: 1002
Decentralize Everything
Small update.

ServiceNode (SN) development is underway, our second new developer is working hard to bring v1 of SN's to testnet.
v1 will be without NTP timekeeper servers at first, but will be implemented in v2 of SN's.

We would like the SN network to grow and stabilise before we add NTP as the first service.
So far SN's will require 1/20th of the collateral of a Masternode (10,000CRW) = 500CRW per SN and will be rewarded appropriately.

Follow SN development here

https://github.com/Crowndev/crowncoin/tree/servicenode

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Separately the team are quite sure we have the correct framework for the application platform to go ahead and start specifying work tasks.
Documentation will be made available in the coming days boasting the breakthrough we made.

More infomation coming soon.

this is really great news, do the service nodes also need a dedicated ip?  same as a throne?


The intention is for a dedicated IP to not be required, subject to us confirming that that doesn't introduce security issues.

One of the main purposes of service nodes is to provide a different point of entry for the community to provide services and be paid, without the hassle of setting up a Tron.
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