Author

Topic: [ANN][ICO] «Envion» Most Profitable Self-Expanding Crypto Infrastructure - page 190. (Read 125689 times)

jr. member
Activity: 34
Merit: 1
Hi,

I need help. I can't sign in with my account using my password that I signed up few weeks back. I hit the Forgot Passord button but I still don't receive any email to change my password. If I register a new email account, can I still get a 30% discount?

Thanks and God bless! 😊

THere was NO signup a few weeks back. There was only email registration for receiving emails.
So you are creating a new account, and yes, with a new account you get 30% off if you send ether by the deadline.

To repeat, the signup only started  today. Anything before was just an email list.
so create a new account.
Hope that helps.
jr. member
Activity: 100
Merit: 1
Hi,

I need help. I can't sign in with my account using my password that I signed up few weeks back. I hit the Forgot Passord button but I still don't receive any email to change my password. If I register a new email account, can I still get a 30% discount?

Thanks and God bless! 😊
newbie
Activity: 2
Merit: 0
The ICO process is arranged very badly by Envion for Singapore (SG) investors. Right from the start, Envion did not state any restriction or exclusion for SG investment. In their write-up on the supported document for KYC submission, they even indicated SG Passport, National Identity or Driving License as relevant supporting documents for KYC submission. When the ICO open, Envion only then released the Subscription Agreement and Prospectus which state that SG investor is not allowed to participate. During ICO process, most SG investor may not tried to read through the  100 plus pages of subscription agreement and prospectus thoroughly to find that SG investor are to be excluded. The worst thing is that ICO payment setup process allowed the deduction of the ETH from the investors’ wallet before the completion of KYC process and document submission.

The questions to Envion are
(1) why can’t Envion stated clearly upfront that SG investor are to be excluded from this ICO?
(2) why can’t Envion release the Subscription Agreement and Prospectus earlier before the ICO open so that SG investors can read through the documents thoroughly and notice their ineligibility for participation before joining in the ICO? Would Envion have compromised anything to have these documents released earlier?
(3) why did Envion allowed the deduction of the ETH funds from investors’ wallet before the submission of KYC documents and completion of verification check? SG investors have the the ETH payment upfront deducted from their wallet only to have their application rejected later for refund (which we are not even sure for now when the refund would take place)? There are also additional gas fee incurred for this transactions to the SG investors. This is a very silly ICO workflow design which incur unnecessary work and cost for the refunds later if the KYC profile failed.

We are extremely angered and disappointed by the entire ICO process that Envion have managed. For SG investors who have been following closely on this ICO, it has been a big waste of time and effort to follow and standby this project even when there are a lot of FUD surrounding it. For those Who joined the bounty program, they could also end up promoting this ICO for nothing in return! We strongly feel that Envion team do own an apology to all the ICO participating SG investors for the MISLEADING INFO!!

For now we demand that the Envion team read this message, respond fully to these queries with transparency and process our ETH refund as soon as possible for us to move on. If not, this episode would reflect badly on Envion team and its investors relations!

From a group of very angry and disappointed SG investors

 
jr. member
Activity: 34
Merit: 1
Some more of my thoughts on Envion for those who are interested. I'm working in the field of renewable energies and therefore have been following this ICO regularly.

Today I told my coworker about the current hype with ICOs and he, who has been working with banks for the last 20 years, told me that it reminded him of 1999/early 2000s when people were throwing money at anything. He told me there was e.g. a company from Hongkong that said had invented tracking systems for trucks and were already selling products with a cash flow worth millions.

In the end it turned out the company had faked a great percentage of sales to their "customers" and hadn't even bothered to set up letterbox companies with the respective names they allegedly had sold these products to. The formerly acclaimed global yearly turnover of 93 million $ turned out to be more something like 1.5 million $.

I agree, there are a lot of bogus ICO's out there, with some horrible white papers, Envion is not one of them


With Envion what I have seen so far is that they don't have a working product yet.
They don't have a working product? I saw videos of their mining unit working, and also they mentioned testing it in a few environments

Therefore there a few factors to consider if you want to assess the potential of their product:
First, it's just a prototype at the moment, which therefore cannot have been tested under the many different working conditions yet that it has to endure if it is to be distributed globally.
What about dusty, dry, hot, cold environments or everything in sequence within 24 hours, which happens if you put up a container next to a solar power plant in the desert.

Then the costs:
- of the Envion mining equipment itself
- the costs for transportation
- the costs for maintenance if something stops working

So I do GPU mining personally, and its pretty profitable and I don;t get good prices for my units.
Envion will be getting much better pricing and also ASIC units that are more profitable in general, so they are off to a good start,
I also pay horrible city prices for electricity and i still make good money. So Envion will at least be cutting costs from electricity and from hardware


The availability of:
- cheap electricity
- of trained people who maintain the equipment

and if there are no trained mainentance staff available:
- the costs to hire and transport the staff to and from the mining site

Not even considering the initial investment cost, the advances in new mining hardware or the possible increase in network size and difficulty increase for many cryptos, the overall costs for running and maintenance will decide the profitability.

I agree, the one cost i dont incur that they will is the cost of staff and of transportation, and it is up to management to keep the minimal. I know for myself, i have barely touched my miners, they are fine once they are up and running, i do everything from remote management

In my eyes this is why mining companies are located in Iceland and China. There is cheap electricity AND trained personnel available that does not have to travel around the globe to provide their service.

- And if there are other spots with even cheaper or nearly free electricity, why is it that they haven't been claimed yet? They have to be small niches which until now have not been interesting enough for the major players.

Perhaps Envion is first to market in this regard, and even if they cant claim these cheap energy spots, they can just park the units where the other mining companies have their units and incur no additional costs, right?

So either the niches Envion wants to exploit are small and if they are not the other factor, the costs for providing proper maintenance, is the reason that no one else is there yet.


If they put up their containers in Europe or the US they will find enough people capable to keep the systems running, but then, how are electricity prices there?
as I said, even with high city prices of electricity i am making decent money, it actually amazes me how much money is in mining, there are not many businesses where u make back all of your liabilities in less than a year and then some

If you truly want cheap electricity it has to be produced at the lowest marginal costs possible, which in the long run means you have to go for renewables. However, medium and large power plants, like solar and wind, are only built if the demand or state subsidies will make this project economically feasible. In Germany, for example, the ROI for photovoltaic plants is around 12-14 years with the current state subsidy of around 0.11 €/kWh if you sell the electricity to the grid or even lower if you do not meet the criteria to receive the subsidies, which depends on the size of the plant.

So I wonder why a plant owner, at least in Germany or Europe, would want to sell electricity to Envion at a price which is lower than the one guaranteed by the state, which still is above market prices. And even if he doesn't receive the subsidies there is still a huge market he can sell electricity to at current market prices.

There is no reason why the plant owner should sell Envion electricity below market prices. Envion, of course, could buy at market prices but what would thein their edge be compared to other miners?

Im not sure of the energy companies' motives either, but Envion already has LOI's from several companies, unless they are flat out lying which i find hard to believe given the quality of well known people involved


The next question is, how many plants there are that are desperate enough to sell their electricity below market prices or even below their marginal costs? This would entail e.g. power plants that were built without meeting the conditions of economic feasability in the first place, state projects that had to be abandoned due to increased costs, for example.

again, im not sure about this, i guess this is the gamble we are taking, but its not much of a gamble because they can just park the units anywhere,
 as i said the profit margin is high... unless im missing something.. instead of 100% ROI in 8 months it will be 10 months.. not so bad


Envion doesn't provide any information where they think these potential niches are located. And if they know where they are, how big are they? As Envion wants to reinvest 25% of the returns into growing their infrastructure how long will it be until they run out of these yet unclaimed sources of cheap or free electricity.
not sure, but im happy with my return even if they only fill the $130ish million

Of course, if new niches appear on the planet, they can ship the containers to the other side of the globe. But how much is this going to cost compared to the earnings generated by their equipment during the available amount of time until that niche is closing again, e.g. as local demand in electricity goes up and the owner of the plant can charge other consumers higher prices than Envion? Does Envion hedge against this kind of risk or do they simply pack up under these circumstances and move somewhere else, which in turn causes new costs for transportation and set up at the new location?
They have confirmed contracts of lengths sufficient enough that if the circumstances changed they are still making heafty profits

The only long term feasible solution I can see at the moment is that Envion's (and any other) cryptomining is only profitable if marginal costs are driven as low as possible and stay that way. And places where these conditions are met are already occuppied (at least to a certain extent). So if Envion wants to be more profitable than other miners, they have to have lower costs than others and they have to avoid the additional costs, like moving and setting up equipment over and over or costs of transporting trained staff for maintenance.

Therefore, I see Envion's advantage against other miners, the mobility of their system also as its biggest Archilles heel as these additional costs will bite into their earnings. But if they want to reduce these costs, they will lose their advantage against other miners and will be just another mining company that moves to Iceland and buys electricity at market prices.
again, that was my whole point.. go to iceland then, its crazy progit margins still

The only other feasible solution I see for profitable cryptomining is that Envion ensures low electricity prices by owning the power plant themselves and running their equipment on their own power. This would be the solution with the lowest marginal costs.

But then, why should you even bother with long term crypto mining using your own electricity when you could as well sell the electricity itself?


For me these questions are not answered or even asked.


What is definitely true is that the founders/members have already made a huge amount of money so far and I have to congratulate them on it. And if their product will prevail only time will show. It's just like in the good old dotcom times.

Bottom line is the profit margin is huge.. so any further benefits they deliver from just baseline mining is just a bonus. Im mining in a garage with cards bought from the local radioshack, per se, and my profits are a joke compared to other businesses (ie: not a 10% profit margin per year). I look forward to any further comments. I realize you are the energy expert, but they have experts on their team as well and i dont think they could have gotten this far and lied about contracts if they dont have something substantial and they have declared they are ready with assembly line and contracts
full member
Activity: 335
Merit: 100
I am very impressed with the technology owned by envion, mining method used is very eco friendly and can be moved anywhere.
innovations like this should continue to be developed to be more better and can be a motivation for other mining platforms
member
Activity: 140
Merit: 10
Same thing happened for me I just closed it after recieving all the confirmation emails that my documents were uploaded and were waiting for verification wich can take a couple of days.

I still recieved my tokens so I guess its fine to close the tab and carry on you can still log in later and restart the verification process if need be.

Can you see your tokens/transaction on the dashboard?

https://ico.envion.org/#!/dashboard

I've nothing there even though my transaction appears in their wallet at https://etherscan.io/address/0xd780ae2bf04cd96e577d3d014762f831d97129d0

Propably that damned KYC unlinked my ETH wallet from my account after numerous restart attempts for verification. Didn't want to miss out this one but apparently I'm forced to skip further transactions.

I am running into the same problem. Verification shows up as being checked, but my tokens are not on my dashboard as of yet.
newbie
Activity: 2
Merit: 0
What is the miner hardware utilised by Envion? Can we get more details regarding specs please.
newbie
Activity: 9
Merit: 0
New member here, this ICO looks interesting
newbie
Activity: 2
Merit: 0
So I read the prospectus and I found a RED FLAG. It allows the company to buy back your token at any time, for 1$. they just have to give 60 days notice:

"The Issuer reserves the right to redeem the Tokens at any time prior to the Termination
Date up to an amount representing 99.9% of the equivalent of USD 1.00"

This needs to be addressed by Envion.

This is on page 12 of the prospectus: https://static.envion.org/kyc/Envion_Prospectus.pdf


"I TERM OF THE TOKENS
I. Term of the Token
The Tokens are issued for a period of 30 (thirty) years starting with commencement of the
Subscription Period (the end of that period: the “Termination Date”).
II. Redemption of the Tokens
1. The Issuer reserves the right to redeem the Tokens at any time prior to the Termination
Date up to an amount representing 99.9% of the equivalent of USD 1.00 (in words: one USDollar)
per Token. Notice of early redemption shall be given pursuant to clause M (Notices)
not less than 30 nor more than 60 days before the day fixed in the notice on which any Tokens "


It's not a red flag, it's standard in every single security or equity purchase agreement.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Share_repurchase

Not at $1 value. A share buyback would be at market value at the time or some such agreed upon price.
Would you agree to buy apple shares for$500 if there was a clause to buy it back at $500 whenver they want? doesnt make sense right. Unless I am misreading it but that should be clarified. It seems to be a buyback for $1?

I can see this will be an issue we have to address with some more depth.  I'll provide a little more info now and we'll release a detailed statement.

It's technically not a repurchase.  It's a feature of the financial instrument that underlies the ICO.  ICOs don't really exist in the legitimate financial world right now, but envion worked with our legal team to find terms that would make an ICO possible now and viable into the future.

The redemption is not a buy back or a repurchase per se. It allows a refund to the purchaser up to 99.9% which means that you would be refunded your investment, but you would keep the ownership of your token and hence continue to receive the full value of the dividends entitled to you as the owner of that token.

We will elaborate on this concept in a blog post so that it's very clear how the financial instrument works and relates to the concept of ICOs.  The high-level take-away is that we can't take your tokens and that it's a good thing because it means the ICO is iron-clad from a legal standpoint.

Ok, I see what you mean, further down I see:
2. The Issuer shall redeem the remaining amount of the equivalent of USD 1.00 (in words:
one US-Dollar) per Token on Termination Date together with any Profit Participation due and
not paid yet Profit Participations are subject to Swiss withholding tax (currently 35%).

So the 99.9% is being redeemed, and then the full amount is redeemed after the 30 years.
Thanks for clarification.

... but what is the purpose of the clause then.



I'd also like to know/get a response for this..
newbie
Activity: 71
Merit: 0
So I read the prospectus and I found a RED FLAG. It allows the company to buy back your token at any time, for 1$. they just have to give 60 days notice:

"The Issuer reserves the right to redeem the Tokens at any time prior to the Termination
Date up to an amount representing 99.9% of the equivalent of USD 1.00"

This needs to be addressed by Envion.

This is on page 12 of the prospectus: https://static.envion.org/kyc/Envion_Prospectus.pdf


"I TERM OF THE TOKENS
I. Term of the Token
The Tokens are issued for a period of 30 (thirty) years starting with commencement of the
Subscription Period (the end of that period: the “Termination Date”).
II. Redemption of the Tokens
1. The Issuer reserves the right to redeem the Tokens at any time prior to the Termination
Date up to an amount representing 99.9% of the equivalent of USD 1.00 (in words: one USDollar)
per Token. Notice of early redemption shall be given pursuant to clause M (Notices)
not less than 30 nor more than 60 days before the day fixed in the notice on which any Tokens "


Some more of my thoughts on Envion for those who are interested. I'm working in the field of renewable energies and therefore have been following this ICO regularly.


Today I told my coworker about the current hype with ICOs and he, who has been working with banks for the last 20 years, told me that it reminded him of 1999/early 2000s when people were throwing money at anything. He told me there was e.g. a company from Hongkong that said had invented tracking systems for trucks and were already selling products with a cash flow worth millions.

In the end it turned out the company had faked a great percentage of sales to their "customers" and hadn't even bothered to set up letterbox companies with the respective names they allegedly had sold these products to. The formerly acclaimed global yearly turnover of 93 million $ turned out to be more something like 1.5 million $.


With Envion what I have seen so far is that they don't have a working product yet.

Therefore there a few factors to consider if you want to assess the potential of their product:
First, it's just a prototype at the moment, which therefore cannot have been tested under the many different working conditions yet that it has to endure if it is to be distributed globally.
What about dusty, dry, hot, cold environments or everything in sequence within 24 hours, which happens if you put up a container next to a solar power plant in the desert.

Then the costs:
- of the Envion mining equipment itself
- the costs for transportation
- the costs for maintenance if something stops working

The availability of:
- cheap electricity
- of trained people who maintain the equipment

and if there are no trained mainentance staff available:
- the costs to hire and transport the staff to and from the mining site

Not even considering the initial investment cost, the advances in new mining hardware or the possible increase in network size and difficulty increase for many cryptos, the overall costs for running and maintenance will decide the profitability.


In my eyes this is why mining companies are located in Iceland and China. There is cheap electricity AND trained personnel available that does not have to travel around the globe to provide their service.

- And if there are other spots with even cheaper or nearly free electricity, why is it that they haven't been claimed yet? They have to be small niches which until now have not been interesting enough for the major players.


So either the niches Envion wants to exploit are small and if they are not the other factor, the costs for providing proper maintenance, is the reason that no one else is there yet.


If they put up their containers in Europe or the US they will find enough people capable to keep the systems running, but then, how are electricity prices there?


If you truly want cheap electricity it has to be produced at the lowest marginal costs possible, which in the long run means you have to go for renewables. However, medium and large power plants, like solar and wind, are only built if the demand or state subsidies will make this project economically feasible. In Germany, for example, the ROI for photovoltaic plants is around 12-14 years with the current state subsidy of around 0.11 €/kWh if you sell the electricity to the grid or even lower if you do not meet the criteria to receive the subsidies, which depends on the size of the plant.

So I wonder why a plant owner, at least in Germany or Europe, would want to sell electricity to Envion at a price which is lower than the one guaranteed by the state, which still is above market prices. And even if he doesn't receive the subsidies there is still a huge market he can sell electricity to at current market prices.

There is no reason why the plant owner should sell Envion electricity below market prices. Envion, of course, could buy at market prices but what would thein their edge be compared to other miners?

The next question is, how many plants there are that are desperate enough to sell their electricity below market prices or even below their marginal costs? This would entail e.g. power plants that were built without meeting the conditions of economic feasability in the first place, state projects that had to be abandoned due to increased costs, for example.

Envion doesn't provide any information where they think these potential niches are located. And if they know where they are, how big are they? As Envion wants to reinvest 25% of the returns into growing their infrastructure how long will it be until they run out of these yet unclaimed sources of cheap or free electricity.

Of course, if new niches appear on the planet, they can ship the containers to the other side of the globe. But how much is this going to cost compared to the earnings generated by their equipment during the available amount of time until that niche is closing again, e.g. as local demand in electricity goes up and the owner of the plant can charge other consumers higher prices than Envion? Does Envion hedge against this kind of risk or do they simply pack up under these circumstances and move somewhere else, which in turn causes new costs for transportation and set up at the new location?

The only long term feasible solution I can see at the moment is that Envion's (and any other) cryptomining is only profitable if marginal costs are driven as low as possible and stay that way. And places where these conditions are met are already occuppied (at least to a certain extent). So if Envion wants to be more profitable than other miners, they have to have lower costs than others and they have to avoid the additional costs, like moving and setting up equipment over and over or costs of transporting trained staff for maintenance.

Therefore, I see Envion's advantage against other miners, the mobility of their system also as its biggest Archilles heel as these additional costs will bite into their earnings. But if they want to reduce these costs, they will lose their advantage against other miners and will be just another mining company that moves to Iceland and buys electricity at market prices.


The only other feasible solution I see for profitable cryptomining is that Envion ensures low electricity prices by owning the power plant themselves and running their equipment on their own power. This would be the solution with the lowest marginal costs.

But then, why should you even bother with long term crypto mining using your own electricity when you could as well sell the electricity itself?


For me these questions are not answered or even asked.


What is definitely true is that the founders/members have already made a huge amount of money so far and I have to congratulate them on it. And if their product will prevail only time will show. It's just like in the good old dotcom times.


member
Activity: 117
Merit: 14
Same thing happened for me I just closed it after recieving all the confirmation emails that my documents were uploaded and were waiting for verification wich can take a couple of days.

I still recieved my tokens so I guess its fine to close the tab and carry on you can still log in later and restart the verification process if need be.

Can you see your tokens/transaction on the dashboard?

https://ico.envion.org/#!/dashboard

I've nothing there even though my transaction appears in their wallet at https://etherscan.io/address/0xd780ae2bf04cd96e577d3d014762f831d97129d0

Propably that damned KYC unlinked my ETH wallet from my account after numerous restart attempts for verification. Didn't want to miss out this one but apparently I'm forced to skip further transactions.
jr. member
Activity: 34
Merit: 1
So I read the prospectus and I found a RED FLAG. It allows the company to buy back your token at any time, for 1$. they just have to give 60 days notice:

"The Issuer reserves the right to redeem the Tokens at any time prior to the Termination
Date up to an amount representing 99.9% of the equivalent of USD 1.00"

This needs to be addressed by Envion.

This is on page 12 of the prospectus: https://static.envion.org/kyc/Envion_Prospectus.pdf


"I TERM OF THE TOKENS
I. Term of the Token
The Tokens are issued for a period of 30 (thirty) years starting with commencement of the
Subscription Period (the end of that period: the “Termination Date”).
II. Redemption of the Tokens
1. The Issuer reserves the right to redeem the Tokens at any time prior to the Termination
Date up to an amount representing 99.9% of the equivalent of USD 1.00 (in words: one USDollar)
per Token. Notice of early redemption shall be given pursuant to clause M (Notices)
not less than 30 nor more than 60 days before the day fixed in the notice on which any Tokens "


It's not a red flag, it's standard in every single security or equity purchase agreement.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Share_repurchase

Not at $1 value. A share buyback would be at market value at the time or some such agreed upon price.
Would you agree to buy apple shares for$500 if there was a clause to buy it back at $500 whenver they want? doesnt make sense right. Unless I am misreading it but that should be clarified. It seems to be a buyback for $1?

I can see this will be an issue we have to address with some more depth.  I'll provide a little more info now and we'll release a detailed statement.

It's technically not a repurchase.  It's a feature of the financial instrument that underlies the ICO.  ICOs don't really exist in the legitimate financial world right now, but envion worked with our legal team to find terms that would make an ICO possible now and viable into the future.

The redemption is not a buy back or a repurchase per se. It allows a refund to the purchaser up to 99.9% which means that you would be refunded your investment, but you would keep the ownership of your token and hence continue to receive the full value of the dividends entitled to you as the owner of that token.

We will elaborate on this concept in a blog post so that it's very clear how the financial instrument works and relates to the concept of ICOs.  The high-level take-away is that we can't take your tokens and that it's a good thing because it means the ICO is iron-clad from a legal standpoint.

Ok, I see what you mean, further down I see:
2. The Issuer shall redeem the remaining amount of the equivalent of USD 1.00 (in words:
one US-Dollar) per Token on Termination Date together with any Profit Participation due and
not paid yet Profit Participations are subject to Swiss withholding tax (currently 35%).

So the 99.9% is being redeemed, and then the full amount is redeemed after the 30 years.
Thanks for clarification.

... but what is the purpose of the clause then.

As they told, it is only for legal purposes.

Buying back it for 1 $ and still pay for dividends is like shooting yourself from the foot.

? "Legal purposes" is not an answer. You dont work for envion do you? I see their logo on your profile but I am inclined to think not. Let Envion answer please. Or at least someone from Envion that can elaborate briefly.
legendary
Activity: 1764
Merit: 1012
So I read the prospectus and I found a RED FLAG. It allows the company to buy back your token at any time, for 1$. they just have to give 60 days notice:

"The Issuer reserves the right to redeem the Tokens at any time prior to the Termination
Date up to an amount representing 99.9% of the equivalent of USD 1.00"

This needs to be addressed by Envion.

This is on page 12 of the prospectus: https://static.envion.org/kyc/Envion_Prospectus.pdf


"I TERM OF THE TOKENS
I. Term of the Token
The Tokens are issued for a period of 30 (thirty) years starting with commencement of the
Subscription Period (the end of that period: the “Termination Date”).
II. Redemption of the Tokens
1. The Issuer reserves the right to redeem the Tokens at any time prior to the Termination
Date up to an amount representing 99.9% of the equivalent of USD 1.00 (in words: one USDollar)
per Token. Notice of early redemption shall be given pursuant to clause M (Notices)
not less than 30 nor more than 60 days before the day fixed in the notice on which any Tokens "


It's not a red flag, it's standard in every single security or equity purchase agreement.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Share_repurchase

Not at $1 value. A share buyback would be at market value at the time or some such agreed upon price.
Would you agree to buy apple shares for$500 if there was a clause to buy it back at $500 whenver they want? doesnt make sense right. Unless I am misreading it but that should be clarified. It seems to be a buyback for $1?

I can see this will be an issue we have to address with some more depth.  I'll provide a little more info now and we'll release a detailed statement.

It's technically not a repurchase.  It's a feature of the financial instrument that underlies the ICO.  ICOs don't really exist in the legitimate financial world right now, but envion worked with our legal team to find terms that would make an ICO possible now and viable into the future.

The redemption is not a buy back or a repurchase per se. It allows a refund to the purchaser up to 99.9% which means that you would be refunded your investment, but you would keep the ownership of your token and hence continue to receive the full value of the dividends entitled to you as the owner of that token.

We will elaborate on this concept in a blog post so that it's very clear how the financial instrument works and relates to the concept of ICOs.  The high-level take-away is that we can't take your tokens and that it's a good thing because it means the ICO is iron-clad from a legal standpoint.

Ok, I see what you mean, further down I see:
2. The Issuer shall redeem the remaining amount of the equivalent of USD 1.00 (in words:
one US-Dollar) per Token on Termination Date together with any Profit Participation due and
not paid yet Profit Participations are subject to Swiss withholding tax (currently 35%).

So the 99.9% is being redeemed, and then the full amount is redeemed after the 30 years.
Thanks for clarification.

... but what is the purpose of the clause then.

As they told, it is only for legal purposes.

Buying back it for 1 $ and still pay for dividends is like shooting yourself from the foot.
member
Activity: 140
Merit: 10
For me it stays on "Starting/uploading your authorization process." even though in my e-mail I got 3 mails to thank me for uploading my documents..

Can you please confirm?
jr. member
Activity: 34
Merit: 1
So I read the prospectus and I found a RED FLAG. It allows the company to buy back your token at any time, for 1$. they just have to give 60 days notice:

"The Issuer reserves the right to redeem the Tokens at any time prior to the Termination
Date up to an amount representing 99.9% of the equivalent of USD 1.00"

This needs to be addressed by Envion.

This is on page 12 of the prospectus: https://static.envion.org/kyc/Envion_Prospectus.pdf


"I TERM OF THE TOKENS
I. Term of the Token
The Tokens are issued for a period of 30 (thirty) years starting with commencement of the
Subscription Period (the end of that period: the “Termination Date”).
II. Redemption of the Tokens
1. The Issuer reserves the right to redeem the Tokens at any time prior to the Termination
Date up to an amount representing 99.9% of the equivalent of USD 1.00 (in words: one USDollar)
per Token. Notice of early redemption shall be given pursuant to clause M (Notices)
not less than 30 nor more than 60 days before the day fixed in the notice on which any Tokens "


It's not a red flag, it's standard in every single security or equity purchase agreement.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Share_repurchase

Not at $1 value. A share buyback would be at market value at the time or some such agreed upon price.
Would you agree to buy apple shares for$500 if there was a clause to buy it back at $500 whenver they want? doesnt make sense right. Unless I am misreading it but that should be clarified. It seems to be a buyback for $1?

I can see this will be an issue we have to address with some more depth.  I'll provide a little more info now and we'll release a detailed statement.

It's technically not a repurchase.  It's a feature of the financial instrument that underlies the ICO.  ICOs don't really exist in the legitimate financial world right now, but envion worked with our legal team to find terms that would make an ICO possible now and viable into the future.

The redemption is not a buy back or a repurchase per se. It allows a refund to the purchaser up to 99.9% which means that you would be refunded your investment, but you would keep the ownership of your token and hence continue to receive the full value of the dividends entitled to you as the owner of that token.

We will elaborate on this concept in a blog post so that it's very clear how the financial instrument works and relates to the concept of ICOs.  The high-level take-away is that we can't take your tokens and that it's a good thing because it means the ICO is iron-clad from a legal standpoint.

Ok, I see what you mean, further down I see:
2. The Issuer shall redeem the remaining amount of the equivalent of USD 1.00 (in words:
one US-Dollar) per Token on Termination Date together with any Profit Participation due and
not paid yet Profit Participations are subject to Swiss withholding tax (currently 35%).

So the 99.9% is being redeemed, and then the full amount is redeemed after the 30 years.
Thanks for clarification.

... but what is the purpose of the clause then.
sr. member
Activity: 1302
Merit: 403
If there is such problems with verification, how other investors could make their own investments??
member
Activity: 70
Merit: 10
So I read the prospectus and I found a RED FLAG. It allows the company to buy back your token at any time, for 1$. they just have to give 60 days notice:

"The Issuer reserves the right to redeem the Tokens at any time prior to the Termination
Date up to an amount representing 99.9% of the equivalent of USD 1.00"

This needs to be addressed by Envion.

This is on page 12 of the prospectus: https://static.envion.org/kyc/Envion_Prospectus.pdf


"I TERM OF THE TOKENS
I. Term of the Token
The Tokens are issued for a period of 30 (thirty) years starting with commencement of the
Subscription Period (the end of that period: the “Termination Date”).
II. Redemption of the Tokens
1. The Issuer reserves the right to redeem the Tokens at any time prior to the Termination
Date up to an amount representing 99.9% of the equivalent of USD 1.00 (in words: one USDollar)
per Token. Notice of early redemption shall be given pursuant to clause M (Notices)
not less than 30 nor more than 60 days before the day fixed in the notice on which any Tokens "


It's not a red flag, it's standard in every single security or equity purchase agreement.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Share_repurchase

Not at $1 value. A share buyback would be at market value at the time or some such agreed upon price.
Would you agree to buy apple shares for$500 if there was a clause to buy it back at $500 whenver they want? doesnt make sense right. Unless I am misreading it but that should be clarified. It seems to be a buyback for $1?

I can see this will be an issue we have to address with some more depth.  I'll provide a little more info now and we'll release a detailed statement.

It's technically not a repurchase.  It's a feature of the financial instrument that underlies the ICO.  ICOs don't really exist in the legitimate financial world right now, but envion worked with our legal team to find terms that would make an ICO possible now and viable into the future.

The redemption is not a buy back or a repurchase per se. It allows a refund to the purchaser up to 99.9% which means that you would be refunded your investment, but you would keep the ownership of your token and hence continue to receive the full value of the dividends entitled to you as the owner of that token.

We will elaborate on this concept in a blog post so that it's very clear how the financial instrument works and relates to the concept of ICOs.  The high-level take-away is that we can't take your tokens and that it's a good thing because it means the ICO is iron-clad from a legal standpoint.
legendary
Activity: 1764
Merit: 1012
all of you that buy this have forgotten what crypto is. verification for buying? is this a government pump and dump project? wanted to invest 1k $ but no ty

They must obey the laws or they can't run a business otherwise and can't pay our dividends.

KYC is a must for this kind of projects. I don't like it either but there is nothing to do.
newbie
Activity: 18
Merit: 0
all of you that buy this have forgotten what crypto is. verification for buying? is this a government pump and dump project? wanted to invest 1k $ but no ty
jr. member
Activity: 34
Merit: 1
So I read the prospectus and I found a RED FLAG. It allows the company to buy back your token at any time, for 1$. they just have to give 60 days notice:

"The Issuer reserves the right to redeem the Tokens at any time prior to the Termination
Date up to an amount representing 99.9% of the equivalent of USD 1.00"

This needs to be addressed by Envion.

This is on page 12 of the prospectus: https://static.envion.org/kyc/Envion_Prospectus.pdf


"I TERM OF THE TOKENS
I. Term of the Token
The Tokens are issued for a period of 30 (thirty) years starting with commencement of the
Subscription Period (the end of that period: the “Termination Date”).
II. Redemption of the Tokens
1. The Issuer reserves the right to redeem the Tokens at any time prior to the Termination
Date up to an amount representing 99.9% of the equivalent of USD 1.00 (in words: one USDollar)
per Token. Notice of early redemption shall be given pursuant to clause M (Notices)
not less than 30 nor more than 60 days before the day fixed in the notice on which any Tokens "


It's not a red flag, it's standard in every single security or equity purchase agreement.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Share_repurchase

Not at $1 value. A share buyback would be at market value at the time or some such agreed upon price.
Would you agree to buy apple shares for$500 if there was a clause to buy it back at $500 whenver they want? doesnt make sense right. Unless I am misreading it but that should be clarified. It seems to be a buyback for $1?
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