Topic: [ANN][XCP] Counterparty - Pioneering Peer-to-Peer Finance - Official Thread - page 174. (Read 1276789 times)

So lets say you start a company today (in regular wallstreet) and i want to buy stocks of your company. The moment I use a normal exchange and I think i'm buying your asset it goes through multiple clearing houses and at the end I think I have a share of your company but because of all these (middle man companies) it's possible that someone else has paperwork thinking they have the same stock that i bought. In other words a situation happens where there is a possibility of corruption and also a possibility of a situation where multiple people think they own the same exact asset, which is totally cool as long as the people who think they own an asset don't try to actually physically ask for that asset lol. Anyways a clearinghouse is not inherently a problem, it just leaves the "possibility" of corruption because it's a middle man of sorts. What Patrick (CEO of overstock) initially desired when he talked about creating a crypto currency version of wallstreet is basically a peer to peer system where say if you are starting a company and you want to sell stock, and I decide to purchase shares of your company, it's directly between me and you. If I purchase a stock from you it's going from you to me and not from you to a middle man to another middle man, to another middle man and finally i potentially have ownership rights of that stock (in theory). So what actually happened was the "law" told patrick that no matter what he needs a clearinghouse (Middle man company to authenticate the transactions of equity shares from a company to an investor). Now remember having a middle man introduces the "possibility" of future corruption, but basically Patrick is like you know what, ok fine by law we need a clearing house, ok we will make the system so transparent anyways by using block chain technology that it will still be 80% better than the regular stock market system.

what is the issue with a "clearing house"? or, what is a clearing house?

The guys at the wallstreet journal write their new article with a bit of pessimistic flair using terms like "it falls short" and "Medici's limits" etc..
Ok so there will be a clearinghouse but so what, this will be a great step to creating a more peer to peer world and I'm sure the crypto community is willing to accept a few bumps in the road and sacrifices to make the necessary headway in this world that is still dominated by central powers.

http://blogs.wsj.com/moneybeat/2014/10/24/bitbeat-the-promise-and-limits-of-overstocks-crypto-stock-exchange/?utm_content=buffer94df6&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer

Note, this is a proposal to temporarily remove it from the version of Counterwallet that we host, not from the Counterparty distributed exchange.

Is it for both Sell and Buy or only for Buy with BTC orders ?  (like it was on Masterchest)

There is at least one additional reason for XCP to have value. Another spam prevention mechanism:

"There is a small fee per recipient with dividends, to prevent SPAM." See here - https://github.com/CounterpartyXCP/Counterparty/blob/master/README.md.

This fee is burned. Currently this dividend fee is set to 0.0002 XCP per recipient. I.e. 5,000 dividend recipients = 1 XCP burned.

Removing BTC based trading from Counterwallet proposed, please comment here: https://github.com/CounterpartyXCP/counterwallet/issues/560

+1

I agree. I also vote for removing BTC from the DEX until a better solution is found. I'd like to add that the DEX works very well for XCP and any other assets.

Not in any very obvious way, no. It certainly doesn't give warnings that the issue is being abused by a couple people. It's one thing if an order drops because someone accidentally logs out, that's bound to happen a few times. It's another if there are a couple people actively abusing it to game the exchange.

I completely understand where you are coming from. I was just frustrated by your first few sentences. I find it to be quite useable.


Doesn't Counterwallet give warnings about using BTCPay anyway?

No problem, I'm just trying to think about how newcomers will approach counterparty/counterwallet, first impressions are important!

Solid feedback. Thanks for taking the time to report the issue in detail.

Not trying to bash the entire DEx, but it's silly to assume that the majority of new people coming to counterwallet won't be operating in BTC, though. It's not unreasonable to give people fair warning about the fact that BTC on the exchange, does not function very well. It should be visible somewhere on the exchange or wallet itself, not buried in this thread..

Please appreciate that this only occurs for BTC trading. There is no need to bash the entire DEx for that. There are ways to improve the BTC trading experience. These are being explored/developed. Try using XBTC instead, for example.

Ok, I'm just saying they should not have the xcp/btc exchange open right now. I've seen people complaining about it all week and it simply does not work. It should just be closed for now until they sort out btcpay because it's opening the door to financial loss for new people. That post you quoted is from august and there's no way I could find that in this thread easily. There should be an announcement about the exchange posted somewhere accessible, to discourage BTC use currently. Devs being aware of the issue, and new counterwallet users being aware, are two different things of different importance.

The developers are very aware of the problems with BTCPay in the DEX (although it is interesting to hear them spelled out in detail).  That is the reason why at the top of the Counterwallet, there is the notice: "The easiest way to buy XCP is to use Quick Buy in Counterwallet. For traditional exchanges, click here."  Buying XCP with BTC should be done using Vennd (Quick Buy), and selling XCP for BTC should be done using a centralized exchange.  IIRC, they announced a while ago that they are working on a solution to the BTCPay issue.

Buying and selling assets for XCP, on the other hand, works pretty well.


Ok, this was in August.  @xnova @phantomphreak Is there any update?

I had to register just to ask this. Can you guys please fix or address the decentralized exchange in Counterwallet? It's nigh unusable at the moment.

It is possible to tie a sellers coins up for 3+ hours and sometimes more, if a person buys an order and then logs out of Counterwallet, the BTCpay will simply remain in an unconfirmed state and hold the sellers coin/asset in escrow indefinitely, until it cancels. The only option for the seller is to cancel his order at a fee, or wait an indeterminate amount of time for the order to expire. This is completely unfair and opens the door to serious gaming, which is already happening.

At least one seller has been gaming the market and indefinitely tying up other sellers coins. He lists his own XCP at 15% higher than poloniex and bter, anyone who sells under him gets their orders "bought" by him, and held in escrow so they are off the order list entirely, leaving only his inflated coins to buy. Whoever does this has 2-3 BTC wallets and has been holding other sellers funds via this logout method for days now, while he trades his own BTC/XCP to himself to distort the market value and try to catch some noob willing to pay too much.

Please address this issue, or make a public announcement that the exchange should not be used until this can be amended, because all it does is cause pure frustration and ties my coins up in limbo for hours unless I pay to cancel my order. I still have 0.1 BTC floating aruond somewhere that hasn't been returned from a 4 day old order. Of all the orders I've put up, only 6% have actually gone through. 94% have expired. It's ridiculous and should not be open in its current state.

All this exchange will do is scare off new people if that's their first experience with counterwallet. I've already seen 5-6 new people complaining about the exchange and about this glitch since I started reading chat a lot, just over a week ago. If the userbase picks up and newcomers think they can do arbitrage or something and place orders once they see that they've "sold" their coins, there will be some pissed off folk. I really like counterparty don't get me wrong, the exchange is just busted as hell and being gamed by 1-2 jerks.

I'm gathering more details as we speak.

80kB?  LOL, that would be pretty big.  We don't want to store PNG images or XML documents in the blockchain, just a little financial data.

They had to with Bitcoin tanking and Overstock putting Counterparty on the map. I won't be surprised if they implement the 80kB OP_RETURN soon.