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Topic: ANTMINER U3 Discussion and Support Thread - page 70. (Read 149415 times)

full member
Activity: 138
Merit: 102
October 28, 2014, 04:19:42 PM
There is customs duty to add as well surely. VAT is to do with Bitmain.  Below a certain price, no VAT or Duty is payable.

I buy lots of stuff from China and never pay any duty or VAT because I keep the cost and weight below certain amounts and perhaps because the vendors lie about the price I paid. Of course this is not possible with a minimum order quantity of 20.  Perhaps Bitmain should team up with some of the vendors in Shenzhen that one can find on aliexpress.com

... You can't complain that Bitmain isn't illegally underdeclaring the value of goods, that's not a valid expectation. Pay your taxes.

I'm complaining that a DIY device is not being marketed and that the order quantity is ridiculous.  There would be no power supply included and it would be up to the recipient to bolt on a heatsink and cooling.  I've got plenty of heatsinks and cooling fans from defunct processors.  With the cost of VAT and duty and the mark up of middle men, these are being marketed to the naive.  How is that for ethical company behaviour ?

Additionally I pay all the taxes that I'm asked to pay so I resent your allegation that I'm not.

1) This is NOT a DIY device
2) Don't buy it if you don't want to
3) I resent that you're resenting that I resented that you were asking Bitmain to underdeclare the value of imported goods in order to avoid you having to pay taxes.


I'm perfectly aware that it is not a DIY device.
You're helping to market a device that will never make a cent for the purchasers.
I was asking no such thing.  I just remarked upon how it is that I've never paid VAT or duty on items from China.


It's true, there was no request to lower stated cost for customs or taxation purposes from what I read.

Dogie, if your role in this thread is that of a company representative you should temper your words and act accordingly.

And to Tupsu's point, it doesn't matter where the added expense comes from; it the product costs too much (net to the consumer) then it's "No Sale". Don't create friction in the purchase process. This isn't Q4 2013, when even rational people tripped over themselves to throw money out the window.
newbie
Activity: 51
Merit: 0
October 28, 2014, 02:01:37 PM
There is customs duty to add as well surely. VAT is to do with Bitmain.  Below a certain price, no VAT or Duty is payable.

I buy lots of stuff from China and never pay any duty or VAT because I keep the cost and weight below certain amounts and perhaps because the vendors lie about the price I paid. Of course this is not possible with a minimum order quantity of 20.  Perhaps Bitmain should team up with some of the vendors in Shenzhen that one can find on aliexpress.com

... You can't complain that Bitmain isn't illegally underdeclaring the value of goods, that's not a valid expectation. Pay your taxes.

I'm complaining that a DIY device is not being marketed and that the order quantity is ridiculous.  There would be no power supply included and it would be up to the recipient to bolt on a heatsink and cooling.  I've got plenty of heatsinks and cooling fans from defunct processors.  With the cost of VAT and duty and the mark up of middle men, these are being marketed to the naive.  How is that for ethical company behaviour ?

Additionally I pay all the taxes that I'm asked to pay so I resent your allegation that I'm not.

1) This is NOT a DIY device
2) Don't buy it if you don't want to
3) I resent that you're resenting that I resented that you were asking Bitmain to underdeclare the value of imported goods in order to avoid you having to pay taxes.


I'm perfectly aware that it is not a DIY device.
You're helping to market a device that will never make a cent for the purchasers.
I was asking no such thing.  I just remarked upon how it is that I've never paid VAT or duty on items from China.
legendary
Activity: 1666
Merit: 1185
dogiecoin.com
October 28, 2014, 01:48:59 PM
There is customs duty to add as well surely. VAT is to do with Bitmain.  Below a certain price, no VAT or Duty is payable.

I buy lots of stuff from China and never pay any duty or VAT because I keep the cost and weight below certain amounts and perhaps because the vendors lie about the price I paid. Of course this is not possible with a minimum order quantity of 20.  Perhaps Bitmain should team up with some of the vendors in Shenzhen that one can find on aliexpress.com

... You can't complain that Bitmain isn't illegally underdeclaring the value of goods, that's not a valid expectation. Pay your taxes.

I'm complaining that a DIY device is not being marketed and that the order quantity is ridiculous.  There would be no power supply included and it would be up to the recipient to bolt on a heatsink and cooling.  I've got plenty of heatsinks and cooling fans from defunct processors.  With the cost of VAT and duty and the mark up of middle men, these are being marketed to the naive.  How is that for ethical company behaviour ?

Additionally I pay all the taxes that I'm asked to pay so I resent your allegation that I'm not.

1) This is NOT a DIY device
2) Don't buy it if you don't want to
3) I resent that you're resenting that I resented that you were asking Bitmain to underdeclare the value of imported goods in order to avoid you having to pay taxes.
newbie
Activity: 51
Merit: 0
October 28, 2014, 01:43:32 PM
There is customs duty to add as well surely. VAT is to do with Bitmain.  Below a certain price, no VAT or Duty is payable.

I buy lots of stuff from China and never pay any duty or VAT because I keep the cost and weight below certain amounts and perhaps because the vendors lie about the price I paid. Of course this is not possible with a minimum order quantity of 20.  Perhaps Bitmain should team up with some of the vendors in Shenzhen that one can find on aliexpress.com

... You can't complain that Bitmain isn't illegally underdeclaring the value of goods, that's not a valid expectation. Pay your taxes.

I'm complaining that a DIY device is not being marketed and that the order quantity is ridiculous.  There would be no power supply included and it would be up to the recipient to bolt on a heatsink and cooling.  I've got plenty of heatsinks and cooling fans from defunct processors.  With the cost of VAT and duty and the mark up of middle men, these are being marketed to the naive.  How is that for ethical company behaviour ?

Additionally I pay all the taxes that I'm asked to pay so I resent your allegation that I'm not.
legendary
Activity: 1232
Merit: 1011
October 28, 2014, 12:21:06 PM
There is customs duty to add as well surely. VAT is to do with Bitmain.  Below a certain price, no VAT or Duty is payable.

I buy lots of stuff from China and never pay any duty or VAT because I keep the cost and weight below certain amounts and perhaps because the vendors lie about the price I paid. Of course this is not possible with a minimum order quantity of 20.  Perhaps Bitmain should team up with some of the vendors in Shenzhen that one can find on aliexpress.com

... You can't complain that Bitmain isn't illegally underdeclaring the value of goods, that's not a valid expectation. Pay your taxes.

I agree with this fully.  Asking the most trusted ASCI creators to pull Illegal moves is not a good move for bitcoin.


why not? not so long time ago Bitmain had no problems to underdeclare goods.

but I guess that was before establishing as the most trusted ASIC vendor. now it is just any other asic company, with huge mining operation, with payed shills on forums, etc.
full member
Activity: 224
Merit: 100
October 28, 2014, 10:57:34 AM
Will you provide a RPi img for these miners?
If yes, than do it also for the B+ model, thanks!
legendary
Activity: 1722
Merit: 1000
October 28, 2014, 08:38:01 AM
There is customs duty to add as well surely. VAT is to do with Bitmain.  Below a certain price, no VAT or Duty is payable.

I buy lots of stuff from China and never pay any duty or VAT because I keep the cost and weight below certain amounts and perhaps because the vendors lie about the price I paid. Of course this is not possible with a minimum order quantity of 20.  Perhaps Bitmain should team up with some of the vendors in Shenzhen that one can find on aliexpress.com

... You can't complain that Bitmain isn't illegally underdeclaring the value of goods, that's not a valid expectation. Pay your taxes.

I agree with this fully.  Asking the most trusted ASCI creators to pull Illegal moves is not a good move for bitcoin.
legendary
Activity: 1666
Merit: 1185
dogiecoin.com
October 27, 2014, 11:34:55 PM
There is customs duty to add as well surely. VAT is to do with Bitmain.  Below a certain price, no VAT or Duty is payable.

I buy lots of stuff from China and never pay any duty or VAT because I keep the cost and weight below certain amounts and perhaps because the vendors lie about the price I paid. Of course this is not possible with a minimum order quantity of 20.  Perhaps Bitmain should team up with some of the vendors in Shenzhen that one can find on aliexpress.com

... You can't complain that Bitmain isn't illegally underdeclaring the value of goods, that's not a valid expectation. Pay your taxes.
newbie
Activity: 51
Merit: 0
October 27, 2014, 07:58:08 PM

Thats because Estonia is expensive to ship to, you can take that up with UPS. Shipping to UK is $230.

PS, VAT is nothing to do with shipping prices or Bitmain, its your government charging that.

There is customs duty to add as well surely.

VAT is to do with Bitmain.  Below a certain price, no VAT or Duty is payable.

I buy lots of stuff from China and never pay any duty or VAT because I keep the cost and weight below certain amounts and perhaps because the vendors lie about the price I paid. Of course this is not possible with a minimum order quantity of 20.  Perhaps Bitmain should team up with some of the vendors in Shenzhen that one can find on aliexpress.com
legendary
Activity: 1218
Merit: 1003
October 27, 2014, 07:54:21 AM

Thats because Estonia is expensive to ship to, you can take that up with UPS. Shipping to UK is $230.

PS, VAT is nothing to do with shipping prices or Bitmain, its your government charging that.

My only shipping choice is UPS  for  543.85 USD .



legendary
Activity: 1666
Merit: 1185
dogiecoin.com
October 27, 2014, 07:32:26 AM
#99

Also MOQ is down to 20 for those wanting to purchase directly now. Its still quite a few but better than 60. You could probably share 10 and 10 with a friend.

I give up.
Shipping to my location in EU still 543.85 USD
27,19 USD per piece + 20% VAT = 32,63 USD per piece for shipping.

Item cost 1120 USD +20% VAT = 1344 USD : 20= 67,2 USD per piece

Thats because Estonia is expensive to ship to, you can take that up with UPS. Shipping to UK is $230.

PS, VAT is nothing to do with shipping prices or Bitmain, its your government charging that.
legendary
Activity: 1218
Merit: 1003
October 27, 2014, 07:23:19 AM
#98

Also MOQ is down to 20 for those wanting to purchase directly now. Its still quite a few but better than 60. You could probably share 10 and 10 with a friend.

I give up.
Shipping to my location in EU still 543.85 USD
27,19 USD per piece + 20% VAT = 32,63 USD per piece for shipping.

Item cost 1120 USD +20% VAT = 1344 USD : 20= 67,2 USD per piece

Total cost per item 99,83 USD
Too late, too expensive.

legendary
Activity: 1666
Merit: 1185
dogiecoin.com
October 27, 2014, 02:54:08 AM
#97
The "retailers" will jack the price up wiping out any ROI potential that ever existed unfortunately.  Sad

I don't believe these are designed for ROI.. I believe these are designed to just be slick miners for people who wish to just mine and not spend a lot.  The prices won't be that expensive IMO.   Eyeboot.com for example has very reasonable prices.

Also MOQ is down to 20 for those wanting to purchase directly now. Its still quite a few but better than 60. You could probably share 10 and 10 with a friend.
legendary
Activity: 1722
Merit: 1000
October 26, 2014, 07:28:08 PM
#96
The "retailers" will jack the price up wiping out any ROI potential that ever existed unfortunately.  Sad

I don't believe these are designed for ROI.. I believe these are designed to just be slick miners for people who wish to just mine and not spend a lot.  The prices won't be that expensive IMO.   Eyeboot.com for example has very reasonable prices.
legendary
Activity: 1722
Merit: 1000
October 26, 2014, 07:21:03 PM
#95
Looks slick, IMO could be quite awesome for anyone just wanting to get into a bit of mining.
legendary
Activity: 1666
Merit: 1185
dogiecoin.com
October 26, 2014, 05:36:29 PM
#94
1) no its not, it's an external brick like the BFL jalapeño had.
2) it probably is. Likely about 15% the weight of the final package

1) That's what I said :/
2) Its probably not even 15% due to the heftiness of the U3 and the packaging. But even at 15%, its not going to make a huge difference to the shipping.

As I've said above, we evaluated adding a second SKU and determined it wasn't worthwhile. Now if several people were to come together and show that they'd order a few 100 of that SKU, then Bitmain can reconsider it. But again, its not going to have the cost benefits you're expecting.
legendary
Activity: 2128
Merit: 1005
ASIC Wannabe
October 26, 2014, 02:04:21 PM
#93
The point and what you said are valid, i've seen too many power supplies come from China which can only be called an electrical death trap and/or an EMC compliance nightmare.

Seriously, anyone can get power supplies that can kick out 6A, we don't need power supplies that will either throw out too much RFI or burn someones house to the ground, after all, anyone reselling these in Europe (and I assume other countries, but I wouldn't know) will be liable for it.

These are the same PSUs you buy in the US and EU from Amazon - it all comes from China. We looked at making a no PSU SKU and the price wouldn't make a lot of sense so everyone would buy the with PSU SKU.

1. Pieh0 is right, there is a big internal difference between a well designed quality psu and a cheap firestarter...
You are welcome to post a full CE check report and PICs from the internal design

2. It make no sense to pay high air freight cost for a PSU

So please offer them without PSU and let customer decide (if anybody want to buy them ;-))

We're talking about AC/DC PSUs, not ATX PSUs.

The non AC/DC package fundamentally didn't make any sense.

1) The U3 packaging includes the PSU internally and so its not as simple as not including the PSU in the first place. The PSUs would have to be actively removed.
2) The PSU's weight isn't significant at all compared to the miner.
3) The price difference was too small to make it worth creating another SKU.

1) no its not, it's an external brick like the BFL jalapeño had.
2) it probably is. Likely about 15% the weight of the final package
legendary
Activity: 1666
Merit: 1185
dogiecoin.com
October 26, 2014, 05:03:38 AM
#92
The point and what you said are valid, i've seen too many power supplies come from China which can only be called an electrical death trap and/or an EMC compliance nightmare.

Seriously, anyone can get power supplies that can kick out 6A, we don't need power supplies that will either throw out too much RFI or burn someones house to the ground, after all, anyone reselling these in Europe (and I assume other countries, but I wouldn't know) will be liable for it.

These are the same PSUs you buy in the US and EU from Amazon - it all comes from China. We looked at making a no PSU SKU and the price wouldn't make a lot of sense so everyone would buy the with PSU SKU.

1. Pieh0 is right, there is a big internal difference between a well designed quality psu and a cheap firestarter...
You are welcome to post a full CE check report and PICs from the internal design

2. It make no sense to pay high air freight cost for a PSU

So please offer them without PSU and let customer decide (if anybody want to buy them ;-))

We're talking about AC/DC PSUs, not ATX PSUs.

The non AC/DC package fundamentally didn't make any sense.

1) The U3 packaging includes the PSU internally and so its not as simple as not including the PSU in the first place. The PSUs would have to be actively removed.
2) The PSU's weight isn't significant at all compared to the miner.
3) The price difference was too small to make it worth creating another SKU.
yxt
legendary
Activity: 3528
Merit: 1116
October 25, 2014, 06:39:26 AM
#91
The point and what you said are valid, i've seen too many power supplies come from China which can only be called an electrical death trap and/or an EMC compliance nightmare.

Seriously, anyone can get power supplies that can kick out 6A, we don't need power supplies that will either throw out too much RFI or burn someones house to the ground, after all, anyone reselling these in Europe (and I assume other countries, but I wouldn't know) will be liable for it.

These are the same PSUs you buy in the US and EU from Amazon - it all comes from China. We looked at making a no PSU SKU and the price wouldn't make a lot of sense so everyone would buy the with PSU SKU.

1.
Pieh0 is right, there is a big internal difference between a well designed quality psu and a cheap firestarter...
You are welcome to post a full CE check report and PICs from the internal design

2.
It make no sense to pay high air freight cost for a PSU


So please offer them without PSU and let customer decide (if anybody want to buy them ;-))



legendary
Activity: 1666
Merit: 1185
dogiecoin.com
October 23, 2014, 11:25:28 PM
#90
The point and what you said are valid, i've seen too many power supplies come from China which can only be called an electrical death trap and/or an EMC compliance nightmare.

Seriously, anyone can get power supplies that can kick out 6A, we don't need power supplies that will either throw out too much RFI or burn someones house to the ground, after all, anyone reselling these in Europe (and I assume other countries, but I wouldn't know) will be liable for it.

These are the same PSUs you buy in the US and EU from Amazon - it all comes from China. We looked at making a no PSU SKU and the price wouldn't make a lot of sense so everyone would buy the with PSU SKU.
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