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Topic: ASICMINER: Entering the Future of ASIC Mining by Inventing It - page 1154. (Read 3917543 times)

full member
Activity: 236
Merit: 100
www.bitcoingem.com
Estimated increase in divs (not including the hashrate increase) is 0.00507625 BTC per share.  Grin

Well, technically the INCREASE in divs is 0.00322625  Cheesy

(2042.5-752)/400000 = 0.00322625
sorry for dumb question but what is the 752?

He said it right under the equation:

(2042.5-752)/400000 = 0.00322625
because the income of the auction last week has then to be substracted from this week's auction.

legendary
Activity: 2478
Merit: 1020
Be A Digital Miner
Estimated increase in divs (not including the hashrate increase) is 0.00507625 BTC per share.  Grin

Well, technically the INCREASE in divs is 0.00322625  Cheesy

(2042.5-752)/400000 = 0.00322625
sorry for dumb question but what is the 752?
full member
Activity: 185
Merit: 100
The motions have been posted.  I split them up so that each modification sinks/swims on it's own.

https://btct.co/security/ASICMINER-PT (motions tab)

Cheers.
I hate to bother you,but did you get my pm?
sr. member
Activity: 322
Merit: 252
Estimated increase in divs (not including the hashrate increase) is 0.00507625 BTC per share.  Grin

Well, technically the INCREASE in divs is 0.00322625 BTC/share Cheesy

(2042.5-752)/400000 = 0.00322625
Because the income of the auction last week then has to be substracted from this week's auction.

Not that I'm complaining  Grin
sr. member
Activity: 294
Merit: 250
http://coin.furuknap.net/
Well, whaddayaknow, I actually spoke to him about that today too, after soliciting feedback from this forum about a 100-split PT that would make DRIP far more possible.

.b

Sounds interesting, but would the 100-split PT be non-voting shares? I would be certainly for more liquidity and options for people who find the non-split price hefty. But still want that true fractional share DRIP. Smiley If this can be done with many blue chip companies, why not in the BTC world? (challenge thrown out)

It would work exactly like the existing PT; no voting, conversion on a 1:100 base only (ie 100 PT/100 can be converted to 1 regular AM), dividend pass-through, maybe with some kind of fee for the work involved.

Until we got colored coins, though, I think this is the way to go.

.b
legendary
Activity: 1288
Merit: 1227
Away on an extended break
Estimated increase in divs (not including the hashrate increase) is 0.00507625 BTC per share.  Grin
legendary
Activity: 1106
Merit: 1006
Lead Blockchain Developer
In that case, you really need to compare to the average fee on BTCT too, which is 0.2%.

Looks like I made an error on the original calculation - 0.2% instead of 0.4% so good catch. Regardless, I'm of the buy and hold mindset right now and any way to avoid fees I'm all for. Now if either BitFunder or btct can implement a true DRIP with fractional share repurchases (obviously with friedcat's blessing) then I will be won over 100%. Grin

Well, whaddayaknow, I actually spoke to him about that today too, after soliciting feedback from this forum about a 100-split PT that would make DRIP far more possible.

.b

The motions have been posted.  I split them up so that each modification sinks/swims on it's own.

https://btct.co/security/ASICMINER-PT (motions tab)

Cheers.
hero member
Activity: 752
Merit: 500
bitcoin hodler
9,020.00 GH/s on BTC Guild, just sayin...

anyway - 3500 BTC for a week of mining on 9 Thash/s, then around 2500 BTC from sale of devices, makes a nice 0.015 BTC dividend per share Smiley

friedcat will be the next Bill Gates / Steve Jobs...
member
Activity: 87
Merit: 10
Well, whaddayaknow, I actually spoke to him about that today too, after soliciting feedback from this forum about a 100-split PT that would make DRIP far more possible.

.b

Sounds interesting, but would the 100-split PT be non-voting shares? I would be certainly for more liquidity and options for people who find the non-split price hefty. But still want that true fractional share DRIP. Smiley If this can be done with many blue chip companies, why not in the BTC world? (challenge thrown out)
sr. member
Activity: 294
Merit: 250
http://coin.furuknap.net/
In that case, you really need to compare to the average fee on BTCT too, which is 0.2%.

Looks like I made an error on the original calculation - 0.2% instead of 0.4% so good catch. Regardless, I'm of the buy and hold mindset right now and any way to avoid fees I'm all for. Now if either BitFunder or btct can implement a true DRIP with fractional share repurchases (obviously with friedcat's blessing) then I will be won over 100%. Grin

Well, whaddayaknow, I actually spoke to him about that today too, after soliciting feedback from this forum about a 100-split PT that would make DRIP far more possible.

.b
member
Activity: 87
Merit: 10
In that case, you really need to compare to the average fee on BTCT too, which is 0.2%.

Looks like I made an error on the original calculation - 0.2% instead of 0.4% so good catch. Regardless, I'm of the buy and hold mindset right now and any way to avoid fees I'm all for. Now if either BitFunder or btct can implement a true DRIP with fractional share repurchases (obviously with friedcat's blessing) then I will be won over 100%. Grin
sr. member
Activity: 294
Merit: 250
http://coin.furuknap.net/
I still don't get how you come up with 0,25% to 0,5% with BF. There's a 0,5%-1% fee on sales, so a flip will include that no matter if the buy is 0%. They say in the FAQ that if you are a day trader, you can get the fees down as low as 0.25%, but for most small to medium investors, that's not going to be an option.

Do a ฿100 buy and sell, regardless of time span, and you'll be out between ฿0.5 and ฿1 on Bitfunder, but always ฿0.4 on BTCT. I can't see how that's even; BF is at best 25% more expensive and at worst 150% more expensive.

0% fee on buy and 0.5% to 1% fee on sell = average fee on a transaction (buy or sell) is (0.5% - 1%) / 2 = 0.25% to 0.5%

In that case, you really need to compare to the average fee on BTCT too, which is 0.2%.


My point was that with the dividend fee and withdrawal fee, it might be a wash to better if you qualify for the discount. The tiering is based on the last 60 days so one doesn't necessarily need to be a day trader, just buy/sell a combined 50+ BTC in 60 days to start earning discounts.

And also you can avoid the sell fee by accumulating more than 250 shares and transferring out to non-passthrough shares as mentioned by someone else. A strategy is to buy cheap PT shares and accumulate/dividend invest, and supplement with non-PT shares purchased through auctions and transfer those to PT shares.

If the dividend fee is going away then for a buy and flipper btct.co is better. But for a longer-term buy and holder, BitFunder can be better because you can avoid fees altogether (sale or withdrawal fees).

Plus I will believe that the dividend fee is going away on btct when I actually see it written down in the details or there is a motion passed.

I'm sure burnside will get around to the motion soon, I just spoke with him about it yesterday :-)

.b
member
Activity: 87
Merit: 10
I still don't get how you come up with 0,25% to 0,5% with BF. There's a 0,5%-1% fee on sales, so a flip will include that no matter if the buy is 0%. They say in the FAQ that if you are a day trader, you can get the fees down as low as 0.25%, but for most small to medium investors, that's not going to be an option.

Do a ฿100 buy and sell, regardless of time span, and you'll be out between ฿0.5 and ฿1 on Bitfunder, but always ฿0.4 on BTCT. I can't see how that's even; BF is at best 25% more expensive and at worst 150% more expensive.

0% fee on buy and 0.5% to 1% fee on sell = average fee on a transaction (buy or sell) is (0.5% - 1%) / 2 = 0.25% to 0.5%

My point was that with the dividend fee and withdrawal fee, it might be a wash to better if you qualify for the discount. The tiering is based on the last 60 days so one doesn't necessarily need to be a day trader, just buy/sell a combined 50+ BTC in 60 days to start earning discounts.

And also you can avoid the sell fee by accumulating more than 250 shares and transferring out to non-passthrough shares as mentioned by someone else. A strategy is to buy cheap PT shares and accumulate/dividend invest, and supplement with non-PT shares purchased through auctions and transfer those to PT shares.

If the dividend fee is going away then for a buy and flipper btct.co is better. But for a longer-term buy and holder, BitFunder can be better because you can avoid fees altogether (sale or withdrawal fees).

Plus I will believe that the dividend fee is going away on btct when I actually see it written down in the details or there is a motion passed.
sr. member
Activity: 294
Merit: 250
http://coin.furuknap.net/
If that is the case then it makes things slightly more equal (outside of the btct.co withdrawal fee and discount to 0.5% sale on BitFunder based on trading volume). But I guess let's the market decide. Grin

I still don't get how you come up with 0,25% to 0,5% with BF. There's a 0,5%-1% fee on sales, so a flip will include that no matter if the buy is 0%. They say in the FAQ that if you are a day trader, you can get the fees down as low as 0.25%, but for most small to medium investors, that's not going to be an option.

Do a ฿100 buy and sell, regardless of time span, and you'll be out between ฿0.5 and ฿1 on Bitfunder, but always ฿0.4 on BTCT. I can't see how that's even; BF is at best 25% more expensive and at worst 150% more expensive.

.b

member
Activity: 87
Merit: 10
The dividend fee is scheduled to be removed completely, according to burnside, and would in any case apply to the whole market, not individual owners. In other words, the 10,000 fee of 0.5% would have been for the entire market, not just individual holder of more than 10,000 shares.

.b

If that is the case then it makes things slightly more equal (outside of the btct.co withdrawal fee and discount to 0.5% sale on BitFunder based on trading volume). But I guess let's let the market decide. Grin
sr. member
Activity: 294
Merit: 250
http://coin.furuknap.net/
For btct.co, it's a 0.2% buy fee (with 2FA), 0.2% sale fee (with 2FA), bitcoind withdrawal fee (can be up to 0.0025 BTC) and eventual dividend fee (0.5% to 3%).

The dividend fee is scheduled to be removed completely, according to burnside, and would in any case apply to the whole market, not individual owners. In other words, the 10,000 fee of 0.5% would have been for the entire market, not just individual holder of more than 10,000 shares.

.b
member
Activity: 87
Merit: 10
Prob a lot to do with the high threshold of investing on bitfunder vs. btctc. A lot of new people flooding to snag a few ASICMINER-PT right now as hash rate booms and auctions happen every week Smiley I myself am in it for the long haul due to the kickass dividend.

Higher threshold if someone is a buy and flipper, but lower if they are a buy and holder and reinvest dividends as there is no fee now or any planned for the future for dividends on BitFunder. And as mentioned, once you clear the threshold of 250 shares you can just transfer them to non-passthrough shares (to auction) or over to btct.co (0.2% sale fee + bitcoind transaction fee).

EDIT: Did the math.
For BitFunder, it's a 0% buy fee, 1% to 0.5% sale fee (depending on trade volume), no withdrawal fee.
For btct.co, it's a 0.2% buy fee (with 2FA), 0.2% sale fee (with 2FA), bitcoind withdrawal fee (can be up to 0.0025 BTC) and eventual dividend fee (0.5% to 3%).
So for a buy and sell on BitFunder it's essentially averages out to 0.25% to 0.5% per buy and sell. On btct.co, it's to 0.4% per buy and sell. Almost a wash. But add the withdrawal fee and eventual dividend fee on btct.co or if you have higher trading volume then BitFunder comes out ahead.
sr. member
Activity: 476
Merit: 250
I dunno why there's a couple of sell walls on bitfunder.  Those owner could have (> 250 shares) transfer their shares to btct, where the fees are lower (if you are selling) and better prices.
yeah, I was wondering about that, too.  I guess it might take a while to transfer like that, but they could probably sell for 10% more.
hero member
Activity: 756
Merit: 500
I dunno why there's a couple of sell walls on bitfunder.  Those owner could have (> 250 shares) transfer their shares to btct, where the fees are lower (if you are selling) and better prices.
full member
Activity: 224
Merit: 100
we still have a big 1.20 wall on bitfunder.

Well, there's your problem... :-P

.b

so, if you want cheap AM shares, come to bitfunder...

Yeah, looks like BitFunder has a greater % of people who got in early on ASICMINER and want to cash out some. Also no fees to buy on BitFunder vs. btct.

Prob a lot to do with the high threshold of investing on bitfunder vs. btctc. A lot of new people flooding to snag a few ASICMINER-PT right now as hash rate booms and auctions happen every week Smiley I myself am in it for the long haul due to the kickass dividend.
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