Topic: ASICMINER: Entering the Future of ASIC Mining by Inventing It - page 1326. (Read 3917029 times)

Well I am also adding shares and would certainly like a shot at buying the hardware in a priority position since we have invested in the company to begin with.

Hopefully this will happen and I think the concept should also have to do with holding the shares for a period of time before and after you buy hardware to help reduce speculation and sell-offs.

Its like .5% or something.  If the bigger shareholders end up locking their shares anyway, it would make things easier for multiple reasons. Just more paperwork.

Maybe come up with a scheme where X shares give you right to X % discount on an X amount of devices

Else anyone could just buy 1 share and be eligible for the same discount as a holder of 1000 shares

You can transfer your shares to Friedcat to prove you have the shares at the moment of ordering, then Friedcat will transfer them back

The transfer fees will be the price you have to pay to get the discount (I do not know what the transfer fees are, so this  might be completely un-economical)

+1

I was going to ask about this as well.. I am currently a shareholder (small holding but slowly growing), but I think it would be awesome for shareholders to have priority when it comes time to start selling hardware. How this would best be accomplished I haven't come up with any good ideas yet, but please try to keep us informed as to what direction you would like to take.

Please make sure this is not only available for large account holders / board members only. Perhaps once we figure out an appropriate way to prove our ownership of shares, maybe stating a minimum number of shares or investment required to qualify for priority orders would be a good idea. If announced far enough ahead of time smaller stake investors like myself can increase our holdings over time up to the level required. This should also encourage some more interest in the stocks and likely increase the price prior to having hardware ready for sale.

Just spouting thoughts out loud here now.. back to work

Yes - ASICminer will have to solve the allocation problem.
While FIFO (first come, first serve) is usually the simplest it may not be the  best strategy (BFL has similar issues and they employ some lottery scheme).

I suggested a dedicated GLBSE account for that purpose a while ago. Each share would reserve a certain allocation for a particular series of chips. Then you have a market for ASIC hardware orders. ASICminer could provide an initial incentive to count the IPO price of the order towards the final hardware price. The only problem with that scheme is that you get speculators, which just buy these orders in order to sell them at a higher price. And these speculators may not be interested in buying the actual hardware, which may delay the selling and inflate the price of the hardware. To counter that, the shares would have to be issued at a significant fraction of the final price, e.g. 50%. Then the speculators have a significant stake and need to get their investment back ASAP. Also another issue is AFAIK that GLBSE charges transfer fees proportional to the traded asset. This would cut into the profit from sales.

In the end, ASICminer has to find a way of filling the orders with either an optimal strategy to make profit, and/or one which has the least damaging effect on reputation and sales.

I believe share transfers have fees.

I suggested that as well, although verifying ownership would be difficult as Nefario doesn't release holdings info.

yes. Because the profit margin for selling the chips is considerable. That's why other players try so hard to produce chips as well.

Its possible, but I doubt it.  The self mining and sale of hardware as an ongoing concern is where the real money is at.

dividends/profits are paid to ASICminer (200k shares max). There may be some motions to "re-invest" the profit into a sustained business. The exact ratio is yet to be determined and mainly depends on shareholders.

Ok. That might be of interest to a few people, so I'll do some math. (my focus is on the second series of chips which get sold to the public, ignoring self-mining and sustained business/profit). If you feel that some numbers are off, let me know.

It's pretty safe to say that each ASIC chip which is produced and meets a minimum specs will be sold - just because the market is at a vacuum. While ASICminer still hasn't determined the price level, its competitors have:
BFL, 40 GH/s , $1300 (http://www.butterflylabs.com/order-form-bitforce-sc-single/)
bASIC, 27 Gh/s, $1070 (http://www.btcfpga.com/index.php?route=product/product&manufacturer_id=11&product_id=58)

I expect ASICminer to outperform any competitor, both on specs and price point. But the price won't be much lower than any competitor - that wouldn't make sense from a profit point of view. Given that, ASICminer could probably sell 50GH/s at $1000.

The production schedule is not out (yet) but let's assume ASICminer can produce 50 TH/s worth of chips in the second series. This corresponds to a total sales price of $1,000,000, which should be 50-80% profit (considering the overhead costs). So you're looking at a company valuation of $500k-$800k for the second series alone! Right now ASICminer is traded for about $240k. So the ROI on that second series is more than 100% if you buy now.

That is my understanding.

IF I'm not mistaken, the IPO has finished, which means the bonus offer isn't available anymore.

Obviously there will be the 'we did it first', but just like with FPGA, the first to have it out doesn't necessarily have all of the business.  There will be different performance characteristics, different price points, probably different shipping schedules (what good is being first if you have 2 months of backlog?).

Out of interest... i believe there are 3 asicproducer that openly admit that they are working on such hardware. Which of these competitors will have the asics probably as the first available and when would that probably be?

How much would it hurt the other companies, that didnt come out first with asics, when they are a month or more later? Would the income be a third or can something like that being said?

You can only decide for yourself

I can tell you the reasons why I decided to invest and am still buying:

1. I believe ASICMINER  will be able to deliver on what they set out to do
2. I don't think BFL will have any working product before ASICMINER does (at least I hope not)
3. I like the transparency of ASICMINER (much better than BFL)
4. If 1 & 2 come true then I am benefitting from ASIC mining without actually owning any hardware, but I will be able to buy said hardware if I want after it has proven itself
5. I like being a shareholder in high-risk start up companies

My few bitcents worth

so here i am trying to decide wether to buy a couple dozen ASICMINER shares.
anyone care to focus on these?

I think everyone is glancing over the most flagrant issue here. Nerded said he did not pay for the shares delivered yet (why bitcoinfountain issued shares before payment is kinda unclear to me...) and hes talking about being robbed? You got robbed for something you didnt pay for... As far as I am concerned, YOU OWE bitfoutain 300btc and someone stole what you owe. If you are not paying, you are in no way better than the guy who actually stole and are in no right to even comment on the subject until you pay your due.

Yes, the discussions are interesting but it would be nice to have a read only thread so that we could follow the ASIC development progress.

Well, it's always good to know about other projects.
But this one doesn't seem to be too far yet - they are talking even about February.
Also it is unclear what the bonds offer to their holders.

They are also discussing that the customs tax could be pretty high for importing the produced chips.
How is it with ASICMINER with respect to customs?