Bitcoin traders, why don't you just trade forex? - page 19.

goldcoinminer

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Quote from: Caladonian on November 26, 2016, 12:08:20 AM

Quote from: Omega Weapon on November 25, 2016, 10:40:10 PM

Quote from: shintosai on November 24, 2016, 09:24:06 AM

Quote from: wildworld on November 24, 2016, 08:50:27 AM

With forex trading, I earn a lot of money, and certainly after the elections.
With a good trategy make good profits.
Forex trading is for me my daily work.

wow that's good mate do you have any certain rules that you followed or just instinct you use before buying your trade? i really like to have this type of daily investment but im not familiar and still trying to understand i can't afford paying broker that can guide me i'm still reading and watching videos about how to gain good profits inside forex.

I really don't think someone just say, I'm going do this trade just because it feels right, there must be some kind of analysis behind the decision, we cannot just use our instinct and the trade to me that will be like gambling.

considering this as your weapon while you are inside the war, analyzing and knowing the possible movements will give an edge to place your entry
and that's really important knowing yourself if how far you can take the risk and most of all you must need to be observant allow yourself to learn
and be guided if possible.

What I know is, only the intelligent trader will have a chance to succeed in the long run, the learning we have here is important and we should continue to improve it as the market is not fix, it moves base on the economic factors and we have to abreast ourselves on that news.

Caladonian

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Quote from: Omega Weapon on November 25, 2016, 10:40:10 PM

Quote from: shintosai on November 24, 2016, 09:24:06 AM

Quote from: wildworld on November 24, 2016, 08:50:27 AM

With forex trading, I earn a lot of money, and certainly after the elections.
With a good trategy make good profits.
Forex trading is for me my daily work.

wow that's good mate do you have any certain rules that you followed or just instinct you use before buying your trade? i really like to have this type of daily investment but im not familiar and still trying to understand i can't afford paying broker that can guide me i'm still reading and watching videos about how to gain good profits inside forex.

I really don't think someone just say, I'm going do this trade just because it feels right, there must be some kind of analysis behind the decision, we cannot just use our instinct and the trade to me that will be like gambling.

considering this as your weapon while you are inside the war, analyzing and knowing the possible movements will give an edge to place your entry
and that's really important knowing yourself if how far you can take the risk and most of all you must need to be observant allow yourself to learn
and be guided if possible.

Omega Weapon

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Quote from: shintosai on November 24, 2016, 09:24:06 AM

Quote from: wildworld on November 24, 2016, 08:50:27 AM

With forex trading, I earn a lot of money, and certainly after the elections.
With a good trategy make good profits.
Forex trading is for me my daily work.

wow that's good mate do you have any certain rules that you followed or just instinct you use before buying your trade? i really like to have this type of daily investment but im not familiar and still trying to understand i can't afford paying broker that can guide me i'm still reading and watching videos about how to gain good profits inside forex.

I really don't think someone just say, I'm going do this trade just because it feels right, there must be some kind of analysis behind the decision, we cannot just use our instinct and the trade to me that will be like gambling.

StarofBTC

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Quote from: Theforextrader on November 24, 2016, 12:11:03 PM

Quote from: leeloo on November 24, 2016, 12:06:05 PM

Quote from: Theforextrader on November 24, 2016, 11:50:23 AM

did you know MM's can see your margin level and stop losses. if your margin level low they will move markets to grab contracts. thus risk management.

I heard it from multiple sources that even the some of the brokers themselves manipulate the market to trigger the stop losses of retail traders, and it was about big (internationally big) brokers, though obviously only ones that are MMs themselves. I read it from a systematic forex trader that his bot doesn't place stop losses for this reason, but follows the market and executes them manually.

well i can tell you it's true they do. i don't place stop losses i only do when there is news given mm's can do anything then. you may think you have a small balance why me? but they still do. we call it a stop hunt.

Manipulation in the forex market is most common. Sudden spikes and ledge are perfect witness to this (which may not be found with other brokers charts). I too heard many forex traders do not prefer trading with stop loss for this reason. Do not aware of bitcoin markets with these kind of manipulations, still possible.

Theforextrader

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Quote from: leeloo on November 24, 2016, 12:06:05 PM

Quote from: Theforextrader on November 24, 2016, 11:50:23 AM

did you know MM's can see your margin level and stop losses. if your margin level low they will move markets to grab contracts. thus risk management.

I heard it from multiple sources that even the some of the brokers themselves manipulate the market to trigger the stop losses of retail traders, and it was about big (internationally big) brokers, though obviously only ones that are MMs themselves. I read it from a systematic forex trader that his bot doesn't place stop losses for this reason, but follows the market and executes them manually.

well i can tell you it's true they do. i don't place stop losses i only do when there is news given mm's can do anything then. you may think you have a small balance why me? but they still do. we call it a stop hunt.

leeloo

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Quote from: Theforextrader on November 24, 2016, 11:50:23 AM

did you know MM's can see your margin level and stop losses. if your margin level low they will move markets to grab contracts. thus risk management.

I heard it from multiple sources that even the some of the brokers themselves manipulate the market to trigger the stop losses of retail traders, and it was about big (internationally big) brokers, though obviously only ones that are MMs themselves. I read it from a systematic forex trader that his bot doesn't place stop losses for this reason, but follows the market and executes them manually.

leeloo

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Quote from: mindrust on November 24, 2016, 11:42:39 AM

I know there are people who make money out of forex but they are getting less and less in the longer time frame.

While the winners are %20 in a 3 months time frame, they are %0.22 in 3 years. You know why? Because they played too long.

"citation needed"

I mean, you may have those stats, but they say nothing about the "why." For all we know, with such a low entry barrier and so much hype, myths, and charlatans out there, maybe only 0.22% of the people use sensible strategies. For 10,000 fools that's still 22 wizards, and they get the spoils from 9,978 others.

Quote from: mindrust on November 24, 2016, 11:42:39 AM

Things really get messy with forex. Forex players will never agree with this but its gambling and definitely not a job.

Actually, maybe that's one of the reasons for the above: most people don't treat it as a job, but use it as the means for their gambler's high. No surprise they play like idiots.

With gambling proper, you don't have an edge -- the house has the edge, period (and when it turned out to be not true, as with blackjack, they changed the game, blacklisted card counters, etc.)

Theforextrader

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Quote from: mindrust on November 24, 2016, 11:42:39 AM

Quote from: leeloo on November 24, 2016, 11:14:32 AM

Stop losses. Also, don't over-utilize your leverage. There are many people living off forex, but most who try blow up because they don't manage their risk exposure.

I know there are people who make money out of forex but they are getting less and less in the longer time frame.

While the winners are %20 in a 3 months time frame, they are %0.22 in 3 years. You know why? Because they played too long.

Things really get messy with forex. Forex players will never agree with this but its gambling and definitely not a job.

You can say; there isn't a guaranteed job neither, people lose their jobs too. And that's where i get confused. A bit.

I guess it can be a job as long as you make money:)

i disagree practice makes you better i've been trading for 4 years taught my friends they left their jobs within a year.

the 20% probably get greedy and once you change your lifestyle you can't really afford losses and they take more risks thus they lose and then when they get desperate they make mistakes. my account has only grown stick to the rules follow risk management.

every 1 lot size you must have $1000 in your account. don't trade more. average currency moves around 300 pips daily that is $300 a day and that is without even taking a risk.

yesterday we made $760 and that was on two currencies only.

those that have played it long consider it joke making money they earn in the weekdays in the weekend they blow it all.

did you know MM's can see your margin level and stop losses. if your margin level low they will move markets to grab contracts. thus risk management.

mindrust

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Quote from: leeloo on November 24, 2016, 11:14:32 AM

Stop losses. Also, don't over-utilize your leverage. There are many people living off forex, but most who try blow up because they don't manage their risk exposure.

I know there are people who make money out of forex but they are getting less and less in the longer time frame.

While the winners are %20 in a 3 months time frame, they are %0.22 in 3 years. You know why? Because they played too long.

Things really get messy with forex. Forex players will never agree with this but its gambling and definitely not a job.

You can say; there isn't a guaranteed job neither, people lose their jobs too. And that's where i get confused. A bit.

I guess it can be a job as long as you make money:)

Theforextrader

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Quote from: Fredomago on November 24, 2016, 11:07:43 AM

Quote from: Theforextrader on November 24, 2016, 10:50:21 AM

You can easily win at forex by simply following some rules. risk management for one.

are those rules really easy or its just a common thing most brokers offer i guess forex really take some time before we can understand how to play it properly and how to gain much stable its been a good source of income but a lots of things that still needed to learn from time to time.

took me 5 months to learn and haven't looked back ever since. you got to understand trillion of dollars not just floating around without a system in place. MM's love retail traders. i give signals see my signature.

rules being easy to follow depends on you. don't trade with emotions. NFP next week see how mm's play the markets on friday.

leeloo

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Quote from: Fredomago on November 24, 2016, 11:07:43 AM

Quote from: Theforextrader on November 24, 2016, 10:50:21 AM

You can easily win at forex by simply following some rules. risk management for one.

are those rules really easy or its just a common thing most brokers offer i guess forex really take some time before we can understand how to play it properly and how to gain much stable its been a good source of income but a lots of things that still needed to learn from time to time.

Those "rules" are part of your strategy, not something forced upon you by your broker. Apart from the margin quota, that is, because it is forced upon you. However, if you're playing anywhere close to your quota, it's already late for you.

Quote from: marcuslong on November 24, 2016, 11:01:43 AM

Forex is really based on USD and i tried trading in forex and i just lossed $100 dollars in minute it's kinda hard to understand the market there even though i have a trainor , traiding bitcoin is really good when im using the exchange website itself i can make grow my money there as fast as the altcoin is growing.

Okay, but that also means you can lose your money as fast as the altcoin is falling...

Quote from: mindrust on November 24, 2016, 10:45:46 AM

I personally am against any trade with a leverage system. Trading with the money you don't own is just a silly game.

But i took my chances with forex in the past, like most of us here, blowed up my account, never looked back.

Stop losses. Also, don't over-utilize your leverage. There are many people living off forex, but most who try blow up because they don't manage their risk exposure.

Fredomago

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Quote from: Theforextrader on November 24, 2016, 10:50:21 AM

You can easily win at forex by simply following some rules. risk management for one.

are those rules really easy or its just a common thing most brokers offer i guess forex really take some time before we can understand how to play it properly and how to gain much stable its been a good source of income but a lots of things that still needed to learn from time to time.

marcuslong

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Quote from: AyeYo on July 09, 2011, 09:53:57 AM

I see there are a lot of first time traders trading Bitcoin via the hack exchanges of MtGox and Tradehill. It makes me wonder, why don't you guys just trade real forex? You can open micro accounts with as little as $25. You get security far better than these shady exchanges. You get real customer service with a real business that won't disappear and leave you only an email address to cry to. You get real trading platforms with reliable data, not some ghetto hack stuff. You get plenty of liquidity, which allows of smooth trading. And, best of all, you don't have to worry whether it's legal or not! Trading is hard enough as it is, why anyone would want all these additional factors working against them is beyond me.

So, to all the bitcoin traders out there... what are your reasons for trading these shady, unsafe bitcoin markets over regular FX?

Forex is really based on USD and i tried trading in forex and i just lossed $100 dollars in minute it's kinda hard to understand the market there even though i have a trainor , traiding bitcoin is really good when im using the exchange website itself i can make grow my money there as fast as the altcoin is growing.

leeloo

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Quote from: Victorycoin on November 24, 2016, 10:41:49 AM

Quote from: leeloo on November 24, 2016, 09:36:39 AM

Cryptocurrencies (altcoins especially) have a huge volatility, so there's no need to use leverage to make profit, which means not even unexpectedly huge moves can wipe you out.

Here are some dummy numbers:

I use 20x leverage for EURUSD, expecting a maximum volatility of 0.1%.
There's a 0.5% move against me. I'm pretty dead.
I use no leverage for BTCUSD, expecting a maximum volatility of 2%.
It moves 10% against me. I'm hurt. But I'm still kicking.

In both cases, I had the same expectancy of profit, yet the actual risks (loss v.s. death) are quite different.

Excuse my ignorance if I'm totally incorrect; I'm just trying to verify this idea here.

Forex, I must say is the one with huge volatility! In fact, currencies like GBP/JPY and EUR/JPY could move over 400 pips in one single day. The difference between the behavior of the two trades you suggested above lies on the forex trade being a margin trade, so the leverage ends up multiplying your winning or loss and that is the reason, leverage is often referred to as a double edged sword.

Let's ignore that for a moment and pretend that we have the picture I painted: using 20x leverage to magnify a 20x smaller volatility v.s. no leverage. Am I right about the difference in the risk of blowup?

For the file, I'm not against leverage. It just it seems that the structure of risk is very different without having to use it, and I would like to see if I understand it correctly.

Theforextrader

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You can easily win at forex by simply following some rules. risk management for one.

mindrust

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How do you know if they don't?

I personally am against any trade with a leverage system. Trading with the money you don't own is just a silly game.

But i took my chances with forex in the past, like most of us here, blowed up my account, never looked back.

Victorycoin

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Quote from: leeloo on November 24, 2016, 09:36:39 AM

Cryptocurrencies (altcoins especially) have a huge volatility, so there's no need to use leverage to make profit, which means not even unexpectedly huge moves can wipe you out.

Here are some dummy numbers:

I use 20x leverage for EURUSD, expecting a maximum volatility of 0.1%.
There's a 0.5% move against me. I'm pretty dead.
I use no leverage for BTCUSD, expecting a maximum volatility of 2%.
It moves 10% against me. I'm hurt. But I'm still kicking.

In both cases, I had the same expectancy of profit, yet the actual risks (loss v.s. death) are quite different.

Excuse my ignorance if I'm totally incorrect; I'm just trying to verify this idea here.

Forex, I must say is the one with huge volatility! In fact, currencies like GBP/JPY and EUR/JPY could move over 400 pips in one single day. The difference between the behavior of the two trades you suggested above lies on the forex trade being a margin trade, so the leverage ends up multiplying your winning or loss and that is the reason, leverage is often referred to as a double edged sword.

leeloo

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Activity: 28

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Cryptocurrencies (altcoins especially) have a huge volatility, so there's no need to use leverage to make profit, which means not even unexpectedly huge moves can wipe you out.

Here are some dummy numbers:

I use 20x leverage for EURUSD, expecting a maximum volatility of 0.1%.
There's a 0.5% move against me. I'm pretty dead.
I use no leverage for BTCUSD, expecting a maximum volatility of 2%.
It moves 10% against me. I'm hurt. But I'm still kicking.

In both cases, I had the same expectancy of profit, yet the actual risks (loss v.s. death) are quite different.

Excuse my ignorance if I'm totally incorrect; I'm just trying to verify this idea here.

wildworld

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Quote from: shintosai on November 24, 2016, 09:24:06 AM

Quote from: wildworld on November 24, 2016, 08:50:27 AM

With forex trading, I earn a lot of money, and certainly after the elections.
With a good trategy make good profits.
Forex trading is for me my daily work.

wow that's good mate do you have any certain rules that you followed or just instinct you use before buying your trade? i really like to have this type of daily investment but im not familiar and still trying to understand i can't afford paying broker that can guide me i'm still reading and watching videos about how to gain good profits inside forex.

After years of experience, it has become automatic for me. Watch the news, make my analysis. Also you must have a positive feeling when you purchase. Every night I make an analysis, what I'm going to buy the next day.
I buy and sell within a week or sometimes during the day. A good mind you need and do not be distracted. I read graphs like a book, so I know when it's time to buy or sell. I think that this is a gift, but not for everyone. Forex trading requires a lot of time and energy.

shintosai

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Quote from: wildworld on November 24, 2016, 08:50:27 AM

With forex trading, I earn a lot of money, and certainly after the elections.
With a good trategy make good profits.
Forex trading is for me my daily work.

wow that's good mate do you have any certain rules that you followed or just instinct you use before buying your trade? i really like to have this type of daily investment but im not familiar and still trying to understand i can't afford paying broker that can guide me i'm still reading and watching videos about how to gain good profits inside forex.

Topic: Bitcoin traders, why don't you just trade forex? - page 19. (Read 24933 times)