Bitcoin traders, why don't you just trade forex? - page 20.

marcuslong

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Quote from: AyeYo on July 09, 2011, 08:53:57 AM

I see there are a lot of first time traders trading Bitcoin via the hack exchanges of MtGox and Tradehill. It makes me wonder, why don't you guys just trade real forex? You can open micro accounts with as little as $25. You get security far better than these shady exchanges. You get real customer service with a real business that won't disappear and leave you only an email address to cry to. You get real trading platforms with reliable data, not some ghetto hack stuff. You get plenty of liquidity, which allows of smooth trading. And, best of all, you don't have to worry whether it's legal or not! Trading is hard enough as it is, why anyone would want all these additional factors working against them is beyond me.

So, to all the bitcoin traders out there... what are your reasons for trading these shady, unsafe bitcoin markets over regular FX?

Forex is really based on USD and i tried trading in forex and i just lossed $100 dollars in minute it's kinda hard to understand the market there even though i have a trainor , traiding bitcoin is really good when im using the exchange website itself i can make grow my money there as fast as the altcoin is growing.

leeloo

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Quote from: Victorycoin on November 24, 2016, 09:41:49 AM

Quote from: leeloo on November 24, 2016, 08:36:39 AM

Cryptocurrencies (altcoins especially) have a huge volatility, so there's no need to use leverage to make profit, which means not even unexpectedly huge moves can wipe you out.

Here are some dummy numbers:

I use 20x leverage for EURUSD, expecting a maximum volatility of 0.1%.
There's a 0.5% move against me. I'm pretty dead.
I use no leverage for BTCUSD, expecting a maximum volatility of 2%.
It moves 10% against me. I'm hurt. But I'm still kicking.

In both cases, I had the same expectancy of profit, yet the actual risks (loss v.s. death) are quite different.

Excuse my ignorance if I'm totally incorrect; I'm just trying to verify this idea here.

Forex, I must say is the one with huge volatility! In fact, currencies like GBP/JPY and EUR/JPY could move over 400 pips in one single day. The difference between the behavior of the two trades you suggested above lies on the forex trade being a margin trade, so the leverage ends up multiplying your winning or loss and that is the reason, leverage is often referred to as a double edged sword.

Let's ignore that for a moment and pretend that we have the picture I painted: using 20x leverage to magnify a 20x smaller volatility v.s. no leverage. Am I right about the difference in the risk of blowup?

For the file, I'm not against leverage. It just it seems that the structure of risk is very different without having to use it, and I would like to see if I understand it correctly.

Theforextrader

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You can easily win at forex by simply following some rules. risk management for one.

mindrust

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How do you know if they don't?

I personally am against any trade with a leverage system. Trading with the money you don't own is just a silly game.

But i took my chances with forex in the past, like most of us here, blowed up my account, never looked back.

Victorycoin

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Quote from: leeloo on November 24, 2016, 08:36:39 AM

Cryptocurrencies (altcoins especially) have a huge volatility, so there's no need to use leverage to make profit, which means not even unexpectedly huge moves can wipe you out.

Here are some dummy numbers:

I use 20x leverage for EURUSD, expecting a maximum volatility of 0.1%.
There's a 0.5% move against me. I'm pretty dead.
I use no leverage for BTCUSD, expecting a maximum volatility of 2%.
It moves 10% against me. I'm hurt. But I'm still kicking.

In both cases, I had the same expectancy of profit, yet the actual risks (loss v.s. death) are quite different.

Excuse my ignorance if I'm totally incorrect; I'm just trying to verify this idea here.

Forex, I must say is the one with huge volatility! In fact, currencies like GBP/JPY and EUR/JPY could move over 400 pips in one single day. The difference between the behavior of the two trades you suggested above lies on the forex trade being a margin trade, so the leverage ends up multiplying your winning or loss and that is the reason, leverage is often referred to as a double edged sword.

leeloo

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Activity: 28

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Cryptocurrencies (altcoins especially) have a huge volatility, so there's no need to use leverage to make profit, which means not even unexpectedly huge moves can wipe you out.

Here are some dummy numbers:

I use 20x leverage for EURUSD, expecting a maximum volatility of 0.1%.
There's a 0.5% move against me. I'm pretty dead.
I use no leverage for BTCUSD, expecting a maximum volatility of 2%.
It moves 10% against me. I'm hurt. But I'm still kicking.

In both cases, I had the same expectancy of profit, yet the actual risks (loss v.s. death) are quite different.

Excuse my ignorance if I'm totally incorrect; I'm just trying to verify this idea here.

wildworld

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Quote from: shintosai on November 24, 2016, 08:24:06 AM

Quote from: wildworld on November 24, 2016, 07:50:27 AM

With forex trading, I earn a lot of money, and certainly after the elections.
With a good trategy make good profits.
Forex trading is for me my daily work.

wow that's good mate do you have any certain rules that you followed or just instinct you use before buying your trade? i really like to have this type of daily investment but im not familiar and still trying to understand i can't afford paying broker that can guide me i'm still reading and watching videos about how to gain good profits inside forex.

After years of experience, it has become automatic for me. Watch the news, make my analysis. Also you must have a positive feeling when you purchase. Every night I make an analysis, what I'm going to buy the next day.
I buy and sell within a week or sometimes during the day. A good mind you need and do not be distracted. I read graphs like a book, so I know when it's time to buy or sell. I think that this is a gift, but not for everyone. Forex trading requires a lot of time and energy.

shintosai

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Quote from: wildworld on November 24, 2016, 07:50:27 AM

With forex trading, I earn a lot of money, and certainly after the elections.
With a good trategy make good profits.
Forex trading is for me my daily work.

wow that's good mate do you have any certain rules that you followed or just instinct you use before buying your trade? i really like to have this type of daily investment but im not familiar and still trying to understand i can't afford paying broker that can guide me i'm still reading and watching videos about how to gain good profits inside forex.

wildworld

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With forex trading, I earn a lot of money, and certainly after the elections.
With a good trategy make good profits.
Forex trading is for me my daily work.

pooya87

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Quote from: RealPhotoshoper on November 23, 2016, 09:52:48 PM

Quote from: Raja_MBZ on November 23, 2016, 09:53:02 AM

Honestly people try bitcoin & altcoin trading because of very high profit and loss probability. Here, everything happens with a huge percentage, either loss or profit. Sometimes you can get richer in few seconds or poorer in a few minutes.

your opinion sounds like bitcoin is a high risk investment such as HYIP or something.
i don't think it was the main reason why people trade bitcoin instead regular forex.
bitcoin trading run for 24/7 , forex cannot afford to do that , so simply in bitcoin you can even trade in holiday!

you are thinking of stocks market which has an open time period. Forex on the other hand is always open 24 hours a day similar to bitcoin and altcoin markets because Forex also has an international scope of currency trading which makes it so that there is someone always making trades.

RealPhotoshoper

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Quote from: Raja_MBZ on November 23, 2016, 09:53:02 AM

Honestly people try bitcoin & altcoin trading because of very high profit and loss probability. Here, everything happens with a huge percentage, either loss or profit. Sometimes you can get richer in few seconds or poorer in a few minutes.

your opinion sounds like bitcoin is a high risk investment such as HYIP or something.
i don't think it was the main reason why people trade bitcoin instead regular forex.
bitcoin trading run for 24/7 , forex cannot afford to do that , so simply in bitcoin you can even trade in holiday!

Theforextrader

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Very possible to profit from forex if you know what your doing

gkv9

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!!! RiSe aBovE ThE StoRm !!!

Quote from: capoeira on November 23, 2016, 09:34:21 AM

not realy. I allready said above that BTC is easier to trade (in the sense of easier to learn). But you CAN profit more in Forex.

Do you really think that earning profits in forex is more??? And why is that???
Forex might be the biggest traded platform currently but Bitcoins too provide some decent profits on altcoin trading where you can trade and convert your coins to xx amounts based on the coin you chose and the way it goes...
But possibility of earning profits are more in bitcoins rather than forex because forex is more UNPREDICTABLE than bitcoin and altcoin trading...

Raja_MBZ

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Honestly people try bitcoin & altcoin trading because of very high profit and loss probability. Here, everything happens with a huge percentage, either loss or profit. Sometimes you can get richer in few seconds or poorer in a few minutes.

capoeira

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Quote from: talkbitcoin on November 23, 2016, 07:18:21 AM

Quote from: capoeira on November 22, 2016, 12:33:42 PM

Quote from: Radenz on November 22, 2016, 02:29:03 AM

Quote from: AyeYo on July 09, 2011, 08:53:57 AM

I see there are a lot of first time traders trading Bitcoin via the hack exchanges of MtGox and Tradehill. It makes me wonder, why don't you guys just trade real forex? You can open micro accounts with as little as $25. You get security far better than these shady exchanges. You get real customer service with a real business that won't disappear and leave you only an email address to cry to. You get real trading platforms with reliable data, not some ghetto hack stuff. You get plenty of liquidity, which allows of smooth trading. And, best of all, you don't have to worry whether it's legal or not! Trading is hard enough as it is, why anyone would want all these additional factors working against them is beyond me.

So, to all the bitcoin traders out there... what are your reasons for trading these shady, unsafe bitcoin markets over regular FX?

Cryptocurrencies trading is more profitable than forex trading.
Sometimes, you can double your money in just few days.
However, it's risky.
I am actually interested to forex trading.
But, at this time i prefer bitcoin(& altcoins) trading to make more money.

In theory you can dubble your money in Forex in minutes

the theory is always so much different than reality! and the only reason why you are so insistent on saying Forex is more profitable is to advertise your signature and get some referrals in those links.

not realy. I allready said above that BTC is easier to trade (in the sense of easier to learn). But you CAN profit more in Forex.

talkbitcoin

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All I know is that I know nothing.

Quote from: capoeira on November 22, 2016, 12:33:42 PM

Quote from: Radenz on November 22, 2016, 02:29:03 AM

Quote from: AyeYo on July 09, 2011, 08:53:57 AM

I see there are a lot of first time traders trading Bitcoin via the hack exchanges of MtGox and Tradehill. It makes me wonder, why don't you guys just trade real forex? You can open micro accounts with as little as $25. You get security far better than these shady exchanges. You get real customer service with a real business that won't disappear and leave you only an email address to cry to. You get real trading platforms with reliable data, not some ghetto hack stuff. You get plenty of liquidity, which allows of smooth trading. And, best of all, you don't have to worry whether it's legal or not! Trading is hard enough as it is, why anyone would want all these additional factors working against them is beyond me.

So, to all the bitcoin traders out there... what are your reasons for trading these shady, unsafe bitcoin markets over regular FX?

Cryptocurrencies trading is more profitable than forex trading.
Sometimes, you can double your money in just few days.
However, it's risky.
I am actually interested to forex trading.
But, at this time i prefer bitcoin(& altcoins) trading to make more money.

In theory you can dubble your money in Forex in minutes

the theory is always so much different than reality! and the only reason why you are so insistent on saying Forex is more profitable is to advertise your signature and get some referrals in those links.

but what happens in reality is that if users are not familiar with trading they can't do anything in either markets and if they are new they have a better time in altcoin markets than in forex and also if they are experienced and want more profit they can make more money with altcoins than they can with forex because of the way altcoins get pumped.

gchan316

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For retail traders, in most cases you are trading against the house/FX dealer. They do everything they can to eat up all your money, i.e. huge bid/ask spread in volatile periods, spiking the price if you placed stop loss order, giving you a huge margin. There is nearly no way to trade in a relatively fair FX exchange unless you go into brokerage firm to trade in CME. Fair game does not apply on retail players in FX market.

I can see a fairer market in crpytocurrency exchanges. If you are thinking of security, just think of in real market the security or credit risk is transferred to the cost of exchange fee. You will be happier to think like this way.

freedomgo

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Playbet.io - Crypto Casino and Sportsbook

Quote from: capoeira on November 22, 2016, 10:48:30 PM

Quote from: Omega Weapon on November 22, 2016, 08:49:43 PM

Quote from: capoeira on November 21, 2016, 10:12:18 AM

In Forex you can have leverages up to 1000x.
so you can make even the 1 minute graph a profitable one. So Forex moves much faster if you know how to. But I understand the dificulty of trading Forex when coming from cryptos. In cryptos you can simply ride the euforia and panic.

You forgot to add that you can lose your money as fast too, leveraging that much is a mistake I think unless you are really sure your analysis is spot on and you are going to make money no matter what.

you don't go "all in" in Forex, obviously. first thing to learn with leverage is position sizing

I really thought "all in" only happens in gambling. Grin

capoeira

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Quote from: Omega Weapon on November 22, 2016, 08:49:43 PM

Quote from: capoeira on November 21, 2016, 10:12:18 AM

In Forex you can have leverages up to 1000x.
so you can make even the 1 minute graph a profitable one. So Forex moves much faster if you know how to. But I understand the dificulty of trading Forex when coming from cryptos. In cryptos you can simply ride the euforia and panic.

You forgot to add that you can lose your money as fast too, leveraging that much is a mistake I think unless you are really sure your analysis is spot on and you are going to make money no matter what.

you don't go "all in" in Forex, obviously. first thing to learn with leverage is position sizing

Omega Weapon

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Quote from: capoeira on November 21, 2016, 10:12:18 AM

In Forex you can have leverages up to 1000x.
so you can make even the 1 minute graph a profitable one. So Forex moves much faster if you know how to. But I understand the dificulty of trading Forex when coming from cryptos. In cryptos you can simply ride the euforia and panic.

You forgot to add that you can lose your money as fast too, leveraging that much is a mistake I think unless you are really sure your analysis is spot on and you are going to make money no matter what.

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