Bitcoin vs Taxes - page 14. | Bitcointalksearch.org

Chip-Dale

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Quote from: bohr on July 16, 2017, 02:46:18 PM

Quote from: Beerwizzard on July 15, 2017, 03:08:15 AM

I've heared that in some countries people have to pay the income tax after buying fiat for their bitcoins. Anyone faced such problem? If yes then how you deal with it in your country?
At one point of view bitcoin is an instrument for investment so ppl buy it willing to get income in their currency.
At the other point it is a currency and it might be used with a purpose of saving. In this case the tax would be stupid.

In most countries if you buy something and then you sell it for an higher price then you need to pay taxes on it, if for example if you buy a house for 100000 dollars and then you sell it for 120000 then you need to pay tax on the 20000 gain that you got.

The fact is that every state exists at the expense of taxpayers. I think every citizen wants to have a strong army in his country and even some social guarantees. That all the institutions of the state work at 100%. This all requires money and we must understand that the state treasury is filled from taxes. But only one question is of interest to all, the rich should pay more than a simple worker.

bohr

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Quote from: Beerwizzard on July 15, 2017, 03:08:15 AM

I've heared that in some countries people have to pay the income tax after buying fiat for their bitcoins. Anyone faced such problem? If yes then how you deal with it in your country?
At one point of view bitcoin is an instrument for investment so ppl buy it willing to get income in their currency.
At the other point it is a currency and it might be used with a purpose of saving. In this case the tax would be stupid.

In most countries if you buy something and then you sell it for an higher price then you need to pay taxes on it, if for example if you buy a house for 100000 dollars and then you sell it for 120000 then you need to pay tax on the 20000 gain that you got.

zulkarnaen

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I think as long as you can still do bitcoin transactions and there is never a problem in the transaction, legality is certainly not very necessary. And probably still have a good chance because it is not obliged to pay income tax from bitcoin.

Mahanton

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In my country Bitcoin still havent been taxed as of now Its not still accepted and regulated but there is already a local wallet service provider do offer on buy and selling bitcoin which im little bit in doubt on buying since spread of buy and sell is too high which i do save up money for having a bulk transaction on buying bitcoin without being affected too much on the spread. Tax isnt still imposed but those high spreads i consider it as tax. lol

Mometaskers

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So far my country has not yet made any clear regulations about taxing bitcoins despite recognizing it as legal and I hope it stays that way. I mean, how would they consider bitcoins? Would they tax it like it was money in a bank account and then tax it again when you sell it for fiat?

For now the only thing I'm not satisfied with is the large spread between the exchange's buy and sell price. I suppose they also have to pay the government certain fees.

oktana

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Quote from: Przemax on July 15, 2017, 04:08:03 PM

As every income tax on financial speculation gain, "bitcoin tax" can be prolonged by making investments with the gained income.

That does not save you from paying tax but it just prolongs the payment. And maybe it is not so unfair, because you might as well lose that income in the future.

I am not advising anything. Its not that I am doing that, thats all I have heard how rich people avoid paying the income tax.

They either present transfers as loses, or they invest the gains. For the not so rich like ourselfs, buying things with bitcoins is a great way of spending the gained bitcoins over the internet without the worry of taxing errors.

For some transactions with reasonable nominal taxes may not be very influential, the whales avoids taxes because he doesn't want to destroy them all by giving a quarter or even half of their income for taxes. I understand that, but it's good to be a statesman, taxes needed for development, we should not think too much about corruption.

Przemax

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As every income tax on financial speculation gain, "bitcoin tax" can be prolonged by making investments with the gained income.

That does not save you from paying tax but it just prolongs the payment. And maybe it is not so unfair, because you might as well lose that income in the future.

I am not advising anything. Its not that I am doing that, thats all I have heard how rich people avoid paying the income tax.

They either present transfers as loses, or they invest the gains. For the not so rich like ourselfs, buying things with bitcoins is a great way of spending the gained bitcoins over the internet without the worry of taxing errors.

foxbat

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Quote from: Beerwizzard on July 15, 2017, 03:08:15 AM

I've heared that in some countries people have to pay the income tax after buying fiat for their bitcoins. Anyone faced such problem? If yes then how you deal with it in your country?
At one point of view bitcoin is an instrument for investment so ppl buy it willing to get income in their currency.
At the other point it is a currency and it might be used with a purpose of saving. In this case the tax would be stupid.

Yes, that is a fact that is taking place in countries that accept bitcoin, where bitcoin is like a business vehicle, it is a real currency, and its users pay a tax for items they use.

stompix

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Quote from: bouren on July 15, 2017, 11:10:10 AM

Quote from: Beerwizzard on July 15, 2017, 03:08:15 AM

I've heared that in some countries people have to pay the income tax after buying fiat for their bitcoins. Anyone faced such problem? If yes then how you deal with it in your country?

You need to understand first what is Income tax, it is a tax which is paid on income. How buying bitcoins for money considered as income? You go to shop, buy grocery then do you need to pay income tax on that?
Don't confuse pro economics term with bitcoins.

Cause buying fiat means selling coins not buying bitcoins.
So it is considered taking profit unless you will be able to prove that you spent more on those cons that you sold them for.

Rather than giving advice about "pro" economics learn how to read.

Savik

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How about if you mine coins yourself? Mine 1 BTC and sell it for $2000, is that a $2000 capital gain (in the US)?

foxbat

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Quote from: Suffoc8 on July 15, 2017, 11:42:32 AM

Quote from: Beerwizzard on July 15, 2017, 03:08:15 AM

I've heared that in some countries people have to pay the income tax after buying fiat for their bitcoins. Anyone faced such problem? If yes then how you deal with it in your country?
At one point of view bitcoin is an instrument for investment so ppl buy it willing to get income in their currency.
At the other point it is a currency and it might be used with a purpose of saving. In this case the tax would be stupid.

As a citizan you must do your obligation on your taxes although it is on the internet they know what you are doing. The government know about everything. And if you don't want to pay a tax don't sell or buy bitcoin.

Yes, the government knows everything; however, sometimes they ignore some things, bitcoin is an example in my country, i can use it freely, i do not need to lose any numbers money to pay taxes.

Suffoc8

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Quote from: Beerwizzard on July 15, 2017, 03:08:15 AM

I've heared that in some countries people have to pay the income tax after buying fiat for their bitcoins. Anyone faced such problem? If yes then how you deal with it in your country?
At one point of view bitcoin is an instrument for investment so ppl buy it willing to get income in their currency.
At the other point it is a currency and it might be used with a purpose of saving. In this case the tax would be stupid.

As a citizan you must do your obligation on your taxes although it is on the internet they know what you are doing. The government know about everything. And if you don't want to pay a tax don't sell or buy bitcoin.

RedditMaster

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Quote from: inthelongrun on July 15, 2017, 09:33:15 AM

Quote from: Beerwizzard on July 15, 2017, 03:08:15 AM

I've heared that in some countries people have to pay the income tax after buying fiat for their bitcoins. Anyone faced such problem? If yes then how you deal with it in your country?
At one point of view bitcoin is an instrument for investment so ppl buy it willing to get income in their currency.
At the other point it is a currency and it might be used with a purpose of saving. In this case the tax would be stupid.

Here in my country it is understood because all income is taxable. Income, in whatever form, and from where ever for as long as it is still considered income, a certain tax is imposed. However, with regard to bitcoin income, it is hard for my government to track them as these are all online. The Internal Revenue cannot easily monitor people's income if they are through online transactions.

+1

Governments are still not focusing enough on Bitcoin to make it necessary to pay taxes in the sense that there is practically no way to get caught. Most people, I believe, who made a fortune with Bitcoin do not pay taxes on it... why would they? The government has no idea and even if they do they cannot prove you actually own an address without knowing your secret keys and/or password, so it would be a futile endeavor for them to even try.

With that said, it is still advisable to pay them so as to avoid any potential legal or repayment issues down the road.

bouren

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Quote from: Beerwizzard on July 15, 2017, 03:08:15 AM

I've heared that in some countries people have to pay the income tax after buying fiat for their bitcoins. Anyone faced such problem? If yes then how you deal with it in your country?

You need to understand first what is Income tax, it is a tax which is paid on income. How buying bitcoins for money considered as income? You go to shop, buy grocery then do you need to pay income tax on that?
Don't confuse pro economics term with bitcoins.

audaciousbeing

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Quote from: Beerwizzard on July 15, 2017, 03:08:15 AM

I've heared that in some countries people have to pay the income tax after buying fiat for their bitcoins. Anyone faced such problem? If yes then how you deal with it in your country?
At one point of view bitcoin is an instrument for investment so ppl buy it willing to get income in their currency.
At the other point it is a currency and it might be used with a purpose of saving. In this case the tax would be stupid.

In my country it has not been formalised but when its eventually done, then its going to be against profit that one will be taxed and nothing else but that will mean serious documentations and updating in other to ensure the right amount of tax to be paid in which I am sure we have the capacity yet. To other countries, bitcoin will be regarded as stock where one pay say capital gains tax in its disposal if there is a profit though.

onrise

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Wanted to know if there is any country which has Zero tax on Btc . Well rest in the tax paying nations I think they will have to pay as per their category under which they fall in the tax bracket . Well if Btc is treated as separate entity then it's a different story .

The_prodigy

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Quote from: joebrook on July 15, 2017, 10:09:55 AM

Quote from: Emoclaw on July 15, 2017, 03:11:08 AM

If you sell Bitcoin for Fiat, then you have to pay taxes.
While Bitcoin is a currency, it is considered a commodity and therefore by selling it you're 'making money'.
It's illegal if you don't pay taxes.

I dont agree with you at all, with your premise, if you sell bitcoin for fiat then you should pay tax, if thats the case then if you buy bitcoins with fiat, you should then pay tax again since you consider it as a commodity.

I think that this is really a dillema since some people consider bitcoin a separate resource from mo ey that is taxable but we have to agree that bitcoon functions and is used as mo ey that is taxable. Thug in some points I agree that with the taxes imposed to bitcoin makes it harder to enjoy it like it used to before but in the end I think it is a price we really have to pay

joebrook

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Quote from: Emoclaw on July 15, 2017, 03:11:08 AM

If you sell Bitcoin for Fiat, then you have to pay taxes.
While Bitcoin is a currency, it is considered a commodity and therefore by selling it you're 'making money'.
It's illegal if you don't pay taxes.

I dont agree with you at all, with your premise, if you sell bitcoin for fiat then you should pay tax, if thats the case then if you buy bitcoins with fiat, you should then pay tax again since you consider it as a commodity.

djoko adi

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In my country bitcoin taxed As of November 9, 2016, all fees for both transactions and withdrawals incurred in Bitcoin have included VAT (Value Added Tax) of 10%. While to send bitcoin to fellow wallet was not charged.

inthelongrun

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The Martian Child

Quote from: Beerwizzard on July 15, 2017, 03:08:15 AM

I've heared that in some countries people have to pay the income tax after buying fiat for their bitcoins. Anyone faced such problem? If yes then how you deal with it in your country?
At one point of view bitcoin is an instrument for investment so ppl buy it willing to get income in their currency.
At the other point it is a currency and it might be used with a purpose of saving. In this case the tax would be stupid.

Here in my country it is understood because all income is taxable. Income, in whatever form, and from where ever for as long as it is still considered income, a certain tax is imposed. However, with regard to bitcoin income, it is hard for my government to track them as these are all online. The Internal Revenue cannot easily monitor people's income if they are through online transactions.

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