Topic: Black Arrow 28nm 100Ghash Bitcoin ASIC from $0.49/GH/s - page 128. (Read 787050 times)
they need to give their opinion about compensation before shipping because that gives to some customer clear picture of their costs-in some countries tax are big and if BA does not thing to provide some hosting plan for compensation so they can go for refund...
And a quick glance at the last two pages worth of replies to this thread is resulted in my using a permanent marker to cross out Black Arrow's name from my list of viable ASIC manufacturers.
All of my ASIC investments thus far have been at least moderate fails at this point.
All of my ASIC investments thus far have been at least moderate fails at this point.
I think regardless of what they refund you in - Bitcoin or USD it is OK as long as the value of the refund is the same as what you originally paid (minus a processing fee if they charge one).
And that's the problem. They choose the option where the value is less, regardless of the exchange rate. Theres a clear different between pre-orders up thru april that took BTC and said BTC was forwarded BA, and further orders when we switched to Bitpay and Shopify and BTC was then cashed out to USD and sent to BA. Pretty simple.
The arrangement between you and your supplier is irrelevant to the contract between you and your customers. If someone ordered $5,000 worth of merchandise and paid you, you have to refund them the same amount in whatever currency you choose to refund in. Anything else means your "refund" is not really a refund at all.
For the most part the general consensus I have seen is that people should be refunded in the 'currency' / "medium of exchange" that was used to make the purchase. If you give someone 3 chickens for a BTC miner... then its worth 3 chickens. If I give someone 12 pesos... its worth 12 pesos. The relative value of chickens to pesos is irrelevant. If you want to value things in US dollars you should buy from companies that accept US dollars for payment.
I think regardless of what they refund you in - Bitcoin or USD it is OK as long as the value of the refund is the same as what you originally paid (minus a processing fee if they charge one).
And that's the problem. They choose the option where the value is less, regardless of the exchange rate. Theres a clear different between pre-orders up thru april that took BTC and said BTC was forwarded BA, and further orders when we switched to Bitpay and Shopify and BTC was then cashed out to USD and sent to BA. Pretty simple.
The arrangement between you and your supplier is irrelevant to the contract between you and your customers. If someone ordered $5,000 worth of merchandise and paid you, you have to refund them the same amount in whatever currency you choose to refund in. Anything else means your "refund" is not really a refund at all.
+1, I agree because it should not matter to the customer.
"The arrangement between you and your supplier is irrelevant to the contract between you and your customers."
They have already said compensation will go out after shipping.
What do you think they are planning to do? Arbitrarily wait a month before giving it to us?
What do you think they are planning to do? Arbitrarily wait a month before giving it to us?
So for the compensation we need a definitive answer.
Are you shipping 2 TH/s for each X-3 order when the shipping date supposedly starts about one week from now? Is this the final answer here?
If you can't or are not willing to definitively confirm then we're going to have to start pursuing refunds.
Are you shipping 2 TH/s for each X-3 order when the shipping date supposedly starts about one week from now? Is this the final answer here?
If you can't or are not willing to definitively confirm then we're going to have to start pursuing refunds.
Every single week you guys want a definitive answer on compensation. Don't you understand that it's pointless for them to keep adjusting compensation before they begin shipping?
If you aren't happy with them then please just get a refund already because the constant bitching is annoying.
I think regardless of what they refund you in - Bitcoin or USD it is OK as long as the value of the refund is the same as what you originally paid (minus a processing fee if they charge one).
And that's the problem. They choose the option where the value is less, regardless of the exchange rate. Theres a clear different between pre-orders up thru april that took BTC and said BTC was forwarded BA, and further orders when we switched to Bitpay and Shopify and BTC was then cashed out to USD and sent to BA. Pretty simple.
The arrangement between you and your supplier is irrelevant to the contract between you and your customers. If someone ordered $5,000 worth of merchandise and paid you, you have to refund them the same amount in whatever currency you choose to refund in. Anything else means your "refund" is not really a refund at all.
I think regardless of what they refund you in - Bitcoin or USD it is OK as long as the value of the refund is the same as what you originally paid (minus a processing fee if they charge one).
And that's the problem. They choose the option where the value is less, regardless of the exchange rate. They can't do that - not legally as far as I know. You entered in a contract to buy goods and services at say US $5,000. If you get a refund, the refund value should be $5,000-processing fee (if there is one) regardless if they choose to refund you in Bitcoin or US dollars. Entering into a contract to buy goods and services is not the same as buying shares or currency where the value of your holdings is prone to market swings.
I think regardless of what they refund you in - Bitcoin or USD it is OK as long as the value of the refund is the same as what you originally paid (minus a processing fee if they charge one).
And that's the problem. They choose the option where the value is less, regardless of the exchange rate. Theres a clear different between pre-orders up thru april that took BTC and said BTC was forwarded BA, and further orders when we switched to Bitpay and Shopify and BTC was then cashed out to USD and sent to BA. Pretty simple.
I think regardless of what they refund you in - Bitcoin or USD it is OK as long as the value of the refund is the same as what you originally paid in US dollars (minus a processing fee if they charge one).
Edit - clarity.
Edit - clarity.
So let me get this straight.. He sent BTC, wants a refund, but minersource is choosing to refund the USD amount. But when I got my refund, minersource chose to refund the same amount of Bitcoin instead of the USD equivalent. And you think this is fair? So minersource benefits regardless of the price of Bitcoin, because they'll choose to refund the option that benefits them every time.
I guess I was right in my presumption that had the price of Bitcoin gone up from when I purchased (BTC =$1167 when I paid), then they'd try to get me to accept less Bitcoins to coincide with the USD value, versus them forcing me to accept the same amount of coins, even though the value has fallen by half since then.
Like I said, they're having their cake and eating it too.
I guess I was right in my presumption that had the price of Bitcoin gone up from when I purchased (BTC =$1167 when I paid), then they'd try to get me to accept less Bitcoins to coincide with the USD value, versus them forcing me to accept the same amount of coins, even though the value has fallen by half since then.
Like I said, they're having their cake and eating it too.
So, what is it Minersource? Refunds based on actual BTC paid or the exchange rate with USD? Pick one and I'll accept it as long as you apply this rule retroactively to anyone who ordered Blackarrow related products. Is that fair enough for you?
Has anyone found an efficient way of getting refunded at a more immediate pace. Im getting tired of waiting and getting a refund after shipping as they offer now is just unacceptable. Has anyone outside of China been refunded recently?
You need to file a report at http://www.ic3.gov/complaint/default.aspx and hopefully enough people file as well to create a case for the DOJ/FBI. Otherwise, I don't think so.
Is this an American only thing or international?
Unfortunately, only for minersuorce orders or if you are in the US.
See,
"Q: Can I file a complaint if I have been victimized by an individual or company in the United States, but I am not a citizen of the United States?
If one of the two parties involved is located within the United States, please feel free to file a complaint."
If only I could file a complaint against you for wasting taxpayer resources with such a frivolous complaint. I know you said you ignored me, but for the benefit of everyone else.
1) you were offered a refund of the exact amount of dollars you paid.
2) you were offered to have the power supply shipped to you if you paid shipping.
3) You ordered a product that only said free shipping for customers who ordered an X1 or X3 through minersource, and when you were told you had to pay free shipping you threw a temper-tantrum and contacted the FBI and the FTC.
If that's the attitude you have - good luck with life, man. The hallmark of adulthood is taking responsibility for one's own decisions, and you seem to have failed to achieve that.
By the way, filing a false report to a federal agency, pursuant to title 31 of the United States Code, is punishable by a $10,000 fine. Here's hoping the system works.
Has anyone found an efficient way of getting refunded at a more immediate pace. Im getting tired of waiting and getting a refund after shipping as they offer now is just unacceptable. Has anyone outside of China been refunded recently?
You need to file a report at http://www.ic3.gov/complaint/default.aspx and hopefully enough people file as well to create a case for the DOJ/FBI. Otherwise, I don't think so.
Is this an American only thing or international?
Unfortunately, only for minersuorce orders or if you are in the US.
See,
"Q: Can I file a complaint if I have been victimized by an individual or company in the United States, but I am not a citizen of the United States?
If one of the two parties involved is located within the United States, please feel free to file a complaint."
If only I could file a complaint against you for wasting taxpayer resources with such a frivolous complaint. I know you said you ignored me, but for the benefit of everyone else.
1) you were offered a refund of the exact amount of dollars you paid.
2) you were offered to have the power supply shipped to you if you paid shipping.
3) You ordered a product that only said free shipping for customers who ordered an X1 or X3 through minersource, and when you were told you had to pay free shipping you threw a temper-tantrum and contacted the FBI and the FTC.
If that's the attitude you have - good luck with life, man. The hallmark of adulthood is taking responsibility for one's own decisions, and you seem to have failed to achieve that.
By the way, filing a false report to a federal agency, pursuant to title 31 of the United States Code, is punishable by a $10,000 fine. Here's hoping the system works.
Has anyone found an efficient way of getting refunded at a more immediate pace. Im getting tired of waiting and getting a refund after shipping as they offer now is just unacceptable. Has anyone outside of China been refunded recently?
You need to file a report at http://www.ic3.gov/complaint/default.aspx and hopefully enough people file as well to create a case for the DOJ/FBI. Otherwise, I don't think so.
Is this an American only thing or international?
Unfortunately, only for minersuorce orders or if you are in the US.
See,
"Q: Can I file a complaint if I have been victimized by an individual or company in the United States, but I am not a citizen of the United States?
If one of the two parties involved is located within the United States, please feel free to file a complaint."
nexus99 look forward to that.
Has anyone found an efficient way of getting refunded at a more immediate pace. Im getting tired of waiting and getting a refund after shipping as they offer now is just unacceptable. Has anyone outside of China been refunded recently?
You need to file a report at http://www.ic3.gov/complaint/default.aspx and hopefully enough people file as well to create a case for the DOJ/FBI. Otherwise, I don't think so.
Is this an American only thing or international?
I'm in CO so I should be able to confirm X-1 in the wild as soon as they are available. I've got some batch 1 and batch 2 on order with MS.
Has anyone found an efficient way of getting refunded at a more immediate pace. Im getting tired of waiting and getting a refund after shipping as they offer now is just unacceptable. Has anyone outside of China been refunded recently?
You need to file a report at http://www.ic3.gov/complaint/default.aspx and hopefully enough people file as well to create a case for the DOJ/FBI. Otherwise, I don't think so.
Edit: the link above also applies to orders placed at Minersource.net.
Has anyone found an efficient way of getting refunded at a more immediate pace. Im getting tired of waiting and getting a refund after shipping as they offer now is just unacceptable. Has anyone outside of China been refunded recently?
X-3 doesn't exist? Since the backplane issue has been fixed I would consider it to exist.
A 5-hashing board prototype exists.
The X-3 is a specific retail product that you have not shipped yet, therefore it does not exist.
Now instead of being snarky and chiming in like a troll, go and get customers' questions answered.
+1
time for a refund
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