Topic: Buy the DIP, and HODL! - page 143. (Read 122148 times)

You could be right because most times human needs is insatiable that is why sometimes when an investor has not really arrived at his targeted point they will be having the mindset that immediately they get to that particular point they will hold but however you will be surprising to see that even after achieving there goal they will not really be satisfied and as such they will keep pushing to acquire more, which is also applicable in Bitcoin investment because with the potential of Bitcoin it will be very difficult to be satisfied with the amount you have already accumulated because in one way or another you would always find the need to acquire more Bitcoin especially when the source of income is flowing you will always keep investing.

At first I won't consider that has loss, it can only be loss if one literally sells his investment in loss during a dip , that's why is better to use that opportunity to accumulate and hodl Bitcoin. We can't just expect the price to be going up only, surely they will be some dip as time goes due to volatility. And yeah when it comes to holding is better to use money that you can stay without using for long , like forgetting that you have such amount of money invested in Bitcoin. Because if one endup using money that's meant for certain expenses he or she may endup messing up Their holding, like selling it at the wrong time or using it to take care of some expenses.

Hahaha...Your advice is so funny to me and it is highly unprofessional, to say the least. Are you telling me that we should buy Bitcoin at both favourable and unfotable prices? That's the way I see it with your advice. If I may ask you, do you know the reason why Bitcoin has not pushed its current ATH of about $73,850 through ever since despite the high adoption and awareness about it? The reason is simple, the high net worth individuals and companies that will commit their money to it at a very high level are rare.

This is because it is risky at this time and it is against their principle of investment, which is very reasonable. You see, investment has its own guidelines and principles for effective productivity so we should not due to Bitcoin ignore it. If we did, then it may become an issue over time. Fine, Bitcoin might have reached a very high price in the next 10 years, but how sure are you? This is why we need to be cautious no matter how we are trusting about it. For this, continuous buying of Bitcoin at any price as you said is so faulty, however, what I know in investment is DCA, and if done rightly, we will not regret it. But this should not be done without extra viable plans.

Investing in valuable assets like Bitcoin is a great approach and comes with the conviction of  success. Why will an investor have a temporary feeling of uncertainty or lack of conviction in putting their money in valuable assets (Bitcoin), unless they don't know the purpose of their investments. Investing in valuable assets and one with potentials like Bitcoin is source of pleasure, after putting your money in such asset (Bitcoin) and picturing what you stands to benefit ahead comes with a lot of excitement that's what triggers us to invest in it. Bitcoin history has shown a consistent upwards trend over the years, However so long as your perspective and intentions is to Buy and Hold for long-term there is no need to have doubt or feel loss at any moment.  Our main concern in Bitcoin should be our consistency level in accumulating Bitcoin  over the long period ahead to yield good investment.

If we can naturally accept the fact that after investing in Bitcoin and holding that investment we may experience a temporary loss of money, then we will certainly not hesitate to hold Bitcoin. I have invested the market has changed a bit and if that affects us then surely we will not be able to hold our investment for a long time. You have to forget the illusion of the amount of money that you have invested and the amount of money that you will invest regularly and you have to assume that this money is fully deducted from your total money. The invested money will not be of any use to you, you don't care if you gain or lose, if you can plan like this, you will be successful in keeping your investment for a long time.

Here's the link that shows the amount of 133 BTC accumulated from early 2013 to early 2022 with around $47k invested at $100 per week. https://dcabtc.com?sd=2013-01-01&sda=custom&f=weekly&d=9_years&ac=10000&c=true

I don't buy it.

I think that at some point people have enough BTC, so you can imagine all that you want about people not having enough, but there surely are ways to live quite well off of 133 BTC, especially if your earlier standard of living had been around $100k per year... and you could give up your job and largely start to draw that same amount of income or more income than that each year and likely into perpetuity including accounting for increases in the cost of living and/or the likely ongoing and seemingly inevitable debasement of the dollar and other fiat currencies.

Currently, 133 BTC has a spot price of nearly $9 million and a 200 WMA price (which I believe to be more important of nearly $5 million.

https://bitcoindata.science/withdrawal-strategy

There is likely merely a need to think a bit more realistically in terms of not needing to have to work and still earn similar or more income than you are actually earning.. People maybe fantasize , but they actually don't have such 133 BTC or whatever other amount that I am suggesting should be enough based on already existing lifestyle and ability to maintain such lifestyle including potentially better with merely living off of their BTC at a reasonably sustainable withdrawal rate .. and whether there is still a need to continue to earn income and buy more bitcoin seems a bit of a fantasy way of thinking about the situation of someone else to me in terms of proclaiming no one is ever satisfied with being able to start to live off of their bitcoin rather than having an ongoing feeling of needing to continue to accumulate more BTC... yeah some people are never satisfied.. yet that does not mean that they should  not be able to live well with bitcoin, even the example that I gave...and there are a lot of similar examples that I could give in which "enough" BTC has likely been achieved given the person's past lifestyle situation and even possible expectations to live similarly, to improve and/or to account for inflation/debasement of the dollar and other fiats.

Demand is inexhaustible, if everyone has bitcoins in their wallets everyone will be more in demand and will take initiative to accumulate more bitcoins. You notice that people who have accumulated bitcoins in the past are enthusiastic enough to still accumulate in the present, because that person must have understood the joy inside of accumulating bitcoins. 
The higher the income in a person's life, the more basic needs will increase in his life, so a person is busy with various activities in addition to his job. And I think it's normal for that place to be busy with Bitcoin, because the more busy with Bitcoin, the more successful that person is. 
Of course, if we look at 2012, 2013, 2014, 2015, we can know all the details.

You seem to be talking about potential personality problems that some people might have in terms of never having enough.

Let's say that you had an income of about $50k in early 2013, and so in the beginning or 2013, you started accumulating around $100 per week of bitcoin, and so you kept your job, and so you don't consider after some point you are going to feel that you have enough BTC?  After 9 years from early 2013 to early 2022, you had invested right around $47k and you had accumulated nearly 133 BTC.  Wouldn't you start to feel that you have enough BTC at some point?  or do you still need more?  Even if your income doubled from $50k in 2013 to $100k in 2022, don't you consider at some point you have enough BTC to start to withdraw and maybe you don't need your $100k job if you have enough BTC to provide the same level (or more) income?

A question to ask does someone really feel satisfied while holding Bitcoin? To me I will simply say no because as long as the cash keep flowing you would always want to accumulate enough Bitcoin since bitcoin wallet doesn't have a maximum limit, in as much as your income keep flowing and you apply DCA method then you can never be satisfied even though you have about 10,000 BTC once the income keeps coming you will always apply your DCA money to increase your portfolio.

Most people who had thousands of BTC never stop at one or two they keep increasing their portfolio through DCA except for those people who are on an average job that pays little that could take time to increase their BTC holding in their portfolio.

For example, there could be guys who keep their monthly expenses to $500 or lower, yet maybe they earn around $2,100 per month, and so  this person would be investing around 3x the size of his monthly expenses, so a guy like that might make a lot of progress towards getting to fuck you status or some other "satisfied status" as compared with a guy who might make $6k per month and then has $5k worth of expenses, including maybe not even investing much more than $100 per week into bitcoin.. .. Such a guy is going to take a lot longer to get to fuck you status, not only because his living expenses are high, but also because how much he is investing is not very high, even in order to attain his standard of living.

The guy with the lower expenses could increase his expenses later in life after he has been building his bitcoin investing.. so maybe his goal is to get his bitcoin investment to high levels, even though he only makes around 1/3 the amount odf the guy making $6k per month.

I believe that no one should ever be satisfied with making money, when you're stagnant and always receiving debit alerts without credits, it hurts your finance gradually until its obvious that your finances are diminishing. Investments are what needs to be made on a regular to keep your residual income pumping in and increases the security of your finances.

In bitcoin accumulation journey, the most important thing is to start up. Starting with $10 monthly isn't a bad thing at all, if that's his spare funds, its welcome. Remember you invest with your spare funds and not emergency funds. One good thing is the desire to invest. Once there is desire, there possibility of a good result is high. The person that started with $10 monthly and has a target can increase his investment capacity with time as his finances improves.

At some point I disagree because an investor will still continue to accumulate beyond the cycle but, just because most people have the sufficient income they can double their amount at any given time, I still want to emphasize on the $10 per week because I have heard of most cases when people choose an investment choice at first and they decide to observe first using the little they have at the moment and whenever they realize the investment is really a good investment like bitcoin then you can see the investor investing aggressively like for example, when an investor is sure about the investment you see them making every possible means to accumulate and if possible they start increasing the amount monthly depending on their discretionary income, secondly there’s this set of people who have gotten informations about bitcoin and they know how bitcoin works, if you observe carefully you’ll discover the second set of people and their approach towards accumulating bitcoin will be totally different from an old investor. We don’t have to mix up things knowing fully well bitcoin investment comes with planning so if anyone is willing to invest 20% weekly that’s their plan, the time range is not the problem at first as investor should practice a healthy investing plan.

The satisfaction I mean is that you can't hold your Bitcoin forever or is it possible to hold your Bitcoin investment forever? I think that answer is no, for there is a certain point you will hold your Bitcoin when you have accumulated enough for a long time you can decide to sell out part of your Bitcoin hodling that is the satisfied I means so don't get me wrong.

Yea, the word "satisfy" depends on the individual bitcoin target that he feels is enough for him to acquire based on his own discretionary income in which he is using to buy bitcoin. However, I feel that anyone using DCA strategy to by bitcoin for as low as $10 might not get to the extend that he will say that he has enough Bitcoin until maybe 30yrs-40yrs time.

So considering the word satisfy, it depends on how old that you are and for how long will you continue building your bitcoin portfolio with the amount that you are using to DCA regularly based on your discretionary income. A rich guy who is ready to invest in bitcoin using DCA regularly without missing will have a high chance of reaching his bitcoin target because he has all the resources he needs around him to make it happen fast compare to someone that is an average earner.

Am not sure of qwhat you meant by being satisfied, nor do I think other investors who consider the future would use such word. I am very sure that no one is ever satisfied with making more money (even the world's richest people), so why should we be satisfied with making investments?. The continuous use of the DCA strategy for at least four years, before doing whatever you want to do with it doesn't mean someone is satisfied. There might just be a very important project that has been sidelined, with the intention of making use of the investment after at least four years.

In another sense, if your portfolio happens to be very high, but you keep getting extra personal funds, then you should continue to invest. Or do you prefer to waste your extra funds just because you feel your accumulation portfolio is satisfactory enough?.

Well said, I would also love to add that the stash of Bitcoin any investor would accumulate is not solely dependent on the number of years, but the amount invested aggressively or conservatively is what builds the portfolio. An investor who is investing $10 for 4,5 years above as you said would not have any good stash of Bitcoin, but another who invest $200 using same time frame will accumulate more, thus we see the relation, it goes on and on.
In essence what matters is Amount readily for the investment aligning with your plan (Target), with any suitable strategy used by the investor.

Well I don't know how other people do it but for me I don't think it's necessary to build emergency, reserve, and floating funds before you start buying bitcoin. You can actually do all at the same time provided you have allocated a certain percentage to all of these funds before your salary comes in with the week or within the month end.  You already know your salary before hand, you can say 10% to emergency funds, 15% reserve funds, 5% floating funds, 20% investment funds, and so on depending on how many places you want to share your money into. When you say you want to build up other funds first before you can start buying bitcoin, you are wasting time and procastination is gradually setting in. It's best you do all side by side, that way you are actually more on the safe side. No matter the income you are earning, once you put everything in percentage it will be very easier for you to divide you money once it comes.
Your approach might work for you, don't get wrong, but I think it will be better if everything is done along side each other to eliminate the risk of procastination and possibly missing out on buying the bitcoin.

Yes as long as Bitcoin investment is concern we don't only need to hold and wait but we should just keep on accumulating more and more Bitcoin until we are satisfied with the quantity of Bitcoin we have accumulated not in less than 3 years below but 4,5 years and above, we can buy more Bitcoin using both DCA method and the lump sum strategy which will help us accumulate more Bitcoin in a long run.

Exactly, holding Bitcoin for long-term investment is the best, rather than trading with it though I'm not against trading and stuff but is only advisable for those that have good knowledge and skills when it comes to trading , but when it comes to investing such skills ain't needed all one need is just some basic knowledge and some nice discretionary income , and he or she is ready to go (that's the beauty of investing in bitcoin). But when comes to holding one should learn how to plan ahead as he or she are holding, because without proper planning one can endup messing with his investment. Like selling it too early , or using it as an emergency funds (which is wrong) because long-term holding is all about patient, and the number of stashes one had accumulated, that's why we don't only have to hold and wait we have to accumulate till we hit the point of having enough Bitcoin Stash in our portfolio.

To me, it seems that some guys and/or maybe several guys get it wrong when they try to paraphrase me or to sum up what I am saying in their own words, so they end up stating something different than what I said, and surely there can be a bit of annoyance when I feel that I have to respond to those kinds of matters.. so I am not sure about the solution especially if guys some guys are paraphrasing and/or summarizing merely in an honest attempt to get clarification, but still get it wrong... so then I find myself repeating what I believe to be fairly trivial points, and in the end, maybe it does not matter what I think and/or what I said, even though it still feels uncomfortable for guys saying that other guys should do x, y or z because JJG said a, b or c.


Of course, I am suggesting that there is a certain value in having solid financial foundations that allow for being more aggressive in your BTC buying/accumulating.. So the stronger a guy's finances, the more aggressive that he can be.

I am not trying to tell anyone or suggest to anyone how they should invest in terms of their own needs to figure out what works for them, so many times if we are talking about someone who is brand new to bitcoin, it is likely important that they get started in bitcoin as soon as possible and don't be diddly daddling around, but just because someone is new to bitcoin, that does not mean that any of us are going to know their finances, so some guys might be able to start out by lump summing and other guys might ONLY have DCA as an option, and surely some guys might already have some emergency funds in place, and other guys might have very messed up finances in terms of having a lot of debt and lack of clarity regarding how much disposable income that they might have.. even though I think that some people have some really messed up finances, an overwhelming majority of folks are going to have as much knowledge of their finances to know whether or not (at this particular moment if we are talking with them on the street) they can buy $10 worth of bitcoin.   


You seem to be speaking a bit of gobble-dee-gook here, yet surely I did not say that there is any need to be overly prepared for emergencies, yet the more prepared that anyone is in regards to emergencies, and other financial matters, the more aggressive they can be in their accumulation of bitcoin.


 I repeatedly staid that I believe that there is no need to build your emergency fund in advance of investing into bitcoin, and I also repeatedly said that it is good to get started investing into bitcoin right away, including the possibility of building an emergency fund at the same time, in the event that someone might only start out by having something like 2-4 weeks worth of extra cash that he might have available. 

Sure there could be some folks who know their situation and they know that they don't even have 2 weeks of extra cash available, they are not clear about their income and/or their expenses, which means that they are not even clear if they have any disposable income, then those folks should not be buying any bitcoin, but if anyone can determine that they actually have disposable income, such as $10 that they can use to buy bitcoin, then they should be able to get started buying bitcoin and like you suggested, the more they get their financial and psychological shit in order, then the more aggressive they can be in terms of their bitcoin accumulation... so yeah, there could be some needs to at least get their emergency fund up to 3 months of their expenses prior to becoming aggressive in their bitcoin accumulation, but I surely had not said that they need to get their emergency fund up to 3 months of their expenses prior to getting started in bitcoin since anyone should be able to build his emergency fund up to 3 months and to slowly buy bitcoin at the same time, so if he has around $500 per month of absolute bare minimum expenses, then he has to get his emergency fund up to $1,500 at some point and maybe he might choose to grow his bitcoin investment and his emergency fund at right around the same rate, so that they  both reach 3 months around the same time.. and surely these are discretionary matters regarding how to do these kinds of things in safe ways and potentially serious attempting to get involved and get started in bitcoin as soon as possible.. while at the same time, getting his financial and psychological matters in order by making sure that he has a plan in place for building his emergency fund..  people are responsible to make their own judgements in these regards, but personally I see little to no reason for such hypothetical person to spend 3-6 months or even longer such as a year building his emergency fund up to 3 months, when previously he ONLY had around $200 to $400 in his reserves, and then he absolutely is not buying any BTC during that time while he is build up his emergency fund.. makes little sense to me and seems overly conservative, cautious and keeps the guy a no coiner for way longer than he needs to be.. in other words, get the fuck started and get some bitcoin, especially if you can figure out that you have any amount of discretionary/disposable income. and if the guy has $200 to $400 that he already considers to be disposable income (it just happens to be reserves and/or float or an emergency fund), there should be no reason that he cannot use $10 of that (or some other amount he finds to be reasonable) to buy bitcoin and at least convert himself away from being a no coiner.


You are not very far off.. but it might not be good to be trying to paraphrase me...and no problem if you are trying to engage with the ideas and working out your views on how to balance these various matters of becoming a coiner and at the same time figuring out how aggressive that any of us can afford to be without overdoing it and while trying to both build our bitcoin and build the solidness of our bitcoin accumulation within our financial and psychological means and within our individual circumstances..