▁ ▂ ▄ ▅ ▆ Cloudmining 101 (ponzi risk assessment) ▆ ▅ ▄ ▂ ▁ - page 91.

Muhammed Zakir

hero member

Activity: 560

Merit: 506

I prefer Zakir over Muhammed when mentioning me!

Quote from: yvv on November 30, 2014, 09:50:59 AM

Quote

hashprofit.com 1+3+4+~6+7 (looking in to it, feedback welcome)

Looks like the most suspicious among all to me. But I got the most of BTC from them through promo sales (50% discounts!) and refferals. They gave me three times more Khs for free than I bought from them on sale. Two weeks ago, I removed all referrals links from my signature on all forums which I use, but I still continue to receive free Khs from hashprofit referrals.

You may want to remove 7 from it as you can sell hashpower in Hashprofit.

~~MZ~~

pawel7777

legendary

Activity: 2436

Merit: 1561

Quote from: Puppet on December 14, 2014, 07:10:07 AM

Ive been getting several requests for a tip jar. I didnt want to do this to avoid the impression I'm doing this for personal gain.
But since the ponzi pushers turned that argument around by saying it proves Im shilling for whatever company complies with my criteria, I might as well post an address.

15YNTMoAzTCve64rveEka75qCeJMZpmDCx

Anything I receive on that address will be used to further this cause, like doing signature campaigns to raise awareness.

That's a good idea. Sent you a small one. Keep up the good work!

l3sny

hero member

Activity: 859

Merit: 1000

Thanks Puppet Wink

Why hashie Gen1 is ponzi? I have asked that question before but I did not get the answer.

Puppet

legendary

Activity: 980

Merit: 1040

Ive been getting several requests for a tip jar. I didnt want to do this to avoid the impression I'm doing this for personal gain.
But since the ponzi pushers turned that argument around by saying it proves Im shilling for whatever company complies with my criteria, I might as well post an address.

15YNTMoAzTCve64rveEka75qCeJMZpmDCx

Anything I receive on that address will be used to further this cause, like doing signature campaigns to raise awareness.

l3sny

hero member

Activity: 859

Merit: 1000

Quote from: Puppet on December 13, 2014, 06:49:34 PM

Several operators so far have offered to, and/or sent me 'privileged' information.
When asked, I will respect confidentiality but I refuse to sign NDA's and I want to be clear that I base my assessments solely on publicly available information.

There is a very good reason for that, I want everyone to be able to (and do) their own due diligence and I dont want anyone to feel they have to trust me or my assessment of whatever 'secret' information I might be given. Whatever Im told or given in confidence will therefore not change any rating.

If you think thats unfair, just make it public so everyone can scrutinize it. If you think that doing so might hurt your business model, then there is probably something wrong with your business model.

Actually there is nothing wrong with our business model. We just do not want to disclose it for the reasons I explained to you in private as we just do not have any interest in it. I did not ask you to judge our business model but to confirm if we are mining/possess the hashing power and do not do fractional mining. If you were in this business you would understand that given recent drop in diff dynamics that has occured almost two months ago and subsequent drop in diff would make it very difficult for fractional mining business to survive. We have even reduced our maintenance fees by 25% on 01 Dec and we plan to reduce them further.
It seems that you did not want to look on the evidence I was ready to disclose and that's the end of it. Please accept that not all legit businesses like ours will do as you please.

I think the DC above is from Space 1999 Wink

creuz

member

Activity: 119

Merit: 10

CheapCheap Mining

Our miners don't use electricity so lowest fees. Actually we only employ real humans who manually compute hashes. Only young calculus genius from best third world universities work for us.

Our miners are hackproof.

We are able to switch to most profitable algorithm at anytime.

Our ecological footprint is very low. The datacenter is protected by north korean military commandos.

You can pay with dollar, food, or technological secret.

creuz

member

Activity: 119

Merit: 10

Quote from: Puppet on December 13, 2014, 06:49:34 PM

Several operators so far have offered to, and/or sent me 'privileged' information.
When asked, I will respect confidentiality but I refuse to sign NDA's and I want to be clear that I base my assessments solely on publicly available information.

There is a very good reason for that, I want everyone to be able to (and do) their own due diligence and I dont want anyone to feel they have to trust me or my assessment of whatever 'secret' information I might be given. Whatever Im told or given in confidence will therefore not change any rating.

If you think thats unfair, just make it public so everyone can scrutinize it. If you think that doing so might hurt your business model, then there is probably something wrong with your business model.

OK, we have nothing to hide.

Our control center

Client support staff daily briefing :

Our datacenter (can't show more, its a critical part of our business) :

Inside :

Puppet

legendary

Activity: 980

Merit: 1040

Several operators so far have offered to, and/or sent me 'privileged' information.
When asked, I will respect confidentiality but I refuse to sign NDA's and I want to be clear that I base my assessments solely on publicly available information.

There is a very good reason for that, I want everyone to be able to (and do) their own due diligence and I dont want anyone to feel they have to trust me or my assessment of whatever 'secret' information I might be given. Whatever Im told or given in confidence will therefore not change any rating.

If you think thats unfair, just make it public so everyone can scrutinize it. If you think that doing so might hurt your business model, then there is probably something wrong with your business model.

tmfp

legendary

Activity: 1932

Merit: 1737

"Common rogue from Russia with a bare ass."

Quote from: creuz on December 13, 2014, 06:25:11 PM

Quote from: Puppet on December 13, 2014, 04:27:47 PM

Your answer: "we cant say". It might as well be santaclaus then.

SantaClaus Mining
Lifetime contract
Best mining hardware from secret Nazi research center.
Our miners were sent to dark side of the moon (minus 153 °C) by cheapest Russian launchers.

So only for bitcointalk members, here is our limited offer :

10 TH for only 1 BTC.
Hourly payout.
+1800% a year profit.

For 24h only. Hurry Up !

I vouch for SantaClaus Mining as very dependable and honest operation. I invested 8 satoshis last Christmas in special invitation and have been paid regular every twelve minutes, now ROI'd 64 times and have 300 PH/s and my own hydropower plant.
DO NOT LISTEN TO FUD from sick making so called scambusters who are all investors in GRINCH Mining cowboy ponzi scheme competition.

I BELIEVE IN FATHER CHRISTMAS.

creuz

member

Activity: 119

Merit: 10

Quote from: l3sny on December 13, 2014, 06:31:25 PM

looks legit! Wink

To reward our 10 first customers :

If you buy more than 100 TH we offer you...

One day on a paradise island all expenses paid with one of the best friends of Justin Bieber ! Fantastic.

l3sny

hero member

Activity: 859

Merit: 1000

looks legit! Wink

creuz

member

Activity: 119

Merit: 10

Quote from: Puppet on December 13, 2014, 04:27:47 PM

Your answer: "we cant say". It might as well be santaclaus then.

SantaClaus Mining
Lifetime contract
Best mining hardware from secret Nazi research center.
Our miners were sent to dark side of the moon (minus 153 °C) by cheapest Russian launchers.

So only for bitcointalk members, here is our limited offer :

10 TH for only 1 BTC.
Hourly payout.
+1800% a year profit.

For 24h only. Hurry Up !

l3sny

hero member

Activity: 859

Merit: 1000

Quote from: Puppet on December 13, 2014, 04:27:47 PM

Quote from: l3sny on December 13, 2014, 04:25:54 PM

Exactly. And to do this you would need to have such control over your miners that you could mine to your address and probably pool directly which is not always the case.

Thats the point isnt it; if you dont control the miners, then who does?
Your answer: "we cant say". It might as well be santaclaus then.

Well.... we basically do not care. We use hosted miners and we do not care where they mine. Perhaps we will change that as indeed it is a good argument for the sake of the credibility if it is questioned.

Puppet

legendary

Activity: 980

Merit: 1040

Quote from: l3sny on December 13, 2014, 04:25:54 PM

Exactly. And to do this you would need to have such control over your miners that you could mine to your address and probably pool directly which is not always the case.

Thats the point isnt it; if you dont control the miners, then who does?
Your answer: "we cant say". It might as well be santaclaus then.

l3sny

hero member

Activity: 859

Merit: 1000

Quote from: darkangel11 on December 13, 2014, 04:13:46 PM

Quote from: l3sny on December 13, 2014, 12:06:00 PM

Quote from: darkangel11 on December 13, 2014, 11:50:10 AM

Quote from: l3sny on December 13, 2014, 11:35:53 AM

There is no chance to positively verify a legit mining operation, that's the paradox.

Yes, there is!
If you show your mining address anyone can calculate how many coins you mined and how many you paid out to your clients. As long as the coins keep moving from the mining address to their clients, while the money the clients paid for shares go to a separate address, everything is fine.

Even if you have a public mining address you would have to be mining with your own miners on a pool. What if you use a hosted service elsewhere and bitcoins are being distributed among other participants and then redistributed to the shareholders minus the costs of maintenance? You would need to know not only the number of users but also the amount of shares each of them has. It cannot be solved that easily as you think.

In such case it wouldn't be their mining address. A mining address is a place where you place fresh coins not redistrubuted ones.

Exactly. And to do this you would need to have such control over your miners that you could mine to your address and probably pool directly which is not always the case. Some operations may be using hosted miners by a third party and get their profits distributed from the 'second hand'. Moreover mining operations need liquidity, they buy and sell hashing power outside their platform. This is just normal practice so you may see dodgy things under the address. Therefore I think proper verification is not that straight forward Wink

darkangel11

legendary

Activity: 2296

Merit: 1335

Don't let others control your BTC -> self custody

Quote from: l3sny on December 13, 2014, 12:06:00 PM

Quote from: darkangel11 on December 13, 2014, 11:50:10 AM

Quote from: l3sny on December 13, 2014, 11:35:53 AM

There is no chance to positively verify a legit mining operation, that's the paradox.

Yes, there is!
If you show your mining address anyone can calculate how many coins you mined and how many you paid out to your clients. As long as the coins keep moving from the mining address to their clients, while the money the clients paid for shares go to a separate address, everything is fine.

Even if you have a public mining address you would have to be mining with your own miners on a pool. What if you use a hosted service elsewhere and bitcoins are being distributed among other participants and then redistributed to the shareholders minus the costs of maintenance? You would need to know not only the number of users but also the amount of shares each of them has. It cannot be solved that easily as you think.

In such case it wouldn't be their mining address. A mining address is a place where you place fresh coins not redistrubuted ones.

armedmilitia

hero member

Activity: 562

Merit: 506

We're going to need a bigger heatsink.

Quote from: Puppet on December 13, 2014, 03:23:09 PM

I know who they are, they are rated on my list:
Zeushash 1+2+3+4+5 => 5/7 = (very) suspicious

Whoops, must have missed that! In my defense, that list is getting pretty long. Maybe we should start a wiki? Cheesy

Puppet

legendary

Activity: 980

Merit: 1040

Quote from: armedmilitia on December 13, 2014, 02:46:50 PM

No proof, this is what I saw:
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/zeushashcom-payments-have-resumed-892061

Interesting. Ill keep on eye on it, but for now one or two users reporting 1 day delay, its a bit early to pronounce a collapse.
edit: well its more than 1-2 users clearly, but lets not yet rule out a technical issue.

Quote

Link to their official site:
https://zeushash.com/

I know who they are, they are rated on my list:
Zeushash 1+2+3+4+5 => 5/7 = (very) suspicious

armedmilitia

hero member

Activity: 562

Merit: 506

We're going to need a bigger heatsink.

Quote

Link?

No proof, this is what I saw:
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/zeushashcom-payments-have-resumed-892061

Link to their official site:
https://zeushash.com/

Puppet

legendary

Activity: 980

Merit: 1040

Quote from: armedmilitia on December 13, 2014, 02:39:55 PM

From the looks of the list you're only showing SHA256 cloud mining companies. No "love" for the scrypt crowd?

exactly. I dont follow alt coins at all, sorry. But you can apply the same criteria yourself. IN fact I strongly encourage everyone to do their own due diligence, dont just take my word for it.

Quote

I heard zeusminer stopped payouts for their contracts... Wink

Link?

Topic: ▁ ▂ ▄ ▅ ▆ Cloudmining 101 (ponzi risk assessment) ▆ ▅ ▄ ▂ ▁ - page 91. (Read 361355 times)