Dear aiwill,
I'm very sorry to raise this question, but.. many try to scam us here with their "brand new ASIC companys" nearly every day.
Can you verify what you say?
Topic: Eyes to the horizon: A bitcoin ASIC project will be announced in June - page 11. (Read 72096 times)
May 25, 2013, 06:53:37 PM
May 25, 2013, 10:28:57 AM
Seeing the pricing you propose for 1TH in model B (1,000-1,200BTC/TH/year), I'm afraid your IPO price will be too expensive. I would take into account that Bitfountain's IPO price was 0.1BTC per share, for an expected deployment of +250TH. If I do not recall it wrong, each share is 1/400,000 of the total profit/hashrate, which means that their price for TH was 160BTC, not a hefty 1,000-1,200BTC price tag.
Even at today's difficulty, a TH would take about a year to earn 1200BTC. Ridiculously overpriced, especially as that price only leases you the hash rate for a year.
At today's difficulty, 1 TH/s will make 1200 BTC in 27 days. (without electricity costs). You know, 1200 BTC per 1 TH/s is 1.2 BTC per 1 GH/s. Similar price as Avalon #3
Maybe that is why you want to sell shares 
Or maybe you want to sell shares to finance the infrastructure roll out for hosting another 900Thash...I would prefer Mode A, but in addition I suggest you spread your risk by selling some chips or miners too. This will also be good for bitcoin itself.
You say you will pay out 100% of profit, but how do you calculate "profit"?
May 24, 2013, 04:45:22 AM
OP: I also think model A is more interesting, but only because the pricing of model B seems too high.
Anyhow, as you do not seem to need funding to develop your project, in your shoes I would just mine and keep the profit, while also selling any hardware in excess, which would also help to decentralize Bitcoin a lot. Sometimes is easier to manufacture units en masse once you got everything right that to find a place with enough power/connectivity to deploy a huge operation.
My understanding is that ASICminer had to launch an IPO to raise the funds needed to develop their project from scratch, and this is why it has been such a good investment for their shareholders. As you do not seem to need money for that, the only purpose of going public would be to raise more funds than your mining operation would generate by itself, which obviously would be a bad investment for your shareholders, unless they really count on the Greater Fool Theory
Please correct me if I'm wrong, as you may also use the IPO funding to produce and deploy more TH.
Anyhow, as you do not seem to need funding to develop your project, in your shoes I would just mine and keep the profit, while also selling any hardware in excess, which would also help to decentralize Bitcoin a lot. Sometimes is easier to manufacture units en masse once you got everything right that to find a place with enough power/connectivity to deploy a huge operation.
My understanding is that ASICminer had to launch an IPO to raise the funds needed to develop their project from scratch, and this is why it has been such a good investment for their shareholders. As you do not seem to need money for that, the only purpose of going public would be to raise more funds than your mining operation would generate by itself, which obviously would be a bad investment for your shareholders, unless they really count on the Greater Fool Theory
Please correct me if I'm wrong, as you may also use the IPO funding to produce and deploy more TH.
hi , there re some misunderstands,
1. we of course need money ，needless to say some other research like hardware wallet we are preparing , the difference between DIY and mode B is :volume and speed. with the potential investment from community we can create 200T+ safely,without which 100T will be our best and risky.
2. Purpose of mode A is even simpler: decentralize . "Raise more funds than your mining operation" is a kind of cheat.
Thanks for your reply. Just for clarity, with model A you would raise the funds needed to produce the chips and assemble the units, correct? Thus, the IPO will be launched before the deployment, as per ASICminer - is this correct?
I also think that the ASICminer business model has been very clever and successful, both for them and their shareholders. If I'm correct, they launched only 200,000 shares in the IPO, each share priced very conveniently (cheap) compared to the estimated deployment, and entitled to 1/400,000 of the profits generated (which means that they are sharing 50% of their profits with public shareholds, and keeping for them and private investors the other 50%).
This allowed them to a) make the project happen, b) distribute a high return to shareholds and b) generate a very good profit for them.
May 24, 2013, 04:34:03 AM
OP: I also think model A is more interesting, but only because the pricing of model B seems too high.
Anyhow, as you do not seem to need funding to develop your project, in your shoes I would just mine and keep the profit, while also selling any hardware in excess, which would also help to decentralize Bitcoin a lot. Sometimes is easier to manufacture units en masse once you got everything right that to find a place with enough power/connectivity to deploy a huge operation.
My understanding is that ASICminer had to launch an IPO to raise the funds needed to develop their project from scratch, and this is why it has been such a good investment for their shareholders. As you do not seem to need money for that, the only purpose of going public would be to raise more funds than your mining operation would generate by itself, which obviously would be a bad investment for your shareholders, unless they really count on the Greater Fool Theory
Please correct me if I'm wrong, as you may also use the IPO funding to produce and deploy more TH.
Anyhow, as you do not seem to need funding to develop your project, in your shoes I would just mine and keep the profit, while also selling any hardware in excess, which would also help to decentralize Bitcoin a lot. Sometimes is easier to manufacture units en masse once you got everything right that to find a place with enough power/connectivity to deploy a huge operation.
My understanding is that ASICminer had to launch an IPO to raise the funds needed to develop their project from scratch, and this is why it has been such a good investment for their shareholders. As you do not seem to need money for that, the only purpose of going public would be to raise more funds than your mining operation would generate by itself, which obviously would be a bad investment for your shareholders, unless they really count on the Greater Fool Theory
Please correct me if I'm wrong, as you may also use the IPO funding to produce and deploy more TH.
hi , there re some misunderstandings
1. we of course need money ，needless to say some other research like hardware wallet we are preparing , the difference between DIY and mode B is :volume and speed. with the potential investment from community we can create 200T+ safely,without which 100T will be our best and risky.
2. Purpose of mode A is even simpler: decentralize .
May 24, 2013, 04:06:56 AM
OP: I also think model A is more interesting, but only because the pricing of model B seems too high.
Anyhow, as you do not seem to need funding to develop your project, in your shoes I would just mine and keep the profit, while also selling any hardware in excess, which would also help to decentralize Bitcoin a lot. Sometimes is easier to manufacture units en masse once you got everything right that to find a place with enough power/connectivity to deploy a huge operation.
My understanding is that ASICminer had to launch an IPO to raise the funds needed to develop their project from scratch, and this is why it has been such a good investment for their shareholders. As you do not seem to need money for that, the only purpose of going public would be to raise more funds than your mining operation would generate by itself, which obviously would be a bad investment for your shareholders, unless they really count on the Greater Fool Theory
Please correct me if I'm wrong, as you may also use the IPO funding to produce and deploy more TH.
Anyhow, as you do not seem to need funding to develop your project, in your shoes I would just mine and keep the profit, while also selling any hardware in excess, which would also help to decentralize Bitcoin a lot. Sometimes is easier to manufacture units en masse once you got everything right that to find a place with enough power/connectivity to deploy a huge operation.
My understanding is that ASICminer had to launch an IPO to raise the funds needed to develop their project from scratch, and this is why it has been such a good investment for their shareholders. As you do not seem to need money for that, the only purpose of going public would be to raise more funds than your mining operation would generate by itself, which obviously would be a bad investment for your shareholders, unless they really count on the Greater Fool Theory
Please correct me if I'm wrong, as you may also use the IPO funding to produce and deploy more TH.
May 24, 2013, 02:20:44 AM
what an expensive product for 1000btc for 1TH, another manufacturer can get that for less than 180 btc..for 1TH. i wonder why you want 2 sell your 100TH? do you want to make a quick buck from all the newbies? take advantage of them.. be careful ..
May 24, 2013, 02:11:40 AM
Mode A,keping eays on
May 23, 2013, 11:34:21 PM
Count me in! mode A is better.
May 23, 2013, 11:21:29 PM
Strongly suggest mode A also. I would also recommend not paying out 100% of earnings in dividends, but keep about 30% for further R&D so you can develop and deploy better and better technology as time goes on. Hope you guys succeed!
hehe ,thx. please notice that we will def keep going on R&D on the area of not only mining but some other BTC-related products. Not a Hit and Run biz for sure.
Also consider your project as a new startup without any prototype, company nor reputation yet... May we see a detailed business plan?
surely you will someday.
You have to know that if one party is too dominant in Bitcoin. It's not good for Bitcoin future, in term of security, adoption by the public etc.
So far I can see the trend of China ASIC members are becoming very dominant in Bitcoin mining. It's not good for the bitcoin future because member of public will not trust and use Bitcoin widely as they should.
To maintain Bitcoin survival and wide adoption, I would suggest a kind of mix between mode A and mode B. Something like ASICminer is doing.
BTW, i'm interested too.
So far I can see the trend of China ASIC members are becoming very dominant in Bitcoin mining. It's not good for the bitcoin future because member of public will not trust and use Bitcoin widely as they should.
To maintain Bitcoin survival and wide adoption, I would suggest a kind of mix between mode A and mode B. Something like ASICminer is doing.
BTW, i'm interested too
.thx for this sincere suggestion. i will think about it.
May 23, 2013, 10:23:46 PM
I agree that the proposed price of 1000-1200 BTC per TH/s is too expensive. Aiwill, please consider making this project more affordable for everyone involved.
Probably he wants a quick buck and a big one
That way he can recovers back his ROI fast and all what is left is your money he is playing with ... typical smart Chinese guy
they are willing to bust their brains and their butts to get this thing going .. really hope we can received our avalon chip soon
before this China Monster comes out .. because the degree of difficulty will jump sky high..
Avalon Chip alone only costs you 252 btc versus 1000btc... my that is a lot of a difference.. for a 1TH miner
May 23, 2013, 10:06:05 PM
Strongly suggest mode A also. I would also recommend not paying out 100% of earnings in dividends, but keep about 30% for further R&D so you can develop and deploy better and better technology as time goes on. Hope you guys succeed!
May 23, 2013, 08:40:19 PM
Any Chinese user knows if the following is just FUD?
Source: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.2243603
Source: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.2243603
Not sure.
Never heard this.
It's very fresh news. That happened just a few hours ago. Anyhow, can you still login and use Bitcoin exchanges/wallets (like blockchain.info or MtGox) using Telecom China?
used VPN or proxy and you should not have a problem...
No problem to access to blockchain or Mtgox using Telecom China.
May 23, 2013, 08:38:35 PM
I agree that the proposed price of 1000-1200 BTC per TH/s is too expensive. Aiwill, please consider making this project more affordable for everyone involved.
May 23, 2013, 08:31:46 PM
You have to know that if one party is too dominant in Bitcoin. It's not good for Bitcoin future, in term of security, adoption by the public etc.
So far I can see the trend of China ASIC members are becoming very dominant in Bitcoin mining. It's not good for the bitcoin future because member of public will not trust and use Bitcoin widely as they should.
To maintain Bitcoin survival and wide adoption, I would suggest a kind of mix between mode A and mode B. Something like ASICminer is doing.
BTW, i'm interested too.
So far I can see the trend of China ASIC members are becoming very dominant in Bitcoin mining. It's not good for the bitcoin future because member of public will not trust and use Bitcoin widely as they should.
To maintain Bitcoin survival and wide adoption, I would suggest a kind of mix between mode A and mode B. Something like ASICminer is doing.
BTW, i'm interested too
. May 23, 2013, 08:17:53 PM
expensive and we don't have much business details, setup and information about you. moreover is a risk in setting up a business in communist china, they/authorities can just come and seize your mining rigs.
May 23, 2013, 06:27:59 PM
The website listed in the OP seems to just be a Chinese bitcoin news page.
Where is all this work being done? I assume down in Shenzhen?
Electricity is cheap in China, so the difference in investment cost for 130nm and 60 or 28nm etc is not worth the electricity savings I'd guess. But if this is meant to be an on going business I'd hope they would reinvest some profit into developing a smaller form factor for the future.
I'd certainly be interested, but only if I could travel down from Shanghai to have a look at test rigs etc.
As for not being able to access bitcoin traffic, just setup a private VPN in Hongkong or something. I've found accessing bitcoin and litecoin site patchy without a VPN, so it does seem the authorities do try to block them (when they know about them).
Where is all this work being done? I assume down in Shenzhen?
Electricity is cheap in China, so the difference in investment cost for 130nm and 60 or 28nm etc is not worth the electricity savings I'd guess. But if this is meant to be an on going business I'd hope they would reinvest some profit into developing a smaller form factor for the future.
I'd certainly be interested, but only if I could travel down from Shanghai to have a look at test rigs etc.
As for not being able to access bitcoin traffic, just setup a private VPN in Hongkong or something. I've found accessing bitcoin and litecoin site patchy without a VPN, so it does seem the authorities do try to block them (when they know about them).
May 23, 2013, 04:59:25 PM
Please let us know which kind of equation did you used to determine the price per GH/s ?.
IMO it's very overpriced for a 130nm chip structure.. you're producing a huge amount of 308224 chips, you may get a discount on such quantity?.
Also consider your project as a new startup without any prototype, company nor reputation yet... May we see a detailed business plan?
IMO it's very overpriced for a 130nm chip structure.. you're producing a huge amount of 308224 chips, you may get a discount on such quantity?.
Also consider your project as a new startup without any prototype, company nor reputation yet... May we see a detailed business plan?
May 23, 2013, 04:13:14 PM
Mode A definitely.
May 23, 2013, 03:48:53 PM
Mode A. Interesting indeed. 
May 23, 2013, 03:45:31 PM
Count me in as interested - I'd also vote for mode A.
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