Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP. - page 1306.

molecular

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Quote from: joesmoe2012 on May 28, 2013, 11:36:54 PM

Quote from: thezerg on May 28, 2013, 08:35:10 PM

Small Memorial day pull-back from the top of the recent rally does not even matter when you look at how
BTC is pwning Gold!!!

the silverbox update (comparison from the beginning of this thread, March 13th, 2012, gold=1690, nasdaq=3055, Bitcoin=5.4):
Bitcoin is 129.57. Gold is 1386.00. Nasdaq is 3488.00
Bitcoin: 2299.44%
Gold: -17.99%
Nasdaq: 14.17%
Gold Diff: 2826% advantage Bitcoin
Nasdaq Diff: 2002% advantage Bitcoin[/b][/size]

great....Only problem is that means BTC is way over valued at the moment, it's gone haywire against notably one of the most stable metals on earth.

Funny how I was just postponing my planned metal purchase (via BTC) again because I still think BTC is way undervalued compared to gold.

joesmoe2012

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Ching-Chang;Ding-Dong

Quote from: thezerg on May 28, 2013, 08:35:10 PM

Small Memorial day pull-back from the top of the recent rally does not even matter when you look at how
BTC is pwning Gold!!!

the silverbox update (comparison from the beginning of this thread, March 13th, 2012, gold=1690, nasdaq=3055, Bitcoin=5.4):
Bitcoin is 129.57. Gold is 1386.00. Nasdaq is 3488.00
Bitcoin: 2299.44%
Gold: -17.99%
Nasdaq: 14.17%
Gold Diff: 2826% advantage Bitcoin
Nasdaq Diff: 2002% advantage Bitcoin[/b][/size]

great....Only problem is that means BTC is way over valued at the moment, it's gone haywire against notably one of the most stable metals on earth.

BitcoinAshley

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Quote from: thezerg on May 28, 2013, 08:35:10 PM

Small Memorial day pull-back from the top of the recent rally does not even matter when you look at how
BTC is pwning Gold!!!

the silverbox update (comparison from the beginning of this thread, March 13th, 2012, gold=1690, nasdaq=3055, Bitcoin=5.4):
Bitcoin is 129.57. Gold is 1386.00. Nasdaq is 3488.00
Bitcoin: 2299.44%
Gold: -17.99%
Nasdaq: 14.17%
Gold Diff: 2826% advantage Bitcoin
Nasdaq Diff: 2002% advantage Bitcoin[/b][/size]

So... Gold collapsing, Bitcoin UP? Grin

thezerg

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Small Memorial day pull-back from the top of the recent rally does not even matter when you look at how
BTC is pwning Gold!!!

the silverbox update (comparison from the beginning of this thread, March 13th, 2012, gold=1690, nasdaq=3055, Bitcoin=5.4):
Bitcoin is 129.57. Gold is 1386.00. Nasdaq is 3488.00
Bitcoin: 2299.44%
Gold: -17.99%
Nasdaq: 14.17%
Gold Diff: 2826% advantage Bitcoin
Nasdaq Diff: 2002% advantage Bitcoin[/b][/size]

miscreanity

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Quote from: molecular on May 28, 2013, 04:42:39 PM

In a follow-up kind-of interview with elisa johnson he reiterates the above points and when asked why he thinks a global currency was a bad idea states that this would at some point mean even bigger state than we have now. However he then talks about possibilities of technology towards more direct forms of democracy (non-representative) and - lo and behold - talks about the elite fearing bitcoin as something they can't let happen. So it seems he sees bitcoin as a tool for the people to take back some of the power, a good thing in his mind.

Very strange taken the fact the he started out telling us a global currency was not a good idea. But I guess he meant a "global fiat currency" as he stated in the previous interview. Even weirder that he is convinced the new global currency will be fiat taken he knows about bitcoin and its potential.

but listen for yourself (about 2-3 minutes from linked time):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=e97T0Bfex5A#t=930s

Great how Bitcoin came up naturally as a relevant topic.

Townsend described a global fiat currency as a Hail Mary play, so I think he looks at that as a doomed effort to be quickly replaced by social structures built upon modern technologies.

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miscreanity

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Quote from: S3052 on May 26, 2013, 03:59:10 AM

most of this is ~~going to happen~~ happening now

manfred

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Energy is Wealth

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BitcoinAshley

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Quote from: Zangelbert Bingledack on May 25, 2013, 04:27:09 PM

The reasoning by which he concluded the global reserve currency would be fiat seems faulty: governments are not an aggregate blob; each one has its own interests. No single government wants to give up its fiat control, but even less do they want to use another country's fiat. They will use gold (or maybe someday bitcoins).

You so sure about that? Remember how easy it was for the banksters to convince a whole bunch of countries in Europe to adopt the Euro... Grin

If major fiat currencies collapse, it will be a piece of cake for banksters to get their politician cronies to enact legislation supporting a "Eartho" Tongue

Edit: Hopefully they pick an even stupider name.

Zangelbert Bingledack

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The reasoning by which he concluded the global reserve currency would be fiat seems faulty: governments are not an aggregate blob; each one has its own interests. No single government wants to give up its fiat control, but even less do they want to use another country's fiat. They will use gold (or maybe someday bitcoins).

miscreanity

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Quote from: Dusty on May 25, 2013, 12:34:26 PM

Quote from: molecular on May 25, 2013, 05:31:31 AM

I thought those were interesting points so I wrote them up for you guys to maybe discuss some.

Thank you for your effort molecular, it has been very appreciated (by me, at least).

Seconded. Some powerful points, not the last of which is establishment of a fiat global currency. Like gold, fiat isn't going to simply disappear overnight.

The natural resources acquisitions have been moving along for almost a decade now. That whole decoupling trend from a while back hasn't stopped.

It's a global game of Chinese checkers.

KarmaShark

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Of all the threads on the forums I think I like to follow this one the most. I firmly believe one should be diversified into physical at this point in time to protect ones fiat purchasing power longer-term. With that said, I also firmly believe that 1BTC = 1oz Au within two years, which opens the door to an entirely new paradigm.

Keep that printing going boys, tis good for the BTC.

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Libertas a calumnia

Quote from: molecular on May 25, 2013, 05:31:31 AM

I thought those were interesting points so I wrote them up for you guys to maybe discuss some.

Thank you for your effort molecular, it has been very appreciated (by me, at least).

molecular

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Just watched an interesting "goldmoney" interview with Erik Townsend.

With Bitcoin in mind listening to the first 15 or so minutes can be quite exciting.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IhmmvCgRiew

The rest is also interesting (more about energy / resources / china).

Here are some of the points Mr. Townsends makes:

About USD / EUR / JEN collapse:

The fears many people have about the USD collapsing are based on well-founded concerns, but those things are going to happen to Europe and Japan first.
This will result in capital flight into the USD
This in turn will enable US govt/fed to print more
The ultimate consequences of this will be horrific for the United States

About what might happen next in global currency space:

There will likely be a new global reserve currency replacing the USD everyone will be forced to use in international trade and new power will go to the new global reserve bankers.
Mechanisms by which people will be forced to convert USD->new world currency at unfavorable rates will be interesting to see.
Although he doesn't like it, Townsend thinks it will surely be a fiat currency
Why fiat? Because a sound money (gold) standard would take power from the governments and they wont give up that power and especially in the US the people are cheering the government so there wont be a revolution that would be necessary to make govt give up power.

about US / russia / china / gold / cold war:

Russia/China are buying physical (not only gold, but other resources they would have to buy from the west as well)
Townsend thinks what we're seeing is the early stages of the 500 year east-west power cycle reversing with asia being the next hegemonial superpower.
There will be a cold war between China and US
China is preparing for USD collapse (gold is hedge)
China is preparing for collapse of commerce with west by stockpiling coal, gold, copper,...

about energy / US protectionism

US might decouple US oil from free market, creating a world in which US pay $80 / barrel and the free market (rest of world) pay $200/barrel
This protectionism would bring on trade wars and other international tensions
Even if North America (incl. Canada) was able to achieve energy independence consider that this would mean that the rest of the world would no longer trade oil in USD and therefor the US would lose its "exorbitant privilege" (breakdown of petrodollar system -> higher US interest rates -> US bond and currency crisis).
Hence the idea of everything getting better because of (unlikely) US energy independence is not accurate.

I thought those were interesting points so I wrote them up for you guys to maybe discuss some.

FNG

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Quote from: marcus_of_augustus on May 24, 2013, 07:31:05 AM

http://jessescrossroadscafe.blogspot.co.nz/2013/05/monetary-rapture-incredible.html

Gold run at the COMEX .... Cool

Eventually paper gold will no longer represent the price of physical. Good to see

manfred

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Energy is Wealth

Quote

bitcoin however can only really be manipulated up in the long term

Did't know bitcoin is manipulated up!
If the bitcoin price will be up or down depends on the time span u talking about. bitcoin and steam-engines are very much alike.
Both are revolutionary in its day and world changers. And like the steam-engine bitcoin will quickly be surpassed be superior technology. (When that happens price can only go down) Not talking about current copy cats (litecoin....) put truly new designs. Might only exist on paper right now, but is only a matter of time before does new cryptocoins are released. bitcoins only weakness is the time it takes to complete a transaction. Yes steam-trains are still around and have its hard core followers, but it can not compete in the real world with a TGV.

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Quote from: Frozenlock on May 24, 2013, 07:03:27 PM

And when all these bubbles explode, cash will be king.

cash won't as you can print more

gold won't because all the goldbugs complain and moan about is how they are constantly being manipulated by the banks/gov

bitcoin however can only really be manipulated up in the long term

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And when all these bubbles explode, cash will be king.

BitcoinAshley

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By "everything else is rising" are we referring to the stock markets that are rising on no fundamentals?

Actually, there are a few fundamentals
-Ruthless money printing by CB heads
-Artificially low interest rates, neo-keynesian policies 2 Da Max
-Unemployment rate continuing to rise
-Bubbles everywhere! Bond bubble, student loan bubble, housing bubble (reinflated) etc etc
-Economic data continually looking weaker and weaker
-Constant scandal after scam, year after year, LIBOR, Countryside, CDSs, etc., blatant manipulation everywhere, no tinfoil-hat needed

SOO, I'd say the case for paper gold manipulation isn't exactly a shot in the dark.

Are Silverdoctor and the ridiculous irrational PM-bull "news" sites exaggerating everything they can get their hands on? Sure. But that doesn't vindicate the rest of the fiat economy.

Disclaimer: Not a gold bug, or a BTC bug, or a fiat bug. I prefer the Pokemon approach because even if I'm dead wrong, I'll still be rich. Cool

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