Government & Bitcoin - page 65. | Bitcointalksearch.org

arallmuus

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Quote from: jayce on June 20, 2015, 03:04:22 PM

-snip-

Im pretty much aware of the words " support" and you should read before posting. I've stated before (below) and it is pointless to argue on a grey area , much like arguing is GOD exist or not which is a grey area as well.

Quote from: arallmuus on June 20, 2015, 02:33:06 PM

Basically this is a grey area to talk about, in which case support will be mean to legalize is and not support will mean to make it illegal , depends on what your perception is.

Also your own post killed your argument (bolded and resized them even colored them red just so you are aware that there are 2 meanings there ). The words enable to function which means in this case the government allowed BTC to function as it is (a currency) therefore your post actually just supported my argument that some government support BTC

Quote from: jayce on June 20, 2015, 03:04:22 PM

2. give assistance to, especially financially; enable to function or act.

Quote from: jayce on June 20, 2015, 03:04:22 PM

If you lost your fiat, you can report it to police.

What for? so you could get it back ? I wouldnt need any government nor police If I could secure my BTC properly which alot of people couldnt. Also a hacking attempt is considered as a cyber crime therefore it can be reported as well ( not sure about this)

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Quote from: arallmuus on June 20, 2015, 02:33:06 PM

You are getting the wrong idea again. Basically this is a grey area to talk about, in which case support will be mean to legalize is and not support will mean to make it illegal , depends on what your perception is.

Let me share you this

Quote from: arallmuus on June 20, 2015, 02:33:06 PM

It is in the nature of BTC to be decentralized currency and therefore you are responsible for your own lost also that dont get the wrong idea that if you lost something that is regulated then the government will be responsible for it because robbery happens atleast 100 times a day and none of it is the responsibility of government although they own FIAT

If you lost your fiat, you can report it to police. Who did create the police? I think its government. Maybe not of all robbery can be handled by them, but atleast they still try to solve that, because its their task.

arallmuus

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Quote from: jayce on June 20, 2015, 01:25:53 PM

Quote from: arallmuus on June 20, 2015, 12:35:42 PM

Quote from: jayce on June 19, 2015, 02:49:23 PM

I think the word "support" is difference with "legalize". If government legalized something, it doesn't mean that government support it. If the government really support bitcoin, so I think they will introduce it and build facilities for bitcoin to their people. I never heard a government do that before. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

Indeed it is different but you should note that you are getting the wrong idea there. Government support and create FIAT but do they build bank ? YES to get a profit from FIAT. With BTC you will never getting the same treatment because BTC isnt a centralized currency which is issued by a country, it is uncorrelated with any authority at all therefore getting legalized is actually a huge stepstone for BTC already

So I can say that govenment never want to support it since it can't be controlled by them. They just let people using it, but won't take any responsibility if their people get scammed or hacked on their wallet.

You are getting the wrong idea again. Basically this is a grey area to talk about, in which case support will be mean to legalize is and not support will mean to make it illegal , depends on what your perception is.
It is in the nature of BTC to be decentralized currency and therefore you are responsible for your own lost also that dont get the wrong idea that if you lost something that is regulated then the government will be responsible for it because robbery happens atleast 100 times a day and none of it is the responsibility of government although they own FIAT

jayce

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Quote from: arallmuus on June 20, 2015, 12:35:42 PM

Quote from: jayce on June 19, 2015, 02:49:23 PM

I think the word "support" is difference with "legalize". If government legalized something, it doesn't mean that government support it. If the government really support bitcoin, so I think they will introduce it and build facilities for bitcoin to their people. I never heard a government do that before. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

Indeed it is different but you should note that you are getting the wrong idea there. Government support and create FIAT but do they build bank ? YES to get a profit from FIAT. With BTC you will never getting the same treatment because BTC isnt a centralized currency which is issued by a country, it is uncorrelated with any authority at all therefore getting legalized is actually a huge stepstone for BTC already

So I can say that govenment never want to support it since it can't be controlled by them. They just let people using it, but won't take any responsibility if their people get scammed or hacked on their wallet.

BTCevo

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Quote from: arallmuus on June 19, 2015, 01:05:00 PM

Any news regarding this? AFAIK no government has build a BTC ATM for their BTC user in their country yet. Any BTC ATM that you have seen or read isnt from the government

P.S : I could be wrong on this

Nope there are no more news from him that claim their government already build one ATM in their mall and he posted the picture of their bitcoin ATM too but I can't find his thread anymore now. I remembered as well that he told us that their government build that ATM for people that are using bitcoin. I can't be wrong about this thread. This is one of what I can found https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/worlds-first-bitcoin-atm-is-announced-first-location-cyprus-157940

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Quote from: mayflor2 on June 20, 2015, 10:11:53 AM

Quote from: tom555 on April 25, 2015, 02:49:25 PM

in my opinion government slowly will welcome for bitcoin as one of their economy base.

What makes you feel that? The last thing bitcoin needs is government regulation because it will affect system functioning of bitcoin. Welcoming it would be nice, fucking with it? Probably not.

because they want to control it via taxing, and regulate it, but especially because of taxes, isn't obvious? they want to milk everything that live in this planet, bitcoin will not be an exception for them

arallmuus

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Quote from: jayce on June 19, 2015, 02:49:23 PM

Quote from: arallmuus on June 19, 2015, 01:05:00 PM

Actually there alot of government that do support it and BTC is considered to be a legal currency in their country. If you are interested, here is a list of how government's point of view towards BTC

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legality_of_bitcoin_by_country

I think the word "support" is difference with "legalize". If government legalized something, it doesn't mean that government support it. If the government really support bitcoin, so I think they will introduce it and build facilities for bitcoin to their people. I never heard a government do that before. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

Indeed it is different but you should note that you are getting the wrong idea there. Government support and create FIAT but do they build bank ? YES to get a profit from FIAT. With BTC you will never getting the same treatment because BTC isnt a centralized currency which is issued by a country, it is uncorrelated with any authority at all therefore getting legalized is actually a huge stepstone for BTC already

Quote from: bitnanigans on June 20, 2015, 10:49:20 AM

In a way, it's a good thing, as it will allow for consumer protection and make it harder for scammers to get away with their crimes.

Huh? you should probably re-read what you have posted and also read about what makes BTC different from the old fashioned currency FIAT. By making it this way, BTC will be just another FIAT controlled by the goverment and also it will just erase the pseudo-anonymous principle of BTC and also its decentralized priciple

bitnanigans

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Governments will always want to be able to control and regulate bitcoin since it's directly related to financial value. In a way, it's a good thing, as it will allow for consumer protection and make it harder for scammers to get away with their crimes. However, too much control and restrictive regulation will always be a problem.

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Quote from: mayflor2 on June 20, 2015, 10:11:53 AM

Quote from: tom555 on April 25, 2015, 02:49:25 PM

in my opinion government slowly will welcome for bitcoin as one of their economy base.

What makes you feel that? The last thing bitcoin needs is government regulation because it will affect system functioning of bitcoin. Welcoming it would be nice, fucking with it? Probably not.

If there is no regulation I doubt it will ever reach mainstream status. As long as there are ways to stay anonymous and the privacy of Bitcoin which currently is pretty poor improves in the future, those that want to circumvent regulations will be able to if they want to risk it.

mayflor2

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Quote from: tom555 on April 25, 2015, 02:49:25 PM

in my opinion government slowly will welcome for bitcoin as one of their economy base.

What makes you feel that? The last thing bitcoin needs is government regulation because it will affect system functioning of bitcoin. Welcoming it would be nice, fucking with it? Probably not.

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Quote from: arallmuus on June 19, 2015, 01:05:00 PM

Actually there alot of government that do support it and BTC is considered to be a legal currency in their country. If you are interested, here is a list of how government's point of view towards BTC

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legality_of_bitcoin_by_country

I think the word "support" is difference with "legalize". If government legalized something, it doesn't mean that government support it. If the government really support bitcoin, so I think they will introduce it and build facilities for bitcoin to their people. I never heard a government do that before. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

Quote from: arallmuus on June 19, 2015, 01:05:00 PM

Quote from: jayce on June 19, 2015, 12:18:33 PM

Yeah I haven't met any users from Greece yet here.

Plenty of them at the local Greece board here https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?board=120.0

Actually I never check the board yet. I'm sorry for Greek users here Sad

arallmuus

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Quote from: jayce on June 19, 2015, 12:18:33 PM

Quote from: arallmuus on June 14, 2015, 12:27:17 PM

Actually there are no evidence about this yet . Some government banned BTC but also some support it

I'm not sure if there are some government that really support bitcoin. I think they just let bitcoin grow as long as it won't disturb the economy system of the country.

Actually there alot of government that do support it and BTC is considered to be a legal currency in their country. If you are interested, here is a list of how government's point of view towards BTC

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legality_of_bitcoin_by_country

Quote from: jayce on June 19, 2015, 12:18:33 PM

Quote from: arallmuus on June 14, 2015, 12:27:17 PM

Also that a crime related news seems to be getting more attention from the people so that could be another reason on why media keep on exposing BTC with the bad news.

That's why I think there is someone or some party that using media to make bitcoin become bad to world people.

It is not the sole fault of media, who to be blame will be the people who use it for bad things instead of the media because basically media reports whatever news you have to lure people to read them but of course Gavin Propose a Fork news wont gain as much interest as a 30 year old guy busted while purchasing a drug using BTC news.

Quote from: jayce on June 19, 2015, 12:18:33 PM

Yeah I haven't met any users from Greece yet here.

Plenty of them at the local Greece board here https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?board=120.0

Quote from: BTCevo on June 19, 2015, 12:42:48 PM

Yes, there are some government that support bitcoin, they even build some ATM for them

Any news regarding this? AFAIK no government has build a BTC ATM for their BTC user in their country yet. Any BTC ATM that you have seen or read isnt from the government

P.S : I could be wrong on this

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Quote from: jayce on June 19, 2015, 12:18:33 PM

Quote from: arallmuus on June 14, 2015, 12:27:17 PM

Actually there are no evidence about this yet . Some government banned BTC but also some support it

I'm not sure if there are some government that really support bitcoin. I think they just let bitcoin grow as long as it won't disturb the economy system of the country.

Yes, there are some government that support bitcoin, they even build some ATM for them too in case they are need to get their money from their wallet. But it will be a problem if bitcoin grow as long as people want and it will disturb the economy system because more people will move to bitcoin rather than fiat

oblivi

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Quote from: jayce on June 19, 2015, 12:18:33 PM

Quote from: arallmuus on June 14, 2015, 12:27:17 PM

Actually there are no evidence about this yet . Some government banned BTC but also some support it

I'm not sure if there are some government that really support bitcoin. I think they just let bitcoin grow as long as it won't disturb the economy system of the country.

Quote from: arallmuus on June 14, 2015, 12:27:17 PM

Also that a crime related news seems to be getting more attention from the people so that could be another reason on why media keep on exposing BTC with the bad news.

That's why I think there is someone or some party that using media to make bitcoin become bad to world people.

Quote from: BillyBobZorton on June 19, 2015, 08:33:40 AM

Mainstream media keeps spreading fud to Bitcoin so when people get in a critical situation like the Greeks are right now, they fear to put their money into Bitcoins and instead either leave them inside the bank and get them stolen by the gov, or leave them inside their houses in form of fiat or gold and get them stoled by other desperate Greek people and opportunistic vandals.

Yeah I haven't met any users from Greece yet here.

I meet a Greek user actually, but guess what he's a poster here.
Im pretty sure that every Greek Bitcoin user is on this forum, so to know a demographic of real BTC usage in Greece you could look at the Greek section in bitcointalk. It's safe to say Bitcoin is still a small niche there and the average folk has absolutely no idea what that is, so they are about to get a big haircut if they leave their wealth inside the banks, today was the last day to get your money out, we'll see what happens in Monday.

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Quote from: arallmuus on June 14, 2015, 12:27:17 PM

Actually there are no evidence about this yet . Some government banned BTC but also some support it

I'm not sure if there are some government that really support bitcoin. I think they just let bitcoin grow as long as it won't disturb the economy system of the country.

Quote from: arallmuus on June 14, 2015, 12:27:17 PM

Also that a crime related news seems to be getting more attention from the people so that could be another reason on why media keep on exposing BTC with the bad news.

That's why I think there is someone or some party that using media to make bitcoin become bad to world people.

Quote from: BillyBobZorton on June 19, 2015, 08:33:40 AM

Mainstream media keeps spreading fud to Bitcoin so when people get in a critical situation like the Greeks are right now, they fear to put their money into Bitcoins and instead either leave them inside the bank and get them stolen by the gov, or leave them inside their houses in form of fiat or gold and get them stoled by other desperate Greek people and opportunistic vandals.

Yeah I haven't met any users from Greece yet here.

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Quote from: arallmuus on June 14, 2015, 12:27:17 PM

Quote from: jayce on June 14, 2015, 12:05:39 PM

Quote from: arallmuus on June 14, 2015, 09:05:52 AM

Banning it will not stop anything actually, it will just force BTC to step into underground pace. The same thing with drugs and stuff, it is illegal in most countries but that dont stop people from using or distributing it. Although this would means that BTC will be acknowledge at something similar of "criminal related stuff" or so

So, we can say the bitcoin will be so hard to ~~developed~~ to be adopted in the country as I told before. If bitcoin is be banned by government, the shop online is too.

Corrected some parts of it, if you mean that chances for BTC to be adopted gonna be lower then yes

Quote from: jayce on June 14, 2015, 12:05:39 PM

Quote from: arallmuus on June 14, 2015, 09:05:52 AM

To be honest that a fault from the BTC user. Media play a role in reporting a case which unfortunately the case is about someone using BTC to purchase some illegal things i.e silkroad. Its not the media that ruin BTC but it is the BTC user that ruin it, most people will now see BTC as a criminal related stuff due to all this negative publicity

I think media seems like to exaggerated crime news related bitcoin. I don't know whether it just my feeling or it's an action of some parties behind it that don't like bitcoin.

Actually there are no evidence about this yet . Some government banned BTC but also some support it , so It is pretty unclear if the negative publicity for BTC was given by the government to surpressed BTC however some government has no rights to control the media in their country though.

Also that a crime related news seems to be getting more attention from the people so that could be another reason on why media keep on exposing BTC with the bad news .

Mainstream media keeps spreading fud to Bitcoin so when people get in a critical situation like the Greeks are right now, they fear to put their money into Bitcoins and instead either leave them inside the bank and get them stolen by the gov, or leave them inside their houses in form of fiat or gold and get them stoled by other desperate Greek people and opportunistic vandals.

Dotakels

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Quote from: Amph on June 14, 2015, 03:00:58 AM

Quote from: gripflierGO on June 13, 2015, 12:33:47 PM

Quote from: knowhow on June 12, 2015, 05:09:43 PM

Quote from: arallmuus on June 12, 2015, 04:41:52 AM

Quote from: knowhow on June 11, 2015, 06:55:10 PM

Quote from: arallmuus on June 11, 2015, 05:12:54 PM

It doesnt matter if you agree or not because that is not your call to do so. Laws are the main thing government use to control his country and your job would be to bow down before the law ofcourse and ofcourse sooner or later once government start to acknowledge BTC and its threat to their economic structure then we will see a heavy tax on BTC/FIAT exchange to discourage user.

well soo the black market will act to allow users to get the bitcoins as to sell them ,currently able to get them on exchanges... if government take a huge step ,btc comunity will find a way to avoid them .... the same think some people declare the btc ammount holding others just dont....

I doubt that it will go way that far. Worst thing would be that some people will be discouraged to exchange it to FIAT and the others might still be doing it as usual. It is pretty simple to avoid it anyway because people could do a peer-2-peer exchange without involving any exchanger thus this could be use to avoid the huge tax when you are exchanging it to FIAT

if governments would think to attack bitcoin ,well for them is pretty easy to be buying bitcoins and trying to control the price...but why they should do that?they control the currencys already....countryes make the bump and dump very easy.... and yes a pression but when bank acts all market react

Governments will attack bitcoins in the future and that is for sure. Governments are very intelligent and criminal minded people they will only look at their profits so they are waiting for bitcoin to grow so once the bitcoin grows and reaches to the stable price they will definitely attack the bitcoin.

what governments you're talking about? not all the governments are aghainst bitcoin, many will embraces it, because they know they can gain tons of money on taxes if it become big, if not, then they will simply not care, and bitcoin will be used for a very niche market, and from nerd only

Yes thats right if they not accepted or their have no interest with bitcoin they can let it, because if the attack that like DDO's government that already accepted it will be complained that you should not do that, because many people now are using bitcoin.

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Quote from: arallmuus on June 14, 2015, 12:27:17 PM

Quote from: jayce on June 14, 2015, 12:05:39 PM

Quote from: arallmuus on June 14, 2015, 09:05:52 AM

Banning it will not stop anything actually, it will just force BTC to step into underground pace. The same thing with drugs and stuff, it is illegal in most countries but that dont stop people from using or distributing it. Although this would means that BTC will be acknowledge at something similar of "criminal related stuff" or so

So, we can say the bitcoin will be so hard to ~~developed[/b] to be adopted in the country as I told before. If bitcoin is be banned by government, the shop online is too.~~

Corrected some parts of it, if you mean that chances for BTC to be adopted gonna be lower then yes

Quote from: jayce on June 14, 2015, 12:05:39 PM

Quote from: arallmuus on June 14, 2015, 09:05:52 AM

To be honest that a fault from the BTC user. Media play a role in reporting a case which unfortunately the case is about someone using BTC to purchase some illegal things i.e silkroad. Its not the media that ruin BTC but it is the BTC user that ruin it, most people will now see BTC as a criminal related stuff due to all this negative publicity

I think media seems like to exaggerated crime news related bitcoin. I don't know whether it just my feeling or it's an action of some parties behind it that don't like bitcoin.

Actually there are no evidence about this yet . Some government banned BTC but also some support it , so It is pretty unclear if the negative publicity for BTC was given by the government to surpressed BTC however some government has no rights to control the media in their country though.

Also that a crime related news seems to be getting more attention from the people so that could be another reason on why media keep on exposing BTC with the bad news .

Yes and people believe that bitcoins are generally used for the illegal activities like drugs, money laundering etc that is what the news were published and that is the reason why bitcoins have negative impact on the minds of the people.

arallmuus

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Quote from: jayce on June 14, 2015, 12:05:39 PM

Quote from: arallmuus on June 14, 2015, 09:05:52 AM

Banning it will not stop anything actually, it will just force BTC to step into underground pace. The same thing with drugs and stuff, it is illegal in most countries but that dont stop people from using or distributing it. Although this would means that BTC will be acknowledge at something similar of "criminal related stuff" or so

So, we can say the bitcoin will be so hard to ~~developed~~ to be adopted in the country as I told before. If bitcoin is be banned by government, the shop online is too.

Corrected some parts of it, if you mean that chances for BTC to be adopted gonna be lower then yes

Quote from: jayce on June 14, 2015, 12:05:39 PM

Quote from: arallmuus on June 14, 2015, 09:05:52 AM

To be honest that a fault from the BTC user. Media play a role in reporting a case which unfortunately the case is about someone using BTC to purchase some illegal things i.e silkroad. Its not the media that ruin BTC but it is the BTC user that ruin it, most people will now see BTC as a criminal related stuff due to all this negative publicity

I think media seems like to exaggerated crime news related bitcoin. I don't know whether it just my feeling or it's an action of some parties behind it that don't like bitcoin.

Actually there are no evidence about this yet . Some government banned BTC but also some support it , so It is pretty unclear if the negative publicity for BTC was given by the government to surpressed BTC however some government has no rights to control the media in their country though.

Also that a crime related news seems to be getting more attention from the people so that could be another reason on why media keep on exposing BTC with the bad news .

jayce

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Quote from: arallmuus on June 14, 2015, 09:05:52 AM

Banning it will not stop anything actually, it will just force BTC to step into underground pace. The same thing with drugs and stuff, it is illegal in most countries but that dont stop people from using or distributing it. Although this would means that BTC will be acknowledge at something similar of "criminal related stuff" or so

So, we can say the bitcoin will be so hard to developed in the country as I told before. If bitcoin is be banned by government, the shop online is too.

Quote from: arallmuus on June 14, 2015, 09:05:52 AM

To be honest that a fault from the BTC user. Media play a role in reporting a case which unfortunately the case is about someone using BTC to purchase some illegal things i.e silkroad. Its not the media that ruin BTC but it is the BTC user that ruin it, most people will now see BTC as a criminal related stuff due to all this negative publicity

I think media seems like to exaggerated crime news related bitcoin. I don't know whether it just my feeling or it's an action of some parties behind it that don't like bitcoin.

Topic: Government & Bitcoin - page 65. (Read 70830 times)