HashFast announces specs for new ASIC: 400GH/s - page 408.

amer

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Quote from: crumbs on December 04, 2013, 05:56:21 PM

Quote from: amer on December 04, 2013, 05:49:46 PM

How about you stay on topic, instead of going of on tangents and hypotheticals?
Hashfast has promised to refund its customers in the currency it was paid in. When said currency became 10x as valuable, they reneged on that promise. Simple.

Sure thing, if you can handle the discussion without converting to analogy, let's try it.

You said that Hashfast wouldn't have to convert to fiat to pay their manufacturing expenses citing some kind of consumer protection law. Cite the law.

Gyrsur

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Bitcoin Legal Tender Countries: 2 of 206

^^ if the promise this they have to hedge against currency risk of high volatility. simple as that but it needs the amount for the hedge also.

crumbs

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Quote from: amer on December 04, 2013, 05:49:46 PM

Quote from: crumbs on December 04, 2013, 05:46:21 PM

Quote from: amer on December 04, 2013, 05:43:59 PM

Quote from: crumbs on December 04, 2013, 05:37:21 PM

Funding R&D and manufacture with pre-order money runs afoul of a slew of consumer laws. Hashfast is legit & wouldn't do that.

Show me the consumer law that says this. We can sue kickstarter.com for creating a business model completely based on this illegal behavior.

Kickstarter participants are investors, not consumers. They're funding an enterprise, not pre-ordering goods.
Please familiarize yourself with the topic that you are so eager to rage on.

You're raging, I'm not. I'm just trying to point out how ridiculous you sound, but you're a true believer, so it's might be impossible.

How about companies that accept payment in multiple currencies. When they do a currency exchange and the value wildly fluctuates - then what?

How about you stay on topic, instead of going of on tangents and hypotheticals?
Hashfast has promised to refund its customers in the currency it was paid in. When said currency became 10x as valuable, they reneged on that promise. Simple.

amer

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Quote from: crumbs on December 04, 2013, 05:46:21 PM

Quote from: amer on December 04, 2013, 05:43:59 PM

Quote from: crumbs on December 04, 2013, 05:37:21 PM

Funding R&D and manufacture with pre-order money runs afoul of a slew of consumer laws. Hashfast is legit & wouldn't do that.

Show me the consumer law that says this. We can sue kickstarter.com for creating a business model completely based on this illegal behavior.

Kickstarter participants are investors, not consumers. They're funding an enterprise, not pre-ordering goods.
Please familiarize yourself with the topic that you are so eager to rage on.

You're raging, I'm not. I'm just trying to point out how ridiculous you sound, but you're a true believer, so it's might be impossible.

How about companies that accept payment in multiple currencies. When they do a currency exchange and the value wildly fluctuates - then what?

Kouye

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Cuddling, censored, unicorn-shaped troll.

Quote from: amer on December 04, 2013, 05:43:59 PM

Show me the consumer law that says this. We can sue kickstarter.com for creating a business model completely based on this illegal behavior.

Kickstarter does not 100% guarantee you'll get anything for the money you DONATE, as far as I understood.
Pre-order kinda does, on the other hand.
See the difference?

crumbs

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Quote from: amer on December 04, 2013, 05:43:59 PM

Quote from: crumbs on December 04, 2013, 05:37:21 PM

Funding R&D and manufacture with pre-order money runs afoul of a slew of consumer laws. Hashfast is legit & wouldn't do that.

Show me the consumer law that says this. We can sue kickstarter.com for creating a business model completely based on this illegal behavior.

Kickstarter participants are ~~investors~~ donators*, not consumers. They're funding an enterprise, not pre-ordering goods.
Please familiarize yourself with the topic that you are so eager to rage on.

*Thanks Kouye, missed that Cheesy

amer

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Quote from: crumbs on December 04, 2013, 05:37:21 PM

Funding R&D and manufacture with pre-order money runs afoul of a slew of consumer laws. Hashfast is legit & wouldn't do that.

Show me the consumer law that says this. We can sue kickstarter.com for creating a business model completely based on this illegal behavior.

crumbs

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Quote from: reactor on December 04, 2013, 05:31:28 PM

Quote from: crumbs on December 04, 2013, 04:36:58 PM

Quote from: WastedLTC on December 04, 2013, 04:19:05 PM

...
No one would get a refund in BTC, EVER! Just get that straight. Companies typically convert to USD immediately via bitpay.

A company that believes in BTC and manufactures BTC mining equipment... converts all of its BTC to fiat the first chance it gets?
I agree that no one will get BTC as long as the price stays high. If the price falls, people who paid in BTC will definetly be refunded in BTC, as per wording of the original agreement.

Yes, because real companies have bills and employees to pay, not to mention costs for hardware design and fabrication. BTC doesn't pay for shit in the real world yet. Sorry.

If BTC doesn't pay for shit in the real world, which world were the Baby Jets sold in?
Funding R&D and manufacture with pre-order money runs afoul of a slew of consumer laws. Hashfast is legit & wouldn't do that.
Therefore, there was no need to convert the pre-order money to fiat.
If you have any more questions, feel free to ask.

Edit: To be able to offer refunds, the company needs to have a minimum of all of the customer's funds on reserve. If that money is spent on development and manufacture, and the product fails, there would be *no money to refund the customers with*. Basic math will tell you that.

reactor

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Quote from: crumbs on December 04, 2013, 04:36:58 PM

Quote from: WastedLTC on December 04, 2013, 04:19:05 PM

...
No one would get a refund in BTC, EVER! Just get that straight. Companies typically convert to USD immediately via bitpay.

A company that believes in BTC and manufactures BTC mining equipment... converts all of its BTC to fiat the first chance it gets?
I agree that no one will get BTC as long as the price stays high. If the price falls, people who paid in BTC will definetly be refunded in BTC, as per wording of the original agreement.

Yes, because real companies have bills and employees to pay, not to mention costs for hardware design and fabrication. BTC doesn't pay for shit in the real world yet. Sorry.

crumbs

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Quote from: ImI on December 04, 2013, 05:24:05 PM

Quote from: crumbs on December 04, 2013, 05:20:22 PM

Did you honestly miss the red text, or do you just need an excuse to sperg?

You asked:

Quote

A company that believes in BTC and manufactures BTC mining equipment... converts all of its BTC to fiat the first chance it gets?

And i was kind enough to explain to you why a ASIC-company isnt able to keep their funds in BTC. Or better said they wont keep much funds at all, nor BTC nor FIAT. Thats it, not more and not less.

No, this is what i said:

Quote from: crumbs on December 04, 2013, 04:36:58 PM

Quote from: WastedLTC on December 04, 2013, 04:19:05 PM

...
No one would get a refund in BTC, EVER! Just get that straight. Companies typically convert to USD immediately via bitpay.

A company that believes in BTC and manufactures BTC mining equipment... converts all of its BTC to fiat the first chance it gets?
I agree that no one will get BTC as long as the price stays high. If the price falls, people who paid in BTC will definetly be refunded in BTC, as per wording of the original agreement.

Creative redacting redacting is just weak.

ImI

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Quote from: crumbs on December 04, 2013, 05:20:22 PM

Did you honestly miss the red text, or do you just need an excuse to sperg?

You asked:

Quote

A company that believes in BTC and manufactures BTC mining equipment... converts all of its BTC to fiat the first chance it gets?

And i was kind enough to explain to you why a ASIC-company isnt able to keep their funds in BTC. Or better said they wont keep much funds at all, nor BTC nor FIAT. Thats it, not more and not less.

itod

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Honey badger just does not care

Quote from: ninjarobot on December 04, 2013, 04:52:32 PM

These twitter updates are great. Whoever at HF is doing these, thank you.

+1, absolutely the best way of delivering updates. These HF threads here are so full of spam and FUDers they are rendered useless. Compare that to fast end clean twitter feed with only relevant info - a blessing.

crumbs

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Quote from: ImI on December 04, 2013, 05:03:41 PM

Quote from: crumbs on December 04, 2013, 04:36:58 PM

Quote from: WastedLTC on December 04, 2013, 04:19:05 PM

...
No one would get a refund in BTC, EVER! Just get that straight. Companies typically convert to USD immediately via bitpay.

A company that believes in BTC and manufactures BTC mining equipment... converts all of its BTC to fiat the first chance it gets?
I agree that no one will get BTC as long as the price stays high. If the price falls, people who paid in BTC will definetly be refunded in BTC, as per wording of the original agreement.

Ever considered that they have to pay bills? And i doubt that chip manufacturers take BTC or they can pay the rent per BTC.

But i also doubt that you are so dumb that you arent aware of this. So wtf do you keep asking this bullshit "questions"?

Did you honestly miss the red text, or do you just need an excuse to sperg?

If you are truly differently enabled, i'll spell it out for you:

If bitcoin price tanked, the refunds would be issued in BTC, as promised by Hashfast. No one would be able to request their refund in dollars.
The price went up, and Hashfast reneged on their promise.

amer

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Quote from: cedivad on December 04, 2013, 04:06:16 PM

Can you just stop spamming the thread? Open your thread and put it on your signature, thanks.

Seriously, take the fucking "I want to buy your miner" conversation to the appropriate forum. I don't understand why a community of early technology adopters has so many people that fail at proper forum usage.

jspielberg

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Since we paid btc... I think you will get more interest if you offer btc.

There was some fellow who posted a week or so back in one of these whinging threads about accepting USD for his pre-order. I contacted him at the time for details, but he seemed less interested once he had a potential purchaser.

ImI

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Quote from: crumbs on December 04, 2013, 04:36:58 PM

Quote from: WastedLTC on December 04, 2013, 04:19:05 PM

...
No one would get a refund in BTC, EVER! Just get that straight. Companies typically convert to USD immediately via bitpay.

A company that believes in BTC and manufactures BTC mining equipment... converts all of its BTC to fiat the first chance it gets?

Ever considered that they have to pay bills? And i doubt that chip manufacturers take BTC or they can pay the rent per BTC.

But i also doubt that you are so dumb that you arent aware of this. So wtf do you keep asking this bullshit "questions"?

ninjarobot

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Mine Silent, Mine Deep

Quote from: amer on December 04, 2013, 02:35:10 PM

@HashFast - 4 Dec 13 - 2:32PM ET
GN chip bringup - Power consumption: 0.14ua/MHz at 0.77volts at low speeds. That's 0.56W/GH/s. More tests happening now.

These twitter updates are great. Whoever at HF is doing these, thank you.

0.56W/GH/s does not sound very encouraging since they were advertising <0.5W/GH/s underclocked. Not sure at what speed they are testing at but it looks like consumption is +10% of what they were shooting for?

crumbs

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Quote from: WastedLTC on December 04, 2013, 04:19:05 PM

...
No one would get a refund in BTC, EVER! Just get that straight. Companies typically convert to USD immediately via bitpay.

A company that believes in BTC and manufactures BTC mining equipment... converts all of its BTC to fiat the first chance it gets?
I agree that no one will get BTC as long as the price stays high. If the price falls, people who paid in BTC will definetly be refunded in BTC, as per wording of the original agreement.

MrTeal

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Quote from: cedivad on December 04, 2013, 03:08:53 PM

Quote from: Epoch on December 04, 2013, 03:06:13 PM

Quote from: MrTeal on December 04, 2013, 02:43:49 PM

I sure hope they can improve on that, or we're going to be looking at 1W/GH/s at the wall.

Nothing wrong with 1W/GH. Already better than most/all machines out there now.

0.56 W * 1.1 * 1.1 * 1.1 (this last one is to exaggerate it) = 0.74536W

Anyway this is at low speeds, the real world consumption should be higher.

We'll have to see. Actually looking at the numbers more, as presented they make no sense. There's no way the chip is hashing with a current draw of 0.14uA/MHz at any voltage. Tiny low power 8 bit microcontrollers don't get 0.14uA/MHz. Maybe they meant 0.14uA/Hz. That would at least be realistic, and would be say 140A @ 1GHz and 0.77V.

WastedLTC

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Quote from: ASIC-K on December 04, 2013, 04:14:54 PM

Quote from: gjpminingco on December 04, 2013, 04:01:36 PM

Quote from: ryepdx on December 04, 2013, 03:24:45 PM

Quote from: gjpminingco on December 04, 2013, 03:18:17 PM

What Date and Time Did you place your Order??? and what is your Que Position

If you are considering paying the original BTC price, I've got a Baby Jet plus upgrade that cost me 50 BTC in total. I'm #525 in the queue. Order placed 8/29 at 8:55 PM.

So you payed about $6k for your order then

My Offer is $8,500 for your order

hahahah asshat

For people who want a refund, this is a better deal. When you purchased the unit, you could have purchased the BTC the same day and paid for the unit, that has nothing to do with the current value of BTC. Sure, holding it u would have much more but that is not what you chose to do.

Someone offering to pay the USD price is a fair deal if someone wants a refund or to get out. More problems could show up before shipping-- you never know!

No one would get a refund in BTC, EVER! Just get that straight. Companies typically convert to USD immediately via bitpay.

Topic: HashFast announces specs for new ASIC: 400GH/s - page 408. (Read 880816 times)